Were the Early Egyptians aware of Cloning or 'Rebirth'?

I'm sure you know where this thread is going by the title alone.

And you are correct. Ever since my earliest childhood years, as soon as I learned about Egyptian mummies and mummification, I was extremely interested. Why on Earth would people perform such a strange process to preserve these bodies, even encasing them in golden cases adorned with brilliant artwork and metalwork that would be hard to create by skilled artisans even with modern tools.

When I'd see one of these .. "mummy cases" (i forgot their actual name), the golden encasings with the body inside and a depiction of the body on the outside, the first thing that would come to mind is, "these people must've truly believed with much zeal that they'd eventually be resurrected from their grave, why else are the organs taken out and preserved to keep the body from building bacteria and breaking down? Why was the entire body dehydrated to prevent this? Why were the organs buried with the mummy? And why were they buried in elaborate tombs with tools and items to use in the "next life"? Even to the point of certain slaves or workers being encased alive in the tomb of the Pharaoh.

These cases, which some of you really educated types are probably getting annoyed at me by now because I keep calling them cases, have a very futuristic look to them as far as I am concerned. They look almost like a "capsule" MEANT and intended on being picked up one day by some form of Ancient Astronauts that they mistook for Gods and based a Mythology on. Those stories and those Gods had to have root in some form of truth, even if its nothing remotely resembling the total truth. What if they honestly believed that the most prestigous people needed to be preserved in such a painstaking way, in such elaborate tombs, inside such elaborate pyramids, which just happen to be aligned with the stars in the heavens, or were at the time, perfectly pointing to certain constellations and so forth, in order to ensure that they'd be there in the distant future when the "Gods" returned, those Ancient Astronauts who had a technology which resembled this, except more likely a suspended-life-style thing, as well as the ability to "resurrect the dead" which was more than likely a cloning technology. Sure, the clone would not know what the man knew when the man died and was mummified, but if they had his brain too, and were THAT advanced, im sure they could upload the same memories from that brain to the new, cloned brain organ inside the cloned Pharaoh's brand new cranium. So the clone wouldn't literally be a resurrected mummy, but would rather THINK HE WAS A RESURRECTED MUMMY, and APPEAR TO BE to the lesser intelligent Egyptians who had no kind of technology which even resembled anything like what they're witnessing. I mean, they'd see a brand new Pharaoh, looking just like he did before he died, who had the same personality and thoughts "uploaded" into his brain to make him believe he was, walking out of the same building, tomb, or craft that the Ancient Astronauts would've been using as their DNA analysis and cloning facility.

In fact, it must've been so profound that it shaped their culture forever, making mummification and entombment required for all important figures who have passed to ensure afterlife or "next life", or life in the underworld.

Is this too wild, or do you think im on to something? Why did no other culture go through THIS MUCH effort during their mummification? I mean .. its controversial still, but most will agree the Egyptians built Pyramids to put these entombed mummified Pharaohs in upon death, which were aligned perfectly at that time to certain important stars. Why is that? Because thats where the beings came from that founded the Egyptian culture by teaching them things much like the Bible describes the Fallen Angels doing, and then left them to their own devices, which were at best a good way of preserving the body minus its' organs and brain, but im sure you could still access viable DNA material from the mummified remains, and theoreticly clone each and every mummified individual and make an identical twin live person. WE dont have the ability to "build a clones brain" with information before the clone going "live", so that the clone would automaticly think he was the resurected Pharaoh such-n-such, and be likewise IDENTICAL via DNA 100%.

And I am not going to say I am a believer in this "Barackhenaten" stuff but it IS pretty odd that theres a keen resemblence between Obama and Akhenaten. Same goes for Akhenaten's mum, Queen Tiye, who looks just like Michelle Obama. And the two daughters of the President look just like the two daughters Akhenaten had. I dont necessarily think this is going on right now on Earth, but this is just some food for thought ... as to why the Egyptians could've picked up such an odd practice.

How do you feel about it? where did Mummification get its origin? WHAT made them believe so firmly that an afterlife was going to happen and that they needed their body intact to operate in it? If it was a soul-world, like a heaven or hell, the physical body would not be present so to speak, just your spirit or soul. Thus, the underworld/afterlife described in Egyptian Mythology shouldnt require a physical body, so whats the point?

Could it be that they were mistaking a future cloning "reincarnation" into the 3rd dimension, in a clone form, and were convinced by seeing it happen to others while the ancient astronauts with this capability were present, acting like Gods? and that mummification is just an attempt at replicating this?

According to Egyptian mythology, what you had was carried over to the afterlife, and if your body was destroyed, then the soul died.

Erasing someone's name (like you saw in the Mummy movie) was a serious punishment, as it erased them from everything.

It's been a long time since I looked Egyptian after life theology, and I'm sure Byrd, Harte, Hanslune, or any other ATS archaeologist can do better.

EditL The word you were looking for is sarcophagus. If you pronounce it like you're having a coughing fit, you'll probably still forget how to spell it, no worries.




[edit on 30-5-2009 by RuneSpider]

Byrd is the person for this.

Sarcophagus, yep lots of people have problems remembering that one. One Egyptologist I knew remembered it this way:

Sar the cop ate Haggis

But they were strange.

reply to post by runetang


Read the "Egyptian Book of the Dead"
en.wikipedia.org...

answers what they believed for the most part

www.freedomdomain.com...

Try the above link it was written back in the 60's by a student who - well have a read its well worth it. It explains where Ra,Zeus and other legends come from, well it offers a version of events anyway.

No, they weren't aware of cloning. Nor did they have a belief in a reincarnation. They did believe the soul went on to a life in the afterlife and that things there looked pretty much as they did in Ancient Egypt.

Originally posted by runetang
And you are correct. Ever since my earliest childhood years, as soon as I learned about Egyptian mummies and mummification, I was extremely interested. Why on Earth would people perform such a strange process to preserve these bodies, even encasing them in golden cases adorned with brilliant artwork and metalwork that would be hard to create by skilled artisans even with modern tools.

Just for the record, only the very elite nobles got that treatment. Poorer people got a hastier mummification and their coffins were not elaborately decorated. Some were simply put into a hole in the ground and left there.

The "sarcophagus" is the stone outer casing. Inside would be up to six "anthropoid coffins" which were human shaped and often highly decorated. The sarcophagus could be square or more elaborate and might have writing on it... or not.

They believed in a 5-part soul, only some of which (ba and ka) were anything like what we think of as a "soul." The "ib" (heart) was where the deeds and attitudes were recorded and it was what stood in the balance when the deceased entered the hall where judgment waited. It was balanced against "Ma'at" (the principle of harmony and truth (this is a "sort of" because the belief is more complex than that.)

Then there's the Sheut (shadow) which indicated a living person and was seen as a part of the soul.

The Ren (name) is the "connection" to the world and the afterlife. They believed a person never truly dies as long as their name is spoken (or read.)

The Ba, a human-headed bird, was the soul-and-personality (sort of) of the person. The king was considered the Ba of Ra, the sun god... but the king also had his own ba.

The Ka, "life force" was that part of the human soul that needed nourishment. Prayers were important; there are monuments and texts saying, "o traveler, as you pass, please say 'a thousand loaves of bread and a thousand jugs of beer and a thousand joints of beef for the soul of Ptahhotep" (or whomever).

After mummification, the wab-priests performed the ceremony of the opening of the mouth which allowed the Ba to leave the body and be united with the Ka in the afterlife.

We don't have any cases of slaves or workers being buried with pharaohs (except in the case of the opera, "Aida", written long after there were any ancient Egyptians to object.)

Wikipedia gives a good starting point; be aware, though, that the situation is much more complex than is presented: en.wikipedia.org...

They look almost like a "capsule" MEANT and intended on being picked up one day by some form of Ancient Astronauts that they mistook for Gods and based a Mythology on.

Not really. They did not look forward to a future incarnation or reincarnation; they knew they would go straight to the afterlife (unless they'd been really bad and in that case the Ib would be eaten by Apep and their Ren destroyed and the Ba/Ka ceases to exist.

What if they honestly believed that the most prestigous people needed to be preserved in such a painstaking way, in such elaborate tombs, inside such elaborate pyramids, which just happen to be aligned with the stars in the heavens, or were at the time, perfectly pointing to certain constellations and so forth, in order to ensure that they'd be there in the distant future when the "Gods" returned,

They were already awake in the afterworld. They'd have been upset/shocked/disappointed to be hauled out from their wonderful afterlife Egypt.

Sure, the clone would not know what the man knew when the man died and was mummified, but if they had his brain too, and were THAT advanced, im sure they could upload the same memories from that brain to the new, cloned brain organ inside the cloned Pharaoh's brand new cranium.

The brain was scraped out of the skull and thrown away.

So the clone wouldn't literally be a resurrected mummy, but would rather THINK HE WAS A RESURRECTED MUMMY

Except there are lots of records of the kings before they became kings, including monuments of their birth, their deeds as princes, and so forth... while the old king was still alive. Not only that, but they look different than the old king.

Why did no other culture go through THIS MUCH effort during their mummification?

Oh, there are other cultures with extensive and lengthy burial rites. And remember, they only went through this for royalty. Read up on the funerals of ancient Chinese emperors... or even European royalty.

Somtow Sucharitkul (S.P. Somtow), science fiction author and all-around polymath, is part of the Thai nobility. He has a very lengthy tale of all the things that happened during the burial of his grandfather, the king ... which involved pushing a stake through the anus so that the body would sit upright and stuffing it into a pyramid shaped box... and a lot of other things. Quite elaborate cultural practices, funny as heck when Somtow tells it, but at the same time somewhat creepy and somewhat moving.

I mean .. its controversial still, but most will agree the Egyptians built Pyramids to put these entombed mummified Pharaohs in upon death, which were aligned perfectly at that time to certain important stars. Why is that? Because thats where the beings came from that founded the Egyptian culture

Uhm... when, exactly, do you think the Egyptian culture was "founded"? It goes back long before 5,000 BC (small villages), had a notable early king (King Scorpion), was united in 3,000 BC by King Narmer, about the time a full system of writing develops. No aliens/gods mentioned.

by teaching them things much like the Bible describes the Fallen Angels doing

Unless I'm very mistaken (I may be) the Bible only discusses the Fallen Angels once in Revelation. The "how thou art fallen" when read in context in Isaiah (read the WHOLE chapter and book, not just the verse) applies to Babylon and not to Satan. Nephilim are sometimes identified as fallen angels, but there's no real justification for that. Nephilim had sex with human women but didn't teach them anything.

...according to the Bible.

And I am not going to say I am a believer in this "Barackhenaten" stuff but it IS pretty odd that theres a keen resemblence between Obama and Akhenaten.

Say WHAT????????????????????

You're not kidding? Someone believes that?????? Dear heavens -- that sort of thing is what makes people think Conspiracy Theory is just a sham mockery that ties together unrelated things in the most ridiculous ways possible.

The only real resemblance is that Obama and Akhenaten are male humans and are bilaterally symmetrical. Ditto the rest of the family.

Just to add to Byrd (and because I like to be able to say that I'm adding something to Byrd!) there have been mummies found in Peru, too.

news.nationalgeographic.com...

www.npr.org...

I hadn't heard of the ones Byrd mentioned in China or Europe; as far as I'd known five minutes ago, only Egypt and Peru had mummies. You learn something new every day!

If you want some fuel to your theory, the fact that other cultures had mummies doesn't disprove it, except that other cultures had contact with ancient astronauts, too. It's too farfetched for my taste, but there are writers who have theorized about ancient astronaut visits. (Eric von Daniken, Zechariah Sitchin, to name two off the top of my head) To me, it's just science fiction without hard proof, though.