Originally posted by miriam0566
really... its not a dig. your statements are not conducive with a person that has any experience with desire. for example...
On the contrary, I have a bit of internet addiction whereas it relates to casual games. This can be quite harmful and detrimental and it is something
I struggle with regularly. While this is not equatably the same, I recognize that sloth is detrimental to my development as well as health.
its like saying
-lighting a match starts a fire.
-feeding the fire wood makes the fire bigger
BUT, that fire is NOT the cause of the house burning down.
Wait, are you now making the argument that the hundred million adult men who view pictures of naked women and naked women having sex are going to
become rapists and that all pornography should be illegal?
what? i mean we are long past "different opinion". what you are claiming is just absurd. and i hope that by no means you think that i am taking the
opposite polar degree. i agree that pornography doesnt mean you WILL go out and rape or molest, but to ignore the connection doesnt make sense. its
I am claiming that if people are given options, normal people would opt to choose the least harmful option; this is psychologically valid as a claim.
Generally people will not seek to go out of their way to harm another unless there is a pre-existing psychological issue which results in forms of
The connection you believe there is is tenuous;
The above is a valid Logical conclusion. You are making a correlation that pornography will encourage someone to take advantage of a situation if
they are presented with it; The statistical ownership of pornography in general tends to show that the majority of men or women don't take advantage
of advantageous situations.
If your viewpoint were accurate, I as well as a majority of other people probably would've raped someone twelve times over by now. Yes, I own
pornography. No, I don't think it is a big deal. As far as I'm aware I haven't gone out and raped anyone in the almost two decades since I've
looked at naked people.
a person does not rape, molest, or kill unless there is a strong desire there before he does it, and what you basically saying is, pornography does
NOTHING to put that desire there.... correction, you contradict yourself, because before you stated that porn fans the lust, but somehow you separate
lust from desire.
You are making the argument the desire either comes from or is nurtured by the pornography; the problem is you don't recognize that there was a
pre-existing problem that inclined this person towards the behavior. Just because some people commit murder with a fork doesn't mean you should make
first off, child porn IS different BECAUSE it has a victim. in my case, pictures were taken while i was abused. so if rape is wrong, then why is
pictures of the rape ok?
Aaah, it comes out. It's different because you were personally affected by it as a child. Sorry, now I must take everything you say with a grain of
salt; you have an emotional bias on the subject which is perfectly understandable, but a bias nonetheless. The same is true of rape victims having a
reasonable discussion about rape.
To answer your question, however... What about child porn taken at nude beaches with the party not having sex? What of Animated child pornography?
What of pornography of adult sex models age regressed to pre-pubescence having sex with an adult? What of artistic depictions of nude children? What
of photographically identical CGI renderings of an indistinguishable from real child having sex with an adult?
Why is a picture of the rape okay... hmm, well, a picture of an act that was harmful is generally considered to be bad or illegal. If it is a erotic
rape/snuff story that is different than someone actually being harmed. There *are* women who get off on reading rape stories, pretending rape
fantasies and enjoying the thought of the loss of control; but I assure you these same women don't actually want to be raped and don't go out
seeking to be raped. The same is true for men.
manga, and this guys apparent fetish is different (there is no victim) but is also the same (same desires and lusts). you choose to look at the harm
but you ignore the foundation, the cause of the problem.
No. I would argue that the lusts are different. I would also argue that you are incapable of perceiving the difference due to emotional bias. What
a normal person gets out of pornography is *Not* the same thing as what a person with a psychological control issue gets from it. Some of us go
gambling, and a few of those people will sell their entire lives and lose it all on a bet... that doesn't make the latter people normal and they
should never be considered in such arguments. We don't make rules, laws or even decisions based upon the narrow margin of humans who are
malfunctioning. I do not carry a knife or gun with me at all times because I'm afraid of being raped or mugged, even if I do live in an unconcealed
you are basically preaching that fires dont burn houses (porn doesnt fuel desires) based solely on the fact that you LIKE to set fires (you want
freedom to sin). doesnt sound at all logical to me.
No, I am preaching that fire does burn houses but an arsonist is not always involved. Sometimes a fire is just a fire.
logic is not based on consensus. at least it shouldnt be. stop using studies as a crutch and actually think about what you are saying.
I have thought long and hard about a lot of these subjects, well before I came across studies which clarified my position on things. My position has
also changed over the years, largely due to the consideration of new information. It is why I enjoy learning more about any topic, because it reveals
more of reality to me. That being said, all studies are not equal. Who conducts the study, what the cross-section is as well as if the conditions
imply an innate bias to the study (Such as all people in the study are in JAIL) are things to consider.
To reiterate the original topic of the thread...
People should be allowed to sin. They own their soul, they should make the decisions of what to do with it... they should not have to suffer being
preached at, antagonized, brutalized, ostracized, humiliated, shamed, alienated, vilified or at any point treated as human garbage. No matter what
their sin is.
Humanity was given the capacity of reason and compassion, but also we were given the vices of intolerance and hatred. Our emotions are what we rely
upon in order to feel compassion, but a greater majority of the time they lead us to exclusionary practices and the above happens.
I forgive all people who have sinned. This is different from condoning their every act. While I wish no harm on any other human being, I recognize
that harm happens and worse; most people cannot perceive the ephemeral meaninglessness of physical existence and transcend beyond things that happen
to their bodies.
The soul is immortal, the body merely a vessel... all sins committed against a vessel do nothing to the soul unless we allow it. If we wish to be
tainted, corrupted, broken, twisted, deviated or anything else.... it is ultimately our decision what we decide to internalize in our lives.
Unfortunately, our culture is one of victimization and feeds deeply into the need to feel violated, victimized and scarred for life due to our
[edit on 9-6-2009 by TheColdDragon]