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Historic First Five Carriers from Four Different Countries

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posted on Jul, 1 2004 @ 10:51 AM
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hey i kow about naval tactics hell i am joining them when i leave collage.
iv been on and talked to RN personal.
also not all american forces think like that it may be standard drills but not every captian follows the drills to the letter.
also i do believe they were preocupied at the time




posted on Jul, 1 2004 @ 10:56 AM
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Originally posted by devilwasp
hey i kow about naval tactics hell i am joining them when i leave collage.
iv been on and talked to RN personal.
also not all american forces think like that it may be standard drills but not every captian follows the drills to the letter.
also i do believe they were preocupied at the time


That does not matter. If this was during a war game then the carrier was provided with escorts. There is no way that they were preoccupied. The escorts sole purpose would be to protect the carrier and screen any vessels that would be closing to withing weapons range of her. There is SOP that all ships follow, especially the CO's who would like to keep their jobs, which would clearly lay out pre-planned responses for everyone to follow.

The only way that I can see the frigate getting to make an attack on the ship is that they were allowed to close in and conduct a simulated attack as a training exercise. This would have been pre-coordinated and approved by the carrier.



posted on Jul, 1 2004 @ 10:59 AM
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Originally posted by devilwasp
also the frigate i talk about is a frigate managed to sneak into your carrier battle group and sink the carrier


A sub may have a chance, and that is a big may. What with the 688 class subs now attached the CBG it will really be difficult even for the latest Russian subs. A carrier is one of the most protected surface warships. There is no way a surface ship is going to get within 300 miles of a carrier if they have hostile intent.

BTW. I looked at my copy of Janes All The Worlds Ships and could not find this super frigate you spoke of. How about some details as to country of origin and class.


[edit on 1-7-2004 by FredT]



posted on Jul, 1 2004 @ 11:02 AM
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escorts can only do so much.
also a frigate could have broken through if it got lucky.
that thing about the subs yeah a kilo could do it.



posted on Jul, 1 2004 @ 11:06 AM
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Originally posted by devilwasp
escorts can only do so much.
also a frigate could have broken through if it got lucky.
that thing about the subs yeah a kilo could do it.


There is no such thing as being lucky when it comes to modern warfare on the high seas. There is no way that something the size of a frigate, with no stealth characteristics, could make it to within weapons range of a carrier during a war game. Why do you think the Russians started making the Oscar class subs? They knew that the only thing that had a remote chance of sneaking up on a carrier was a sub.

I'm sorry that your sources either lied or misheld information from you. It is time for you to accept that fact. Quit defending the undefendable.



posted on Jul, 1 2004 @ 11:09 AM
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nothing is undefendable !
i dont accept defeat as an option.
a frigate isnt that large its not as big as a destroyer and tend to go quite fast so it could. the escorst could have been drawn away by other ships attacking.



posted on Jul, 1 2004 @ 11:17 AM
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Originally posted by devilwasp
nothing is undefendable !
i dont accept defeat as an option.
a frigate isnt that large its not as big as a destroyer and tend to go quite fast so it could. the escorst could have been drawn away by other ships attacking.


No, the escort would have stayed close to the carrier to prevent such an attack from happening. The escort could still provide missile defense to the carrier if it had to chase down a contact.

No matter how fast the frigate was going, the carrier could have turned away from it and gotten away. I have yet to see a frigate that can keep up with a carrier at top speed.

Finally, no one would come up with a strategy where they would only send one ship in for a close in attack. That is just suicide. If they were going to attack in that way, they would have had multiple ships coming in from multiple angles to cut off any escape routes for the carrier.



posted on Jul, 1 2004 @ 11:23 AM
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escorts wont stay close to the carrier if theres a threat near it. they cant gaurd every angle of attack





actually a single ship can cause more damage than a whole battlegroup.
one renegade ship could have sunk the carrier with a high powered torpedo or missile. also a carrier cant just take off out of the blue that would leave em defesnseless.
also i dont know if they had other ships cutting it off but i know that the frigate destroyed it.

[edit on 1-7-2004 by devilwasp]



posted on Jul, 1 2004 @ 11:30 AM
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Originally posted by devilwasp
escorts wont stay close to the carrier if theres a threat near it. they cant gaurd every angle of attack

That is why they often assign several escorts to the carrier. That is also one of the reasons why they developed the AEGIS system, to defend from a swarm attack.





actually a single ship can cause more damage than a whole battlegroup.
one renegade ship could have sunk the carrier with a high powered torpedo or missile. also a carrier cant just take off out of the blue that would leave em defesnseless.
also i dont know if they had other ships cutting it off but i know that the frigate destroyed it.

[edit on 1-7-2004 by devilwasp]

No, there is no way to sink a carrier with a single weapon unless it is a nuke. There are too many compartments that would have to be flooded out and too much damage that would have to occur. The enemy ship would have been destroyed long before it was able to carry that out.

Like I said before, the only way that the frigate could have sunk a carrier was if the carrier let it.



posted on Jul, 1 2004 @ 11:34 AM
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a nuke if fired by the frigate would have killed the carrier no matter what defesnse hell it wouldnt even of neaded to hit the carrier.
could of just hit the escort ships.



posted on Jul, 1 2004 @ 11:36 AM
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Originally posted by devilwasp
a nuke if fired by the frigate would have killed the carrier no matter what defesnse hell it wouldnt even of neaded to hit the carrier.
could of just hit the escort ships.


The only way that could happen is if the weapon wasn't shot down on the way to the carrier. It would have to detonate using its normal method for the warhead to be effective. Besides, at the ranges you are describing it would have been a kamikaze mission.

Seems to me like you are running out of excuses.



posted on Jul, 1 2004 @ 11:42 AM
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not exscuses cool
just scenario's
the story i was told was clear in some aspects but not in all areas.
besides i thought the US navy didnt do nuke war games



posted on Jul, 1 2004 @ 11:44 AM
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Originally posted by devilwasp
not exscuses cool
just scenario's
the story i was told was clear in some aspects but not in all areas.
besides i thought the US navy didnt do nuke war games


I can neither confirm or deny that the US Navy has done nuclear war games.

The story you were told obviously was embellished to make it sound better to you. Let me guess, these people heard that you had an interest in joining the RN and wanted to tell you about how exciting it is.



posted on Jul, 1 2004 @ 11:58 AM
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Dont normally post on boards just a vouyer as such.

but maybe i can shed some light on this issue for you,

first theres been numerous cases of british and other nato countries sinking us carriers in battle exercises, also the usn finest subs have done it them selfs.
1 of the most fancy romours i have heard of is, a excerise a few years ago in which 3 teams of 4 SBS frogmen sank 2 carriers and 2 aegis crusiers out at sea. its most likey very true and im sure USN SEALs can do the same.
We must remember as allies we exercise all the time. this makes us all very proficent, We must remember these exercises are designed to find each others weaknesses..and strengths. We must remember also we dont advertise them, as our emenies have ears.
Normally these stories are revealed to boost support for additional money for a new program or a upradge . take the recent story of indian airforce su-30mki beating f-15... this is nothing new and anyone who knows anythink about aircraft wouldnt expect anythink less(situational awareness gives the f15 its edge AWACS ect). but it gives the raptor a huge boost... maybe congress will now boost its numbers for production back up.

hope this answers some of your questions.



posted on Jul, 1 2004 @ 02:02 PM
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also if an enemy fires a nuclear missile at our carrier groups then we all go boom we fire our nukes they fire theirs and before you know it our planet is a glowing ball also the subs would never allow the frigate to get close to the carrier.



posted on Jul, 1 2004 @ 05:04 PM
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actually a small nuke would not cause ww3 as most folk would think, and who you gona fire it at if its a renegade ship?



posted on Jul, 1 2004 @ 07:15 PM
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A renegade ship where did they get the missile then if they are a renegade ship? And the US government would retaliate if a nuclear missile hit their military I don't care how small it is.


[edit on 1-7-2004 by WestPoint23]



posted on Jul, 1 2004 @ 07:36 PM
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Originally posted by WestPoint23
A renegade ship where did they get the missile then if they are a renegade ship?
[edit on 1-7-2004 by WestPoint23]


North Korea
The old Soviet Union Scientists needing money
I am sure you can think of a few more country that would have such interests..



posted on Jul, 1 2004 @ 10:31 PM
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He said where would you attack because its a renegade ship but if its a country its going to be wiped off the face of the earth but he said what if it was a terrorist group then I asked where would the terrorist get the missile and the know how to fire it.



posted on Jul, 2 2004 @ 05:58 AM
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how dificult is it to get a ship these dayss not very ard is the answer,also hows the USA gona nuke any1 if it doesnt know where its from?



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