N. Korea: No longer bound by 1953 truce

Originally posted by animekenji
Technically, there never was an official peace treaty signed in Korea, only a cease fire so no new declaration of war is needed for either side to renew hostilities. If it comes to a shooting war again, it will be interesting to see if the old alliances from the 50's will still hold. Europe, the US and China could all be drawn back into it because of treaties signed with the people of the south (or north in the case of China) 50+ years ago when hostilities first broke out. It will also be interesting to see if Taiwan throws in with South Korea or if China tries to take advantage of the situation by invading Taiwan, and does Japan violate it's pledge to have only a defensive military? There are many complications in the region that could put us all between a rock and a hard place.

[edit on 27-5-2009 by animekenji]

Which is probably why it would be just a whole lot of people's best interest to sit back down at Panmunjom just as soon as humanly possible and to discuss the issues that have made the truce agreement invalid and to try to conclude a peaceful solution to this.

North Korea wont do anything. They never do.

Every now and then they do something crazy but only the bigger stuff gets the news. The North stares at the 1st and 3rd ROK armies all day long and hears the Artillery at the range every single day.

They don't want any.

Lets sink a ship in one of there harbors.

There is one ship that the US could sink with anytime they wanted.

The USS Pueblo
en.wikipedia.org...(AGER-2)
USS Pueblo, still held by the DPRK today, remains a commissioned vessel of the United States Navy.

What could any country say about the US sinking one of its own commissioned vessels.
www.mishalov.com...

A run with 1 B2 bomber at O Dark Thirty and a line of GPS guided bombs down the center line of the ship. they would not even have to be live bombs.
they could be concrete filled practice bombs with a GPS guidance system to guide them.

I am willing to bet that NK would never even get in a shot back anywhere close to the B2.

The one thing the the north korean military can not stand is the loss of face of having a target hit in there country without them being able to do anything about it.

Since we would have hit our own ship and not the country of NK there is nothing the international community the UN or anyone else could say about the attack.

By the way i served under Commander Lloyd Bucher when he was chief of statf mine pac. for Operation End Sweep.

Thats a good way to get NK to fire about 100,000 of their short range artillery pieces into downtown Seoul. Not a good idea if we are going to do something to risk provoking that kind of response we better just go ahead take out some stuff besides a decomissioned warship. I dont think NK would just sit idly by.

Originally posted by ANNED
Lets sink a ship in one of there harbors.

There is one ship that the US could sink with anytime they wanted.

The USS Pueblo
en.wikipedia.org...(AGER-2)
USS Pueblo, still held by the DPRK today, remains a commissioned vessel of the United States Navy.

What could any country say about the US sinking one of its own commissioned vessels.
www.mishalov.com...

A run with 1 B2 bomber at O Dark Thirty and a line of GPS guided bombs down the center line of the ship. they would not even have to be live bombs.
they could be concrete filled practice bombs with a GPS guidance system to guide them.

I am willing to bet that NK would never even get in a shot back anywhere close to the B2.

The one thing the the north korean military can not stand is the loss of face of having a target hit in there country without them being able to do anything about it.

Since we would have hit our own ship and not the country of NK there is nothing the international community the UN or anyone else could say about the attack.

By the way i served under Commander Lloyd Bucher when he was chief of statf mine pac. for Operation End Sweep.

Apparently the US and South Korea have raised the WATCHCON surveillance alert on NK to level 2 from level 3.. still awaiting Yonhap story

Some news coming in, This is via BNO news

reply to post by ANNED



Unauthorized incursion into a sovreign nation's airspace, even without the provocative act of bombardment within said nation's borders, is a blatant act of war, and would be seen as such by the international community.


It does not matter that we would be "bombing" our own vessel. The fact that said vessel is within the territorial confines of another, albeit "Crazytown", nation would be unpermissable.


Let's take the "High Road" for once in terms of diplomacy.

Lil Kim will certainly react to mature statesmanship in his own irrational, unbridled, lunatic fashion, and thus provide all the justification needed to "kick his crazy pink-o behind" with the permission and gratitude of the rest of the world.


Give him enough rope and he'll hang himself once and for all; just make sure that the knot is good and tight!


[edit on 27-5-2009 by Bhadhidar]

So has NK been groomed all along to be the psycho-suicide wild card cult-nation in the "N"WO? It appears the falsehood (or great exaggeration) of the al Qaeda/Muslim fanatic menace has worn too thin by now. Things are rarely as they appear... Let the SHTF as quickly as it must, if it must.

Here it is...

twitter.com...

The South Korea-U.S. combined forces command has raised the surveillance level from 3 to 2 for the first time since 06. Defcon remains at 4. 3 minutes ago from web

South Korea and U.S. joint forces have raised the North Korean surveillance level, according to news wire reports. 2 minutes ago from web

[edit on 5/27/2009 by Hx3_1963]

Interesting article from a Russian source:

North Korea poses no real threat to the world

As the North Korean nuclear issue took a new, dangerous turn on Monday, RIA Novosti sought out the opinion of Douglas H. Paal, vice president for studies at the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace. Paal also served on the National Security Council staffs of presidents Reagan and George H.W. Bush between 1986 and 1993 as director of Asian Affairs. He was also a senior CIA analyst.

What has allowed North Korea to act in the way it does?

The accumulated mistakes of successive administrations to understand that the North Koreans really want to have a nuclear weapon and that they are not prepared to trade it away. There are honest disputes among many people about whether or not North Korea was at one time or another time willing to trade its nuclear weapons. But I think that now, since 1990 through 1994, despite agreements that Clinton had as well as the various agreements under president Bush, it is now very clear that North Korea wants a status very similar to India, where they obtain recognition of their right to retain nuclear weapons, but otherwise normalize relations with their neighbors and the United States.

Do you think North Korea poses a real threat or is it just a political game that they are playing?

I am a little different from some observers, because I think the threat is very small. North Korea lacks the industrial capacity to build large numbers of long-ranged missiles. They will not be able to build so many weapons as to become a strategic factor in the region. But I have to acknowledge that they do pose a threat to South Korea both through short-range missiles, and the possibility of using the nuclear weapons in the South, even though there are just a few, or artillery from the North to the South. That would be the end of the North regime if they were to attack the South, but they still have that capacity. Moreover, they may force the Japanese to reconsider their very modest defense program. The Japanese have the capacity to move to a nuclear weapon, I do not think they will, but they certainly can. Certainly, politically Japan will debate whether or not move to a nuclear weapon in the short term because of this development in North Korea. And they do feel threatened by the North Korean short-ranged missiles and nuclear weapon. But as I said, North Korea is an industrial midget and not really in a position to pose a large-scale threat to the neighborhood.

en.rian.ru...

[edit on 27-5-2009 by maloy]

Originally posted by Bhadhidar
reply to post by ANNED

 

Unauthorized incursion into a sovereign nation's airspace, even without the provocative act of bombardment within said nation's borders, is a blatant act of war, and would be seen as such by the international community.

We have been at war with NK since 1952 there has been no peace treaty just a cease fire agreement that the north has violated many times.

One of those times was when they captured the USS Pueblo.

we can respond to that at any time we chose.

reply to post by ANNED


Yeah, that 1968 Pueblo incident always stuck in my craw. For it to remain in NK hands is a load of crap. It should have already been sunk, but we've had a load of stellar Commanders in Chief since then.

And the next year, NK shot down one of our Recon planes.

Then, our dumbass generals allowed the NK's to hack some of our men in the DMZ who were cutting down a tree. I never understood how those NK turds left alive after doing that.

Hell, if we had blown the hell out of the Pueblo and every thing we could find of NK's that floated for a couple weeks, and if we'd had some fairly close cover for our surveillance planes, and if we'd have shot those turds in the DMZ to doll rags when they killed out soldiers, fatface may not have the same attitude about pushing the US as he does.

Every single time, we've backed up.

Oh, that's right. We protested to the UN.

That scared NK ****less.

I don't see how North Korea could have any ambitions of a global sort in this situation other than making the history books. If Kim Jong Il is really that deranged and ready to nuke a country and have his own demolished than it will be a real tragedy, but I think it's more likely the stage could end up being set for a WW3 through this, Israel has been more aggressive as of late in their dialogue.

It's a shame this hasn't made front line news in mass media, I've seen it on foreign affairs pages as if it's something uneventful like a regular ole' U.N. meeting. Something's amiss that's for sure.

Sadly, if Obama is convinced that DPRK is going to attack the "ONLY" way to reduce the bloodshed in the South would be a preemptive all out Nuclear barrage on nearly all NK military targets.

I absolutely hate the idea of this war, but all in all the use of Nuclear weapons is cheaper in both South Korean and American lives, and quite frankly cheaper in cash than a prolonged ground war.

Kim should be careful. The losses to the South Korean civilian population is unacceptable and the only means to stop it is mushroom clouds.

I agree that Kim is probably going to go out with a bang.

I hope Obama is brave enough to do what should be done if Kim starts to move troops. I will regret deeply the many North Koreans that will be lost if it comes down to it.

X

If nothing else, this is sure to sidetrack we Americans! Keep us busy on different fronts so we don't notice what is happening in this country?

Didn't we kinda figure this would be the next step to detract us? Or that, the globe is going to hell in a hand basket.

Speaking to any military move from NK against SK and US forces... Kim Jong Il would have to do a better job at stealth than blustering about it like this. It's not like there haven't been 50 years of preparations anticipating a day when the North might try something.

The North Korean Army are mostly conscripts, peasants from the fields who are then rendered into angry scarecrows. They are underfed in extreme, suffer from toxically low moral and have no illusions about their beloved leader, Howdy Doody... er, Kim.

They are closer to being an army of the nearly undead than a modern fighting force capable of winning a war against SK and the US.

Originally posted by asala

Apparently the US and South Korea have raised the WATCHCON surveillance alert on NK to level 2 from level 3.. still awaiting Yonhap story

Some news coming in, This is via BNO news

Thanks for posting that asala. With the time change difference we will just start hearing in the next few hours what is really going on over there tomorrow.

It should prove interesting to see what comes out in the wee hours of the morning.

Washington has seemed very quiet today on the subject. That can't be too good!

Originally posted by redoubt
Speaking to any military move from NK against SK and US forces... Kim Jong Il would have to do a better job at stealth than blustering about it like this. It's not like there haven't been 50 years of preparations anticipating a day when the North might try something.

The North Korean Army are mostly conscripts, peasants from the fields who are then rendered into angry scarecrows. They are underfed in extreme, suffer from toxically low moral and have no illusions about their beloved leader, Howdy Doody... er, Kim.

They are closer to being an army of the nearly undead than a modern fighting force capable of winning a war against SK and the US.

Who knows though, that's a sheer wall and wave of humanity, no telling what they might have to get it going in one angry frenetic charge.

They just have to keep the advance moving forward, which they can always do with guns on them from behind like the Soviets had to at first in repelling the Nazis and halting their advance. Two half starved Russian soldiers would move forward with one rifle between them and a handful of bullets each. When your partner fell you grabbed his bullets or the gun and kept going forward, with a Comissar at your back with a loaded pistol on you.

Originally posted by Hx3_1963
Here it is...

twitter.com...

The South Korea-U.S. combined forces command has raised the surveillance level from 3 to 2 for the first time since 06. Defcon remains at 4. 3 minutes ago from web

South Korea and U.S. joint forces have raised the North Korean surveillance level, according to news wire reports. 2 minutes ago from web

[edit on 5/27/2009 by Hx3_1963]

Hx3_1963 my Borg friend who stands to be assimilated here and why?

To what extent is resistance futile?

Originally posted by ProtoplasmicTraveler

Originally posted by constantwonder

Originally posted by lpowell0627
reply to post by constantwonder

 

Actually I think there might be one slight problem here in this assessment.

It's true that the North Koreans are testing nuclear weapons and missiles.

In their own country they are testing nuclear weapons and missiles.

Obama is not writing memos.

Obama is the Commander in Cheif of a very actively engaged U.S. Military that isn't conducting tests in Iraq, Afghanistan or Pakistan but is firing very live munitions and at very alive people who are not American's and in a place that is not America.

Certainly North Koreas acts are provocative but it isn't North Korea or Kim Jung II currently using it's military in hostile ways against other people.

It's my country and my President that is doing that.

what part of that rant has anything to do with the issue in N. Korea. . . . my point is that if this isnt handled in a very delicate manner we, us, America will most likely be drawn into another conflict that i dont think anyone is really ready to fight right now

the fact that anyone has nuclear weapons is a pretty scary thought and the tension rises everytime someone new gets added to the pantheon of potential genocidel world leaders. . . .

this neads to have much attention and be handled very delicately

Originally posted by CAPT PROTON
Makes Powell and Biden look like modern day prophets. Obama will have to make a hard choice if the North Koreans storm over that line.

I declare it sometimes makes me wonder if all these things are scripted well in advance and the last ones to know about it our us!

Of course it is kind of like Ms. Cleo and Gypsy fortune telling too...I see trouble in your future...you want to make more money...and you are concerned about a loved one.

Wow Miss Cleo how did you know?