N. Korea: No longer bound by 1953 truce

Originally posted by Bearack

Originally posted by Kombatt98
USA is again provoking that kim jong 2 again huh ... seriously nk is now a nuke power , if I were USA , i wouldnt attack them they would strike back with biological weapons(the only weapons their ICBM can deliver successfully )
and biological would destroy most of US population or at least kill hundreds of millions in USA

so why is USA provoking NK ??

are the Armageddonites in american govt , secretly fantaszing about the apocalyse being unleashed and Jesus Christ coming from heaven

ROFLMAO.....credibility went out the window suggesting NK and the capability to deliver such weapons via a ICBM. There last fell short by, oh, some 3,000 miles!!!

North korea attempted to test ICBM but it failed

With the development of the Taepodong-2 missile, with an expected range of 5,000-6,000 km,[28] North Korea could hypothetically deliver a warhead to almost all countries in Southeast Asia, as well as the western side of North America.

The Taepodong-2 missile was unsuccessfully tested on July 4, 2006. U.S. intelligence estimates that the weapon will not be operational for another 11 years. The Taepodong-2 could theoretically hit the western United States and other US interests in the Western hemisphere. The current model of the Taepodong-2 could not carry nuclear warheads to the United States. Former CIA director George Tenet has claimed that, with a light payload, Taepodong-2 could reach western parts of Continental United States, though with low accuracy
en.wikipedia.org...

as such a ICBM canot carry nuke , it is definitely designed for bioattack on USA

Originally posted by solidshot

Originally posted by detachedindividual

How is America "provoking" N.Korea?

By stopping the shipping of North Korea they have broken the terms of the truce agreed in the 1950's (as stated earlier in the thread)

As far as I can see, there is an international agreement of searching vessels suspected of carrying WMD.

Now compare that to testing a nuclear device, launching rockets, making threatening statements...

I'm sorry, but the common sense factor in this thread is remarkably low.

reply to post by muzzleflash

its called the Maginot Line

Wow the Maginot Line did the North Koreans deploy on the German side of it or the French side of it.

Wrong war, wrong continent.

reply to post by Bearack


I posted this piece in an earlier thread but it also appears quite relevant to this discussion. If I'm not allowed to do this, the mods can remove it!!

"Pardon me, but The United States Navy is the ultimate deterrent in the area with their Los Angeles and Ohio class nuclear-powered submarines. No one, that includes China, has any desire to engage these subs, if they knew where they were.

The 46 Los Angeles class fast attack submarines main armaments consist of a minimum of 25 Tomahawk Cruise missiles per sub. 31 subs of this class have an additional 12 vertical launch tubes for launching Tomahawks.

Also in the area may be the Ohio class SSBN/SSGN NP subs of which 18 were put into service. 4 Ohio class SSGN (guided missile) submarines were modified and carry a maximum of 154 Tomahawk Cruise missiles, each.

If that is not enough, each of the 14 Ohio SSBN's (Tridents) have a compliment of 24 Trident II (D5) SLBMs. Each SLBM (Sea Launched Ballistic Missile) warhead consists of 8 MIRV's, with a nominal yield of 50 kilotons, each. JUST ONE Ohio class SLBM sub can independently target 192 different locations, 50 kilotons each. (Hiroshima 12-15 KT).

Flight time to North Korea is in minutes.

I'd guess there are at least a minimum of 3 or 4 of these bad boys in the area which will keep the lid on the situation."

If North Korea crosses the invisible line drawn by the powers that be, and TPTB decides on a full out attack, North Korea's life expectency would be measured in heartbeats.

One "Boomer" and 3 or 4 of the fast attack subs can handle the majority of the situation. Especially when you do not know where they are!!

That leaves in reserve, the US Army, US Air Force, US Marines, US Navy Surface Fleet complete with full battle complement, and oh yes....... and the other 63 SSBM and Fast Attack subs hidden thoughout the oceans of this planet.

If I was North Korea, I wouldn't rattle that sabre too hard.

reply to post by Oldnslo


This is precisely why I don't think the attack on Seoul would be that catastrophic.

The US has the capability to render the entire network of artillery useless within an hour.
One flight over the DMZ on the N.Korean side would pinpoint all active areas of potential attack, and a combined assault from all directions would destroy it within minutes.

I agree that they'd probably get a few rounds off first, and it's unfortunate that a lot of people could be killed in Seoul as a result of this first attack, but surely this is better than waiting and hoping that the North don't do anything, and then seeing them open fire and killing potentially millions of people.

If the defence is not in place to respond immediately, the death toll could be in the millions. At least if there was a first strike on the North, the damage to the south would be limited.

The attack could then go on to limit N.Korea in their efforts to increase their military strength once and for all.

Note: Sky news is reporting that N.Korea has now begun operating a nuclear plant for the production of weapons-grade plutonium.

Originally posted by WickettheRabbit
The thing to be concerned about now comes down to motivation. If Lil' Kim is really on his last legs medically speaking, his motivation may be at an all time high. We aren't talking about a man who wants his country taken seriously as a economic giant. He wants his country known as a BAD MOFO.

He may be just rattling his sabre, but it's getting louder and louder on an atomic level.

Shot down in a blaze of glory.

What a funeral pyre to make a viking proud...lets hope not friend.

That's the problem though when everyone plays games, sooner or later there is an end game.

reply to post by Oldnslo

God i hate the team america attitude, policing the world hasnt really worked out for you guys so far what make's this any different?

These sub's aint gonna be firing nothing sorry to dissapoint you

Make no mistake if war with North Korea is imminent, and I truly mean imminent (like within hours) we would strike the artillery batteries zero'ed in on Soul preemptively.

Because within one hour of the fighting those arty batteries could kill upwards of 65,000+ civilians.

Personally I don't think this will lead to a shooting war because frankly what does North Korea have to gain?

Does anyone here have even the faintest clue of what in the world could they possibly gain by invading South Korea?

Nothing.

And no one does something for nothing, especially when their own future is at stake.

This is South Korea wanting normalized relations. Plain and simple.

The last time we got into a fight with North Korea China did get involved. What makes everyone think China wouldn't get involved this time? If we have to go to war do we leave North Korea intact?

This is the very reason China got involved. They wanted that 38th parallel between them and the west. North Korea is a buffer between China and our way of life.

The only way I see China not getting involved is if we promised not to do a pro western regime change. Baring that I don't see China sitting this one out. They will want to occupy North Korea and just add that region to their country. I don't see the South accepting that if the North Attacks and kills a bunch of their people.

Personally, I think the Military Chiefs in North Korea would be more likely to take the threats to the very edge of war (getting close now) and then a military coup would occur. The higher ups in North Korea are smart enough to know they don't stand a chance against South Korea let alone the U.S. nor dare I say, even the U.N.



I would predict that some small skirmishes would occur and the world will be holding its breath and the Generals of the North Korean Military will remove Kim from power and blame it all on Kim. This way they look like heroes to the world and could easily continue with a 'Business-as-Usual' attitude with another new leader and continued poverty within their borders. Or, maybe start making some concessions and help their own people out.

Maybe I'M just an optimist. Hope So...

reply to post by Wally Conley

Originally posted by Wally Conley
According to the latest AP Wires on Yahoo News, the North Koreans are now threatening to attack U.S. Warships in the waters near the Korean Penninsula.

DO YOU HAVE A SOURCE FOR THAT?

Are we looking at different wires?

Thanks

Elf

[edit on 27-5-2009 by MischeviousElf]

reply to post by MischeviousElf


Here is the news report from yahoo

Originally posted by Reading
reply to post by Oldnslo

 

God i hate the team america attitude, policing the world hasnt really worked out for you guys so far what make's this any different?

These sub's aint gonna be firing nothing sorry to dissapoint you

It sure hasn't and it's funny but Korea was considered to be in International Police action and not a war!

Here we are standing gaurd all these years later so Americans can enjoy their consitutional right to own a Hyundai!

reply to post by rogerstigers


Thank you, I had read that,

I took it from the way the Poster said it, they were about to Attack as such "Warships" which is obviously meaning War is about to begin...

But in truth the statement is talking not specifically about warships, and will only "Retaliate" as such to "Shipping" if they go into THEIR borders etc...

There is a huge amount of US warships, and Military personnel within about 2-3 mins missile flight from South Korea.... I thought the worst and where about to attack.

I have searched more.... that is the only mention, that statement and part of the situation so all is well...

Thanks

Elf

So a full load of JDAMs into Pyongyang without warning is now "legal"......... hmmm.....

Too bad Obama would never do it.

reply to post by maloy


The moment the Japanese realize that Obama is a gelding, they'll likely be most agreeable. Being under the US nuclear umbrella won't mean squat the moment they realize that the US umbrella isn't held by a firm, steady hand.

The Japanese weren't supposed to have any, ANY military forces at all, but that's certainly changed, hasn't it? There's this thing we Americans call NECESSITY. Necessity will toss ideals, intentions, and plans right out the window.

A nuclear North Korea is something the Japanese truly fear.

So what if it does upset the Chinese? We can always play the game, LET"S MAKE A DEAL. "You Chinese cap fatface, get rid of the NK nukes, and we'll talk to the Japanese about pulling back from their nuclear program."

Russia's response wouldn't likely be that strong. They have bigger fish to fry elsewhere, and besides, NK is now under the Chinese sphere of influence.

The ME was never a concern to China until the past five or so years. So your argument about the Israelis having nukes is questionable at best.

Jews to a large extent built our nukes, and Jews certainly built Israeli nukes. The NK's aren't nearly as intelligent a people as the Jews/Israelis, and it is safe to assume this backward-assed country had to have had Chinese help.

The addition of heavy bombers and tankers would push Israel right up to the "unmatchable" point with Iran. Iran can't build stuff like that. Of course, since the Russian government will sell everything including their sisters on street corners, they would be the most likely source.

To make this clear, I don't want the US coming to the rescue. I'd like to see our 30,000 troops pulled out and returned home. They would be nothing more than sacrificial speed bumps if NK decided to pour across the border.

Maybe it's time to turn some of these dogs loose. Let it fly. Everyone's a badass nowadays. Let them go, and we can all see how bad they are.

There's a lot that B2's and F-22's can do that F-16's and F-15's can not do. Tonnage and surprise to name just a couple.

reply to post by northof8


The only reason I don't think China would get involved this time is because of money. I don't think that the US would be too quick to continue paying interest on our loans and/or pay down our debt if China started firing missles at our military. At least I would hope not. But with this administration, who knows.

reply to post by Bearack

North Korea could look at it this way. The US is strained militarily and financially but would move to defend SK and Japan, expanding more resources and money.

Needing to be more in debt to China?
Perhaps the Chinese are playing with their Kim puppet?

reply to post by dooper


I think the strategy of arming Japan just puts them in a sacrificial role though. How ironic would it be that the only nation to ever suffer a nuclear attack ends up suffering another the moment we arm them to prevent one?

Japan mounts a preemptive strike then Japan takes the retalitory hit!

Did you see the news today buddy? Fort Campbell is on a three day stand down on a 'suicide watch' the second time this year. The 101st has had 11 suicides since the start of the year.

We need to get these men some R & R Dooper, and start letting some of the locals fight it out for themselves.

We are going to be hard pressed here come pretty soon to come up with a real military response if someone really does attack us.

If we bring back the Draft in a hurry, well that would do it, but we are too, too thin on the ground for a third field of active operations.

It is N.Korea designated to be more fear-mongering. You know Nuclear wars will never be happening. We cherish this world. You know that.

Cheers!!!