Originally posted by mystiq
Please elaborate on this, because I thought the project went terribly wrong with their innate peacefulness and love for their children (good traits really) which meant they couldnt shake off the non-stop waves of renegade power loving rulers who insisted on enslaving them. So its kind of an et renegade problem too isnt it?

Exactly, Mystiq.

Originally posted by Aeons

The "solution" to your problem is already found. And it is not draconian.

It is simple. And the proof of it is all around you.

Education, and legal protections and societal protection for female control of female fertility.

All areas in which women control their own fertility, and have primary legal control of their bodies, there is no population problem.

In all areas where men have created societal or legal obstructions to female control of female bodies, there is population problems.

Of course, most people who spout this horse pucky don't like this answer. Even though it works, it is elegant, and it is sustainable.

REPLY: The problem with your thesis is that the women you mention are not controlling their desires and/or stupidity. Abortion is not a control over their fertility...... the result of their fertility is being destroyed. To control ones fertility is to to have safe sex or no sex at all.

In that light, I have no problem with a woman having control of her own body, but we're not talking about HER body. We're talking about the body of the aborted human. Abortion (infanticide) is ELEGANT??

And....... As far as America's laws go, I have $1000 for you if you can show me where there is a right to an abortion. PM me if you like.

Then there's the old sonnet:

A Robin brings Spring;
A Stork brings babies, and a swallow brings nothing at all.

[edit on 15-6-2009 by zappafan1]

Originally posted by Spooky Fox Mulder
There are getting too many humans. We pollute, abuse nature, overpopulate and kill each other.

I thought you were a starseed? Lets rid the planet of indigos etc.

The problem is not that there are too many of us..the real problem is there are too many of us who dont make good decisions and dont give a damn about this planet.

Who has tought us to abuse nature? Its by far not something people come out of the womb doing. Aside from that its a generational thing. People havent been using 409 for 100 years to clean something, nor have people always relied on oil to power things. This is the last 80 years mostly. Mother earth is as old as father time. God has shown both what to do. If it wasnt for sublimital messages and lack of options through the governmet we would have grown to more choices. Yeah so obamas trying to make a whole buch of cars that dont need as much gas, yet... other recources have been prooven to be as usefull...

It's not about killing the humans that are already here - its' about stopping with all the breeding for a while. It's about teaching the humans that are already here to respect Earth and each other.

Uhhh yeahhh tell people not to shag..... you will get far with that!

It doesn't matter how much sense your idea sounds theoretically, if it doesn't work in practice, and in fact fails 100%

Humans are bred for breeding.

First off, depopulation has already started but with the wrong people first. It take 2.1 children per family (min.) to just keep a culture barely alive. The reason Europe will no longer be European in a few years is this one child or less per family. Italy, France & Germany will still have Italians, French & Germans but their root stock will be middle-eastern. America will still have Americans but they will be of Latin stock. This Earth has plenty of room still but the 1st world countries bought into zero population growth or less. 2 children per family is rare & 3 is rarer still. That's why there are tv shows about those with more. Europe has fallen just won't admit it.

Originally posted by Aeons

Education, and legal protections and societal protection for female control of female fertility.

All areas in which women control their own fertility, and have primary legal control of their bodies, there is no population problem.

In all areas where men have created societal or legal obstructions to female control of female bodies, there is population problems.

[edit on 2009/5/25 by Aeons]

I couldn t aggre with you more. For me it go's like this :

If in the next 100 years population will increase up to 20 billion , this thought itseflt scares me a bit. But is is not because we don't have enought space on this planet ...but 20 billion living the same life,in the same way it s not a nice vison.In this case our grand- grand -children will have much bigger issues than the ones we're dealing with right now.

However 20 billion it's not too much if
-we change our educational system
- we fight against brainwashig
- we start increasing the use of free energy technology , which btw we should ve have done that years back( and not that we didn t have it back then ,but it hasn t been given to us, by those rich & greedy at the top)..,
- if we teach our children to respect nature
-and most important like Aeons said : if we give women all over the world ,legal control over their own fertility....maybe in this way ..growing up with this mentality would take out the whealthy manipulators at the top and would be replaced with people with honor...

Yes it sounds like utopia but not impossible..would it be done in 5 years,..no...of course not...it will take some time...But if we keep this kind of mentality of" oh it cant be done fast so therefor thats not a solution " - then we will never achieve anything...If a doctor would say " oh i want to be a surgeon but only if it takes 1 year instead of 6 or more, then we wouldn t have been able to save lives ,cause we wouldn ve have any doctors and surgeons. ..Evolution takes time..

Peace

He told us to live and be fruitful my friend I dont care what they tryen to do. And having children just makes you a more aggressive individual to deal with foreal so they can try the slick stuff and see how wild a human can and will act about they kids.

[edit on 7/31/09 by Ophiuchus 13]

Originally posted by Ophiuchus 13
He told us to live and be fruitful my friend I dont care what they tryen to do. And having children just makes you a more aggressive individual to deal with foreal so they can try the slick stuff and see how wild a human can and will act about they kids.

[edit on 7/31/09 by Ophiuchus 13]

HE didn't tell us to multiply until we are wallowing in our own excrement which is what it is coming to. All our waterways are polluted with human and animal feces. There is not a place in the wildest countryside where the water in the rivers or lakes is safe to drink.

The Utopians can preach all they want but we already have too many people on the planet. More of them will just mean more poor, undernourished 3rd worlders living not just in the 3rd world, but in a neightborhood near you.

Instead of preaching about what should be done for the desired 20 billions, how about creating theis Utopia for the 7 billion we have now?
It has yet to be proven that it can be done.
So how about do it first?

I'd really like to know why anyone now living desires to see this planet with 20 billion people. I'd like to know how and where they live. Ii wonder if they are people who do not need their own space. I wonder if they are comfortable in a crowd where there are people around them that are only 6 inches to 1 foot away. Studies show that most people prefer at least 3 feet. Me, I like at least 6 feet of my own space in any crowd.

I hear soon it will be against the law NOT to recycle in the UK.

If were FORCED to be greener then can we please not all be murdered to save the planet pretty please?

Maybe i'll recycle when they stop making these products in the first place...

Well actually I do recycle a bit as I live with mummy and daddy in a cosy house

But seriously I read all this crap about military testing huge nucleor weapons etc all the time... I feel sometimes

WHATS THE EFFING POINT SCRUBBING JAM OUT OF THIS GODDAM GLASS JAR TO RECYCLE WHEN GOVERNMENTS DO CRAP LIKE THIS THEN TELL US ITS OUR FAULT WE DESTORY THE PLANET AND NEED TO RECYCLE OR GO TO JAIL!

NO I will not buy into this 'we need to depopulate' solution of yours for 'we' the masses are not the problem, these corperations, military and governments need to wake up and realise they need to STOP creating these problems and deal with them.

the problem is much deeper than simply too many humans around.

Our entire system revolves around consumption. Products are designed to fail so we must replace them. This allows us to have jobs and corporations to profit.

If christmas light lasted forever you would never need to buy them again. Then the factory that makes them goes out of business. The workers get laid off. They cant pay their mortgage. Tax revenue for the state to build roads with drops. The state then cancels plans to build more roads so those workers arent making money now.

and on and on and on.

So we accept those christmas lights will stop working because they have too.

consumption will kill this planet faster than too many people.

The only solution is a radical one....get rid of money. Then we could have a system in place where houses, cars, all use the best technologies available and not just the cheapest stuff

How are you gonna do it?

To me, the "overpopulation" thing is nothing more than an excuse for genocide. There are better, very feasible ways to improve the quality of life in places like Africa and our relationship with the environment, such as the ideas of New Urbanism.

No OP, this planet needs a smarter population. Technology can solve any logistical problem we are having. With providing anything such as, food, water, shelter, clothing, education. Don't ask me how, I'm not going to do a quick search for things you can easily find on the web.

you cant just say i wont reproduce just to have a "Say" against nwo
its my right to have a son,and its my right as a father to defend him againts brainwashing and propaganda.and if theres no more space here well go to another planet and start trashing there

This whole overpopulation/need for depopulation is a human-loathing pile of twaddle.

It is only if one gives up on humans and sees them as nothing more than cattle that one can advocate the sort of mass genocide wanted by Kissinger et al.

So ultimately this belief doesn't come from any physical state of reality/number of people, but from pessimism.

It's also worth noting that Malthus was banging on about this 200 years ago when the global population was a small fraction of what it is now. He has been conclusively proven wrong.