Conservative radio hosts gets waterboarded, and lasts six seconds before saying its torture

So I have read a few people mention the burning and hanging from a bridge as torture.

This happened to Blackwater mercs yes?

That means they have no rights whatsoever as well, according to the logic used by some with regards to the Geneva Conventions. These people are non uniformed combatants in a war zone so anything that occurs to them is A OK right?

American citizens or not, they are technically enemy combatants according to the logic used by some.

Or is it because they are Americans that it is torture?

Originally posted by kinda kurious
Did anyone who watched the video( especially those claiming to be familiar with the technique) just happen to notice HE WAS NOT HELD DOWN?

He sprung up very quickly. Other demonstrations I have seen included the torturee ( new word) being held down by assistants, handcuffed or strapped to the table. They would endure the abuse at the control of interrogators. And repeated over and over again.

BIG DIFFERENCE NO?

Regards...KK




[edit on 22-5-2009 by kinda kurious]

Same with SERE training. The people undergoing this could make it stop..

Good point!

Originally posted by jerico65

Originally posted by bsbray11
It's nothing to have to apologize for, just like I won't apologize for what you believe.

Then secure your opinions about the topic. Just because you believe one thing doesn't make everyone else wrong.

In my opinion you're wrong, and you were the one who brought up a 9/11 reference, so you reap what you sow. Every time you bring up 9/11 talking about "terrorists," I'm going to bring up the fact that it was an inside job, the whole point/counterpoint thing.

How come no one seems to blame the insurgents that are killing women and children in the marketplace on an almost daily basis?

Those would stop too if weren't there, ya know? Those are ultimately our fault too, for pissing them off. When we finally leave, militarily and in all other political respects, we can say, "Your problem now, your responsibility." You seem to enjoy being callous, so that should resonate with you.

Don't know about Soldiers, but it's oh, so easy to blame them.

That article was about CIA agents abducting people, not soldiers. Soldiers are people, too. Would they abduct or detain innocent people by mistake? I'm sure it's possible, and without a court hearing you'd be torturing completely innocent people. That doesn't make us any better than them. We shouldn't be torturing anybody.

Court hearing? These aren't LA gangbangers or some guy that jacked your car.

You obviously bought into the load of crap. I didn't. I'm not afraid of being blown up by a Muslim terrorist, I never have been, I never will be. You are still talking about illegally torturing people. You know, the Nazis' big enemy was Communists! It was communists this, and communists that, and everyone hated them so much, the Nazis staged a couple of things and started going to wars with countries for no good reason. But lots of German people sure thought there was damn good reason, because they had become totally lost in the media frenzy that you're also lost in here in the US. We've done the same things and we're continuing on the same path. You can read news reports here of camps being contracted, built, etc. Obama is even mentioning them now. It is not a political right/left issue, it's a 'fascists are taking over our country' issue.

Originally posted by bsbray11
Let me guess, you think I'm a democrat.

Really don't care what you are. It's doesn't matter.

Yet you have no problem making cracks at me as if I'm a democrat, so it does kind of matter. Apparently you have trouble discriminating who you're talking to, and what you're talking about.

[edit on 22-5-2009 by bsbray11]

reply to post by spacedoubt

I think Tasers, and pepper spray need to be classed under the same category. Or are those ok, because we perform them on our own citizens?

There's a clear distinction. Police don't taser and pepper spray people who they have already captured and restrained. I would never be okay with an officer going into a prisoners cell and just spraying pepper spray in his face or tasering him. Doing so to subdue someone that you are trying to capture is another matter.

Also the taser and pepper spray are used to subdue the subject, they are not used to get answers out of the subject.

[edit on 22-5-2009 by rapinbatsisaltherage]

reply to post by Chevalerous


I hope that as a moderator, I am still permitted to have an opinion, as long as it is expressed in a civilized manner.

I did not say that water boarding and tasers were similar. I said that the reaction to tasers and pepper spray could be worse.

It seems to me that if we're going to call water boarding a form of torture, then the same should be said of those two "non-lethal" techniques.
I surely don't know for a fact, but I'd be willing to bet that more people have died as a reaction to a good tasering, than have died from Water boarding.
Anyone have a stat on that?

Originally posted by spacedoubt
reply to post by Chevalerous

 

I hope that as a moderator, I am still permitted to have an opinion, as long as it is expressed in a civilized manner.

I did not say that water boarding and tasers were similar. I said that the reaction to tasers and pepper spray could be worse.

It seems to me that if we're going to call water boarding a form of torture, then the same should be said of those two "non-lethal" techniques.
I surely don't know for a fact, but I'd be willing to bet that more people have died as a reaction to a good tasering, than have died from Water boarding.
Anyone have a stat on that?

No because waterboarding is a war crime which nations hide and conceal and don't keep stats on.

We, as a nation, has always considered Waterboarding a war crime. We helped prosecute the Japanese for it after WWII.

Hey Whimp- Water boarding is not torture. I have the full version of all our people getting their heads cut off while they are still alive. Would you like to see it so you can differentiate between torture and enhanced interrogation ?

send me a message if you want to see it and I'll make arrangement for you to see it. .................................get a life..............KMG

reply to post by rapinbatsisaltherage


I've seen them rub pepper spray into the eyes of non-violent protesters using Q-tips.

And due to the electrically disruptive nature of Tasers, it seems more deadly than water boarding.

Should we ever do anything to extract information from people that may have knowledge that could save numerous lives?

reply to post by its bologna


Could we taser a war criminal to extract information?
or put pepper spray in his Visine bottle?

Making Waves

It occurs to me that perhaps the whole waterboarding issue is just a case of poor marketing.

Maybe if the U.S. Government could work out a contract with a popular surf music band and turn waterboarding into the latest "teen craze" and beach party phenomenon, it would become so popular that people would insist on their right to be waterboarded...


[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/082935150bfc.jpg[/atsimg]

“Waterboarding? Like, dude... sign me up!”

Waterboarding With Me
(with apologies to the Beach Boys)

I got some information that the government wants from me now
(Come on, let's go waterboarding!)
But I would rather stay cool than suffer the third degree now
(Come on, let's go waterboarding!)
So I'll just hang on tight and see how long I can hold my breath now
(Come on, let's go waterboarding!)
And we can party away as we go waterboarding tonight!

(Telecaster and organ riff)

We got a bucket and a rag
And we're all getting ready to surf now
We're tipping back, tucking in, hanging on,
Heading up for a breath now

We thrash around, scream out loud, turn blue
And call for a lawyer
But the ride is the best since Huck Finn hit the waves
With Tom Sawyer

So come on, come on and go waterboarding with me!
Yeah come on, come on and go waterboarding with me!

Brian Wilson, eat your heart out.

I should dust off my microphone and record this.



(Just my personal opinion, nothing more.)


[edit on 5/22/2009 by Majic]

reply to post by WhatTheory


Since you were asked to waterboard yourself and you say you have been......do it again on tape or better yet live web cam. According to you it is not torture. So it if an easy thing to endure....DO IT AGAIN for us to see....perhaps you'll change a few opinions.

ALL torture is mental in it's intent.......even physical torture...your brain is the gate keeper. The most effective tool for coercion is exploiting mental attributes such as.... pain, fear, humiliation( abu Grab), extreme discomfort, phobias, threats to self and family, etc. The best techniques keep the detainee fit and healthy with the same results as the more extreme physical methods.


Regardless of your stance on the issue,

People......just call a spade a spade and stop dancing around the reality that is it torture.....no need for new phrases such as; "Enhanced Interrogation techniques". As many have said above...if it wasn't torture then why would the US gov use it....think about it.


TORTURE = SCREWING with your brain until it breaks down, using ANY means necessary.

How believable and reliable is the intel coming from a broke brain in capitivity?

Originally posted by spacedoubt
reply to post by rapinbatsisaltherage

 

I've seen them rub pepper spray into the eyes of non-violent protesters using Q-tips.

And due to the electrically disruptive nature of Tasers, it seems more deadly than water boarding.

Should we ever do anything to extract information from people that may have knowledge that could save numerous lives?

A previous poster already said this, but I will make the point she did..those techniques pepper spray and tasers are used to subdue. I think tasers should be outlawed, yes. They do cause death.

No, when we resort to those techniques we become just like them. It is a matter of principle, and a principle I'm willing to die for..

reply to post by spacedoubt

It seems to me that if we're going to call water boarding a form of torture, then the same should be said of those two "non-lethal" techniques.

Again, I think it is relevant to point out that those techniques are briefly used to subdue people, when torture is usually classified as a method that inflicts pain or suffering to punish, intimidate, or to receive information from a subject.





[edit on 22-5-2009 by rapinbatsisaltherage]

reply to post by rapinbatsisaltherage

There's a clear distinction. Police don't taser and pepper spray people who they have already captured and restrained.

Mercy sakes Bat girl. Excellent point!

Star from me.

Regards...KK


[edit on 23-5-2009 by kinda kurious]

reply to post by spacedoubt

I've seen them rub pepper spray into the eyes of non-violent protesters using Q-tips.

That sounds like excessive force, which is illegal.

And due to the electrically disruptive nature of Tasers, it seems more deadly than water boarding.

I wouldn't know, I've never seen statistics on the deadliness of tasers or water boarding.

Should we ever do anything to extract information from people that may have knowledge that could save numerous lives?

No. I'm against torturing terrorist for the same reason I'm against torturing citizens who may be able to help one find a missing child. Torture is wrong and barbaric and often does not obtain accurate information.

reply to post by rapinbatsisaltherage


Usually they are. A brief encounter with 30,000 volts.
I wonder what goes through someone's mind in that brief period of time?
I also think it's possible that tasers have been used for purposes other than subduing. Like getting that drug dealer to talk.

But again, I think the voltage could be more lethal, than an inverted face full of water. So if we're going to declare this torture, we should take a look at other non-lethal instruments as well.

reply to post by spacedoubt

Well you can believe that if you like, but I've never heard of such a case.

Like getting that drug dealer to talk.

That would be illegal because that is not the intended use. Doesn't make tasering torture because some people have abused their intended use.

But again, I think the voltage could be more lethal, than an inverted face full of water.

Again, I wouldn't know and can not make up my mind on such an issue based on a hypothetical that doesn't present any evidence.

Originally posted by spacedoubt
reply to post by Chevalerous

 

I hope that as a moderator, I am still permitted to have an opinion, as long as it is expressed in a civilized manner.

I did not say that water boarding and tasers were similar. I said that the reaction to tasers and pepper spray could be worse.

It seems to me that if we're going to call water boarding a form of torture, then the same should be said of those two "non-lethal" techniques.
I surely don't know for a fact, but I'd be willing to bet that more people have died as a reaction to a good tasering, than have died from Water boarding.
Anyone have a stat on that?

Hey spacy!

Of course I need to respect your opinon on this, but it doesn't matter if we are talking tasering guns or water boarding or what else that is sick to do to another human being!

If someone is a terrorists and you can honestly prove this? - I'm certainly not going to stand in your way!

But this general madness in your society needs to stop now!


Man! whatta hell happened to you guys?

Not all of these guys picked up are guilty you know? - or at least I hope you know this?

If you are so bent on going your own way solving this, we're going to have problems wordwide! - and devide people further apart!

Well I don't know what to tell you? but the torture must stop!

furthermore, it's affecting people who only make their decisions based on propaganda & xenophobia and it need to stop!!

Kill the guilty terrorists in battle, or strangle them for all that I care, but don't deny the more innocent bunch a fair trial!

[edit on 23-5-2009 by Chevalerous]

reply to post by rapinbatsisaltherage


yeah, like sticking one end of a power cord to socket and the other to fingers..its not the intended use, but it could be used as a torture device.

Tasering or using pepper spray repeatedly can be torture.

Well I think it is torture but I still think it is okay to torture radicalized animalistic muslims.I was disapointed to find out it only happened to three of them!