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Conservative radio hosts gets waterboarded, and lasts six seconds before saying its torture

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posted on May, 23 2009 @ 08:52 AM
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reply to post by laiguana
 


So did you strap yourself to a board and have someone dump bath water down your cloth covered face and throat?

I don't see how you could have tried water boarding while bathing. Can you clarify? And if you didnt mind it, why not get a few friends together and re-enact a true water boarding scenario? You know, strapped to a board, upside down cloth over face, etc.




posted on May, 23 2009 @ 08:55 AM
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Originally posted by FlyersFan
Yes, waterboarding is torture. No, I don't care that they did it to THREE terrorists who said they would destroy America and kill Americans.


Ethnocentrism at it's finest.

If you lived in a foreign land, I suppose you could simply replace the word America with your homeland?

(Especially considering your nation was attacked by unfriendly occupiers.)

Hypocritical much?



posted on May, 23 2009 @ 09:37 AM
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reply to post by thefreepatriot
 


Ive seen your insurgents as you like to call them kill kids and there mothers at a park playing. Drove by in a pickup firing an AK 47 out the window.I don't know about you but i think that qualifies as a terrorist. Guess what we caught him and handed him over to Iraqi security they probably tortured him i hope. All you people who are just fundamentally against war have picked up on torture issue. Well i hate to tell You Islamic extremists will kill you your family your friends and no amount of sugar coating will change that. I was toild directly to my face that this individual was going to escape and kill more Americans and jews.

I had to do prisoner transports to Kandahar airport sometimes when i got my all expense paid vacation to hell and i will tell you The are convinced they are killing for Allah. And have such a hatred towards the west its almost hard to describe. They feel we are the great Satan and until western civilization falls Allah cannot bring peace to the earth. So my suggestion is either buck up and start taking it seriously or you better convert now and start praying 5 times a day to Allah.



posted on May, 23 2009 @ 09:54 AM
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Just a passing thought (and I've read much of this particular post) in a war we kill people. Not something anyone does on a daily basis. But war is basically killing people. Or as Patton said, "The object of war is not to die for your country, but to make the other son of a bitch die for his".
It seems that we are more "ok" with the thought of killing than we are with "torture".
I don't get it. We can shoot the bast$#@d in the face but it's bad to pour water in that same face?
We can blow up an entire town, but deny food and sleep and we're evil?
How is killing more morally acceptable than torture?



posted on May, 23 2009 @ 10:00 AM
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reply to post by yellowcard
 


So this guy is a hardened man apt at, and guilty of, killing people in the name of his god? Murder is his life, his mission, his goal?

Or what am I missing?


Wait, a radio bloke?

Whew. 6 seconds you say? 4 or 5 seconds more than most shock jocks can handle without a timeout button.

Pointless.



posted on May, 23 2009 @ 10:02 AM
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I once supported this torture tactic, then was naive about it, but after multiple people doing it and saying it is horrible, I am now fully against it.

Can't believe I actually thought this was okay...just thinking about them doing it to our own soldiers makes me cringe.

I have said that in an unfair game (war), rules are subjective (such as this), but just because war isn't right, doesn't make this right either.



posted on May, 23 2009 @ 10:04 AM
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Originally posted by grover
...having come close to drowning a couple of times in my life and I can say without equivocation that it is a terrifying experience and even if you know that you aren't drowning... your body doesn't and will react like it does... with panic.


But you put yourself in that situation multiple times, of your own accord.

Strange no?

There are people on this planet who would see us all dead and smile at this concept.

Why do so many people ignore this?

People HATE you for not who you are, or what you are, but because you were born apart from them.

Ugh...... I have no words allowed here to explain my feelings.

as they say in cod, qq less and pew pew more.




posted on May, 23 2009 @ 10:37 AM
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reply to post by mikerussellus
 


Actually I am one that is neither for killing or torturing, both are two sides of the same coin.... There are a lot of combat veterans that I have known that will tell you that their friends that were killed in action are better off than those of us that have had to live taking worthless medications to dull our senses and mask symptoms of PTSD. A number of these same guys have died prematurely from stress related ailments and some have taken their own lives .... The greatest way that we could honour these victims of war this coming Memorial Day, would be to change our attitude about warfare and work toward benefiting humanity rather than promoting inhumanity.



posted on May, 23 2009 @ 10:51 AM
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Who cares about this whole "waterboaring" issue? How is this a leftwing vs. rightwing issue? It's not. It's a common sense issue. Stuff like this is necessary to get information we need from people that want to harm us. What are we supposed to do? Nothing? If there's a terrorist threat, do we sit on our hands? Look what other countries do. Pump you full of chemicals. Kidnap your family and cut them up until you talk. Cut off parts of your body until you talk. Let you bleed out until you talk. Burn you until you talk. Pull your joints apart until you talk. This is a COMMON SENSE ISSUE. It doesn't call lasting physical damage and preys on your fears instead - and don't quote me a few incidents. It doesn't harm you like, say, cutting off a finger until you talk does.

Again, this is NOT a leftwing vs. rightwing issue. This is a "I like my country" vs. "I don't like my country" issue. If you're against this, I'm just starting to assume that you hate this country or are so blinded by hate towards the Bush Administration, you can't see the forest for the trees. If you're against waterboarding, GIVE ME A BETTER SOLUTION ON HOW WE CAN GET INFORMATION FROM BAD PEOPLE without causing lasting physical harm. I challenge you. Or are you just ignorant?



posted on May, 23 2009 @ 11:15 AM
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reply to post by sos37
 


True that. It's nice to see someone think with common sense.



posted on May, 23 2009 @ 11:18 AM
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In all truth, from what I have seen and heard about this waterboarding, I do believe it is torture, but it is at least a little bit ethical when compared to other forms. The feeling is simulated, it's all mental. This whole scandal over waterboarding really makes me mad to be honest. America has yet to see the pictures I, and many of you have probably seen. Mutilation, beheadings, electrocutions, etc are all done upon our soldiers, and where is the stink from the American people about that? Lets compare waterboarding to the soldier who is tied down on a metal bed frame and electrocuted. That does serious damage, the feeling is real, not simulated. We are way too moral about our views of torture, and as a result, we're hurting ourselves in the long run. What do terrorists have to be scared of? Pretty soon we'll only be able to talk to them, no contact whatsoever, because we're too sensitive. And you know what's happening while we're not doing anything? They're beheading and mutilating our soldiers over there, with no fear. What's the worst that's going to happen right? We're a kind country.



posted on May, 23 2009 @ 11:34 AM
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reply to post by ChocoTaco369
 

A better solution would be to treat any combatant with dignity and respect and show them that we aren't the Great Satan that they have been conditioned to believe we are. Mistreatment reinforces what they believe and justifies their reluctance to communicate, in the long run adds fuel to the fire, creates more anti American sentiment, and harsher treatment for Americans taken captive.... Torture will not provide usable intelligence and really works against us.



posted on May, 23 2009 @ 11:38 AM
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I think "Marathon Man" torture would be pretty interesting.

"Is it safe?"

I don't know, this whole thread is really comparing apples an oranges.

This Madcow or whatever he's called is not a crazed terrorist(sure we've tortured those who aren't as well, mistakes do happen). But to gauge his reaction toward a "real" terrorist, whom has "real" secrets to withhold doesn't prove a damn thing in my opinion.

First of all, I could survive at least 30-45 seconds of that just by holding my breath. Unless in "real" waterboarding techniques they use a device to keep the mouth open. Why is the guy holding his nose shut, wouldn't it be more effective and painful if water went up his nose, I know when I' in the pool and that happens it burns like hell.

But really if you look at torture over the years I mean spanning back to the Iron Maiden, The Rack, The pear, ect...this water boarding is childs play.

I've even seen recent footage of a Middle Eastern Woman, forget what country it was a while ago. But they jammed a funnel down her throat, loaded her up with some 3-5 gallons of water, then placed a board over her stomach, and had men stand on each side, "see-sawing" pressure on her stomach, till she was forced to vomit, painfully. This was reapeated a few times, not for to gather info, but as punishment for probably not wearing a veil or some nonsense.

I really don't know where all the sympathy for these folks are comeing from, unless you all believe 9/11 was an inside job???

Hey one can hope can't he.



posted on May, 23 2009 @ 11:49 AM
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reply to post by Nola213
 


He wanted the Marine to hold his nose, he said he would and then "I lied" as the water was being poured.... This act in itself proves that the people that do this to others are not honourable people and would not be above lying about the effectiveness of this form of torture.



posted on May, 23 2009 @ 11:52 AM
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Originally posted by laiguana
I tried water-boarding myself in the bath tub and it just felt like water going up my nose....Can't say it feels like torture. I mean sure, I couldn't breath for a moment, but I've experienced worse things than that. I don't really see what the big fuss is. It's a moderate interrogation technique...I'm not certain how effective it has proven to be, although I did read a few articles posted for both sides.


So you ducked under water in your bath, and believe that you know what water torture is like?

How about getting tied down and having people who hate you pour water over your face until you cant hold your breath any longer and start breathing it in.
Then they jeer at you and pour more until your desperately gasping lungs are full. Your attempts to breath no longer even make bubbles in your leaden lungs. Your blood pressure rises until your heart is galloping and your head feels like a bomb going off. Your body is panicking, close to death, struggling against the restraints. Finally your quivering body and bursting head know the relief of unconsciousness.
Then they tip you up to drain the water out, slap you back to consciousness and start again.

You know that they could easily kill you this way, and may if you don't sign their prewritten confession. And if you do sign, your confession will be used as proof that water-boarding works, and these hate-filled Christians will do it all the more to other Muslims, who they have declared an unholy war against.

All this with no trial, and no way to prove yourself innocent.



posted on May, 23 2009 @ 12:03 PM
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reply to post by Kailassa
 


The way you put it makes it sound so much more amusing...still, what I did covered the basics...I put a towel over my head and let the water from the faucet pour over my face. Kind of felt like going to the day spa actually. If this is the worst the terrorists have to experience then, goodness, that must be why they keep trying so hard....



posted on May, 23 2009 @ 12:17 PM
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reply to post by laiguana
 

You were in total control of the situation so of course you made it pleasurable. The pros no how to create an experience that is a living (really a dying) hell.... Has anyone heard of this practice being used on a White, Anglo Saxon, Protestant, in a non friendly environment and by other WASP.



posted on May, 23 2009 @ 12:29 PM
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reply to post by Kailassa
 


Your perception of water boarding isn't correct at all never any risk of drowning at least not the way the military conducts it. I would suggest you do a little more research and stop putting your own perceptions on whats its like you know no more than he does whats it like. Why not ask people that actually went through it. Ill tell you its absolutely terrifying even in my case where i knew they weren't going to kill me it is horrifying. By the way very little water actually goes into the nose and i don't know anyone thats going to open there mouth the rag is there so it feels like your face is under water. What your describing is physical abuse this technique is mental abuse there is a vast difference.And if your going to form an opinion at least get some real facts. heres some more for you:

As i stated previously 3 people were water boarded in US custody.It is horrific the amount of terror this can cause but it was done And all this talk about other methods of interrogation that can be used was turning out to be quite ineffective.

Army doctrine gives interrogators 16 “approaches” to induce prisoners of war to divulge critical information. These approaches aim to exploit a detainee’s self-love, allegiance to or resentment of comrades, or sense of futility. Applied in the right combination, they will work on nearly everyone or so we thought.

But the Kandahar prisoners were not playing by the army rule book. They divulged nothing. “Prisoners overcame the [traditional] model almost effortlessly,” writes Chris Mackey in The Interrogators, ive read this book and would highly recommend it before you pass judgement



The prisoners confounded their captors “not with clever cover stories but with simple refusal to cooperate. They offered lame stories, pretended not to remember even the most basic of details, and then waited for consequences that never really came.”


As much as you like to think interrogations aren't needed as i previously showed a terrorist plot on Los Angeles was diverted. What happened a person was forced to divulge information that saved peoples lives. Now whether water boarding should be used id have to say probably not but then again circumstances may arise where it would become necessary i don't know.But what i do know is discussing this just emboldens the enemy who already believes where weak. And you cant negotiate from a standing of weakness trust me.

Where not dealing with soldiers here this is a religious war to them has entirely different rules so interrogation techniques that works on soldiers has almost no effect on a religious zealot.



“Love of family” often had little purchase among the terrorists, however—as did love of life. “The jihadists would tell you, ‘I’ve divorced this life, I don’t care about my family,’ ” recalls an interrogator at Guantánamo. “You couldn’t shame them.” The fierce hatred that the captives bore their captors heightened their resistance. The U.S. ambassador to Pakistan reported in January 2002 that prisoners in Kandahar would “shout epithets at their captors, including threats against the female relatives of the soldiers guarding them, knee marines in the groin, and say that they will escape and kill ‘more Americans and Jews.’ ” Such animosity continued in Guantánamo.


Please believe me when i tell you the people i dealt with would kill your mother father sister brother and your dog and because they think god commands them to do so will rejoice at there death. Am i ok with water boarding to be honest no not really do i think its good to tell the world what we are willing to do and how far we are willing to go no i dont.



posted on May, 23 2009 @ 12:31 PM
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The more I read the posts from this, the less faith I have in the US. As a Canadian, I must say I'm pretty disgusted with most of the people posting here. Don't you understand that the world is not just a #ing playground for your troops? Don't you guys ever ask yourselves WHY are these people mad at America? It's not just because of your "western way of living" I'll tell you that much. Maybe because your invading their countries, and your government has been relentlessly funding brutal dictatorships for their own benefits for the past what...60-70 years? Those of you who think it's a good idea waterboarding these "terrorists" should look at the bigger picture here. How many of those people locked up at Guantanamo are completely innocent, and had ZERO connection to 9/11 or ANY terrorist organization, and are only there on mere suspicion? You ignorant idiots are assuming everybody there is a terrorist, which is the furthest thing from the truth. Your government is the biggest terrorist of them all. Overnight, secret kidnappings from their homes, without telling their families. Rendition is terror, invading countries like Iraq to quench your thirst for oil, even though they had nothing to do with 9/11...that's terror my friends. Why don't you guys start waterboarding your government officials guilty behind those charges, and see what kind of information you can get out of them? I'm not defending those insane Islamic crazies, but they certainly aren't any worse than some of the nationalistic idiots on this site that clearly think that the USA owns the world, and has every right to kill innocent people in Iraq and Afghanistan without repercussion.



posted on May, 23 2009 @ 12:39 PM
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reply to post by yellowcard
 


I've tried to get that bodily 'reaction' while in the shower and I can get that gag/drowning reflex to kick in. And it's bloody awful!

Basically while having a shower, I have my head face down with the shower head hitting the top of my head full stream and water pouring over my scalp and running down my face and flowing off. A light shower doesn't cut it - you need to have good strong shower pressure so the water is engulfing your head.

As the water runs down my face and over and around my nose and mouth (but not *into*) I then breath in slowly through my nose only. I don't actually inhale in water - but the feeling of the water right by my nostrils and mouth as I try to slowly inhale makes my lungs and entire upper body convulse as though I was trying to stop myself from taking in water while swimming.

I repeat this and can feel my pulse quicken and even though I am completely in control, my eyes are open and it's all my decision, I can feel my body instrinctively reacting to the process.

It's very fascinating, in a "controlled" way. And of course, this is me just standing in the shower trying to have a bit of fun to see if I can get it to work.

I couldn't imagine how it would be under real circumstances: lying on an inclined board, hands bound, blind-folded and having water poured onto a wet flannel over your mouth and nose. You try to breath but the water reflex kicks in and your body automatically stops you as it thinks you're drowning. So you panic, adrenaline kicks in and you heart rate jumps and you breath even more deeper, and it gets worse.

I cannot see how it would be anything but torture!





[edit on 23-5-2009 by noonebutme]



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