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Conservative radio hosts gets waterboarded, and lasts six seconds before saying its torture

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posted on May, 23 2009 @ 06:24 AM
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A rag tag bunch of terrorist maybe a million strong at best cannot destroy America... stop being so hysteric.




posted on May, 23 2009 @ 06:30 AM
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Originally posted by grover
A rag tag bunch of terrorist maybe a million strong at best cannot destroy America... stop being so hysteric.


Wrong again.

America is based on freedom and liberty. All it will take is for terrorist to start hitting soft targets and American freedom will decrease. You will have dog's sniffing bags before people enter places like Wal-Mart and checkpoints while you are driving.

Also weapons are getting smaller and with the backing of China and Russia it will be easier for them to get.

Sadly we have a "Code Pink" foreign policy that thinks if they like us they will not attack us. This is just dangerous.



posted on May, 23 2009 @ 06:39 AM
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GOOD FOR MANCOW!

The guy put his money where his mouth was and he actually investigated to see what waterboarding really is. Good for him.



Yes, waterboarding is torture. No, I don't care that they did it to THREE terrorists who said they would destroy America and kill Americans.

I'd rather those three terrorists be tortured and our lives saved then have us spare them and Americans die.



posted on May, 23 2009 @ 06:53 AM
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Originally posted by platosallegory
This means nothing.

Mancow wasn't the mastermind behind 9/11 that killed 3,000 Americans and he hasn't boasted about beheading Daniel Pearl.

If you'd studied the Daniel Pearl beheading you would see a lot of things about that video did not add up, except as a false flag made to convince us that this is what 'Islamicists" are like.



People are crying for KSM and this is just phony outrage. Nobody has died from waterboarding, but over 300 people have died from being tasered by police. You don't see these phony tears for Taser victims because this is about politics and not torture. The people who were waterboarded still enjoy 3 hots and a cot but the people who were tasered are dead.

Like many others, I have worked as hard to stop Tasering as I have against torture.
But, aside from that, it's a logical fallacy to suggest someone has no right to be arguing one point because they should be arguing another.

By the way, people have died from waterboarding.



War is dirty and values have nothing to do with it when you are facing an enemy that wants to destroy you. The ends justify the means because the ends is the end of your country as you know it if bombs start going off everywhere.

Who is this enemy who wants to destroy you?

Iraq, who was America's friend, who America supplied with ingredients for, and facilities to process, toxic gases for chemical warfare and who had nothing to do with 9/11?

One of the many different Osama bin Ladens featured in the fake videos we were shown?

Cheney and co and Mossad, who co-operated to stage 9/11?

Or the average American, who is so keen to see individual freedoms legislated away and to lose all the privacy and freedom of speech the founding fathers wanted this nation to enjoy?



Values have no place in war and this is why the Founders gave the President extraordinary powers during war time. They knew it was more important to survive instead of living up to some liberal fantasy.

The Founders would be turning in their graves if they saw decency, justice and freedom being dismissed as "some liberal fantasy".
Many staunch republicans also hold these values dear.



If we are blown to bits what good are these values? People will say that I'm using scare tactics but if I have to use scare tactics to convince you that these guys are determined to destroy us then you don't understand what 9/11, the U.S.S. Cole and more means.

You could be right that the people responsible for 9/11 and the attacks on the USS Cole are determined to destroy us. So perhaps you should investigate who carried out these crimes instead of swallowing the official story.

- A clue for you.
It's highly probable the attack on the USS Cole was carried out by the same country that attacked the USS Liberty.


KSM took waterboarding 183 times before he cracked. Mancow couldn't last a few seconds. What this tells me is that America is in trouble. War is about the will to win and if this guy could take this 183 times they are determined to destroy us.

Before KSM "cracked, he was co-operating with the FBI and giving them useful information.
After he cracked all they got for him was the confession they wanted, linking Iraq with 9/11.

For so many years we regarded Russia with contempt, as they would use underhand methods of obtaining exactly the confession the government wanted, regardless of its veracity.
Now we imitate them.

I'm sure that after 183 waterboardings, you'd confess to murdering Superman.



These guys kill people over the slightest thing and to them our values need to be destroyed.

"These guys" indeed.
Do you realise it's been a paying proposition for years to manufacture evidence against someone and sell them to the Americans?
- Who then would round up the suspects family as leverage, to rape and torture in front of them?

You have no idea who most of the people Americans have tortured are, yet you are blithely certain that they all deserve it.
Regardless of the fact that torture comes before trial, not after.
In fact, for many, they never have a trial, and never have a chance to prove their innocence.


[edit on 23/5/09 by Kailassa]



posted on May, 23 2009 @ 07:14 AM
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Now that we're all wrapped up in global warming and waterboarding, what are they doing behind our backs?

If waterboarding is good enough for American servicemen/women, it's sure good enough for someone who wants to kill us.

Wonder how lives would have been lost in Los Angeles without waterboarding? Do people really believe that milk and cookies is route to take?

Honestly, I'm more concerned about where all of the "bail-out" monies have gone! That's another thread.

Have a blessed Memorial Day weekend and remember our fallen heros!




posted on May, 23 2009 @ 07:17 AM
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Well this may be off topic but I have to ask, what is the alternative to be then?

Let us be honest for a minute. Simply capturing and asking repeatedly for information is not going to break the will to say no. Holding a person indefinitely is not going to break their will to say no. In fact, I am not exactly sure that repeated waterboarding sessions would break a person's will if they know for sure that they are not going to die.

The exception would be knowing that in telling the information will cause the sessions to end. At that point, it would be a matter of trust in your captors, would it not?

I will go out on a limb and say that more people condone "torture" far more readily than they think. Is not the screaming child being told no to the toy or candy that they want a form of mental anguish and undue stress from the perspective of the child? Yet we do it daily because we know what is right. Because if you give in and buy the item, buckle under to the wants and desires, you have taught that outrageous public spectacle is an effective means to achieve a goal. While I acknowledge the world of difference between a temper tantrum and suicide bombing in a crowded market, the underling motivations are exactly the same....throwing the most horrific sh* fit that you can to get what you want from the authoritarian.


And as a side note to spacedoubt--immersion in cold or cool whole milk will end the burning of pepper spray much faster than flushing with water. And also, to add to your trivia knowledge, ducks are immune to the effects of pepper spray. I would guess that geese are as well.



posted on May, 23 2009 @ 07:21 AM
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Originally posted by grover

Originally posted by platosallegory
Next... you have not been paying attention... KSM had been giving valuable intelligence before he was water boarded and clammed up afterward... and what were they looking for when the started water boarding him? They were trying to get him to say that there was a link between Saddam Hussein and Al Qeada.


I wish to correct myself.

According to this article: www.timesonline.co.uk...

KSM would not talk until he was waterboarded... but it took only once to get him to start confessing to everything.

Still... what were the other 182 times all about? To get him to say that there was a connection between Al Qaeda and Iraq.

[edit on 23-5-2009 by grover]



posted on May, 23 2009 @ 07:25 AM
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Originally posted by kettlebellysmith
These prisoners don't know what torture is. Yet!


I disagree. Im sure many of the POW's know exactly what torture is. Further, Im sure there are a number of disappeared POWs that know what torture is. People we will not hear testimony from, people that no longer exist in any book.



posted on May, 23 2009 @ 07:38 AM
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reply to post by jerico65
 


........... yes under the geneva convention you are treated as enemy combatants... but from what i understand it also means you are not to be tortured........................................



posted on May, 23 2009 @ 07:40 AM
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reply to post by FlyersFan
 


well.... the real terrorists behind 911 aren't muslims.... they where the people in power during that time period.......you should already know that 911 was an inside job...???????????? and so the question is should these people really be tortured? and as far as the insurgents in iraq being labeled "terrorists" .....you should know thats wrong as well...



posted on May, 23 2009 @ 07:53 AM
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This not the real proper way waterboarding is done!

This gives the wrong impression to the people watching it, even if the message gets through from the radio host!

This was like waterboarding - the light version!

There are two ways of waterboarding!

You could have them laying down as in the video, using a hose that flows water all the time down your throat!

If you don't have a hose you have 3 guys with big buckets rotating, pouring water down the throat of the torture victim.

Or you could have them standing on their knees in front of a bathtub and put their head up & down into the water for long times, almost until their lungs bursts! - this was the speciality of the IRA !

Showing this to the people is not the whole truth how it is done in my opinion!

I tried to analyse the video!

And I found out that they want to imprint into people minds that 'this visual impression of waterboarding with a jar on a bench at the doctor's!

It's too clinical! to get the right impression of waterboarding in this video

Everywhere right now it's like they want this (visual version of water boarding) message to get out and get imprited into people's head!

It's like the use of the flu buzz word: mild

Now they are planting the buzz word: waterboarding

Maybe they want the people to believe that this is the only torture method that is being done by the interrogators?

I have not cracked this nut yet! - need more time to analyse this video together with other messages out there on the net.

But I also understand it would be difficult to simulate the waterboarding the proper way in some office!

*shrug*

Do I make any sence of what I just said, at all here?


[edit on 23-5-2009 by Chevalerous]



posted on May, 23 2009 @ 07:56 AM
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Originally posted by dragonridr


I don't get it if it wasn't torture they wouldn't use it.The difference is it creates terror which can be used to gain information. It is mental torture without the physical effects. They aren't using battery cables cutting off fingers burning out an eye with a hot poker. Physical torture goes into creating fear and physical injury. Mental torture plays off fear of drowning freezing to death anything they can do to break there will. There will tells them not to cooperate you have to convince them this is not in there best interest to do so. If water boarding didn't create terror what would be the point really? Are we supposed to ask real nice for the terrorist to give us information?



So, is this what's one of these "interviews" are supposed to sound like?

"Mr. Khalid Sheik Mohammed, thank you for joining us this morning. Some coffee or maybe a Coke before we begin? Oh, and I'm sorry. Yeah...you'll have to remove the headphones from your iPod. Yeah, it's a rule. I agree, and on behalf of the entire United States government and the President himself, let me apologize that someone didn't explain that in advance.

Oh, I agree...that Lady Gaga really has it going on. Nonetheless, please, you'll have to take off the headphones. But remember, you're signed up for our "Spa Sensation" right after luncheon. Hey - what would a massage be without a little music? You can listen then. OK? Good.

Now Mohammed. Can I call you Mohammed? About this whole September 11 situation, Mohammed. Would you mind telling me who planned the unfortunate event?... Oh, don't be silly. It's fine if you say you don't know. All we want is what you know to be the truth. We'd hate to have you feel that you must lie or unjustly point the finger at any of your friends. Hey, it ain't right for a guy to rat out his friends -- am I right? C'mon, Sheiky...am I right?

...So, really, you don't know anything? Nothing?...Hmmm.What about -- oh. Not that, either, huh? Or maybe you could tell me about the guy who -- really? Yikes. Screwed that one up, too. We thought you knew him.

Yes, that's right! "Our bad!" Ha, ha! Good one! ...Yes! "L-O-L!!!" You've got quite a sense of humor!

Hey, I've enjoyed this. And we hope our time together hasn't been an imposition in your day. And we certainly do appreciate that you pulled yourself away from your prep work for your appearance on Oprah. Well, look. Why don't we meet up tomorrow and talk a bit more then. Maybe, just maybe, you might remember something about September 11 and we can spend a few minutes talking about it.

What's a good time for you? Oh, heck yes. Check your activity schedule and get back to me. ...OK. Your "people" will get back to me. Whatever works for you."

Sure. I'd be glad to validate your parking...What do you think we are? Infidels?"


that my freind is the single greatest post i have ever read in my life



posted on May, 23 2009 @ 08:01 AM
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"Now if the bank manager thinks he's a cowboy, you gotta break that mother real quick. Cut off his finger, the little one, then tell him his thumb is next; after that...he'll tell if he wears womens underwear."

Seriously, that seems a pretty good, harmless way of getting someone to talk. I mean unless they are a real soldier. But I think Mancow woulda given up anything he knew after a few sessions of that.

That is really nothing compared to medieval torture devices. Anyone ever seen "the pear"? Hell I'd tell you anything just looking at that damned thing.

[edit on 23-5-2009 by Nola213]



posted on May, 23 2009 @ 08:05 AM
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Originally posted by platosallegory

Originally posted by grover
A rag tag bunch of terrorist maybe a million strong at best cannot destroy America... stop being so hysteric.


Wrong again.

America is based on freedom and liberty. All it will take is for terrorist to start hitting soft targets and American freedom will decrease. You will have dog's sniffing bags before people enter places like Wal-Mart and checkpoints while you are driving.

Also weapons are getting smaller and with the backing of China and Russia it will be easier for them to get.

Sadly we have a "Code Pink" foreign policy that thinks if they like us they will not attack us. This is just dangerous.


sorry, had to edit out my own post...it got too personal, name calling and all that...but this does show why "waterboarding" doesn't work. as many have already said before; someone having this done to them, will tell the interrogator anything he wants to hear...invalidating the confession. and by the way, what is code pink foreign policy. do you even know what the code pink organization is about? or who they are? or what they are protesting? it sounds like you equate pink to being weak? wow, what a towering and expansive intellect you possess, i'm in awe.

[edit on 23-5-2009 by jimmyx]

[edit on 23-5-2009 by jimmyx]

[edit on 23-5-2009 by jimmyx]



posted on May, 23 2009 @ 08:09 AM
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Originally posted by batch

Originally posted by dragonridr


I don't get it if it wasn't torture they wouldn't use it.The difference is it creates terror which can be used to gain information. It is mental torture without the physical effects. They aren't using battery cables cutting off fingers burning out an eye with a hot poker. Physical torture goes into creating fear and physical injury. Mental torture plays off fear of drowning freezing to death anything they can do to break there will. There will tells them not to cooperate you have to convince them this is not in there best interest to do so. If water boarding didn't create terror what would be the point really? Are we supposed to ask real nice for the terrorist to give us information?



So, is this what's one of these "interviews" are supposed to sound like?

"Mr. Khalid Sheik Mohammed, thank you for joining us this morning. Some coffee or maybe a Coke before we begin? Oh, and I'm sorry. Yeah...you'll have to remove the headphones from your iPod. Yeah, it's a rule. I agree, and on behalf of the entire United States government and the President himself, let me apologize that someone didn't explain that in advance.

Oh, I agree...that Lady Gaga really has it going on. Nonetheless, please, you'll have to take off the headphones. But remember, you're signed up for our "Spa Sensation" right after luncheon. Hey - what would a massage be without a little music? You can listen then. OK? Good.

Now Mohammed. Can I call you Mohammed? About this whole September 11 situation, Mohammed. Would you mind telling me who planned the unfortunate event?... Oh, don't be silly. It's fine if you say you don't know. All we want is what you know to be the truth. We'd hate to have you feel that you must lie or unjustly point the finger at any of your friends. Hey, it ain't right for a guy to rat out his friends -- am I right? C'mon, Sheiky...am I right?

...So, really, you don't know anything? Nothing?...Hmmm.What about -- oh. Not that, either, huh? Or maybe you could tell me about the guy who -- really? Yikes. Screwed that one up, too. We thought you knew him.

Yes, that's right! "Our bad!" Ha, ha! Good one! ...Yes! "L-O-L!!!" You've got quite a sense of humor!

Hey, I've enjoyed this. And we hope our time together hasn't been an imposition in your day. And we certainly do appreciate that you pulled yourself away from your prep work for your appearance on Oprah. Well, look. Why don't we meet up tomorrow and talk a bit more then. Maybe, just maybe, you might remember something about September 11 and we can spend a few minutes talking about it.

What's a good time for you? Oh, heck yes. Check your activity schedule and get back to me. ...OK. Your "people" will get back to me. Whatever works for you."

Sure. I'd be glad to validate your parking...What do you think we are? Infidels?"


that my freind is the single greatest post i have ever read in my life


Yes Funny and very well written!


Love the humour!



posted on May, 23 2009 @ 08:14 AM
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They who would give up an essential liberty for temporary security, deserve neither liberty or security.
Ben Franklin

Enough said.

[edit on 23-5-2009 by grover]



posted on May, 23 2009 @ 08:15 AM
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Originally posted by WhatTheory
Just because Mancow is a wussy does not mean waterboarding is torture.


Waterboarding is NOT torture.
IF it was torture, then I guess the military tortures it's own troops since it is part of their training.
IF it was torture, that Shiek fellow would be dead since he got the treatment something like 83 times.

Waterboarding is mental and not physical. Apparently Mancow is not mentally tough.


Would you care to get a digital video camera some medical professionals, a person trained in 'waterbording' a 7' plank and a towel and then show us your response to simulated drowning? I'm sure ATS would be an appropriate forum.

P.s. I'm in no way encouraging just anyone to try this on a whim... It is a dangerous practice.



posted on May, 23 2009 @ 08:32 AM
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reply to post by CX
 


Thanks for posting. Very powerful and although a recreation, much closer than Mancow's "stunt" which I had pointed out pages ago, he was not restrained.

Star to your posts from me. Regards...KK

[edit on 23-5-2009 by kinda kurious]



posted on May, 23 2009 @ 08:48 AM
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I tried water-boarding myself in the bath tub and it just felt like water going up my nose....Can't say it feels like torture. I mean sure, I couldn't breath for a moment, but I've experienced worse things than that. I don't really see what the big fuss is. It's a moderate interrogation technique...I'm not certain how effective it has proven to be, although I did read a few articles posted for both sides.



posted on May, 23 2009 @ 08:51 AM
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11. .... Although there is no federal law criminalizing torture per se, any act falling within the Convention's definition of torture is clearly illegal and prosecutable everywhere in the country, for example as an assault or battery, murder or manslaughter, kidnapping or abduction, false arrest or imprisonment, sexual abuse, or violation of civil rights. [p. 6]

49. Torture has always been proscribed by the Eighth Amendment to the United States Constitution, which prohibits "cruel and unusual punishments." This Amendment is directly applicable to actions of the Federal Government and, through the Fourteenth Amendment, to those of the constituent states.... While the constitutional and statutory law of the individual states in some cases offers more extensive or more specific protections, the protections of the right to life and liberty, personal freedom and physical integrity found in the Fourth, Fifth and Eighth Amendments to the United States Constitution provide a nationwide standard of treatment beneath which no governmental entity may fall. The constitutional nature of this protection means that it applies to the actions of officials throughout the United States at all levels of government; all individuals enjoy protection under the Constitution, regardless of nationality or citizenship. [p. 13]

47. In 1994, Congress enacted a new federal law to implement the requirements of the Convention against Torture relating to acts of torture committed outside United States territory. This law, which is codified at 18 U.S.C. § 2340 et seq., extends United States criminal jurisdiction over any act of (or attempt to commit) torture outside the United States by a United States national or by an alleged offender present in the United States regardless of his or her nationality. The statute adopts the Convention?s definition of torture, consistent with the terms of United States ratification. It permits the criminal prosecution of alleged torturers in federal courts in specified circumstances. [p. 13]

www.amnestyusa.org...



we have treaties signed outside of the geneva convention that kind of makes torture illegal. it's the UN that is demanding that we investigate and prosecute (if needed) those involved. and gee, sorry, but we seem to owe the world a heck of alot of money and we are very dependent on them lending us more! dependency=servitude.......keep your danged treaties and make them happy!!


and I am still stunned, many of those who are defending this are also part of the christian right camp......they would expect some poor 9 year old rape victim in I think it was peru, to carry twins, and just have faith that god will somehow work it out and she won't lose her life trying to give birth, but well......when it comes to their safety and well being, na......throw the rules out, forget about "faith" and "morals"......where in the world is YOUR FAITH???




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