Why I became the REAL Pro-Choice...Pro-Eugenics

Originally posted by justsomeboreddude
TO ALL THE PEOPLE THAT SAY I AM JOKING

Why cant a person change and have a new view on these matters? I listened to the other side and realized the error of my ways. This is no joke. It is just expanding on a good idea. You might ask, what is that good idea? Well that good idea is giving the people closest to you as well as yourselves to have CHOICE about whether you are good for the family and the world.

Dont you want the freedom to terminate yourself if you are unhappy or sick? Why should anyone, including the government, tell us whether we should live or die. We should leave that answer to our loved ones and to ourselves. Just think of the possibilities.

I can see your point about power over ones body. HOWEVER, how can you extend that to others detrmining whether you should live or die.

Youve got to be jokin, this is just incredulous

reply to post by Amagnon


Thank you for your post. I agree with you that we need to take control and empower people with the choices they need to find happiness. In the process we willl clean up the gene pool.

Originally posted by Toughiv

I can see your point about power over ones body. HOWEVER, how can you extend that to others detrmining whether you should live or die.

Youve got to be jokin, this is just incredulous

Really it is a small step in logic. I am just extending power over ones body to those in their immediate surroundings. I just inlcude the people they spend most of their lives with their families. Do you think its worse to carry a child you dont want for 9 months or be stuck with some mentally ill kid for 18 years or more? I mean come on. Do you want to spend the rest of your life dragging around some relative that is blurting out stuff in church or at walmart and embarrasing the living hell out of you?

[edit on 5/21/2009 by justsomeboreddude]

reply to post by Amagnon

I think eugenics is necessary, because natural selection is no longer going to be in charge of the gene pool - so we have to manage it ourselves, or we will end up with a population suffering from every conceivable genetic disease etc. My suggestion for a eugenics program would be to test mothers for capability, then either offer them a financial incentive (if they have no genetic issues, decent intelligence and physique etc) or a disincentive if they have a genetic disease, or are below average mentally or physically.

Being physically handicapped, one can be a valuble member of society,

reply to post by Stormdancer777


See this is where you misunderstand me. Sure some handicapped people can be an added benefit to society. That is why I leave it to the parents to decide if they want to raise this kid until they are 80. We may benefit to a degree by watching this handicapped person, but we arent the ones suffering on a daily basis to take care of them.

reply to post by justsomeboreddude

I mean come on. Do you want to spend the rest of your life dragging around some relative that is blurting out stuff in church or at walmart and embarrasing the living hell out of you?

All my children have done that.

LOLOLOLOL

reply to post by justsomeboreddude

What I'm really saying here is that I applaud your courage in 'checking out the alternative view.'

I am also saying that what seems 'right' today may seem 'otherwise' tomorrow.

Nobody should be judging anybody else for trying to learn how to use their own brains !!

We've had very little 'correct guidance' in this area from the 'system.'

As people learn how to 'reason objectively' we will all make 'errors.'

I am not saying you have arrived at the 'final solution.'

I'm just saying, IMHO you're doing the right things to 'get to the truth.'

reply to post by visible_villain


Thanks. I understand what you are saying. You dont totally support me but you support my journey. I agree over time I might alter my views in one direction or the other. That is just part of growing. I do feel like I have grown a lot lately and become more open in my thinking. I feel like a better person because of it, because I dont feel a need to force my views on the rest of society. I am able to be big enough to give all people CHOICE.

[edit on 5/21/2009 by justsomeboreddude]

reply to post by justsomeboreddude


Well we pretty much are cartakers of oneanother to one extent or another.

Hopefully the world will end soon some major catastrophe, alien invasion, cometary impact, plague, perhaps I can conjure one up and you wont have to worry.

reply to post by visible_villain

Hi villian, you never answered my question.


tap dancin all around that one , yes?

[edit on 013131p://bThursday2009 by Stormdancer777]

reply to post by Stormdancer777


I feel bad that you have such a negative world view. It is really not that bad. Maybe you have people in your life that are negative in one way or another and that affects your view of life. So hopefully if we can get support for this idea you can eliminate those people from your family so you can have hope again. Why should anyones life be negatively affected by their immediate family? Nobody deserves that. Let us all stand up for the choice to be free and happy and in control of our lives and the space around us.

[edit on 5/21/2009 by justsomeboreddude]

Originally posted by Stormdancer777
reply to post by Amagnon

 

I think eugenics is necessary, because natural selection is no longer going to be in charge of the gene pool - so we have to manage it ourselves, or we will end up with a population suffering from every conceivable genetic disease etc. My suggestion for a eugenics program would be to test mothers for capability, then either offer them a financial incentive (if they have no genetic issues, decent intelligence and physique etc) or a disincentive if they have a genetic disease, or are below average mentally or physically.

Being physically handicapped, one can be a valuble member of society,

I won't argue with that - however, imagine they had been born without the physical handicap? I am not saying remove people who are handicapped - I am saying remove the genetic diseases so that people don't HAVE to be born handicapped - and prevention is far better than cure. Simply select to increase the population who don't have those problems - then over time the number of people suffering those issues will reduce.

If we don't take charge of our genetic heritage - then EVERYONE eventually will be born handicapped. You would never CHOOSE to have a handicapped child - well think again, we as a society ARE choosing that path - and its illogical and cruel to force people to come handicapped into the world.

[edit on 21-5-2009 by Amagnon]

Originally posted by justsomeboreddude
reply to post by Ben Niceknowinya

 

Well I am not saying you have to terminate him. If you can deal with that for the rest of your life then that is great. I am just saying lets give people the freedom to choose. It doesnt matter if we personally agree with it. It is thier family. Lets give them the freedom to choose how they want to live. My friends child is 5. They do love him but he just gets to be more of a burden each year.

I understand your thinking since I used to be pro-life not that long ago. It can seem harsh, but isnt it worse making innocent people suffer just because they were unfortunate to get a mentally ill child or a parent with cancer, or something of that nature. Something like that could interrupt someones schedule and life plans and it isnt right. Also, what if a woman was raped and in shock until after she had the baby. Then later realized that she hated it. Shouldnt she be allowed to be free of the past transgressions of another?



[edit on 5/20/2009 by justsomeboreddude]

No, you definetaly mentioned termination. On more than one occasion. Poisonous gases, injections etc. Right?
You said your best friend's child is 5. I mean, I won't even condole it but, wouldn't a more "humane" approach be to atleast put him where (facility) he can seek the proper attention and care?

See, even this is wrong. And that's what I weigh it out as. Right and wrong.
Yes, life can be unfortunate, or unlucky for some people.
Quote I like to repeat myself, through hardships:
"For every person with no shoes, there's someone with no feet."
But to put a retarded kid "out of his misery" (as your buddy put it) is some mediavil, nazi sh*t.
Best of it you said, "they love him."
I cannot fathom or properly contemplate that statement.

That's why I'm saying: SHADY!

As for the freedom to choose? Again, right and wrong. You decide.


Remember, the handicapped people didn't have the choice in this matter either.

As much as I believe in the power of choice, I would never condole this.


As for abortion, and other issues, I really don't feel like opening that can of worms. I was just interested in your putting people to sleep subject.


*bomboclat*

reply to post by justsomeboreddude


OH geee thanks for the entertainment, I was bored,


[edit on 023131p://bThursday2009 by Stormdancer777]

Yeah I said termination through whatever means.. gas, injection, cremation. That kid wont be loved in a institution. He will just be herded like cattle. So the loving thing to do is put him out of his misery.

Since you are pro-choice, you should be able to understand this. It is no different, actually better, than giving a woman the choice to abort for any reason she wants. Lets be honest, we all know most abortions are done out of convienence, and we all accept that as ok or it would be illegal. So what is the difference really if we extend the choice to anyone in the family that is inconvenient?

Would you want to spend the rest of your life being a slave to a person that only eats Cheetos and Pepsi? What kind of life is that?

[edit on 5/21/2009 by justsomeboreddude]

reply to post by justsomeboreddude

Would you want to spend the rest of your life being a slave to a person that only eats Cheetos and Pepsi

You know my husband?

reply to post by Stormdancer777

You said :
Hi villian, you never answered my question.

The OP asked :
We could just use that money we are spending to feed them to pay them or their families to terminate one another.

And you asked :
Is this a good idea ?

My answer :
This is a profoundly misguided notion.

But, the OP'er didn't 'invent' this.

If one considers 'families' at the 'national scale,' America has been engaged in these kinds of 'efficiencies' for more than century.

Can I 'blame' him for 'following the lead' of our government ? No.

Do I applaud him for 'looking into it himself ?' Yes.

Do I hope he'll 'refine his viewpoint ?' Certainly !

To the topic creator, keep up on the road to opening your mind, because it is still very closed and short sighted.

On the scientific side, I give you this recent article.

Down syndrome reveals cancer-fighting clue
Extra copies of gene keeps tumors from growing

Link to full article if interested... www.msnbc.msn.com...

If your point of view had been adopted by main stream society scientific progress in many areas would be stifled possibly preventing your very premise of being able to identify and extinquish "problem" people. Its a strange Catch-22 in many ways.

Do you see my point here? You consider yourself a "productive" member of society, but if you get stuck with cancer tomorrow and can no longer work or produce, you are now a drain. However, the "burdensome" ones may be able to help make you more productive in the long run as is implied in the above article.

On the spiritual side, you talk of embarassment as a burden that would make someone eligible for extermination. Well...thats just....wow.
But what if some of these "mental disorders" are actually people who have been born with a higher state of conciousness and have difficulty coping with living in our lower form of existence? I know for one that a friend of mines brother has been a "burden" on the family for 25 years now with Down Syndrome, but in the short year that I have gotten to know him he has taught me more about happiness and true recognition of spirituality than all family, religion and others have taught me in 35 years of my life. Thank god or allah or the aliens that your mentality isnt so prevalent in society.

Yes, your thinking is natural...natural in the respect of the animals. What you propose puts us back on par with primal animalistic ways of the wilderness where we have been given the higher conciousness to do it differently.

Good luck on your quest for higher knowledge. Hopefully you will find some.

--Kross--

Originally posted by Stormdancer777
reply to post by justsomeboreddude

 

Would you want to spend the rest of your life being a slave to a person that only eats Cheetos and Pepsi

You know my husband?

That's awesome. Star 4 you. I always a appreciate a sense of humor.

reply to post by XKrossX


Well see this is where you miss my point. I am not saying we have to terminate people because they have down's syndrome. I am just saying their family can choose so if they wish.

Sure he is an enlightenment to you, but you dont have to take care of him for the rest of his life. Just like I dont mind watching my friends autistic child from time to time, because he can be amusing. But I understand my friend not wanting to take care of him for the rest of his life. So really it comes down to choice.

Like say for instance you are forced to take care of your grandma. Lets say she is 95 and has a problem with her bowels and she soils all over the place and doesnt know her own name or yours.

Why not just be able to drive her down to the local hospital, shoot her a little knock out drops, give her a lethal injection, and stare into her eyes lovingly as she fades off into the abyss?

That is way more loving than watching her die of a stroke because you screamed at her for soiling your new couch. At least then her last memories are peaceful and happy and not you screaming at her. Wouldnt you agree?

[edit on 5/21/2009 by justsomeboreddude]