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Electronic Evolution: Research Show Robots Forming Human-like Societies

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posted on May, 20 2009 @ 03:07 PM
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Originally posted by mahtoosacks
reply to post by theyreadmymind
 


those are much more advanced ai traits that come with millions of generations. give those robots enough time and better sensors and i bet you will see them take us over.

once again.... never trust robots.


No matter how many generations they go through, they won't get new brains or new bodies. It's not evolution. The angels throw me for a loop though. That doesn't do anything for survival at all. I'd like to know what they're really thinking when they do that.




posted on May, 20 2009 @ 03:08 PM
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thats because they arent organic.... they dont grow... they bodies arent evolving the mind is.

thats the whole point of the test. to see how to get the mind to evolve. well figure out the body later.

be scared when we do. cus we are F'd big time



posted on May, 20 2009 @ 03:12 PM
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reply to post by mahtoosacks
 


Well first I want to say thanks for being such a condescending.......

Ok genius.. first of all the thread is about electronic evolution... not ai, so what I was calling a hoax was this article that states that it is a version of electronic evolution.

Obviously AI exists, but that doesnot mean that the algorithms behind the code change in anyway over time. Maybe someday that will be possible. In your example of AI all it is doing is storing results for the actions it takes and then placing a value on whether that produced a postive or negative result, based on what the human programer told it what was good or bad. So it is artificial intelligence in a way, but it is limited to the original program and cannot change its programming to evolve it can only store results and choose from those results. Understand?



posted on May, 20 2009 @ 03:12 PM
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just do me a favor and go buy a copy of

unreal tournament 99 (best one in my opinion, but the ai is a little jacked so you can tell when it screws up aka runs in circles repeatedly or trys to run through the same door you are mass launching rockets through)
quake 3 (same deal)

halo (watch how they flank you)
FEAR is another one

just keep playing and youll finally see that this isnt some hoax. computers can think within confines, but it all depends on the "creator"

you got a crappy programmer (aka god to that world) you got a crappy world



posted on May, 20 2009 @ 03:12 PM
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Originally posted by mahtoosacks
reply to post by theyreadmymind
 


empathy is a bummer i know, but HEY thats why sociopaths are called an evolutionary leap.

and every hear of nice guy finishes last?

i dunno maybe theres a dummy in every crowd?

maybe a recessive trait was programmed in to take advantage of this "motherly" attribute.

perhaps the robot knew that in order to better its species that it would need to ensure survival of the smarter faster better robot.

[edit on 5/20/2009 by mahtoosacks]


My bet's on the dummy due to some random mutation of it's wisdom. I think empathy's out. These robots don't really know they are dying. They originally started as random idiots. I'm sure there were plenty that sucked the poison til their eyes bled, but their knowledge was removed from the gene pool. The ones that enjoyed the food had their knowledge passed on. Empathy isn't really necessary here.



posted on May, 20 2009 @ 03:13 PM
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reply to post by justsomeboreddude
 


its the same freaking thing man....

the ai is driving the evolution....

sorry for being condescending, but for real... how can you argue with fact...

[edit on 5/20/2009 by mahtoosacks]



posted on May, 20 2009 @ 03:17 PM
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Originally posted by mahtoosacks
just do me a favor and go buy a copy of

unreal tournament 99 (best one in my opinion, but the ai is a little jacked so you can tell when it screws up aka runs in circles repeatedly or trys to run through the same door you are mass launching rockets through)
quake 3 (same deal)

halo (watch how they flank you)
FEAR is another one

just keep playing and youll finally see that this isnt some hoax. computers can think within confines, but it all depends on the "creator"

you got a crappy programmer (aka god to that world) you got a crappy world


Exactly a computer can "think" within the confines of its program. It doesnt have the ability to alter its programming without human intervention. It can only store results and place relative values on them, then use that data to make "better" decisions. So a computer doesnt evolve because it hasnt changed at all unless the human changes it, it just has a better data set to choose from.



posted on May, 20 2009 @ 03:20 PM
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Originally posted by mahtoosacks
reply to post by justsomeboreddude
 


its the same freaking thing man....

the ai is driving the evolution....

sorry for being condescending, but for real... how can you argue with fact...

[edit on 5/20/2009 by mahtoosacks]


Because that is not evolution. That is making better decisions based on more information to the base the decision on. How can you argue with that? There is no way these robots in the original article sacrificied themselves for the other robots. Do you realize how ridiculous that is?

Most humans wont sacrifice themselves for others and we have emotions. How is a robot going to become Messiahanic and die for the sins of its fellow robot. The only way that could happen is if the original program placed the greatest value on taking actions that result in saving the most robots.

[edit on 5/20/2009 by justsomeboreddude]



posted on May, 20 2009 @ 03:22 PM
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reply to post by mahtoosacks
 


Just out of curiosity, in all the years you've been playing video games, did you ever see an A.I. lay down on a hand grenade to protect its buddies? And if you did, do you think it was programmed in by the programmers or self-learned?

Just wondering. I don't play video games.



posted on May, 20 2009 @ 03:23 PM
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Since i had opened a similar post on this however was over looked so i might as well paste here the info which was intended if anyone was to take note.



The latest spacecraft sent to us is more a living thing than a robot. Shortly after launch from Earth, the tiny capsule blossomed into a sail and rode the solar wind to Mars. On the way, a meteoroid punched a hole in the sail, but surrounding material flowed in and closed the tear. Upon arrival, the spacecraft shrunk more than 100 times its volume to return to the safety of its capsule. After the capsule took the heat from entry into the Martian atmosphere, the thing emerged again, forming a parasail to float gently to the Martian surface, covering the rocks like a blanket. Now it moves like a giant amoeba over the rugged terrain, flowing around large rocks and over small ones, and growing stalks that carry instruments. Yesterday, it found evidence of an ancient sea. It grew an antenna and transmitted the observations to an orbiting spacecraft, which relayed the data to our Martian base. In a few weeks, we'll mount an expedition for a closer look at the area…

Engineers at NASA's Goddard Space Flight Center in Greenbelt, Md., took the first step toward this scenario with the successful test of a shape-shifting robotic pyramid. As the engineers watched like anxious new parents, the robot pyramid traveled across the floor of a lab at NASA Goddard. Robots of this type will eventually be miniaturized and joined together to form "autonomous nanotechnology swarms" (ANTS) that alter their shape to flow over rocky terrain or to create useful structures like communications antennae and solar sails.
www.nasa.gov...







Robotics is advancing at a rapid pace, naturally we should be seeing robots taking over space walks and performing routine checks and patch work for future craft. The obvious benefit of using robots pre programed in space is enormous.


[edit on 20-5-2009 by tristar]



posted on May, 20 2009 @ 03:26 PM
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Originally posted by theyreadmymind
reply to post by mahtoosacks
 


Just out of curiosity, in all the years you've been playing video games, did you ever see an A.I. lay down on a hand grenade to protect its buddies? And if you did, do you think it was programmed in by the programmers or self-learned?

Just wondering. I don't play video games.


Thanks for a great example. That sums it all up right there, well unless you believe that the video game character developed consciousness and a zen like essence that placed the value of his fellow characters lives above his own.

[edit on 5/20/2009 by justsomeboreddude]



posted on May, 20 2009 @ 03:31 PM
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Also, did you ever really think that even humans cant control their own evolution, beyond controlling who breeds with who or killing off people with undersirable traits.

In order to control our evolution we would have to know exactly how our DNA works and no what to change and how to change it to get the results we want. But I assume we will get there some day. That is a pretty wild thought.



posted on May, 20 2009 @ 03:32 PM
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reply to post by theyreadmymind
 


actually yes, but not in the same sense as laying on it, just as that robot didnt kill itself to save everyone, it just warned them.

ive tossed grenades at enemies and they picked it back up and threw it at me.

call of duty 3

ive snuck up behind a wall and started shooting through a small window. layed down suppressive fire to keep everything out of the hallway. they took a side door and came up behind me.

fear

ive run up on several weaker enemy, they saw me, started running and screaming and got the big boys to come while they hide behind them shooting

halo


isnt learning from your decisions to move into the future smarter and better, and passing it on as a learned trait evolution?

also you didnt learn everything you know overnight. and you didnt get to be who you are after 3 successful breedings. Im most definitely positive that your creator is a lot better than anything we can do as of yet, but we are getting closer.


thanks for those videos man, glad to see someone else gets what is happening.

also if you are waiting for these to be the finished product of a perfected and awe inspiring system that rivals even our composition, its going to be a while.

THESE ARE TEST CREATURES WHO ARE PROOF OF CONCEPT THAT IT IS POSSIBLE

[edit on 5/20/2009 by mahtoosacks]


[edit on 5/20/2009 by mahtoosacks]



posted on May, 20 2009 @ 03:38 PM
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reply to post by mahtoosacks
 




THESE ARE TEST CREATURES WHO ARE PROOF OF CONCEPT THAT IT IS POSSIBLE


No they are test robots that are proof that if you limit the randomness of code based on results that a programmer determines is optimal then you get less random code that does more of what you determined was desirable.



posted on May, 20 2009 @ 03:39 PM
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This really makes me wonder why there is even a debate over creationism and evolution.

why couldnt the creator have made evolution as well. obviously if something is going to run for eternity then it will need unforeseeable tune-ups down the road.



posted on May, 20 2009 @ 03:40 PM
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reply to post by justsomeboreddude
 


isnt that the whole point?

lets see if we can make something evolve its mind to cope with whats going on.

tada. it learned not to eat poison all on its own.

guess they got the desired result...

the little robots learned it. and passed on that info. and didnt make the same mistakes after it learned it.


evolution if you ask me.

maybe your definition of evolution is too strict.

[edit on 5/20/2009 by mahtoosacks]



posted on May, 20 2009 @ 03:42 PM
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Originally posted by mahtoosacks
reply to post by theyreadmymind
 


actually yes, but not in the same sense as laying on it, just as that robot didnt kill itself to save everyone, it just warned them.

ive tossed grenades at enemies and they picked it back up and threw it at me.

call of duty 3

ive snuck up behind a wall and started shooting through a small window. layed down suppressive fire to keep everything out of the hallway. they took a side door and came up behind me.

fear

ive run up on several weaker enemy, they saw me, started running and screaming and got the big boys to come while they hide behind them shooting

halo


isnt learning from your decisions to move into the future smarter and better, and passing it on as a learned trait evolution?

also you didnt learn everything you know overnight. and you didnt get to be who you are after 3 successful breedings. Im most definitely positive that your creator is a lot better than anything we can do as of yet, but we are getting closer.


thanks for those videos man, glad to see someone else gets what is happening.

also if you are waiting for these to be the finished product of a perfected and awe inspiring system that rivals even our composition, its going to be a while.

THESE ARE TEST CREATURES WHO ARE PROOF OF CONCEPT THAT IT IS POSSIBLE

[edit on 5/20/2009 by mahtoosacks]


[edit on 5/20/2009 by mahtoosacks]


I'd say that's all some excellent programming, but not evolution. As for your question, passing on my learned experiences to others isn't evolution of the Darwinian kind. I guess you could say it's evolution of a thought or evolution of knowledge. Now if my brain mutates and makes me think of things nobody ever thought of and I pass that trait on to my offspring, that's evolution of the Darwinian kind.



posted on May, 20 2009 @ 03:45 PM
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reply to post by theyreadmymind
 


didnt darwin invent evolution to fit his hypothesis?

which shows that yes... your definition is much too strict.

everything comes from something.

prove me wrong ill buy you lunch


[edit on 5/20/2009 by mahtoosacks]



posted on May, 20 2009 @ 03:46 PM
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Originally posted by mahtoosacks
This really makes me wonder why there is even a debate over creationism and evolution.

why couldnt the creator have made evolution as well. obviously if something is going to run for eternity then it will need unforeseeable tune-ups down the road.


This is true. Typically when evolutionists argue against creationists, they are really arguing against the God of Genesis. There is no reason why there couldn't be a different creator.



posted on May, 20 2009 @ 03:47 PM
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Originally posted by mahtoosacks
reply to post by justsomeboreddude
 


isnt that the whole point?

lets see if we can make something evolve its mind to cope with whats going on.

tada. it learned not to eat poison all on its own.

guess they got the desired result...

the little robots learned it. and passed on that info. and didnt make the same mistakes after it learned it.


evolution if you ask me.

maybe your definition of evolution is too strict.

[edit on 5/20/2009 by mahtoosacks]


Maybe your definition of evolution is just wrong, if it includes an outside entity to update your code based on the results of a group. I would agree it was evolution if the robot itself managed to limit its choices BY ITSELF, but that is not the case here.

You said "the little robots learned it. and passed on that info. and didnt make the same mistakes after it learned it", but this is not what the article states. The article says that the humans took the code from the best survivors and meshed it together to make new code and then updated the robots with this code. So they only evolved in the sense that now they are version 2.0, 3.0, etc.. controlled by the choices of the humans.

I would say that is more analgous to divine intervention than it is to evolution.

[edit on 5/20/2009 by justsomeboreddude]

[edit on 5/20/2009 by justsomeboreddude]



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