SCI: How Could an Event in 1997 Cause a Pandemic in 2009? What Happened?

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posted on May, 18 2009 @ 10:58 AM
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In 1997-98, viruses, bacteria and other microbes started mutating out of control. Disease-causing agents have been evolving extremely rapidly, and strangely, since then.

Life scientists reported an "evolutionary crisis," and "accelerated evolutionary processes." As early as 2002, scientists warned of new infectious diseases appearing and old diseases reemerging due to a "complex interaction of social, economic, evolutionary, and ecological factors."

It all goes back to 1997.


What happened in 1997?

Simply put, a number of factors new to the earth's systems converged, and interracted in new, and unprecedented, ways. The interracting 'factors' include escaped pathogens, lab accidents, GM animals and food, factory farming, pollution, chemical contaminations, and more - categorized broadly as "social, economic, evolutionary, and ecological factors."

Several local biological systems around the world reached individual points of "self-organizing criticality," where the rules changed.


What is "Self-organizing Criticality"?

"Self-organizing" means that things can come together in new ways, re-organize on their own, and change the system's established rules.

"Criticality" describes the pivotal 'point' in time and place where factors converge to trigger or allow a system to self-organize.

"Self-organizing Criticality" is like Artificial Intelligence, except it happens naturally in nature. The main idea is that complex change, or "natural complexity," can emerge spontaneously from simple local interactions - not just on a computer or in a laboratory.



...the complexity observed emerged in a robust manner that did not depend on finely-tuned details of the system: variable parameters in the model could be changed widely without affecting the emergence of critical behaviour (hence, self-organized criticality). Thus, the key result of BTW's paper was its discovery of a mechanism by which the emergence of complexity from simple local interactions could be spontaneous — and therefore plausible as a source of natural complexity — rather than something that was only possible in the lab (or lab computer) where it was possible to tune control parameters to precise values.
wiki



Where's the evidence?

In 1997-98 several 'biological events' signaled a number of distinct 'points of self-organizing criticality' around the world, mainly unrelated. Here are a few highlights:

1997

1. An H5N1 bird flu lethal to humans appeared in Hong Kong; the virus jumped directly from birds to people without going through a traditional "mixing vessel" like pigs (a jump previously considered impossible).



Instead of reassorting to form hybrids in some sort of transitional species mixing vessel, H5N1 is directly attacking the human species, as the 1918 virus is presumed to have done, via an “adaptation of a smoldering avian progenitor.”

Influenza: An Emerging Disease. CDC


2. A previously human H3N2 flu virus appeared in pigs in the USA, and was found to be a "triple assortment" virus, with 'genes' derived from human, swine and bird flu viruses.



...Viruses of the classical H1N1 lineage were virtually the exclusive cause of swine influenza (in the United States and Canada) from the time of their initial isolation in 1930 through 1998. Antigenic drift variants of these H1N1 viruses were isolated in 1991-1998, but a much more dramatic antigenic shift occurred with the emergence of H3N2 viruses in 1997-1998. In particular, H3N2 viruses with genes derived from human, swine and avian viruses have become a major cause of swine influenza in North America.
...H1N2 viruses that resulted from reassortment between the triple reassortant H3N2 viruses and classical H1N1 swine viruses have been isolated subsequently from pigs in at least six states.

Source: Virus Res. 2002 May 10;85(2):199-210. The emergence of novel swine influenza viruses in North America. PMID: 12034486


3. Superbugs first appeared - antiobiotic resistant bacteria.



At a press conference on May 23, 1997, scientists finally acknowledged the arrival of untreatable bacteria they had feared for years - bacteria that resist antibiotics. Drugs which have kept us safe for 50 years were beginning to fail, they said.
...Today, superbugs look triumphant and this is a serious situation.
Over the last five years, scientists have clearly seen a change in their ability to tackle what should have been easily treatable infections, because bacteria are developing the ability to resist antibiotics.

Cocktail that cures. Hindu Also see: CBC


4. A previously benign mycobacterium is found to be a significant cause of lung infections.



(Previously benign) Mycobacterium xenopi is a recognized cause of smoldering pulmonary disease in patients with chronic lung disease. ...The repeated isolation of M. xenopi in association with pulmonary lesions suggests significant infection and mandates further workup and therapy.

Mycobacterium xenopi: innocent bystander or emerging pathogen? pubmed


5. Previously benign protozoa/microsporidia are suddenly recognized as significant human pathogens.



"Only recently recognized as human pathogens, ...Cryptosporidium and Cyclospora have been shown to be transmitted through fecally contaminated food and water. The mode of transmission for microsporidia is still unclear. The laboratory diagnosis of these protozoa is difficult. The routine ova and parasites screen does not include screening for them."

Emerging intestinal protozoa: a diagnostic dilemma. PMID: 10177205
Also see: Brasseur P. Waterborne cryptosporidiosis: a major environmental risk. J Eukaryot Microbiol. 1997 Nov-Dec;44(6):67S-68S. PMID: 9508449[/url]


1998

6. A new triple assortment H1N1 swine flu virus infected a human in Wisconsin.



...the 1998 isolate, A/Wisconsin/10/98, (an H1N1 swine flu infecting a human), ...was a reassortant that contained a mixture of swine, human, and avian influenza A virus genes.
...Reassortant viruses with human influenza A H3 and N2 surface glycoproteins and internal protein genes of swine, avian and human influenza A viruses were recently isolated in the US from multiple outbreaks of respiratory disease in pigs.
...The genotype of A/Wisconsin/10/98 provides further evidence for reassortment between avian, human and swine influenza A viruses and demonstrates that such reassortant viruses can infect humans.

1999 Virus Evolution Workshop. Molecular characterization of human influenza A viruses bearing swine-like hemagglutinin genes. Abstract



But it didn't stop there.

1999

7. Protozoa/microsporidia suddenly cause several foodborne outbreaks.



"Recognized as waterborne parasites, Giardia, Cryptosporidium, and Cyclospora have now been associated with several foodborne outbreaks. The oocysts and cysts of these organisms can persist and survive for long periods of time both in water and on foods. As a result, these parasites have emerged as public health risks and have become a concern to the food industry. Control and prevention of protozoan foodborne disease depends upon our ability to prevent, remove, or kill protozoan contaminants. This review will address the biology, foodborne and waterborne transmission, survival, and methods for detection and control ...."

J Food Prot. 1999 Sep;62(9):1059-70. Giardia, Cryptosporidium, and Cyclospora and their impact on foods: a review. Rose JB, Slifko TR. Department of Marine Science, University of South Florida, St. Petersburg 33701, USA. PMID: 10492484


8. Researchers realize that prion diseases like Mad Cow are probably being spread by bacteria and other microbes.



"Epidemiological observations indicate that a microbial vector is responsible for the transmission of natural prion disease in sheep and goats … ...It is proposed that many microbial proteins may be capable of replicating themselves in mammalian cells eliciting and sustaining thereby degenerative and/or autoimmune reactions subsequent to infections with microorganisms."

Med Hypotheses. 1999 Aug;53(2):91-102. Is the pathogen of prion disease a microbial protein? Fuzi M. Budapest Institute of National Public Health and Medical Officer Service, Hungary. PMID: 10532698

Also see: Dangerous liaisons between a microbe and the prion protein. J Exp Med. 2003 Jul 7;198(1):1-4. Aguzzi A, Hardt WD. PMID: 12847133



2000

8. Asymptomatic cattle are recognized as potential reservoirs for infectious parasites.



"These findings, ...clearly demonstrate the presence of low level, asymptomatic infections in post-weaned and adult cattle in the United States and indicate the potential role of such cattle as reservoirs of infectious parasites."

Vet Parasitol. 2000 Nov 10;93(2):103-12. Prevalence of Cryptosporidium, Giardia and Eimeria infections in post-weaned and adult cattle on three Maryland farms. Fayer R, Trout JM, Graczyk TK, Lewis EJ. United States Department of Agriculture, Agricultural Research Service, 10300 Baltimore Avenue, Building 1040, Beltsville, MD 20705, USA. PMID: 11035228



2001

9. More antibiotic resistant bacteria appear, including E. coli, Shigella and cholera.



"Unusual findings included two enteroinvasive E. coli strains, one Shigella dysenteriae 2 isolate, and a non-O:1 Vibrio cholerae culture. EPEC bacteria and S. flexneri (but not Salmonella) showed unusually frequent antimicrobial resistance, especially towards beta-lactam antibiotics..."

J Clin Microbiol. 2001 Jun;39(6):2134-9. Etiology of children's diarrhea in Montevideo, Uruguay: associated pathogens and unusual isolates. ...Bacteriology and Virology Department, Institute of Hygiene, School of Medicine, Universidad de la Republica, CP 11600, Montevideo, Uruguay. PMID: 11376047
jcm.asm.org...


10. Disease-causing parasites appear on fruits and vegetables, unrelated to bad hygeine or outbreaks.



"This is the first time that parasites have been detected on vegetables and fruit obtained in a highly developed. wealthy country, without there being an outbreak situation. These findings may have important implications for global food safety."

J Food Prot. 2001 Nov;64(11):1793-8. Occurrence of parasites on fruits and vegetables in Norway. Robertson LJ, Gjerde B. Department of Pharmacology, Microbiology and Food Hygiene, The Norwegian School of Veterinary Science, Oslo. PMID: 11726161


2002

11. Disease-causing parasites spread by irrigation water contaminate crops.



"The presence of human pathogenic parasites in irrigation waters used in the production of crops traditionally consumed raw suggests that there may be a risk of infection to consumers who come in contact with or eat these products."

J Food Prot. 2002 Feb;65(2):378-82. Detection of protozoan parasites and microsporidia in irrigation waters used for crop production. Thurston-Enriquez JA, Watt P, Dowd SE, Enriquez R, Pepper IL, Gerba CP. US Department of Agriculture, Agricultural Research Service, University of Nebraska, Lincoln 68583-0934, USA. PMID: 11848571


12. Waterborne diseases change dramatically - from the way they're transmitted, to their incidence and prevalence. In addition, new and reemerging infectious diseases are seen to be "occurring through a complex interaction of social, economic, evolutionary, and ecological factors."



"As the epidemiology of waterborne diseases is changing, there is a growing global public health concern about new and reemerging infectious diseases that are occurring through a complex interaction of social, economic, evolutionary, and ecological factors."

Crit Rev Microbiol. 2002;28(1):1-26. Emerging waterborne infections: contributing factors, agents, and detection tools. Theron J, Cloete TE. Department of Microbiology and Plant Pathology, University of Pretoria, South Africa. PMID: 12003038


13. Water treatment and disinfecting protocols stop working; standard tests do not reveal new strains and pathogens.



"The results confirm the resistance of Clostridium perfringens spores, enteroviruses and protozoa to chlorination and demonstrate the relative persistence of these organisms in the effluents even during the ultraviolet light treatment. The yields also emphasise the influence of the analytical method for the determination of protozoan parasites."

New Microbiol. 2002 Oct;25(4):413-20. Fate of bacterial indicators, viruses and protozoan parasites in a wastewater multi-component treatment system. Bonadonna L, Briancesco R, Cataldo C, Divizia M, Donia D, Pana A. Istituto Superiore di Sanita, Laboratorio di Igiene Ambientale, Roma, Italy. PMID: 12437220

***

"The transmission of Cryptosporidium and Giardia through treated water supplies that meet water quality standards demonstrates that water treatment technologies have become inadequate, and that a negative coliform no longer guarantees that water is free from all pathogens, especially from protozoan agents. Substantial concern persists that low levels of pathogen occurrence may be responsible for the endemic transmission of enteric disease. In addition to Giardia and Cryptosporidium, some species of genera Cyclospora, Isospora, and of family Microsporidia are emerging as opportunistic pathogens and may have waterborne routes of transmission. More than 15 different groups of viruses, encompassing more than 140 distinct types can be found in the human gut. Some cause illness unrelated with the gut epithelium, such as Hepatitis A virus (HAV) and Hepatitis E virus (HEV). The most striking concern is that enteric viruses such as caliciviruses and some protozoan agents, such as Cryptosporidium, are the best candidates to reach the highest levels of endemic transmission, because they are ubiquitous in water intended for drinking, being highly resistant to relevant environmental factors, including chemical disinfecting procedures."

Crit Rev Microbiol. 2002;28(4):371-409. Microbial agents associated with waterborne diseases. Leclerc H, Schwartzbrod L, Dei-Cas E. Faculte de Medecine de Lille, and Institut Pasteur de Lille, France. PMID: 12546197


2003

14. Flies are able to express prion proteins, and spread prion diseases along with other ectoparasites.



Animal prion infections, such as scrapie (sheep) and "mad cow disease" (cattle), have shown a pattern of horizontal transmission in farm conditions and several ectoparasites have been shown to harbor prion rods in laboratory experiments. Fly larvae and mites were exposed to brain-infected material and were readily able to transmit scrapie to hamsters. New lines of evidence have confirmed that adult flies are also able to express prion proteins. Several cell types found on the human skin, including keratinocytes, fibroblasts and lymphocytes, are susceptible to the abnormal infective isoform of the prion protein, which transforms the skin to produce a potential target for prion infection.

Int J Dermatol. 2003 Jun;42(6):425-9. Could ectoparasites act as vectors for prion diseases? Lupi O. Center for Vaccine Development, University of Texas Medical Branch at Galveston, Galveston, TX, USA. PMID: 12786866



By 2003, the local points of self-organizing criticality seemed to be converging globally. It was clear that a global point of self-organizing criticality had been, or was about to be reached.

By 2005, Super Bugs were an everyday reality - and some had evolved to feed on antibiotics. Everything from protozoa to bacteria and viruses had developed resistance to standard treatment and disinfecting protocols, and many had acquired all-new epidemiologies.



Doctors know C. difficile flourish after patients take certain antibiotics. Now it seems any antibiotic can bring on the disease.

..."Something happened 18 to 24 months ago, where the use of particular antibiotics didn't seem to matter anymore," said Dr. Mark Miller, chief of infectious diseases at Montreal's Jewish General Hospital.

www.cbc.ca...



Much has happened biologically speaking since scientists sounded their first warnings in the 1970's, and again, rang the alarm bells in 1997.

MRSA flesh-eating disease is now community-acquired, and can be transmitted sexually. Multi-resistant tuberculosis is virtually pandemic. Diseases like salmonella and e.coli, once only able to infect animals, now are able to infect plants.

Unheard of biological events have been happening: animal diseases infecting plants and vice versa; different microbial species exchanging genes; bacteria dangerous to humans have begun evolving in insects. Now, genes are being exchanged across Super Kingdom barriers. The list goes on.




In recent years, the number of outbreaks from (E. coli) contaminated produce has far surpassed those from beef and poultry and has drawn nearly even with those linked to seafood, according to the Center for Science in the Public Interest, a nutrition advocacy group. While there are more food-borne outbreaks related to seafood, far more people get sick from produce outbreaks, the group found.
NYT

***

New E. coli study could shed light on movement of GM bacteria

A recent study published in the January 2002 edition of Applied and Environmental Microbiology documents the transmission of a potentially pathogenic strain of E. coli from manure-contaminated soil and water into the roots and leaves of lettuce plants. ...E. Ann Clark, co-author of this article, point out that the Rutgers study may shed light on the pathways of movement of genetically engineered bacteria amongst soil, plants and insects.

After growing lettuce in composted manure, each gram of which they had inoculated at a rate of 100 million E. coli 0157:H7 organisms, the Rutgers research team documented a buildup of the pathogenic bacterium within plant leaves. Because the accumulation was within the leaves, not on them, simply washing the leaves in water would not cleanse or remove them.

"The vast majority of manure used in this country is supplied to chemical (non-organic) farms," says Brian Leahy, president of the California Certified Organic Farmers. Yet, the USDA does not regulate the use of manure on chemical farms, whereas it does in organic agriculture.

cropchoice

***

"Scientists have evidence that bacteria dangerous to humans have begun evolving in insects, for reasons that are not clear.

The October edition of Nature Reviews: Microbiology reports that invertebrates such as worms and insects may have begun enabling a rapid evolution for bacteria normally not harmful to humans. Not only are insects capable of delivering disease through bites and stings, they now may be the breeding ground for strains of infectious bacteria never before seen in humans."

Dangerous Bacteria Evolving in Insects. LINK



There are six kingdoms of living things, divided into two major groups or super-kingdoms called Prokaryotes and Eukaryotes. The Six Kingdoms of Life

Not long ago, diseases could not cross species barriers, never mind kingdom barriers.

Now, they're crossing super-kingdom barriers - via a "true" actin isoform that is likely prion-related.



Two Faculty Members have selected for evaluation a paper identifying a surprising case of horizontal gene transfer (HGT) of eukaryotic cytoskeletal proteins to a prokaryotic cyanobacterium.

Mohan Balasubramanian (National University of Singapore, Singapore), a Faculty of 1000 Biology Member for Cell Biology, remarks: "This is the first report of a true actin (i.e. not MreB or ParM related) in a bacterium".

Debashish Bhattacharya (University of Iowa, USA), a Genomics & Genetics Faculty Member, also commented on the paper, saying: "The fact that this rare direction of transfer was detected in a cultivated sample and in limited analyses of natural extracts suggests that eukaryote to prokaryote HGT may occur more frequently in nature than previously thought."
Are eukaryotic genes spreading in prokaryotic populations? f1000biology



None of this should be possible; it never was before.

So the situation is clear. Something happened. Now, the most fundamental rules of biology have changed, and our bio-world is spinning out of control.

H1N1 swine flu is only the tip of the tip of the iceberg.

We do not need bio-terrorists to create and release super-plagues - our world can do it all on its own, using the pollution and contaminants we already created and released for profit and power.



ATS Members,

My apologies. There is much more information, maybe better references, more to be said, and links to be created - but I hit the wall and just wanted to get this posted.

Any contributions you might have are most welcome.

Respectfully, sofi




posted on May, 18 2009 @ 11:49 AM
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Wow, this is truly an amazing compilation of work!
I'll have to wait until I get home to go over the whole thing.

Great job!
FMF



posted on May, 18 2009 @ 11:57 AM
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I can't believe that you missed the one event during 1997 that began all the recent bird flu scares and most probably led to the present swine flu outbreak.

In 1997 the virus responsible for the 1918 pandemic was isolated from bodies buried in the Alaskan permafrost.

www.usmedicine.com...

This was done under the auspices of the CDC.

Since then the 1918 virus has been reconstructed, experimented with to find out which parts made it so contagious and which parts made it so deadly. Then new viruses were made by combining the most dangerous parts of the 1918 virus with many other viruses.

There are powerful people who want to drastically lower the world population. This virus could well be a tool they hope to use.



posted on May, 18 2009 @ 12:04 PM
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Scary stuff for sure. It does seem like there has been a sharp increase in hybrid-like diseases just over the past ten years or so.

And it just goes to show that all of our tampering with the natural world is ultimately more detrimental than beneficial.

Nice job on bringing this issue to light.



posted on May, 18 2009 @ 12:13 PM
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Very interesting and just stunning! And very scarey. What the heck is going on?
I'd heard about multiple resistance in bacteria but had no idea all this was going on. Thanks



posted on May, 18 2009 @ 12:24 PM
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Impressive compilation. Nicely done.
The fact is that mother nature is constantly changing, shifting, adjusting and evolving. Before mankind began to not only tamper with the system but to circumvent it with totally new chemicals and compounds, things changed pretty fast. Now the changes are happening at such a rapid pace we cannot keep up. I don't think we were ever meant too.
It will take a while to get through all of this but I'll flag it and keep coming back.

Nice thread.



posted on May, 18 2009 @ 02:24 PM
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There's a certain discussion held among the PHDs of the World, almost always in the science meme that could be considered the last chapter of human history on Earth.

It's a theory gaining more and more proponents constantly. This theory holds that the Earth has turned against humanity and will be actively working to remove us from the biosphere.

Outbreaks of more and more deadly diseases, viruses, bacteria - all meant to end the damage we are creating. 1997 works fine as the turning point but it's more of a date when science began to notice the worm had turned. The actual date when the campaign against humanity began is subject to debate and ranges from the detonation of the first atom bomb to somewhere in the post industrial / petroleum age to somewhere in the past 20 years.

Our society is held hostage by a few very rich people who despise the Earth, despise all living things and honestly believe money and power can overcome the power of nature. Not a surprising point of view coming from those who rape the Earth but an example of supreme foolishness none the less.

Sadly, we can't go green fast enough to save ourselves. Even if we could implement a sustainable existence overnight the horses have left the barn. All four of them . . .



posted on May, 18 2009 @ 03:34 PM
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Originally posted by Kailassa
I can't believe that you missed the one event during 1997 that began all the recent bird flu scares and most probably led to the present swine flu outbreak.

In 1997 the virus responsible for the 1918 pandemic was isolated from bodies buried in the Alaskan permafrost.

www.usmedicine.com...




My focus here was on new diseases emerging in the 'natural' world, that illustrated self-organization, not "lab accidents" or diseases reconstituted or released by direct human activity.




Since then the 1918 virus has been reconstructed, experimented with to find out which parts made it so contagious and which parts made it so deadly. Then new viruses were made by combining the most dangerous parts of the 1918 virus with many other viruses.

There are powerful people who want to drastically lower the world population. This virus could well be a tool they hope to use.


True.


...The virus also could have been picked up by a bird and carried elsewhere to re-assort with (whatever).

Thank you.

-sofi




changed a point


[edit on 18-5-2009 by soficrow]



posted on May, 18 2009 @ 07:36 PM
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Originally posted by ecoparity

This theory holds that the Earth has turned against humanity and will be actively working to remove us from the biosphere.

Outbreaks of more and more deadly diseases, viruses, bacteria - all meant to end the damage we are creating.


I'm not sure that the planet is sentient in the sense that it has "purposeful strategies." ...Which doesn't change the fact that it WILL harmonize all (added) elements, whatever the effect.




1997 works fine as the turning point but it's more of a date when science began to notice the worm had turned. The actual date when the campaign against humanity began is subject to debate and ranges from the detonation of the first atom bomb to somewhere in the post industrial / petroleum age to somewhere in the past 20 years.


My thesis is that it started in the early 1900's with the first mass vaccinations in WWI, which likely were contaminated with Mad Cow-type prions and HSV-1.

[That's why I get ribbed about prions by old-timers here.]




Sadly, we can't go green fast enough to save ourselves. Even if we could implement a sustainable existence overnight the horses have left the barn. All four of them . . .


True, the horses left the barn long ago. And as every farmer knows, there's no point quarantining or culling if you don't clean the barn too.

Can we clean the barn at this point? ...No, I don't think so.

BUT - maybe we can slow the changes down so that we're not totally overwhelmed (biologically speaking), and then we might have a chance to evolve and adapt... Maybe.

Check out these 2 threads. I wrote them a few years ago but they're still relevant, maybe more so now.

Creating Disease: Pollution, Mutation, Adaptation and Evolution

Financing Pseudoscience: Intelligent Design and the Evolution "Debate"


Thank you.


And many thanks to fullmoonfairy, Lightmare, FunSized and badgerprints too!







[edit on 18-5-2009 by soficrow]



posted on May, 18 2009 @ 07:46 PM
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Well human overpopulation has contributed to a lot of the more bizarre recent diseases; HIV, Ebola, Sars etc...were ALL thought to have existed in nature for a while, until humans eating all sorts of bush meat AND living in proximity to large human populations caused them to go mainstream. They figure HIV and Ebola had popped up many times over the eons but typically died out in small villages, now they hit major populations and spread like wildfire.

As far as this being the first time in history that a bird flu has jumped directly to humans, I do not believe it. The flu has been around for eons (both bird and human) and realistically do we think they were analyzing the transmission 150 years ago? Would would not have had a clue if it jumped directly for birds to humans (or vice versa).

Now the antibiotics thing, yes it is a problem. Plus since antibiotics are NOT money makers (unlike many other dugs) the pharma companies in the U.S. do not invest in developing new/better ones.



posted on May, 18 2009 @ 08:01 PM
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reply to post by soficrow
 


Sofi-

Incredible research- all the stars I can give.

I want to go through your info piece by piece. Your analysis is absolutely critical to understanding disease ecologies. Again, goiong back to Laurie garrett- when "The Coming Plague" came out in (93? I think) she made it clear that the confluence of people, industrial farming, ecologic shifts between man and organism, etc., set the stage for a macro biologic event on the horizon. Clearly, the pieces have all come into clear focus.

One point to add to your research that may be insightful is the demographic of humans who have been in the '90s and especially right now- are the baby boomers. They are the largest population of people of a single age group in recorded Western history. All of them need health care as they age- more people in hospital=more opportunities for cross-species assortment. Prions, for ex., might never have been an issue, until you put millions of animals together in industrial famrs to feed the growing population=-and millions in hospital. A well, the market drove pharmas to try to get ahead of multiply resistant malaria (which we caused), bacteria, etc (all our fault). Pharmas also focused on social issues like ED, so Viagra has more funding than anything else. Add war, overpopulation (=zoonosis), the need to feed starving populations, lack of hygiene and clean water, and the population of the earth becomes the largest bioreactor possible. So much to say in response- will address your points with supporting papers as the week goes by. Unbelievably important post!!!!!!!! Thank you so very much.



posted on May, 18 2009 @ 08:05 PM
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reply to post by soficrow
 


The sequencing of the 1918 virus is of course important- however, keep in mind Porton Down has sequenced Yersinia pestis medievialis (the strain of plague that caused the Black death) and we're not seeing that running around.

This is not to say the 1918 strain couldn't have been released- on purpose or not- but I think the point is that it didn't NEED to have been released- nature has found her own way.

You mentioned you don't feel well= please take care, try slippery elm and CoQ10 if you can and make sure to rest. Don't make yourself sick for the benefit of these amazing posts (coming from an insomniac researcher...). Do take care.



posted on May, 18 2009 @ 08:09 PM
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reply to post by ecoparity
 


I think most life scientist have believed and studied this for years- have been shouting it out loud for years- like climatologists! You are correct- look at history- anytime we have overcrowded, overstretched resources, etc., there has been a pandemic. The Justinian Plague; the Black Death; every influenza pandemic on record; cholera; HIV; even cancer, diabetes, etc- which are no doubt caused in large part (in not all) to environmental stressors and toxins upregulating oncogenes or changing the pancreas, etc.
We forget, at our peril, that the earth DOES self-correct (whether you believe it is a conscious act or not). Too many people= lack of genetic diversity in the ecosphere, etc. The simple laws of thermodynamics support your point- and history substantiates it.



posted on May, 18 2009 @ 08:21 PM
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reply to post by soficrow
 


By the way- I agree that the first vaccinations post WW1 were the beginning- and probably connected to a prion/vaccine crossover. This thesis could also account for rapidly rising autoimmune rates. Prions are just pieces of proteins. If we include them in vaccines we make antibody to pieces of material used everywhere in the body. Hyper-immunity= autoimmune disease.

The same thing happens with adjuvents that are made of squalene or other oils- they are part of our cell membranes. Create hyper-immunity to flu, anthrax, typhus, etc., and simultaneously a response to our own cell membranes? Autoimmune disease.



posted on May, 18 2009 @ 08:30 PM
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Originally posted by CultureD
reply to post by soficrow
 


By the way- I agree that the first vaccinations post WW1 were the beginning- and probably connected to a prion/vaccine crossover. This thesis could also account for rapidly rising autoimmune rates. Prions are just pieces of proteins. If we include them in vaccines we make antibody to pieces of material used everywhere in the body. Hyper-immunity= autoimmune disease.



Yeah You!!!!! Exactly!

...Linus Pauling did work on the immune system in the 1930's, and moved on to identify the 'a' and 'b' conformations of the actin protein in 1950 - which led to the birth of proteinology as the governimg science in pharmaceuticals. ...I think a misfolded actin or actin prion is the key to all of this, created by a contaminated vaccine process - am working on another piece describing same (hopefully finished soon).

GREAT contributions. All starred by me.

Thanks so much,

sofi



posted on May, 18 2009 @ 08:33 PM
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Also- and not to belabour the piont, WWI was the first time that armies were thrown together in barracks that were "modern"; we drafted every young, healthy man and threw them overseas to mix with a population of Europeans who had colonized African countries, and most likely had brought back parasites and other bugs not native to the N Hemisphere. We had young people mixing in every way; evolutions in wound care that kept men on the field, rather than dead or in hospital (and thus, with reduced immune systems); we used petroleum products and nerve agents that contaminated people, soil, etc.; and then they all went back home to a country falling into 1) reckless freedom-sexually, socially, etc., and 2) an economic depression that casued an entire world to suffer immune suppression.


Add vaccines to the mix and already there is a perfect combo for world illness susceptibility. We then had a revolution in the food industry, and people used preservatives (TV dinners, processed tinned food, etc)., which lowered immunity; a culture of repression that again led to an exxcessive revoltof freedom--all the while, using new antibiotics willy-nilly- vaccinating everyone, etc.

BTW- just saw and advert for the new meningitis vaccine while writing. The leading "side effect" is Guillan Barre syndrome. This for a bug that we CAN beat with antibiotics!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Insanity!


PLEASE NOTE- self edit- In no way do I blame European soldiers for the '18 flu- we know it originated here in an Army base in Kansas. I was making the point that we sent sick men to mix with healthy men, who might also have been exposed to microbes that could have increased death rates. The fact that we call it the Spanish Flu shows the prejudice I want to be sure I don't emulate, believe or tolerate. *******************

[edit on 18-5-2009 by CultureD]



posted on May, 18 2009 @ 08:36 PM
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reply to post by soficrow
 


I'm humbled, Sofi- thank you!

Seems we're thinking along the same pathways. Let's see what we can do with this.

It's a pleasure to share ideas with you- too bad we can't be in a lab together doing something positive...

I'm also working on a link between injected (or ingested) MSG as an autism cause- it's used as a preservative in vaccines and glutamaic acid is an excitatory amino- imagine what that does in the prescence of a prion folded just so....



posted on May, 19 2009 @ 08:22 AM
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Originally posted by CultureD
reply to post by soficrow
 


I'm humbled, Sofi- thank you!


Thank you!



I'm also working on a link between injected (or ingested) MSG as an autism cause- it's used as a preservative in vaccines and glutamaic acid is an excitatory amino- imagine what that does in the prescence of a prion folded just so....


Sounds very promising. Looking forward to your post!

...will be working on my actin post today - hope to have something soon.

Take care, sofi



posted on May, 19 2009 @ 10:11 AM
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Originally posted by Sonya610
Well human overpopulation has contributed to a lot of the more bizarre recent diseases; HIV, Ebola, Sars etc...


Hmmm. Here's what I think.

A decision was made in 2003, when the local points of self-organizing criticality started going global.

...The one constant from the get-go was agreement that the H1N1 swine flu Mexican outbreak could NOT be contained.

Everyone said so from the very beginning - and no one backpedaled, no one contradicted the claim.

Was it true? Did they already KNOW for sure that it couldn't be contained?

Did they want it to spread?

IMO - both are true. ...They knew it couldn't be contained because H1N1 had been spreading in the US since 1997-98, and via trade to other international locations. And H5N1 was spreading Asia. And, and...

So true - it was about a decade too late to contain the sucker. Whichever strain or bug takes over and runs to a lethal pandemic.

The decision to let it spread was made around 2003.

In the interim, the corporate-controlled media made "overpopulation" into a huge issue, and blamed most of the world's ills on 'too many people.' ...In fact, corporate global industry is responsible for most of the world's problems.

BUT. Chronic/debilitating disease is pandemic; and the economic burden of caring for people who can't work is eating up profits big time. So sick people gotta go.

...It's called a Policy of Benign Neglect. They didn't actually cause the pandemic on purpose, but they knew it was happening. So they let it happen, and just didn't tell anyone but their buddies.

Unfortunately, super flu's kill young, healthy people - not the old and chronically ill. Big mistake.

- sofi



posted on May, 19 2009 @ 11:06 AM
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Tons of info . Great post. Will read more later when I have time but yea I always suspected it had something to do with our near past and how it would effect us in the future.


We do so many un safe things due to money. Either the popel in charge wanting to make more, or them giving you a specified amount of money to do something for them.


It seems that money itself , Just an idea, actually controls the world.

The people with money don't control the world, because if tomorrow we all said we don't value currency of any kind, they would be a lot less powerfull.

It's the idea of money that corrupts and controls..

Although, I don't have an alternative to money.....Everything has it's good though and we have seen money systems work, but it's the people who become obsessed with it that ruin our world.

F U Greed.





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