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Israel may be ready to back two-state solution

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posted on May, 16 2009 @ 02:50 PM
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Israel may be ready to back two-state solution


www.google.com

By AMY TEIBEL – 56 minutes ago

JERUSALEM (AP) — On the eve of Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu's crucial visit to Washington, his defense minister suggested Saturday the Israeli leader might be ready to endorse a Palestinian state when he meets President Barack Obama.

That would be a significant shift for Netanyahu, who has made clear in the past that he does not think the Palestinians are ready to rule themselves. But that position has put him at odds with long-standing U.S. policy that supports Palestinian statehood as the cornerstone of Mideast peace efforts.

"I think and be
(visit the link for the full news article)




posted on May, 16 2009 @ 02:50 PM
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I'm sorry.

We have been down this road how many times now?
I'm not old but practically all my life I have heard this. So what makes this different?

How will this come about? I wonder. This has and will probably be yet again another case of one step forward with two back.

Of course the article drags Iran into the equation.


Netanyahu has hinted he would be prepared to take military action against Iran to stop it from developing nuclear weapons — something Vice President Joe Biden has said would be "ill-advised." Israeli and foreign media reported this week that CIA Director Leon Panetta secretly visited Israel earlier this month and asked for advance warning of any military strike against Iranian nuclear facilities.

If the Israeli leader does endorse a Palestinian state, he will almost certainly want something in return from Obama — a tougher line on reining in Iran



www.google.com
(visit the link for the full news article)

[edit on 16-5-2009 by SLAYER69]



posted on May, 16 2009 @ 02:53 PM
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Well I am certainly not surprised.

Come on now, just before a big dog and pony show trip to the states, ofcourse Israel is gonna say whatever they want or really whatever Obama wants to hear.

They'll throw the idea around and then in a week blame the palestinians for not wanting to take part in it, and somehow blame Iran for inciting violence.

I've heard this many times and it's never come to pass. Don't hold your breath folks.

~Keeper



posted on May, 16 2009 @ 02:54 PM
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One where the Israelis shape and mould palestinian politics..im not old either and i've heard this clap trap too many times now aswell.



posted on May, 16 2009 @ 03:09 PM
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I had no doubts that a pressure from US would work very fast. US gives military aid to Israel and is its most important strategic partner (more of a boss though).
So all those games by Libermann and others are not important. What is important is what Obama would demand. However i also do not share optimism. Even if Netanyahu wanted to do what he would be probably "asked" to do (like removing illegal settlements , placing much more effort into talks with Palestinians and probably ending blockade on Gaza) - his coalition would simply not allow it all. So it would be the usual two steps forward - two steps back famous Middle East peace dance. People get stepped on though during it.



posted on May, 16 2009 @ 03:22 PM
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Originally posted by tothetenthpower
Well I am certainly not surprised.

They'll throw the idea around and then in a week blame the palestinians for not wanting to take part in it, and somehow blame Iran for inciting violence.



Somebody will get their nose bent out of place and the whole shooting match starts all over again. I say don't even bother discussing it until Peace Breaks out!



posted on May, 16 2009 @ 03:23 PM
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Originally posted by ZeroKnowledge
I had no doubts that a pressure from US would work very fast. US gives military aid to Israel and is its most important strategic partner (more of a boss though).
So all those games by Libermann and others are not important. What is important is what Obama would demand. However i also do not share optimism. Even if Netanyahu wanted to do what he would be probably "asked" to do (like removing illegal settlements , placing much more effort into talks with Palestinians and probably ending blockade on Gaza) - his coalition would simply not allow it all. So it would be the usual two steps forward - two steps back famous Middle East peace dance. People get stepped on though during it.


Although I disagree with you on who the boss of who is I agree totally that this is just the two steps forward of the mideast peace dance. Yes more people will be trampled in the process.



posted on May, 16 2009 @ 03:27 PM
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Most excellent!

The sooner they give the Palestinians their own state, recognized, the better it will be for Israel.

So that when attacked by rockets, or mortars from this new "country," under international law, they can go in, defeat the offending "country" and take the land all nice and legal.

The Palestinians fall for this, they are even more stupid than I previously thought.



posted on May, 16 2009 @ 03:30 PM
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I'm sorry to say, but this is just another part of the merry-go-round, and an attempt to deflect from recent Israeli atrocities, IMO.

The only time Israel will grant Palestine even a modicum of independance, is when there are too few palestinians left to be a threat, in much the same way as the reservations were created for native americans in the US.

Sadly, this will be one of the greatest crimes of humanity - but no-one will even attempt to do anything about it, because all the Israeli's have to do is shout "anti-semite" and mention the holocaust, and then every western government will fall into line - and that's where the power lies.

Between that and the Israeli lobbies in western countries, the palestinians haven't got a chance.



[edit on 16/5/2009 by budski]



posted on May, 16 2009 @ 03:41 PM
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reply to post by budski
 




is when there are too few palestinians left to be a threat

And when there would be "too few Palestinians"? Currently Palestinian autonomy and Gaza are among leaders in population growth, in any case at faster rate then population growth in Israel.
I think you took the "genocide" bait. Well, nobody is immune to propaganda.
An example of change in population:



The Palestinian population in the West Bank, Gaza and east Jerusalem has reached 3.76 million, up from 2.89 million a decade ago, according to census results released Saturday.

www.jpost.com...



posted on May, 16 2009 @ 03:51 PM
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Originally posted by dooper
Most excellent!

The sooner they give the Palestinians their own state, recognized, the better it will be for Israel.

So that when attacked by rockets, or mortars from this new "country," under international law, they can go in, defeat the offending "country" and take the land all nice and legal.


First of all i don't think israel would even consider allowing palestinians having their 'own state', it's all BS talk by israelis as usual.



The Palestinians fall for this, they are even more stupid than I previously thought.


The palestinians aren't falling for anything, they ain't gona back out anytime soon after fighting and dying for decades.



posted on May, 16 2009 @ 03:55 PM
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Originally posted by budski
Between that and the Israeli lobbies in western countries, the palestinians haven't got a chance.


Palestinians will only get their chance when the Arab nations Wake Up around it.Little israel is no match if the Arabs decide to trample all over it slahudeen style.



posted on May, 16 2009 @ 04:04 PM
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Does this sound familiar ?




"Long-term preparation, careful gathering of information, secret discussions, operational deception and the misleading of the public - all these stood behind the Israel Defense Forces "Cast Lead" operation against Hamas targets in the Gaza Strip," the Israeli daily wrote.

Israeli Defense Minister Ehud Barak ordered the army to plan for the offensive more than six months ago, even as Israel was negotiating an Egyptian-brokered truce deal with Hamas and other factions.



As slayer has already pointed out the rules of engagement fall upon and only from the official word of the president of the united states. The stakes are way to big to fool around as Israel fooled around with Lebanon and Palestine



Two weeks ago, the director of the Central Intelligence Agency, Leon E. Panetta, held a quiet meeting with Mr. Netanyahu in Jerusalem. Israel asked the United States to clarify benchmarks that would demonstrate that its diplomatic campaign was working.

The Israeli government, officials said, has assured the United States that it will not take military action against Iran without first consulting Washington. But it has also signaled that it will give the United States only a year or so to show that its good-will approach is getting results.

“They’re preoccupied by Iran, and no one more than the current prime minister,” said Martin S. Indyk, a former American ambassador to Israel and a Middle East peace negotiator. “But the prime minister understands full well that this is a time for American-led engagement.”



posted on May, 16 2009 @ 04:08 PM
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Well,

For those who say that Israel can't hold it's own against the Arab nations, it certainly would put up a good fight. We've seen what happens to countries who try to invade Israel, they loose. Lets not forget they were attacked by multiple countries at once and won.

But that's not the issue. Although I disagree with dooper that a two state solution benefits Israel only, I will agree that if that is their plan to allow such a state to exist, and then attack, under international law they could not punished or critized.

Once or if Palestine become an official state, any act of agression outside it's boarders could and would be considered an act of war, to which Israel would be lawfully able to retaliate.

A two state solution would fix everybody's problem, so long as each other's atonomy was respected and Israel kep to her own and so did the Palestinians.

I will keep my previous idea on the issue. More arm flailing on Israel's part to make Obama happy.

~Keeper



posted on May, 16 2009 @ 04:17 PM
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reply to post by ZeroKnowledge
 


I didn't take any bait, but I do know what I see.

Please try to quote me in context, rather than cherrypicking parts of a sentence that suit your needs - look again and see how many of the people have come into the area as immigrants.

Also look at the attrition rate, and the who conducted the "census"

There are 2 protagonists, and I don't suffer from the illusion that one side or the other does no wrong.

Why not try the same...



posted on May, 16 2009 @ 04:21 PM
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Originally posted by merkava

Originally posted by budski
Between that and the Israeli lobbies in western countries, the palestinians haven't got a chance.


Palestinians will only get their chance when the Arab nations Wake Up around it.Little israel is no match if the Arabs decide to trample all over it slahudeen style.


Sorry, but that will never happen while the US spends a third of their foreign aid busget on Israel.


U.S. Financial Aid To Israel: Figures, Facts, and Impact
Summary

Benefits to Israel of U.S. Aid
Since 1949 (As of November 1, 1997)

Foreign Aid Grants and Loans
$74,157,600,000

Other U.S. Aid (12.2% of Foreign Aid)
$9,047,227,200

Interest to Israel from Advanced Payments
$1,650,000,000

Grand Total
$84,854,827,200

Total Benefits per Israeli
$14,630
Cost to U.S. Taxpayers of U.S.
Aid to Israel

Grand Total
$84,854,827,200

Interest Costs Borne by U.S.
$49,936,680,000

Total Cost to U.S. Taxpayers
$134,791,507,200

Total Taxpayer Cost per Israeli
$23,240

source

Of course, the US and the UK have an interest in keeping the area de-stabalized.

Israel is their surrogate in this regard.

[edit on 16/5/2009 by budski]



posted on May, 16 2009 @ 04:29 PM
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if isreal does endorse a two state system i'm pretty sure their contribution will lack any form of enthusiasm.

if anything they're making an "effort" to sway the Obama Administration in backing them in the event of a isreali conflict.

thinking about it.....

Isreal adopts two state, one country solution.
Palestinians refuse to fight with them in the war with iran/syria etc.
Isreal declares treason and obliterates Palestine in the anarchy of war.

problem solved.



posted on May, 16 2009 @ 04:44 PM
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reply to post by tothetenthpower
 


tothetenth, I intended for some to read between the lines in my brief post, and assure you that Israel wouldn't be the initial party to benefit from a two-state solution.

IF, and IF the Palestinians could tend to their new business in their new nation, then they would benefit, and Israel would benefit, as there would be theoretically - no more reason for contention.

However, based on Arab behavior since the day that Israel declared themselves an independent nation, I seriously doubt that they will change their ways.

Too many nuts in the box.

So they would attack, piss away what they gained, and be defeated once again by Israeli forces.

To the poster who suggested Arabs could unite and defeat Israel, you really, REALLY should break out a history book. And not one published by Hizballah.

Multiple Arab coalitions have already tried to dislodge Israel.

Before Israel even had a military, just after becoming a country, they were attacked by a coalition of Lebanon, Syria, Transjordan, Iraq, Saudi Arabia, a Palestinian militia, and Egypt.

Similar events occurred in 1956.

1967, the Arabs gathered a formidable force, greatly outnumbering the Isralis, and got their asses slaughtered.

1973, they made initial gains against Israel, but within 48 hours, turned it around. Even the Soviets were threatening to jump in.

So I really don't want to hear how surrounding Arabs could take Israel.

They couldn't on their best day.

And today is far removed from their best day.



posted on May, 16 2009 @ 04:49 PM
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reply to post by dooper
 


i see where you are coming from. isreal has a big boot. arabs have little butts= woopa-cha!



posted on May, 16 2009 @ 04:52 PM
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reply to post by dooper
 


I agree with what you've said dooper, most definetly. I should have learned by now that you sometimes need to read between the lines with you
.

And that's fine, but yes, Israel will not be easily defeated by any nation really. Too much power, technology and EVERYBODY who is above the age of 18 is trained military personnel. That says alot about how much a country is prepared for war.

But you assume that the initial conflict would come from the Palestininan side in the event a state was created. I wonder why that is?

I figured either one of them is likely to start something and blame it on the other. We are in agreement that neither side has very many brownie points at the moment don't we?

I mean, if we look at this objectively, there are a million things we can bring up about Palestine and million things we can bring up about Israel that would make somebody's blood boil.

I think it all comes down to whose running the government once this solution is created. If we still have Hezbolah controlling Gaza and the West Bank, then piece will not last.

However, if there is a true democratic process that is un-intererupted by stupid *Snip* then I don't see why such an agreement would not last.

I guess it would require a government in Israel who did want peace to begin with, but that's a little hard right now considering what they have in store for Iran and other Arab Nations.

It's very hard to take sides in a conflict spanning several decades and entails multiple complex issues that will probably take another 2 decades to figure out.

~Keeper



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