Hersh: Children sodomized at Abu Ghraib, on tape

Originally posted by Zealott
Why would an administration be to blame for what a soldier did? What I mean is I'm a go ahead and disregard the vague implications of the aforementioned article.
Assuming American soldiers sodomized Iraqi/Afghanistan womens' children in front of them.
That's not the president's fault.
Just like it's not my fault if the vice president shoots some guy in the face while hunting.
Now... Is it ok for the government or former administration to cover up these recordings? I dunno arguably yes. Maybe they dealt with it. Maybe the soldiers were straight up convicted with no trial thanks to the patriot act.
Either way it might be in the best interest of the US to turn a blind eye to this incident. And because it might truly be better for everyone, MAYBE better, you can't blame this one on bush.

[edit on 15-5-2009 by Zealott]

That is a well known tactic used since the dawn of time. It is not a tactic dreamed up by some bored soldiers.

The behavior at Abu Ghraib was sanctioned by the people in charge. Just how high it goes is the question. The soldiers responsible have always said higher ups ordered the interrogations and use of torture. Many different methods were used to gather intelligence just have a look at the available images. I seem to recall a debate in the MSM about whether the US should employ the use of torture as well, before the Abu Ghraib scandal.

The sexual abuse of children allegations may or may not be true, there have without a doubt be public accusations since 2004 at least. The current Administration should be made to answer these allegations. Silence in a matter like this suggests guilt PERIOD!!! It’s like an accused rapist refusing a DNA test.


[edit on 15-5-2009 by Donkey_Dean]

Originally posted by RRconservative

Who is more gullible? ATS members automatically believing US Troops would do this OR....Seymour Hersch who was once called "The most gullible investigative journalist I have ever encountered" by a former JFK official, and a man who has made his career bashing the United States, even offering to defend Sadamm Hussein himself.

en.wikipedia.org...

Anyway I'm giving our soldiers the benefit of the doubt, before I consider believing this self-serving America hating "investigative journalist".

Have to agree here first of all.

Second of all guaranteed someone would rat the rest out if this happened especially in the military.

If it did happen I would be surprised if anyone in those tapes were still alive today. Very few people would look the other way on this and the folks I served with in the military, well lets just say no one on the tape would be alive within 30 days of the info being transmitted and no one would be looking for them or even care to assuming they knew why they disappeared.

reply to post by Darthorious


One would hope this wouldnt fly, thanks for the calming words. If this happened on my watch they would have had to kill me for sure.


[edit on 15-5-2009 by Donkey_Dean]

they tortured and abused children, what more do you need.

had enough yet?

Originally posted by warrenb
they tortured and abused children, what more do you need.

had enough yet?

1. Proof and accountability.
In that order, please.

Obama bashers are upset Obama is trying to hold the pics back from public consumption ( I don't want to see photos of child abuse, and I do not think showing a bunch of ego driven gawkers online will help a damn thing)
However, we don't need to "see" the photos.
we do need to prove or disprove the allegations, and deal with everyone involved.
ordering or following orders to abuse others ( especially children) is worse than treason and it puts the entire nation at risk.


Im all for harsh prosecution of them all, including the soldiers who blindly tossed our any morals or sense of right and wrong in lieu of following orders.
Blind faith is a fools game... play that game and you will lose every time.
*edited to add:
Please stop saying "we" did this.
Speak for yourself.
I did not do this.
I did not vote for the administration that presided over the allegations.
I did not support the treason perpetrated by these people.
I did not condone this activity.
I am an american citizen.
do not say "we" did this.. speak for yourself, not for me or other Americans who are appauled at the allegations of such activity.







[edit on 15-5-2009 by Ninja-san]

Im sorry but RAPING KIDS calls for justice.

This is what happened in nazi camps during world war 2, the us solider is no different beast. Perhaps a lessorn for all humanity.

The "beast" is war.

The actions are present regardless of the faith, color, creed, or nationality of soldiers. Can anyone recall a 'war' that did not include such inhumanities?

War is the enemy, not soldiering.

Those who call for war are the lost souls; war never resolves anything. It just makes common people pay in blood for the ideology and schemes of their 'elite.'

What the h? Was it American troops who allegedly did this to children? This world really needs to come to an end. They better keep those pics under the highest security or we are all dead.

When I was young I can remember the way the American population felt about Vietnam. I remember watching the news and protesters meeting soldiers at airports with signs and stuff saying baby killers, murders...etc. To the very best of my knowledge I cannot remember ever seeing any pictures then that even remotely resemble this. At that time I thought that people were taking out their displeasure in the war out on the soldiers. I never saw a picture of a soldier smiling after torturing people, I never saw a picture of soldiers smiling and giving a thumbs up, I never saw a picture of a female soldier pointing to a prisoner that had been stripped down and placed in positions that are only intended to humiliate a person and in what appears to be an attempt to make them abandon their faith. I am not saying these things didn't happen, but there were never pictures floating all over the place, including congress. Yet the American people were very displeased with our soldiers. These people took pleasure in this, so much so, that they felt it necessary to take pictures so they could "capture the moment" for a lifetime. Why? I have no clue, unless they are proud of what they have done. Yet there is no outrage by the American people.....

What has happened to us as a race of people?

Yet further proof of the amount of control that the government exercises over the people. How in God's name could any human being not be outraged over this unless they were brainwashed?

To me this is a sign of just how much control the government has over the population. I am certain they are also well aware of this fact. If this doesn't enrage people they now know they can go even further.

reply to post by Chevalerous


this is heart breaking to read. The more I read this stuff the less respect I have for any military personal. How can we give our support, when these are the type of criminal representing the United States.

They all need to be water boarded. Maybe that should be the punishment for any violation of the Geneva convention..

Originally posted by Zealott
Why would an administration be to blame for what a soldier did? What I mean is I'm a go ahead and disregard the vague implications of the aforementioned article.

Oh Deary me!!
It wasn't an attempt at a 'vague implication' at all..
It was a downright accusation,I don't do 'vague' sorry..

How could you dare run a mere footsoldier through the wringer for the same kind of sexual perversity that the administration has long been suspected of?

I'm pretty sure when the cries of "I was ordered to do it" start echoing in the courtroom,the buck will be firmly passed back up the ladder.

Maybe when certain cultures start dropping these weird 'initiations' into 'big boys clubs'..
baring nipples,paddling each other etc..there might be a chance of getting some kind of 'normal person' into the political field..

That,in turn,would leave them a little more disgusted and keen to stamp out what is a fairly common 'dogs of war' practice.

Rape is effective weapon of war, senators told

www.google.com...

How did rape become a weapon of war?

news.bbc.co.uk...

Who decides what an 'effective' result is?
Subhuman I'd say..

What a bunch of lunatics here....

Not a shred of evidence is posted for this being true, the link provided by the OP Leads nowhere, no perpetrators are pointed out and dozens of lemmings are shouting that children WERE raped and calling for america to be destroyed.

WHAT IF this is not true?

[edit on 15-5-2009 by lucid eyes]

reply to post by Chevalerous


War Crime is punishable under the Geneva Convention. Capital punishment can be executed.

I still don’t understand the UN turning their backs on this. Bush and all who knew about this are comparable to Saddam Hussein.

I dont think a Presidential Pardon, makes him exempt from the Geneva or Hague Conventions, including Generals and military involvement.

reply to post by mortalengine


I agree with you America is a terrible place, full of secret agendas and a completely corrupt government.

It was not the Islams who drove the planes into the trade centers, that was also our own government. I think by now there is enough proof of this beyond denial.

reply to post by Bombeni


If you want the world to end, doesn't that kind of imply that we would all be dead anyway?

But this is, indeed, disgusting. Beyond words.

reply to post by lucid eyes


Yes we need answers! Silence in this case suggests Guilt!! Like a rapist refusing a DNA test.

If this is just propoganda, we really need to know!



[edit on 15-5-2009 by Donkey_Dean]

I haven't read all the replies, so my apologies if anything I say becomes repetitive:

There is a core of sexual deviance in the psychopathocracy that makes up the NWO. And these folks are pretty obviously behind the invasion of Iraq. There are many cases of pedophilia and homosexuality in elected officials, and I would hestitate to add that those cases extend to other hierarchical structures. These people network to satisfy their disgusting vices, and these networks are exploited by the powerplayers in our society, who use them as points of control for people. There is no more obedient serf that one that knows that at any moment he can be thrown into the anger of the crowd. This is why these cases are far more common than observable reality seems to imply. Not that they are that common, it's still only a few cases per tens of thousands I would imagine, but it's common enough to form a trend, and to put our leadership in question. There has been homosexual and pedophilia scandals in pratically every democracy. Not every politician is a chickenhawk, gay slang for pedophile according to a radio show I heard, but when they show up TPTB are quick to exploit their blackmailability.

It also fits into the problem - reaction - solution mindset for manipulation of populations. To control children there has to be threats to their security, which is where pedophiles become "convenient" to handle by the elites (who themselves most likely have very high statisitical incidences of sexual deviancy and have the networks to recruit from).

One last thing to add, I am not completely homophobic, I have no problem with consenting adults using their bodies for pleasure, but one thing I have noticed on my time on this earth and socializing with a wide range of people is that homosexuals tend to like them young, tend to fall into pedophilia. As do a few heterosexuals, but my impression is that in the male homosexual community, perhaps because of a higher inhibition threshold, it is more common. Perhaps we should also debate this at the same time we debate silly stuff like gay marriage?

There is true evil both in politics and the military. Those that have chosen to align to slogans like "support our troops" and "free iraq" might want to wake up and see reality for what it really is. This is an even better reason, if one was needed, to stop these wars than the simple fact nobody can afford them.

reply to post by Ninja-san


I think the reason people are upset with the administration is becuase this is so sensitive a topic that it's kinda Your with them or against them.

Yes I agree that this will make other country's hate America.. BUT If his is the way we treat people, we deserve to be hated.. I hate us and I live here.

I understand that this maybe dangerous for the soldiers currently stationed in foreign country's most seemingly in the middle east... Well danger comes with the territory and if this is the way our Military represents the people of the united state then they have ever right to fear there lives, Not only from those abroad but from home as well.

Originally posted by '___'eviant
reply to post by Bombeni

 

If you want the world to end, doesn't that kind of imply that we would all be dead anyway?

But this is, indeed, disgusting. Beyond words.

Yeah that was doubletalk; I don't WANT the world to end, but it needs to. That is what I meant.