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Vatican plays down pope's Hitler Youth past

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posted on May, 12 2009 @ 04:55 PM
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Vatican plays down pope's Hitler Youth past


rawstory.com

The pope has said he never, never was a member of the Hitler Youth, which was a movement of fanatical volunteers,” Vatican spokesman Federico Lombardi told a news conference.

As a 16-year-old seminarian, the pope was a member of an auxiliary air defence squadron “that had nothing to do with Nazism or Nazi ideology,” the spokesman said.

The statement ran counter to what the pontiff had said in numerous interviews, in which he stated that he was an involuntary member of the Hitler Youth during World War II.
(visit the link for the full news article)



[edit on 12-5-2009 by Max_TO]




posted on May, 12 2009 @ 04:55 PM
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I am not sure what to make of this story .

Does it matter to anyone if the pope was an involuntary member of the Hitler Youth during World War II as stated by the Pope ?

To me the key word there is " involuntary " . If this is correct then its kinda hard to lay blame for being forced to do something .

What if he is mistaken and this wasn't an involuntary action , but rather a voluntary action ? Would it matter then ? If thats the case and assuming he admitted up to it at some point and expressed sadness over his decision then how could we hold him forever guilty over something that he did as a teen ?

Then there is the conspiracy theorist , those that may argue that the Vatican is not what it seems and is much more dark behind the scenes then most are aware of . These people may argued that the Pope was in fact chosen not in spite of but because of , his past history with the Nazi's

I don't subscribe to the later but having said that I am interested in hearing any point of view on this topic .




rawstory.com
(visit the link for the full news article)



posted on May, 12 2009 @ 05:04 PM
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Well the story keeps changing, so one way or another he's lying, and who's to tell if the whole thing isn't one big lie.

It matters in terms of image. You wouldn't elect a President who was in Nazi Youth, mainly because christian fanatics, would call him the Anti-christ, and others would go "yeah, it makes sense, yep".



posted on May, 12 2009 @ 05:05 PM
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reply to post by Max_TO
 


Either way it is not a good look for the Pope to have is it?!

The major problem i see with this is that the Pope will never be able to criticize Israel in any major way without this being bought up and accusations of an anti-semetic view circulated by AIPAC and other Jewish groups.

Don't get me wrong, i am a huge opponent of the Catholic Church and the message it broadcasts to its followers regarding sexual health and stem cell research. Yet we need someone to be able to criticize Israels abhorrent behaviour towards the Palastinans, who cannot be attacked, such as the case with any politician or professor in the U.S and many other western nations who 'dares to criticize Israel. And the Pope was often this..



posted on May, 12 2009 @ 05:14 PM
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If I remember correctly, participation in the Hitler Youth became mandatory in '36. I think at that time, you pretty much did what you were told. As for his "emotionless" speech, I don't really know what people expect. Would they like for him to cry? Perhaps ask for Jewish forgiveness? Why? I suppose it may have been more of an issue if he hadn't deserted the Nazi Airforce, but since he did, for most that shows how he felt/thought at the time. I'm sure whatever he felt he needed to confess or seek forgiveness from God from, he has done, which is inline his faith. Besides, I think this topic was looked into, and talked to death before his appointment, as well as, immediately after, there really isn't too much more to say about it.

I think people are probably more upset that he called for the creation of Palastine, and this is appartently a nice distraction for some, for most this is not new information.

[edit on 12-5-2009 by searching4truth]



posted on May, 12 2009 @ 05:17 PM
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The Pope never said he was part of Hilter Youth? He spent two chapters in his autobiography discussing it and life in Nazi Germany.



posted on May, 12 2009 @ 05:20 PM
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It was practically impossible to avoid being caught up in the Nazi movement at some level in Germany in the 1930s. "The World at War" has an interview with a guy who wanted to join, but wasn't allowed to, just because he was Jewish. The American Nazi Bund was popular on the East Coast for a while, until Dec. 7th, 1941, when the Reptilians bombed Pearl Harbor to bring the Andromeda Nebula into WWII via the "back door." (But I digress.)



posted on May, 12 2009 @ 05:23 PM
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I must admit that I am not catholic and I do not wish to mislead anyone .

I must be honest , I don't know what to think .

Was the short list of possible choices for pope that scarce that they had no other choice ?

But once again I can see a case for forgiveness to a misguided teen and allowing that teen to then grow and become anything they wanted to be , even Pope .

Forgiveness to a Pope that actively states half truths and lies ? Sure , as long as he then is also wise enough to step down from his office .

But yah back to my first question , was the short list really that scarce ?



posted on May, 12 2009 @ 05:27 PM
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reply to post by Max_TO
 


"But yah back to my first question , was the short list really that scarce ? "

It's all politics at that level. I don't know what Benedict is famous for before he became Pope, but it was enough for the College of Cardinals to agree on him by majority vote. If we had to go by what we did as a teenager for our entire lives very few of us would be in our current positions, I feel. I did "stoop labor" on a truck farm to pay my way through high school.



posted on May, 12 2009 @ 05:30 PM
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I'll be the first to say that I don't like the pope with his beady little eyes, he looks like he's about to sprout horns. But I don't think he had a choice and I vaguely remember hearing that his cousin I believe was murdered by Nazi's because he had some sort of disability. Either way, if he was willing or not I don't think it looks good on him and it does not surprise me that they downplay it.



posted on May, 12 2009 @ 05:34 PM
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reply to post by Gawdzilla
 


I agree with you .

The hows and why's of the situation would be a pretty interesting story . Perhaps some Knowledgeable ATS member can shed some light on the subject .

I also agree that something as this should not be held against him now . Unless he is actively lying or misleading people now .



posted on May, 12 2009 @ 05:41 PM
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Benedict is no man of God I can tell you that. He is all for the partition of Israel witch is the one thing that will bring hell on earth from Jesus himself. I am sick of the Vatican lying and hiding the proof of Jesus being the one true messiah just to give themselves more claim to fame. Sick really and thats why the Vatican will soon feel his wrath at the hands of the Islamics.



posted on May, 12 2009 @ 05:41 PM
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The Catholic Church is a snivelling hypocritcal and sadistic organization. Did you know that the Church activelly helped known Nazi war criminals to escape justice, by helping them to gain safe passage to counties, like Brazil and Argentina. Countries with no extradition treaty arangements with European Countries. In a little Office at the top of the Spanish Steps, in Rome, the Catholic Passport Office processed many Nazis with false identities and passports just after the war.



posted on May, 12 2009 @ 05:49 PM
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This is clear: Benedict is no John Paul II.

More like EGGS Benedict.



posted on May, 12 2009 @ 05:49 PM
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To those expressing there views to the Vatican in general , thanks for taking the time to post . Perhaps you can offer your opinion as to why and how the current Pope came to be elected ?

Not to put words in your mouth , but am I to assume that your feelings are that he was chosen to be pope partly because of his past ? Or perhaps it was see as a good thing in some fashion ?

I would be interested in hearing any views on this topic .



posted on May, 12 2009 @ 05:53 PM
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Originally posted by freeyourmind1111
I'll be the first to say that I don't like the pope with his beady little eyes, he looks like he's about to sprout horns.


I was born Catholic I'm not a practicing one anymore. I know how you feel this guy gives me the willies.


I miss Pope John Paul.



posted on May, 12 2009 @ 05:55 PM
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Hitler youth were children. Children caught in an information/truth war. An elderly relative of mine is still an emotional wreck as a result. As is possible with children born into any extreme fundamental belief.
I was taught a bunch of lies as a child too. As were/are most of us to some degree.

This threads already got hitler vs israel vs catholics vs islam.... phew... can't imagine where this will end up.

[edit on 12-5-2009 by ivycutler]



posted on May, 12 2009 @ 06:02 PM
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Originally posted by ivycutler
reply to post by Circle
 


Hitler youth were children. Children caught in an information/truth war. An elderly relative of mine is still an emotional wreck as a result. As is possible with children born into any extreme fundamental belief.
I was taught a bunch of lies as a child too. As were/are most of us to some degree.

This threads already got hitler vs israel vs catholics vs islam.... phew... can't imagine where this will end up.



The truth is the truth. However anybody might like to try to present the Catholic Church as whiter than white, they are not. Their priests have abused children; their schools have indoctronated and brainwashed pupils; they interfere with married couples rights on family planning; they are proven Nazi lovers and have a very long history of stoaking up ant-semitism. They are facist and antidemocratic; homophobic; women-haters and are sitting on a horde of secret history that would shed light on early Christianity. Sorry, but that's just for starters.................



posted on May, 12 2009 @ 07:18 PM
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reply to post by Circle
 


I'm not trying to defend anyone. Quite the opposite. Bad stuff happens everywhere across all religions, creeds, nationalities etc.
If you only target the Catholic church then you miss the rest. That is my point.



posted on May, 12 2009 @ 07:23 PM
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reply to post by Max_TO
 


The Conclave
The Cardinals must take an oath when they first enter the Conclave that they will follow the rules set down by the Pope and that they will maintain absolute secrecy about the voting and deliberations. The penalty for disclosing anything about the conclave that must be kept secret is automatic excommunication.

The Cardinals all take seats around the wall of the Sistine Chapel and take a ballot paper on which is written "Eligo in summum pontificem" -- "I elect as supreme Pontiff...". They then write a name on it, fold it, and then proceed one by one to approach the altar, where a chalice stands with a paten on it. They hold up their ballot high to show that they have voted, then place it on the paten, and then slide it into the chalice. The votes are then counted by the Cardinal Camerlengo and his three assistants. Each assistant reads the name, reads the name aloud, writes it down on a tally sheet and then passes it to the next assistant. The third assistant runs a needle and thread through the centre of each ballot to join them all together. The ballots are then burned, as well as all notes made. If a new Pope has been elected, the papers are burned with chemicals (it used to be wet straw) to give white smoke. Otherwise, they give off black smoke, so that the waiting crowds, and the world, know whether their new Holy Father will soon emerge from the Sistine Chapel. On 6 April 2005, it was announced that, in addition to the white smoke, the bells of St Peter's Basilica will be rung to signal the election of the new Pope. This will avoid any doubt about whether the smoke is white or black.

www.catholic-pages.com...



Basically, its mostly a bunch of secret pleas to make whomever Pope, when the smoke clears there is a new Pope. As for why someone voted for this one instead of that one, it is not public knowledge.



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