It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Armed Revoultion Possible, Not So Difficult

page: 9
28
<< 6  7  8    10  11  12 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on May, 13 2009 @ 12:49 AM
link   

Originally posted by dooper
reply to post by DeadFlagBlues
 


You keep making the same error.

You assume a "let's all get on line and assault Washington" mentality.

As said so MANY times in other threads of similar concerns, that's not going to happen, thus your assumptions are without merit.

There will be an incident. An event. An assasination. A law enforcement execution gone bad. A natural, financial, or Constitutional disaster.

This event will be the catalyst.


With so many homes being confiscated, with so many jobs being lost, with so much anger building, it won't take much for the whole thing to go sideways.

When it does, we'll likely see a fair degree of anarchy and destruction.

THAT'S when those who would fight, would fight to RESTORE ORDER. Not assault DC.

And when order is eventually restored BY THE STATES, we can by the States, demand a return to a pre-1900 Constitution.

No fighting the military, no land assaults, no major battles, no massacres.

Sorry.


I've read the Operation Northwoods documents, recommending America secretly attack her own and blame another country.

I've read the Project for a New Century document, saying that America needed to new Pearl Harbour to persuade her citizens to fight in the Middle East.

I've watched 24, seeing self-righteous Americans arranging attacks on America and blaming them on someone else to manipulate the citizenry.

Every American guilty of planning, executing, or allowing to happen a false flag event in America is a traitor and should be drowned in a sewer.

Are you an American, Dooper?
I have noticed your continual vehement and unquestioning support of Israel.

Any enemy of America would be delighted to set on American against the next, brother against brother, laughing as they watch the demise of this once great country.




posted on May, 13 2009 @ 12:54 AM
link   
reply to post by sigil23
 


First off you never have to apologize to me! Your humility and your views are however appreciated but I am not the one you need to be humble too. I am just another fellow Texan tired of the crap and should the TSHTF I will be standing right there with you.

I think put in context that poster was saying in a "what if" scenario. As in what if there were a revolution and assuming the Government was in the wrong what would happen or need to happen...

I could be wrong but I do not think they are saying lets go kill all the politicians or at least I certainly hope not.

Just historically such as from the French revolution retribution is often brought to the politicians, with out a trial by jury.

Speaking of which, if there were to be a revolution that is what I would fear most is that the mob mentality would take hold and people would react out of anger and blood lust which will inevitably be directed towards the wrong people. In my eyes that would be a just as bad or worse travisty than the very things I seek to change such as the patriot act, etc.

One reason I think very highly of SGTChas is because he advocates reason and a calm and collected response that requires planning largely on a mental level. That is not to be violent for the sake of being violent.



posted on May, 13 2009 @ 12:59 AM
link   

Originally posted by DeadFlagBlues
reply to post by xxpigxx
 


- No/Ambiguous Enemy

Who are you shooting at? The "Gubmint?" Who's the government? The "shock troops?" You mean our family, friends, and spouses? Any particular branch of the government or military?

You couldn't possibly answer the question, because not even the man who wrote this article on the "ease" of this whole ordeal has his enemy. Most people out of ignorance declare themselves "Republican" or "Democrat," though really lying somewhere in the middle. Do those people kill eachother?

- Ideology

Who's going to "take lead" when this "movement" takes over? Do we restore the constitution and our current process of law and government? How would you ensure that those offices will be upheld as the one's that came before them turned out disasterous for the people of this republic. Do you give the huge Marxist/Communist movements their say? The Anarchists? The collective ignorance of the "right wing?" The ever confused "left?" Do we all get equal representation?

I don't know if you're a fan of history, but if you can understand the chaos that came after the Russian Revolution, you must know that "restoration" can be more dangerous than "renovation." They say "the road to hell is paved with good intentions." But, further more, I would add "The road to hell is paved without thorough introspection of your good intentions."

- Time/Duration of Conflict

How long before you and yours restore our union? If we can take any cues from the civil conflicts in Sri Lanka or even the never-ending tit for fat in Chechnya, will this go on forever? When is either side content with their compromise? How many innocent people have to die before y'all figure it out?

Seeing as how there's no enemy, there's no "sides" to this one, and there is no concrete distinctions between the people fighting, when would you hope to arrive at an "end point?"

- Casualties

Speaking of the death toll. How many people who you would consider "enemy combatants" or even "collaboraters" are just regular innocent men and women that have no idea what side to take? The news would call an armed uprising "domestic terrorism." People living in the suburbs would believe you and yours to the scrutiny that is passed from the government controlled media. Could you kill somebody that "didn't know." Would they be in the wrong for not adhering to your movements "principles." That sounds a lot like the "fascism" that this movement is fighting, does it not?


------------------------------------------

I posted a very similar response on a Thread/Post by SGTChas a while back. His thread was a Revolution fantasy as well. I think there is a group of ATS posters with an agenda in which they all write/share a sort of civil unrest fiction together to see what kind of feedback they get.

I ask the who/what/when/how and I never get anything close to a reasonable response. I don't recall who posted another thread with the overarching theme of civil unrest but it began with, "I was walking up to an old vets house, as he sized me up for any potential threat I pose, he could see my soul and he knew I was on his side." (or something very close to this) His thread ended with something like, "as we looked up at the flag we were ready for action."

My point being; These threads are nothing but complete fiction and the day-dreams of people wanting something in their lives that seems to be missing or perhaps this is some past-time they enjoy as a sort-of creative writing project to see what kind of reactions they can get out of other ATS posters.



[edit on 13-5-2009 by Mr.Hyde]



posted on May, 13 2009 @ 01:06 AM
link   
Damned if we do, damned if we dont.



posted on May, 13 2009 @ 01:08 AM
link   

Originally posted by Evisscerator
...
It is going to require people taking every single life of those who serve the public trust in order to bring about that change. If you leave any of their ilk behind or alive, they will rise again another day and do the same thing to everyone again....


This is pure insanity.

Excluding schools and hospitals that's 12 million people you'd be killing. Almost everyone would have a family member or someone they know well murdered. So they'd start fighting you. Then, instead of 12 million "enemies" you'd have 120 million very angry enemies.

Or would you be planning on tripling the numbers by killing government paid teachers and medical workers too?

After all, you say the bible says to kill them all.



posted on May, 13 2009 @ 01:11 AM
link   
Any uprising against the government, if it got off the ground, would also lead to an uprising against the uprisers.

The fighting couldn't be contained, and would soon leave America in ruins.

Only a person who hates America would help begin such a thing.



posted on May, 13 2009 @ 01:13 AM
link   
reply to post by Anonymous Avatar
 


point taken about the "what if" scenario.i can definitely relate to what SGTChas is saying in this thread and the "Push to Revolution" thread i am reading right now...i agree with others on this thread on the point that we do not have enough military to "occupy" our largest cities,let alone police the entire country.i have friends in the military,and they would never turn a gun on their fellow americans for defending their rights.i have talked to everyone from gutter punks to my kinfolk in the mountains about this issue,and we all agree that there is a lot more to this situation than the figurehead politicos who are portrayed as the ones running the show.



[edit on 13/5/09 by sigil23]



posted on May, 13 2009 @ 01:17 AM
link   
reply to post by sigil23
 


Indeed there is much more than meets the eye here and a lot of people across all walks of life can sense the storm approaching.

BTW welcome to ATS my friend. Glad you could join us in our discussions.


[edit on 13-5-2009 by Anonymous Avatar]



posted on May, 13 2009 @ 01:23 AM
link   
reply to post by Kailassa
 


i can see how a revolution could turn into a bloodbath as you described...to avoid that,there would have to be some sort of common cause amongst most americans that things need to change in a major way.that is only one of many possible scenarios,though...there is a chance that a nationwide protest of sorts could happen in such a fashion as to prevent "civil war"...



posted on May, 13 2009 @ 01:58 AM
link   
It's just utter ignorance to think of an armed revolution as a solution.

That's exactly what the opposition would want. A public and self-evident excuse to stay in control.

Our society is based upon fear. Fear is what keeps the system running. Every single individual that's part of the system is filled up to their throats with fear. Violence would only increase the fear, thus it would only strengthen that which you are fighting against.

The way to go is an Educational or Informational Revolution.
How the hell can an ATS member not realize this?

You wanna change stuff dramatically? GENERAL STRIKE!
We are the ones that sustain it all. If we all just do nothing for a couple of weeks, or even days, it would all collapse.

[edit on 13-5-2009 by Geladinhu]

[edit on 13-5-2009 by Geladinhu]



posted on May, 13 2009 @ 02:31 AM
link   
I am all for this, but I'll refrain from talking about that right now. I just wanted to give you all a few numbers to mull over, so pay attention!

There are approx. 307,212,123 Americans
(Source: www.macroworldinvestor.com...)

The United States military has approx. 1,454,515 active military personnel, and another 840,000 reservists. This is 2,294,515 soldiers.
(Source: en.wikipedia.org...)

Just for fun...

The Canadian Military has approx. 65,890 active duty soldiers, with another 34,913 reservists. This is 100,803 soldiers.
(Source: en.wikipedia.org...)

The Mexican Military has approx. 181,356 soldiers.
(Source: en.wikipedia.org...)

The 'proposed' United Nations Army will have an estimated 15,000 soldiers.
(Source: archive.newsmax.com...)


Now, for the fun part!

Out of 307,212,123 Americans, approx. 21.6% of them are gun owners. This comes out to 66,357,818 armed Americans.
(Source: wiki.answers.com...)

There are an estimated 200,000,000 guns in America.
(Source: wiki.answers.com...)


So, in a worst-case scenario, in which the United States military, the Mexican military, the Canadian military, and the U.N. Army are all pitted against armed Americans, and assuming every single soldier would obey orders (though many soldiers would likely join the civilians rather than fight them), their force would be 2,591,674 strong.

So, 2,591,674 soldiers, pitted against 66,357,818 armed American civilians. This is 25.60 armed Americans to each military soldier.

Do you really think 25 armed, pissed off men, couldn't win in a battle against 1 armed 'soldier'?

Now just imagine, there are another 59,413,358 males, and 59,187,183 females, aged 18 to 49, that are fit for military service in the United States.
(Source: en.wikipedia.org...)

What if half of them joined in against the government? There are more than enough guns to go around, so don't say it can't happen.

All opinions aside, just in sheer numbers, and given that civilians would be fighting for their lives, their families, their country, and their way of life, rather than fighting 'per orders' as soldiers would be doing, I think the odds are actually heavily tipped in the favor of the civilians.



posted on May, 13 2009 @ 02:31 AM
link   
Hey guys...
I just joined in... (after spending a couple of hours reading the whole thread and catching up…


*I’m sorry but I’ll have to cut my posting in two coz it turned out a bit long.
But bear with me, i tried to be as brief as I could.*

I totally agree with the fact that an armed revolution is EXACTLY what's gonna bring the HELL we're trying to avoid... And i'm 100% positive... THAT's what 'they' (we know who… whoever is orchestrating this NWO bull*) are hoping that we will do: get our rage out in the streets so they have the perfect ‘excuse’ to put us ALL under their boots...

And I think I know why most of us following this thread are not satisfied with the idea that deadflagblue’s been proposing... (even tho it's very well intentioned) that just by behaving and being 'good citizens' everything's gonna be alright... that IS pretty naive.

I truly think (and feel) (and know) that good will, good work, strength, courage, honesty, peace and all the rest of the nice words... ARE the only way we have out of this mess.

But we also need to realize a couple of things...

1. In order to put all this beautiful virtues into action... we need to be proficient at them. We need to have them developed within ourselves and within our close environment, right? So education in this context is vital. We need to invest our NOW time/energy in self-education, self-improvement, rehab, anger management, take the forgive-your-parents workshop... whatever will make us more capable of pouring out these noble virtues... instead of the rage that will bring our own demise.

2. After all these pages and pages of discussion on this topic... does it look like we will ever get to a collective agreement on anything regarding this matter? Hmmm... I don't think so. We're all very smart and we could go on outsmarting each other forever.
And i think the reason why this happens is because... we're focusing on the wrong subject (i.e. 'The System Itself', a.k.a. ‘It’ or ‘Nonsense’).
'IT' is SO wicked that as soon as we engage on discussing about it... we lose sight of what is true (i.e. 'common sense').

No matter what our beliefs are, no matter what our background might be, as long as we keep choosing being ‘pro’ or ‘against’ anything that is related to ‘it’… (and I’m sad to say this coz I’m still doing it, but…) we will STILL be IN ‘IT’ (i.e. working ‘for’ ‘it’, giving ‘it’ our time and thought energy… in fact, even at this very moment while we’re trying to figure out how to get out of ‘it’… we’re feeding ‘it’). And we all know the saying… ‘where attention goes, energy flows’, right? This is Basic Universal Laws 1.0.

And I don’t know about you guys but personally, i’m completely wholly fully thoroughly fed up with ‘its’ nonsense.
I want, for me and for my kids-to-come, ‘something completely different’, something NEW that will finally MAKE SENSE.

Now, I can already hear the little voice in your heads asking… yeah, but ‘WHO’S SENSE’???

And that’s the whole point.

I totally believe that we all humans (regardless the degree of individual delusion we might still be dwelling in), deep down inside, share ONE field of beliefs. Something that is COMMON to all of us. Something that could be called ‘COMMON SENSE’.

Coz, say… who would turn down for example… freedom, joy, peace of mind, harmonious environments, nature, affection, support, beauty, comradery, good food, fresh air, clean water… do you know anyone that would say any of these things are hazardous??? I don’t.

(continues on next posting…)



posted on May, 13 2009 @ 02:36 AM
link   
So what if, instead of focusing on HOW TO GET RID OF ‘IT’ (or THE NONSENSE)…
We just IGNORE the nonsense (STOP FEEDING ‘IT’ with our time and effort), and redirect our thought energy by focusing on WHAT DOES MAKE SENSE to ALL of US… ? (Doesn’t it make sense???) :p

What we’re doing is pretty much like trying to have a meaningful conversation with someone who’s mentally ill… it’s a waste of time my friends… the system IS mentally ill… and no matter how much we try to work around it… its whole foundation is based on PURE NONSENSE. Yeah, i'm trying not to use the word evil...

What if, instead of thinking about how many guns we can gather collectively, to see if we are ’tougher’ than the devil itself… we, the millions that we are, forget about this self-perpetuating war and start beautifying our immediate surroundings? Starting with our own Minds and Hearts, followed by our Homes and Blocks, followed by our Neighborhoods and Cities…

What if we exclusively focus on our vision of the Beautiful, Abundant, Peaceful, Joyful Planet we KNOW we CAN inhabit and start planting fruit trees, growing vegetables out of our lawns, getting to know our neighbors, doing community gatherings, trading skills and goods among our community, making things prettier and easier for those around us… I like it! Sounds good… doesn’t it???

So YES, we DO need to get armed!

First of all with pillows, so we can punch them freely in our bedrooms in order to get our rage and frustration out of our guts within a safe environment. You know, being human in these global times is hard indeed and I don’t think we’ll find it easy to go around smiling a lot right now… so whatever discomfort we might be feeling we need to express it, let it out… but NEVER EVER in a public space. Emotions are personal, and they must be dealt with in that same way.

Then with gardening tools and seeds… coz guys, at the pace this whole thing is developing, we need to get as self-sustainable as we can as fast as we can. Let’s not forget that we are, if not totally, highly dependent on industrialized food right now and that the whole food industry is, if not totally, highly dependent on the economic madness… so you do the math…

Then with open minds and open arms and open eyes and open mouths and open hearts to start bonding to each other, creating personal relationships that will resurrect the flow of goods and skills and support between us people… how are we gonna find out that our neighbor has one too many of exactly what we need if we don’t start a conversation?

Then with… Random Acts of Kindness…! We all must have experienced how as soon as we give something, out of pure good will, without expecting anything in return, something beautiful and unexpected comes our way… right? As soon as we give something truly from our heart, life responds with some sort of out-of-the-blue awesome pampering, doesn’t it? So… let’s do it more often! I love being pampered! And I love to get things from life and not having to necessarily pay for them… well, who doesn’t? Can you imagine the virus of ‘RAK’ being spread globally?!?!? I’m loving it!!!

So I’m thinking… maybe the cliché of ‘Thinking Globally, Acting Locally’ is not a cliché anymore…

Maybe it is the ONE thing left to do.

Maybe our very LIVES depend on the fact of TRULY UNDERSTANDING what this simple sentence means and TRULY ACTING according to it.

Maybe this is our last chance to let the ‘COMMON SENSE’ bring us together, and wake up to the mind-blowing awesomeness of Human Potential.


I’m going to bed now.
I wanna wake up early tomorrow and go around the hood, plant some organic apple seeds I’ve been putting aside for some reason… now I know why. Free apples for my grandkids… yay!

Gnite guys, and thank you all for your passion. This is a great space to get inspired…



posted on May, 13 2009 @ 02:56 AM
link   

Originally posted by DeadFlagBlues
reply to post by xxpigxx
 


God, we're so thoroughly screwed if you have people agreeing with this man. I doubt any of you have thought about the logisitics behind an armed revolution in America. Take your beerhats off for a few hours and run it through your head a few times and see if you think it's even slightly feasible in the process of making your life better.


First and foremost, I do not condone this but...

It is feasible as 3% won the revolutionary war.

To be honest you don't even need guns to win a war.

Gasoline or something like it works pretty well.

Direct open conflict is foolish, guerrilla warfare works.

This country runs due to its Infrastructure.

Like "The Power Grid", Like "Dams", Like "Water Supply"
and if some "creative" individual realizes this and has the
Cojones to make it happen it will start to unspool massively.

We have seen what the fires have done in parts of the country on
small scale, what if someone "really" put their mind and some
timers to the task ?

"All Hell" can break loose.

The wildfires that ravaged Australia are a good example of what
can be done WITHOUT a gun.

And as I stated at the beginning, I do not wish this, and I think
it would be a disaster. Let's just hope the politicians don't want
this to happen either and take some steps to get this Ship back
on course for prosperity instead of financial piracy.

Good Luck to you all !



posted on May, 13 2009 @ 03:01 AM
link   
A "Warning".

I don't doubt at some point in the future that this nation will become engaged in widespread internal asymmetric warfare against multiple insurgencies across the country.

That said, I personally don't think it will be in the immediate future and I am not an advocate or opponent of it.

I offer a warning not as a threat, but as advice.

People advocating militancy should take note of P2OG.

P2OG or Proactive, Preemptive Operations Group has an objective to provoke or stimulate a "terror" response that exposes their target. This allows preemptive action against the target before it becomes a serious threat.

In other words to get the target to jump the gun and get terminated with extreme prejudice.

One other thing, I shouldn't really need to remind anyone of the signals intelligence interception and collection capabilities that exist and how easy it is for someone to be labeled a potential threat.





[edit on 13/5/09 by MikeboydUS]



posted on May, 13 2009 @ 03:13 AM
link   
reply to post by MikeboydUS
 





posted on May, 13 2009 @ 03:43 AM
link   

Originally posted by earthman4
The article is apples and America is Oranges. No relevance whatsoever. Treason is punishable by death. To call yourselves a ressistance is a joke. You have not been invaded. Your archaic notions of nationalism will be crushed by patriots. You don't have to love it or leave it, just die in your pool of self-pity.


Our government is supposed to be of the people, right?

By this reasoning, anything done by our politicians that is against the MAJORITY will of the people is treason, right? In this case, the body composing the Federal government is guilty of treason. Being an elitist globalist and selling out to corporate interests in the sake of gaining personal benefits is not in the will of the people. These politicians only do the minimum to keep their jobs, and are thus careerists on top of all of this. They do not have your, my or anyone's best interest in mind but their own.

That said, armed revolution is a VERY last ditch measure, in my opinion. Despite my thinking that the Builderburg theories are at least partially true, I believe that there are enough non-sheeple around that if we can wake the rest of the populace, it is possible to use the current system to take back America for the people, and keep it that way.

Part of this would involve kicking everyone out of the Federal government, and ceasing all interaction with the UN. From there, it would be best to redact all laws except for the bill of rights, as well as the Constitution, and work from there, beginning with a fairer way of administering taxes.



posted on May, 13 2009 @ 03:46 AM
link   

Originally posted by Ex_MislTech

Direct open conflict is foolish, guerrilla warfare works.

This country runs due to its Infrastructure.

Like "The Power Grid", Like "Dams", Like "Water Supply"
and if some "creative" individual realizes this and has the
Cojones to make it happen it will start to unspool massively.

We have seen what the fires have done in parts of the country on
small scale, what if someone "really" put their mind and some
timers to the task ?

"All Hell" can break loose.

The wildfires that ravaged Australia are a good example of what can be done WITHOUT a gun.

And as I stated at the beginning, I do not wish this, and I think
it would be a disaster. Let's just hope the politicians don't want
this to happen either and take some steps to get this Ship back
on course for prosperity instead of financial piracy.

Good Luck to you all !


Could anyone other than an ignorant gutter crawling coward suggest lighting fires like that would show cohones and help to change a country?

How would you like your wife and child, living in a town known to be safe from fires, to suddenly find the whole town encircled by a wall of flame, with no way to escape, and to be roasted alive while the burning house fell crushing them. Or they might try to escape, and add to the mangled lumps of charcoal the CFA found in cars later, trapped by fallen, burnt trees.

Every person killed in the fires you refer to was either a child or a decent, responsible adult. Three were friends of mine. And you are encouraging, despite your weasel words to evade responsibility, idiots to do that to your fellow Americans. That's if you are an American.

Yes, the worst of those fires was deliberately lit, and you know what came of it? The government now has a registry with each person's phone numbers on it and the ability to phone everyone en masse. They wanted to bring it in, but people were concerned about the invasion of privacy. Now they have what they wanted.

I would show you some of the people, towns and sculptures that were destroyed, but I don't teach pigs to sing.


Anyone following leaders who want them to murder their fellow citizens who are just sitting harmlessly in their homes is a traitor, a creep and a coward.

- And a terrorist.



posted on May, 13 2009 @ 03:58 AM
link   

Originally posted by Kailassa
Any uprising against the government, if it got off the ground, would also lead to an uprising against the uprisers.

The fighting couldn't be contained, and would soon leave America in ruins.

Only a person who hates America would help begin such a thing.


Yes of course.
Sometimes it's just like seeing a rabid Beast, after turning against other animals, starts to eat itself.

Of course I'm not saying America is the beast, but the acts (and non-acts during the Bush years) of a fraction of americans is disturbing to say the least.

I will pray. For America and for the World.
God help us!



posted on May, 13 2009 @ 04:05 AM
link   
To the OP. Congradulations on a successful thread.
I saw when you first opened it last night and I thought to myself "Oh boy, ATS members are going to be brawling each other soon". Here we are, 9-10 pages later, and it looks like we already gota few out of the way.
I read your article, and I agree with a lot of it up to a certain point.
I agree that anything is possible.
I think the biggest subject here being overlooked, or not being looked at enough, is our military. It all depends on our military on how we will end up.
Many here think that the military is going to be the group that they are going to have to worry about when it comes towinning any kind of war.
This is one big issue that can throw a wrench in everyones theories.
I think before any kind of war was waged, you would first have to know whom you are fighting against, whois on your side, who is not on your side, and also those in the middle.At this point, you have to be100 percent sure of who your friends and foes are.
THEN just maybe, you can start the revolution you speak of, but in order to wage war on anyone, you must know what you are fighting first, cause if you dont, that will be your downfall and you will fail.
In my opinion, I do not think that Our Military would bring bombs on its own people just for one simple reason..
They are already fighting for us.
Deep down every Marine/Soldier knows that they are fighting because of some Ahole politician, but at the same time, the real reason they are there in the first place is to Defend their country and the men/women in it.
A revolution in my opinion would not be like what we had before with North and South..It will be within each state, total chaos.

To tell you the truth though, I dont think it will come to that, deep down people will remember that they have children, and nieces,nephews, grandparents, parents, brothers ,sisters, all whom they love too much to go out and play Capt. America.
Im sorry to say this, but I feel that it is true, people nowadays are just too damned soft compared to what they were back in the old days. Too many bleeding hearts for anything like that to happen. It is easy to sit around here and talk tough, but to actually get up and do it, thats a whole other ballgame. Sometimes I feel that there are just too many Keyboard Killahs out there.

-Side Note....I am with the Majority of the people out there that thinks something needs to be done, and I am one of those people who WILL stand for what I believe in, and nobody can take that right away from me.
Im not against a revolution, and Im not for it, but if it has to be done, well by golly sign me up.




top topics



 
28
<< 6  7  8    10  11  12 >>

log in

join