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posted on May, 14 2009 @ 06:55 PM
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Sorry, but I'm not sure most of the beliefs espoused on these forums should be treated with anything BUT ridicule and suspicion. While it's true that people form belief systems and can be hostile to good ideas because of that, there is also such a thing as a stupid idea. I could claim you are all reincarnated spirits from another planet that was invaded by space reptilians, but none of you will be under any obligation at all to respect my beliefs. Reason and evidence should be used to critique ideas. Most of what i see on here is very probably mentally ill individuals waffling on about aliens and government agents tracking them down. Well, fine, if reason and (any evidence whatsoever) points to such ideas being true, then they can be discussed. Until then the people around you are right to laugh and point fingers your way. There is a difference between being open-minded and trying to excuse your mental illness and subjective experience as fact. PEACE!




posted on May, 14 2009 @ 07:14 PM
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reply to post by spacerumsfield
 


I see your new here.

We are talking about the "discussion" of such topics, not really about us being mentally ill and all of us claiming to be santa clause or something.



posted on May, 15 2009 @ 03:52 AM
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reply to post by spacerumsfield
 





Originally posted by spacerumsfield
Sorry, but I'm not sure most of the beliefs espoused on these forums should be treated with anything BUT ridicule and suspicion.


Yeah that's right.... that's the way.
Just bash and ridicule anything you don't understand or can't fathom


Did you even read the OP?






I could claim you are all reincarnated spirits from another planet that was invaded by space reptilians,
but none of you will be under any obligation at all to respect my beliefs.



Then you would be talking about Scientology....and there are places you can go for that.
Either to join them, or for mental help....i would recommend the latter


And despite your claims, most decent members on here DO respect others beliefs and try to have rational and informed discussions and debates on such topics.

You should perhaps give that a go.... instead of what you've done here.




Reason and evidence should be used to critique ideas. Most of what i see on here is very probably mentally ill individuals waffling on about aliens and government agents tracking them down.


Which is exactly the way myself and most of the members on here do things.... reason and evidence.
Perhaps you should read other forums besides the "skunk works" forum





There is a difference between being open-minded and trying to excuse your mental illness and subjective experience as fact. PEACE!


There is indeed... perhaps you should give the former a go





[edit on 15/5/09 by blupblup]



posted on May, 15 2009 @ 04:14 AM
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Originally posted by spacerumsfield
Sorry, but I'm not sure most of the beliefs espoused on these forums should be treated with anything BUT ridicule and suspicion.


Suspicion is fine. That means you are thinking, evaluating things and using your brain to come to some kind of conclusion - hopefully the truth.

But ridicule..? What is the point of that? Nothing wrong with a little humor now and then, but to ridicule topics or people to make them feel small and stupid is just not very productive.

It's better to make a little bit of an effort to show them excactly why you think they may be wrong or have misunderstood something. If you can manage to treat people with a minimum of respect and also provide some useful information regarding the subject in question, you have a good chance of getting an actual discussion going.

Then people may learn something instead of turning into a screaming, raging troll because of hurt feelings. They may become a little less ignorant instead of just logging out of ATS to never return again.

In my very personal opinion, of course.



posted on May, 15 2009 @ 04:30 AM
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Originally posted by blupblup
reply to post by pretty_vacant
 


"You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink"


Exactly. Took the words right out of my mouth.



posted on May, 15 2009 @ 05:24 AM
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Originally posted by ziggystar60
It's better to make a little bit of an effort to show them excactly why you think they may be wrong or have misunderstood something. If you can manage to treat people with a minimum of respect and also provide some useful information regarding the subject in question, you have a good chance of getting an actual discussion going.


Exactly.... very well said


How do we learn anything?

Through discussions and being objective.

Not through ridicule and ignorance.

[edit on 15/5/09 by blupblup]



posted on May, 15 2009 @ 08:51 AM
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reply to post by spacerumsfield
 


what are you doing here?

just curious - I'm sure you have your reasons

and - by the way - ending a snotty little contribution like that with - PEACE?

seriously - childish

[edit on 5/15/2009 by Spiramirabilis]



posted on May, 15 2009 @ 09:46 AM
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Originally posted by blupblup

And despite your claims, most decent members on here DO respect others beliefs and try to have rational and informed discussions and debates on such topics.



You know blup, with respect to the above quoted, I want to add my $.03 ($.01 for inflation) on this precise matter.

I'm going to go out on a limb here, speaking for myself and say that's not true (even for myself it's not), and I'll tell you why.

Personally speaking, I respect the fact that they can HAVE those beliefs without ridicule, however I, in turn, also reserve my own right to NOT respect any person's particular belief or opinion..solely based on what that belief or opinion represents.

I think that's where a lot of angst here comes from, not being able to separate the respect for a person to believe something versus our own conflicting turmoil on realizing how silly or unfounded some belief's are.



AB1



posted on May, 15 2009 @ 10:22 AM
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Originally posted by alphabetaone

Personally speaking, I respect the fact that they can HAVE those beliefs without ridicule, however I, in turn, also reserve my own right to NOT respect any person's particular belief or opinion..solely based on what that belief or opinion represents.



I understand what your saying, perhaps "respecting their beliefs" was the wrong phrase or term for it.
Perhaps having a civil discussions about it and not insulting people would have been a better way to term it.

I agree with you, there are many beliefs and opinions that i do not respect.






I think that's where a lot of angst here comes from, not being able to separate the respect for a person to believe something versus our own conflicting turmoil on realizing how silly or unfounded some belief's are.
AB1


Again, i totally agree.... i think i was just trying to let the rather rude and...er.... well yeah, person know that their post was a little ignorant.

But yes, thanks for pointing it out mate



posted on May, 15 2009 @ 06:01 PM
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Very good opening post. Starred and flagged.
*******************************************
Most people don't want to hear it. They want to remain asleep. How does this affect them? In every single aspect of their life and the life of their children.

Cameras on every street corner, every parking lot, everywhere you are filmed, logged in as a statistic, watched by another person. No privacy.

Rights, little by little everyone's rights are being wittled away slowly and quietly.

1984 is here and most people are being kept so busy they don't have the time or energy to investigate or challenge what the heck is going on all over our planet.

Every human is involved and affected. Everyone of us. Most people just don't want to wake the frig up and see what the hell is actually going on.

Look beyond what is staring you in the face.

We (on Earth) are an enslaved species on a prison planet.

The rabbit hole goes really deep and the twist and turns are sometimes beyond human comprehension.



posted on May, 15 2009 @ 06:22 PM
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reply to post by ofhumandescent
 




Originally posted by ofhumandescent
Very good opening post. Starred and flagged.
*******************************************


Thank you very much







Most people don't want to hear it. They want to remain asleep. How does this affect them? In every single aspect of their life and the life of their children.
Cameras on every street corner, every parking lot, everywhere you are filmed, logged in as a statistic, watched by another person. No privacy.
Rights, little by little everyone's rights are being wittled away slowly and quietly.


Totally agree.... as i said, it is the WHY they don't want to hear it that puzzles me?
Is it largely ignorance, or fear, or stupidity or just the pace of life or just the way we are conditioned?

And yes.....slowly but surely, rights and freedoms are being eroded

And most people either don't know or don't care







1984 is here and most people are being kept so busy they don't have the time or energy to investigate or challenge what the heck is going on all over our planet.
Every human is involved and affected. Everyone of us. Most people just don't want to wake the frig up and see what the hell is actually going on.


Yes it is...

And we are all affected most definitely, yet the will be an extremely small percentage of us who are informed or ready when the time comes.
It is sad that people just don't care..... like really don't care or don't see how it affects their lives...






Look beyond what is staring you in the face.
We (on Earth) are an enslaved species on a prison planet.
The rabbit hole goes really deep and the twist and turns are sometimes beyond human comprehension.



People can't see the wood for the trees unfortunately.

At least some people are aware and some of us think about these issues.
It's a shame that more people don't....but TPTB do such a good job in ridiculing and rubbishing conspiracy theories, why would anyone be interested?



peace


[edit on 15/5/09 by blupblup]



posted on May, 17 2009 @ 02:32 PM
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reply to post by blupblup
 


people should care and i think if shown the right material or exposed to it for long enough, it will open a door for them... and the more people that are willing to use critical thinking and reasoning skills, the better. most people dont care to hear about it because they are so absorbed in their busy busy lives and if they just stepped back for a second and thought about it, their oh s*&# light would come on. i dont see why more people dont question TPTB. think about it....they ridicule these "conspiracy theories", a lot of which make sense...why would they do that? because it is not in line with what they would lead you to believe. hmm, so in two seconds we have come to the realization that TPTB want to decieve us into false beliefs....so why NOT question everything then? the truth is out there, you just have to be willing to dig, look, and think.

a good example is my battle, whom i will refer to as Jimbo. Jimbo watches me on here night after night and at first tells me how rediculous this stuff is...then starts asking what i'm reading about, then starts reading a little bit and a little bit more...then one night at the dining facility, he looks up at me and asks what really happened on 9/11 and why we arent being told the truth. at that point, i shook his hand and told him, "welcome...do some digging and see what you can find" and now this stuff is all he talks about (to me)




posted on May, 18 2009 @ 09:12 AM
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Originally posted by BrainPower
people should care and i think if shown the right material or exposed to it for long enough, it will open a door for them... and the more people that are willing to use critical thinking and reasoning skills, the better.


Definitely...it's getting people to sit and read/watch/listen (to) the stuff that is the tricky part.
But unfortunately, as George Carlin said, they (TPTB) don't want a nation/world of intelligent critical thinkers.

This sums it up better than anyone else has put it.

**Some foul language**

George Carlin








i dont see why more people dont question TPTB. think about it....they ridicule these "conspiracy theories", a lot of which make sense...why would they do that?


I know mate.... but most people are content with watching guff on the TV and plodding along happily in their lives.

As they say,it's a cliché but, "Ignorance is bliss"







a good example is my battle, whom i will refer to as Jimbo. Jimbo watches me on here night after night and at first tells me how rediculous this stuff is...then starts asking what i'm reading about, then starts reading a little bit and a little bit more...then one night at the dining facility, he looks up at me and asks what really happened on 9/11 and why we arent being told the truth. at that point, i shook his hand and told him, "welcome...do some digging and see what you can find" and now this stuff is all he talks about (to me)


Well at least if all of us just wake up one person....then we have done out jobs....over the years there have been a few people that i know have become more interested in this stuff because of chats we've had and whatever.... especially just after 9/11.

But there will always be those, and they are the majority, that will just ridicule and believe whatever the Government say.

[edit on 18/5/09 by blupblup]



posted on May, 18 2009 @ 01:17 PM
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well, yeah my buddy kinda really had no choice but to hear about it, i mean, he is stuck with me for 12 hours a night, 6 days a week haha!!! i think i have figured out the reason why there seems to be a lot of people in the military interested in these topics. i think it boils down to deployment...you are away from (most of) the TV, movies and all the petty little self involved things that keep most people stuck in the social construct that denies critical thinking and reasoning skills. It gives us time to think about stuff



posted on May, 18 2009 @ 02:04 PM
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reply to post by BrainPower
 



Actually that's really interesting man.
I wonder how many other servicemen and women are into these topics?

And if it's for similar reasons as you guys?


That is fascinating for sure.

Cheers



posted on May, 18 2009 @ 10:46 PM
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reply to post by blupblup
 


i dont know exactly, but at least 5 of my close friends over here are into this stuff...thats more than any of my civilian friends.




posted on May, 19 2009 @ 08:48 AM
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Originally posted by BrainPower
reply to post by blupblup
 


i dont know exactly, but at least 5 of my close friends over here are into this stuff...thats more than any of my civilian friends.




That is really interesting stuff.

I think i may look into this a bit more.
I know a lot of ex-military guys come out saying they've seen this and heard that and there is obviously a link between the military and say UFO's for instance.... but i wonder, in terms of figures, how many servicemen and women are actually interested in thses subjects and for what reasons.


Thanks for giving me some food for thought



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