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Draft/Armed Forces Question

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dz

posted on Apr, 27 2004 @ 10:31 AM
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Originally posted by - G -
You contradicted yourself, I didn't?


You are rather slow. If you can't make the connections, I can't help that. I have proved my point several times.

There is a such thing as living a life of peace and knowing when you need to defend yourself. It's not contradicting; it's a fact of life.




posted on Apr, 27 2004 @ 10:31 AM
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Has anybody who posted in his thread actually been in the military, because it smells like a bunch of hippie bull# being thrown around.


However, I do know you can file for conscientious objector status. What you have to do is prove that for your life, you have been a pacifist (so a police report of you getting into a bar fight isn't going to help
). It's hard to get, but possible. Once you have one of those, you'll work in a non-combat position (cook, clerk, etc...).

Also, remember, not everyone in the military fights. For every pilot in an aircraft, there's a bunch of guys on the ground keeping that plane working. For every soldier on the front lines, there's more working the supply lines.

In World War II, only 1 out of every 5 US soldiers actually saw combat. The military is an organism, not an unbridled killing machine. Somebody has to keep the bullets getting to the front lines, someone has to make sure the orders get through, and somebody has to make sure the boys up front have enough food to eat.


dz

posted on Apr, 27 2004 @ 10:33 AM
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Originally posted by Esoterica
Has anybody who posted in his thread actually been in the military, because it smells like a bunch of hippie bull# being thrown around.


However, I do know you can file for conscientious objector status. What you have to do is prove that for your life, you have been a pacifist (so a police report of you getting into a bar fight isn't going to help
). It's hard to get, but possible. Once you have one of those, you'll work in a non-combat position (cook, clerk, etc...).

Also, remember, not everyone in the military fights. For every pilot in an aircraft, there's a bunch of guys on the ground keeping that plane working. For every soldier on the front lines, there's more working the supply lines.

In World War II, only 1 out of every 5 US soldiers actually saw combat. The military is an organism, not an unbridled killing machine. Somebody has to keep the bullets getting to the front lines, someone has to make sure the orders get through, and somebody has to make sure the boys up front have enough food to eat.


Thank you. That's exactly what I was looking for.

Anyways, I have to go run errands now. Thanks to all those that responded in this thread; it was fun.



posted on Apr, 27 2004 @ 10:44 AM
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Originally posted by dz

Originally posted by - G -
You contradicted yourself, I didn't?


You are rather slow. If you can't make the connections, I can't help that. I have proved my point several times.

There is a such thing as living a life of peace and knowing when you need to defend yourself. It's not contradicting; it's a fact of life.


Listen Mr. Lover and not a fighter. . . you started this thread in the Mud Pit Forum, and since you choose to start it here that is what I did, started throwing some mud, seeing if I could get you "fired-up." I SUCCEEDED!

As to who is slow, it seems that I must now give you a lesson in vocabulary;

Contradict - To assert or express the opposite of (a statement).
Contradict - To be contrary to; be inconsistent with.

No where in there do I see anything along the lines of making two seperate statements, in two seperate post as to being "a fact of life." That my fiend is called contradiction!

[Edited on 4/27/2004 by - G -]


dz

posted on Apr, 27 2004 @ 11:44 AM
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Originally posted by - G -
Listen Mr. Lover and not a fighter. . . you started this thread in the Mud Pit Forum, and since you choose to start it here that is what I did, started throwing some mud, seeing if I could get you "fired-up." I SUCCEEDED!


There's a difference between debating and idiocy.


Originally posted by - G -
As to who is slow, it seems that I must now give you a lesson in vocabulary;

Contradict - To assert or express the opposite of (a statement).
Contradict - To be contrary to; be inconsistent with.

No where in there do I see anything along the lines of making two seperate statements, in two seperate post as to being "a fact of life." That my fiend is called contradiction!


..No. The contradiction would be me saying that "I am a peaceful person" and me also saying that "I love fighting". Me saying "I am a peaceful person" and me saying "I will defend myself" is not. I do not go out looking for fights. I do not start fights. In fact, I go out of my way not to fight. BUT when someone comes near me for the sole purpose of fighting, yes I will defend myself. If someone really wants to fight you, they will.

That is not contradicting.



posted on Apr, 27 2004 @ 11:52 AM
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You can file for a non-combatant position.
Alternatively, if you're worried about not being allowed this, volunteer if you're 100% sure the draft will be instated. At least that way you'll have training to a higher standard than the draftees and you'll be in a position to pick the job of your choice.
Or join NASA, or make yourself indespensible at a company that helps with the army/etc.
Do not fear
Anyway, I only think a small number of the draftees will be sent to war


dz

posted on Apr, 27 2004 @ 11:57 AM
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Originally posted by browha
You can file for a non-combatant position.
Alternatively, if you're worried about not being allowed this, volunteer if you're 100% sure the draft will be instated. At least that way you'll have training to a higher standard than the draftees and you'll be in a position to pick the job of your choice.
Or join NASA, or make yourself indespensible at a company that helps with the army/etc.
Do not fear
Anyway, I only think a small number of the draftees will be sent to war


Since NASA is a government agency, would they still pull me out of that to go fight? Technically, I am helping the government. Just not to fight..



posted on Apr, 27 2004 @ 12:05 PM
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I'm confident they wouldnt, but not entirely sure.
Perhaps ask at your local recruiting office or something?
Technically a company can ask for you to be 'passed-over' by the draft if you are important to them..



posted on Apr, 27 2004 @ 12:06 PM
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NASA isn't part of the military, so no dice.



posted on Apr, 27 2004 @ 12:06 PM
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I wasn't trying to rile him up =\ I wasn't even trying to be difficult. I was being completely serious, for once not a trouble maker. Sorry if I offended.


dz

posted on Apr, 27 2004 @ 12:31 PM
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Originally posted by browha
I'm confident they wouldnt, but not entirely sure.
Perhaps ask at your local recruiting office or something?
Technically a company can ask for you to be 'passed-over' by the draft if you are important to them..


Interesting.. hopefully by then I'll be at Lockheed or NASA.



posted on Apr, 27 2004 @ 12:56 PM
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If there is ever a draft, there are provisions in place for conciencious objectors in which you can request serving without being put in a position where you will have to kill.There are many supporting roles people can play for a war efoort without actualy being in the military, although it may be hard to prove that you actualy don't believe in killing as opposed to just not wanting to go to war. If you can prove to them, then they have to let you serve another way.

Here is a link to how the draft works
people.howstuffworks.com...

try this place out too, im don't agree with their anti-military ideas, but some of them could help you state you conciencous objector status.

www.objector.org...

also

www.scn.org...

Im in the military, and I hope that if the time comes people will join up and fight to defend the country, but I don't want to have to fight alongside some guy who doesn't want to be there, and won't follow oders. Thats why i think the draft is a bad idea.

[Edited on 27-4-2004 by TheEXone]



posted on Apr, 27 2004 @ 09:57 PM
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The draft should be used only in the defence of the home or motherland. It is your duty to defend what belongs to you and your fellow countrymen.

Cowards will be shot



posted on Apr, 27 2004 @ 10:00 PM
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they cant touch you anymore. they have to stay at least 1 foot away. which is still pretty close for a huge DI yelling in your face



posted on Apr, 27 2004 @ 10:45 PM
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Originally posted by Esoterica
Has anybody who posted in his thread actually been in the military, because it smells like a bunch of hippie bull# being thrown around.



I am in the military, and I will tell you this.

First of all, Congress has approved an additional $28 million dollars for the Selective Service's budget. You do realize what that means, everyone, don't you? Selective Service normally does little more than register numbers for when people turn 18, and/or when someone registers to vote or join the military. Aside from that, they are in charge of calling those numbers in the event of a draft. So prepare, if you are able-bodied, the draft is coming for you within the next few years.

A little evidence :

In 2004, $28 million was added to the SSS budget in anticipation for another possible military draft. On March 31, 2005, the SSS must report to President Bush that the system, which has lain dormant for decades, is ready for activation.

From here

March 31st is right around the corner. We may hear nothing, we may hear dire news. Your best bet, if you are fearful of getting drafted, is to (ack!) join early, before the draft. Bush has worked out a deal with Canada to, in the event of a draft, disallow U.S. draft-dodgers to cross over into Canada to escape. Also, there's no escaping by way of running off to college-- that won't work anymore.

IF you get drafted, expect the MOS' that are the bottom of the barrell, i.e. Infantry, Indirect Fire Infantry, Combat Engineers (testing mines), and whatever other jobs that volunteers don't want.


dz

posted on Apr, 27 2004 @ 11:27 PM
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Originally posted by Cappa

Originally posted by Esoterica
Has anybody who posted in his thread actually been in the military, because it smells like a bunch of hippie bull# being thrown around.



I am in the military, and I will tell you this.

First of all, Congress has approved an additional $28 million dollars for the Selective Service's budget. You do realize what that means, everyone, don't you? Selective Service normally does little more than register numbers for when people turn 18, and/or when someone registers to vote or join the military. Aside from that, they are in charge of calling those numbers in the event of a draft. So prepare, if you are able-bodied, the draft is coming for you within the next few years.

A little evidence :

In 2004, $28 million was added to the SSS budget in anticipation for another possible military draft. On March 31, 2005, the SSS must report to President Bush that the system, which has lain dormant for decades, is ready for activation.

From here

March 31st is right around the corner. We may hear nothing, we may hear dire news. Your best bet, if you are fearful of getting drafted, is to (ack!) join early, before the draft. Bush has worked out a deal with Canada to, in the event of a draft, disallow U.S. draft-dodgers to cross over into Canada to escape. Also, there's no escaping by way of running off to college-- that won't work anymore.

IF you get drafted, expect the MOS' that are the bottom of the barrell, i.e. Infantry, Indirect Fire Infantry, Combat Engineers (testing mines), and whatever other jobs that volunteers don't want.


Include Australia in that list.

Out of curiosity, for those of you that aren't in the military, would you be ok with being drafted?



posted on Apr, 27 2004 @ 11:27 PM
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Hey dz, I have been through two boot camps, the Navy's and the Army's. It's not like the movies. They won't hit you or make you do anything stupid. Don't listen to the wannabe's who have never served. That said, in the Army, there is a MOS, a job, called Chaplain's Assistant. You basically are a priests, pastors, rabbis, or cleric's assistant. The military has many Chaplain's. It's just a spiritual job. You don't have to be Jewish to be a Rabbi's assistant, for example. But since a Chaplain can't carry arms, you are also his body guard as well. Just something to think about.


dz

posted on Apr, 27 2004 @ 11:30 PM
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Originally posted by curme
Hey dz, I have been through two boot camps, the Navy's and the Army's. It's not like the movies. They won't hit you or make you do anything stupid. Don't listen to the wannabe's who have never served. That said, in the Army, there is a MOS, a job, called Chaplain's Assistant. You basically are a priests, pastors, rabbis, or cleric's assistant. The military has many Chaplain's. It's just a spiritual job. You don't have to be Jewish to be a Rabbi's assistant, for example. But since a Chaplain can't carry arms, you are also his body guard as well. Just something to think about.


Well, what if for example, I told them I'd do something with computers? I have more than enough experience. Or would that be more along the lines of me having to volunteer to get that position?

It's also not even just me. The new draft includes women. I don't want my girlfriend going to war, and neither does she want to go. She could never kill anyone, let alone hold a gun.



posted on Apr, 27 2004 @ 11:44 PM
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Originally posted by dz
I just have a bunch of questions that maybe some of you could help me with.

If they do the draft and I were to get drafted, would I be able to request not having to kill anyone? I understand by living in this country I might have to serve my time (although I dont agree with it), but I also have morals and do not want to kill a fellow man.

Also, are they allowed to touch you in bootcamp? For example, they tell me to get up at 5 am and I don't really care, so get up at 7. They tell me to stand up straight and I don't care. Can they grab me and push me around, or punch me or anythin?

I say this because if they can't, than what're they going to do if they draft me and I just don't listen. I'll go to boot camp and do all that. I did cross country and track all through high school/junior high, so I'm more than in shape. But as far as listening, if I don't want to be there, I won't be doing what they expect me to do. They can scream all they want in my face; it's not gonna change much.

I guess I just wanna know how far they can go to make you do what they want you to do.


_
Kid, put a skirt on and go live in Canada. I wouldn't trust a limpwrist spoiled little brat like you with a rifle in his hand anyway.


_


dz

posted on Apr, 27 2004 @ 11:59 PM
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Originally posted by jsobecky
Kid, put a skirt on and go live in Canada. I wouldn't trust a limpwrist spoiled little brat like you with a rifle in his hand anyway.



I'm really getting tired of people calling me kid. If you want a flat out flame war, fine.

First off, let's start off with you calling me a limpwrist spoiled little brat. Well, by limpwrist, I'm assuming you're accusing me of masturbation. Well seeing as how I've been with my girlfriend for quite some time, have lived with her for quite some time, and plan on marrying her, I haven't had the need for masturbation. We pleasure eachother more than frequent enough.

Now we'll go onto the spoiled little brat part. Let's see how spoiled I am. I pay for my own college; that's about 60k. My apartment is paid for by myself, my girlfriend, and my roommate, along with all our other bills. My parents pay none. I've had jobs for the most part since I was 15. Actually, if you want to get technical, I've worked in my uncles restaurant just helping out since I was 13. By the way, at 16 years old, I was a systems administrator at a company bringing in more money than you probably make now. Am I being cocky? Sorry, just trying to help in your flame war. So, if you'd care to show me where I'm spoiled, I'd appreciate it.

Now, seeing as how you got to assume about me, I'll assume about you. Well, I'm assuming your name is Becky, and by that you are a girl. The fact that you are calling me a kid makes me think you are older. I'm going to be easy and say 30? Also, you consider me a kid, so what, 13?

So you're a 30 year old female, on a forum flaming a 13 year old boy... yeah, you are a success in life.

I'm sorry, but if you want to have a legit debate, fine. Pick a topic, and we shall debate. But don't go assuming I'm some stupid kid just because I don't want to die and want to live a successful life. You want to go to some stupid unjust war and get yourself killed in the name of patriotism, go for it. I'd rather be called a coward, live, and do something in this world that actually does make a difference for the better.




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