My Take On The Religious Right, Obama, & Notre Dame

So President Obama has been invited to speak at Notre Dame which seems to really be pissing off the religious right. In their eyes Obama who supports abortion should not be speaking there because of the Church’s stance on abortion which is no abortions. I mean you even have people turning down awards because they don’t want to share the same stage as President Obama. Wow. I guess I can understand their point of view but I just happen to disagree with it and I’ll go into that next.

First off I’ll delve into the hypocrisy of the reaction by the religious right. I find it ironic they are making a stink about Obama going there and speaking but yet didn’t mind at all when Bush went there and spoke. Last I checked the Vatican was against the death penalty. That’s right, under no circumstances shall the death penalty be implemented and that is their stance. Bush who was the governor of Texas had the most death penalties in his term there than in the states history. On top of that because of his war in Iraq (and I do call it his war because this war was in no way shape or form to protect us in any way) many innocent men, women, and children are now dead. That to me is a tantamount to murder which is also not thought to highly of in the Catholic religion.

Second I’ll go into the religion itself. According to the fables Jesus was a kind, giving, and forgiving man who didn’t care what religion you were, what sins you had committed in your past, or anything of that sort. He would listen to anyone who wanted to speak to him. He would help anyone who needed help. There were no prerequisites or you must do this first. No, Jesus didn’t love in slices he took people as a whole. I think today’s modern day Catholics are some of the biggest hypocrites in as their attitudes are really quite the opposite of what Jesus stood for. They try to cram down this morality bid on people while them themselves committing those same “sins”.

I think the religious right have a lot of soul searching to do. I think people are starting to realize that religion and government should not mix nor should morality and government. It’s not the government’s job to tell people how to live their lives or push some religious agenda on the people.
You are free to pray to whoever you want but don’t push it on everyone else either directly through direct laws or indirectly through the morality code. It’s the government’s job to protect our liberties nothing less and nothing more.

reply to post by tjeffersonsghost


But just picture the moment! B.O. gets up and says, "We are NOT a Christian nation."

reply to post by Gawdzilla


If you link it all together our whole world will be dominated by a single religion and the government won't let you not believe in it. It will be their way or the gas chamber. You think Maitreya isn't here yet? The UN takes this guy seriously, so why isn't this serious? He will lead the NWO and a single religion.

www.share-international.org...

Originally posted by watchtheashes
reply to post by Gawdzilla

 

If you link it all together our whole world will be dominated by a single religion and the government won't let you not believe in it. It will be their way or the gas chamber. You think Maitreya isn't here yet? The UN takes this guy seriously, so why isn't this serious? He will lead the NWO and a single religion.

www.share-international.org...

Really? All the religious nutters are going to quietly let the "government" tell them what religion they should abuse other people in the name of? The loafers in the fancy clothes are going to change to a new religion or give up their cushy jobs? This is going to happen? That would be a pop-corn moment for me.

I'm not following through even if it means the gas chamber. No government is going to tell me anything that by common sense seems wrong. It doesn't matter if you believe or not, this is going to happen. Don't take my word for it. Take the United Nations' word for it. Haven't you heard the Great Invocation? Its Luciferic.

This is the UN and the Lucis Trust's New Age Prayer for this "Maitreya."

A Mantram for the New Age and for all Humanity

From the point of Light within the Mind of God
Let light stream forth into the minds of men.
Let Light descend on Earth.

From the point of Love within the Heart of God
Let love stream forth into the hearts of men.
May Christ return to Earth.

From the centre where the Will of God is known
Let purpose guide the little wills of men –
The purpose which the Masters(alien race of "space brothers") know and serve. (they claim jesus was one of these HAH)

From the centre which we call the race of men
Let the Plan of Love and Light work out
And may it seal the door where evil dwells.

Now research Maitreya's teachings. Same thing.

Let Light and Love and Power restore the Plan on Earth.

reply to post by watchtheashes


"No government is going to tell me anything that by common sense seems wrong."

"Common sense"? If sense was common, we wouldn't need traffic laws. People would pay attention and respect each other. And we all know that isn't "common", even if it does make sense.

reply to post by Gawdzilla


I agree with you on that very strongly. You're right. The OP has a point though, Obama's administration is attacking our first amendment rights.

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

LIARS!!!

Originally posted by watchtheashes
reply to post by Gawdzilla

 

I agree with you on that very strongly. You're right. The OP has a point though, Obama's administration is attacking our first amendment rights.

What attack, specifically, do you think they're making? Sources, please?

On our rights as citizens and the first amendment. Of course every President has been doing that, contrary to our Founding fathers, slowly over time. Especially Bush. Over 224 years not one president has raised the national debt as much as he has. He's doubled it in 8 years vs 224 years of a relatively constant debt. Obama's really gonna finish it, then we'll have to reform. They are all just puppets. You'd almost think the left and right was a joke, and they are all in on it.

EDIT:

Whoops forgot the s in a few places.

[edit on 4-5-2009 by watchtheashes]

reply to post by watchtheashes


I think if you look at the records you'll see time when the debt soared quite handily. The ACW and WWII come to mind immediately. It was never a flat progression. However, Dubya did an amazing job of taking a balanced budget when Clinton left and wrecking it.

Times of war are times of war. George W Bush just came out and said 9/11 was the US government sometimes, I swear, and no one seemed to take it into account. Obama might be playing the fool for now, just like he did, to really screw the nation. I supported Obama, but now I realize what his "change" was about. He never did say what kind of change. Just goes to show how the American public has no say anymore.

Originally posted by tjeffersonsghost
So President Obama has been invited to speak at Notre Dame which seems to really be pissing off the religious right.

No. It's pissing off CATHOLICS who send their kids to a CATHOLIC school and expect that CATHOLIC school to abide by the rules of the Church.

I find it ironic they are making a stink about Obama going there and speaking but yet didn’t mind at all when Bush went there and spoke. Last I checked the Vatican was against the death penalty. That’s right, under no circumstances shall the death penalty be implemented and that is their stance.

I find it ironic that you have no clue what the Catholic Church teaching is on CATHOLIC Universities following Catholic law and you have no idea what the Catholic Church teaching regarding the death penalty.

YOU ARE DEAD WRONG.

Roman Catholic Church
In a June, 2004 memo to the U.S. Bishops, Pope Benedict XVI (then known as Joseph Cardinal Ratzinger) made this statement : "Not all moral issues have the same moral weight as abortion and euthanasia. There may be a legitimate diversity of opinion even among Catholics about waging war and applying the death penalty, but not however with regard to abortion and euthanasia." [77]

The Church has traditionally accepted capital punishment as per the theology of Thomas Aquinas (who accepted the death penalty as a necessary deterrent and prevention method, but not as a means of vengeance; see also Aquinas on the death penalty).

In Evangelium Vitae, the Church teaches that capital punishment should be avoided unless it is the only way to defend society from the offender in question, and that with today's penal system such a situation requiring an execution is either rare or non-existent.[78] The Catechism of the Catholic Church holds a similar view [79]

And from the Catholic Catechism - Section 2267 - death penalty

2267 Assuming that the guilty party's identity and responsibility have been fully determined, the traditional teaching of the Church does not exclude recourse to the death penalt y, if this is the only possible way of effectively defending human lives against the unjust aggressor.
If, however, non-lethal means are sufficient to defend and protect people's safety from the aggressor, authority will limit itself to such means, as these are more in keeping with the concrete conditions of the common good and are more in conformity to the dignity of the human person.

Today, in fact, as a consequence of the possibilities which the state has for effectively preventing crime, by rendering one who has committed an offense incapable of doing harm - without definitely taking away from him the possibility of redeeming himself - the cases in which the execution of the offender is an absolute necessity "are very rare, if not practically non-existent."

More from the Catholic Church Catechism and 'thou shalt not kill'

That to me is a tantamount to murder

There are justified wars. Your opinion about these wars being murder is just your opinion. Self defense is NOT murder. Not as far as the Catholic Church is concerned and not as far as reality is concerned either.

I think today’s modern day Catholics are some of the biggest hypocrites in as their attitudes are really quite the opposite of what Jesus stood for.

Anti-Catholic much? Your bigotry is showing :shk:

BTW .. Jesus said 'let the children come unto me'. He didn't say ... go ahead and kill them and let those murderers of children give speeches in the temples... in the house of My Father.

I think people are starting to realize that religion and government should not mix nor should morality and government.

Then Obama shouldn't be going to a CATHOLIC university at all then.
He's pushing his 'morality' by being there. He pushes his 'morality'
by going to Georgetown and demanding that they cover up the
Christian symbols while he's there giving a speech.

You have it backwards. The government and politicians shouldn't be mixing with, and demanding changes from, religious institutions.

It’s not the government’s job to tell people how to live their lives or push some religious agenda on the people.

Sure. So what's that got to do with Obama going to a CATHOLIC University and pushing his non-religious agenda on it (them)? Georgetown for example.

Again ... you've got it backwards.

You are free to pray to whoever you want but don’t push it on everyone else either directly through direct laws or indirectly through the morality code.

The people going to Notre Dame are going to a CATHOLIC University and therefore they should expect a CATHOLICIZED education. Period. It's the duty of those in charge of Notre Dame to make sure that everyone there receive a good education and that they follow the teachings and laws of the CATHOLIC church. They aren't 'pushing it on everyone else'. They are providing what was paid for ... a CATHOLIC institution.

Anyone who doesn't want a CATHOLICIZED education shouldn't go there.
Anyone who goes and complains about the CATHOLIC rules is a moron.
They knew what the deal was when they signed up for the school.
They know where the door is. No one is holding them there.

It’s the government’s job to protect our liberties nothing less and nothing more.

That has nothing to do with Notre Dame and their decision not to follow CATHOLIC rules.

You're making a great point on the Catholic thing, however it is just religion in general. Our guns, our rights etc. What has happened to the USA? Good old in the nineties USA. After 2001 we went down the drain.

reply to post by FlyersFan


Don't bother. They just need a new thread to dump on religion. It will go on for a few pages. They will tell stupid jokes, compliment each other for being so smart and the thread will die.

Originally posted by jd140
reply to post by FlyersFan

 

Don't bother. They just need a new thread to dump on religion. It will go on for a few pages. They will tell stupid jokes, compliment each other for being so smart and the thread will die.

You make that sound like a bad thing.

"Religions are the opiate of the masses."

Originally posted by FlyersFan
I find it ironic that you have no clue what the Catholic Church teaching is on CATHOLIC Universities following Catholic law and you have no idea what the Catholic Church teaching regarding the death penalty.

Oh so in the Catholic religion there is a moral "weight" to what is right and what is wrong. Its not whats right and whats wrong its wrong to what extent. Umm Ok.... You either sin or you dont. Period.

Also your facts on the death penalty are either out dated or wrong here is their stance
www.catholicnews.com...
it is controversial in the religion but it is their stance.

There are justified wars. Your opinion about these wars being murder is just your opinion. Self defense is NOT murder. Not as far as the Catholic Church is concerned and not as far as reality is concerned either.

There was no self defense in Iraq there was an invasion they didnt invade us we did them. Period. Tens of thousands of innocents died because of it period. That is murder not self defense.

Anti-Catholic much? Your bigotry is showing :shk:

Not anti catholic much at all Im anti hypocrisy which all man made religions pretty much has plenty of.

BTW .. Jesus said 'let the children come unto me'. He didn't say ... go ahead and kill them and let those murderers of children give speeches in the temples... in the house of My Father.

Jesus listened to all and didnt care what kind of sinner you were. He didnt listen to you because of your sins for he understood we are ALL imperfect. Your hypocrisy is quite laughable. Ill listen to one sinner but not another sinner.

You have it backwards. The government and politicians shouldn't be mixing with, and demanding changes from, religious institutions.

We agree here. Government shouldnt be making changes to religions. I dont think Obama is forcing changes on the religion hes just going to speak at Notre Dame. To me this isnt a big deal.

The people going to Notre Dame are going to a CATHOLIC University and therefore they should expect a CATHOLICIZED education. Period. It's the duty of those in charge of Notre Dame to make sure that everyone there receive a good education and that they follow the teachings and laws of the CATHOLIC church. They aren't 'pushing it on everyone else'. They are providing what was paid for ... a CATHOLIC institution.

Anyone who doesn't want a CATHOLICIZED education shouldn't go there.
Anyone who goes and complains about the CATHOLIC rules is a moron.
They knew what the deal was when they signed up for the school.
They know where the door is. No one is holding them there.

They are getting a catholic education I dont think obama is changing anyones education. He is just going to there to speak. Once again youll pick and choose which sinners to let speak. hehe religions really are funny.

[edit on 4-5-2009 by tjeffersonsghost]

Just to reiterate, religious right does not equal catholics does not equal Christians. You might try rewriting your OP and seeing if a good discussion follows.

Originally posted by Gawdzilla

Originally posted by jd140
reply to post by FlyersFan

 

Don't bother. They just need a new thread to dump on religion. It will go on for a few pages. They will tell stupid jokes, compliment each other for being so smart and the thread will die.

You make that sound like a bad thing.

"Religions are the opiate of the masses."

No I think movies are the opiate of the masses. What is the best way to hide a secret? In plain sight!!!!





Keep talking guys this is just a point.

[edit on 4-5-2009 by watchtheashes]

reply to post by watchtheashes


"No I think movies are the opiate of the masses. What is the best way to hide a secret? In plain sight!!!! "

So, you're using a movie to prove a point?

One of the reasons religions don't like movies is that they don't like the competition.

I'm making a point that the Illuminati use movies/shows to reveal their plans sometimes so that when people find out they're "nutjobs." The perfect plan I would say. The end of that trailer says find out the truth google search 2012. Not google: 2012 movie. Like this for example.