Amazing Video: Neuroscientist has stroke and experiences Nirvana

Sounds like the complete opposite to true consciousness to me. To be conscious is to be aware of oneself and surroundings, what she described was being disconnected from that. What she described was an inability to define the boundaries between her physical and mental self and the rest of the world. That may seem very peaceful and nice in the moment but it’s not truly consciousness.

I don’t get what’s supposed to be so profound about this, it’s just an altered state of mind achievable through the use of drugs, in dreams, severe brain damage etc. It’s not enlightenment; you don’t learn any great truths from it. At best it may give you a new perspective but it isn’t a pre-requisite for it.



As an aside, has anyone else here ever suffered severe migraines? Watching the video I identified with a worryingly large number of symptoms but after a little research it seems the two do share a few of them. At its worst I had the same pain behind the eye, followed by numbness down one side, inability to process or comprehend speech, auras, inability to define where I end and everything else began etc. Has anyone else had the same symptoms? If so how close did they come to the description in the video?

reply to post by Mike_A


I have had migraines, and I did notice the similarities. The difference, I think, is that you can still use the left side of your brain during a migraine, and you shouldn't lose control of any of your limbs, although they can numb. Generally, a pack of ice applied to the eye that's starting to hurt and blur for a couple of minutes usually helps me.

So aside from the pain behind the eye, blurring of vision, and weird sensation, I don't believe you should be alarmed. Of course, I am not a doctor so if you suspect something get it checked. If you have a lot of migraines that's a reason to go see a doctor. Mine are only once every couple of months/years.

[edit on 4-5-2009 by Viral]

THis is interesting. I worked for several years in a retirement home and a stroke is my biggest fear after working with survivors.

reply to post by Mike_A


The enlightening part is that she was able to break through her brain chatter and experience a true state of just being while having the stroke. Through this, she realized that we all have this side of ourselves that is more at one with the universe. And that, when we take away our worries and stress of who we are and what are place in this society, we are able to understand that underneath all that is a being that is pure energy filled with love and joy. It is not about being oblivious to our surroundings, its about being more in tune with with our true self and our surroundings, instead of just sizing up who are, what we got, where we have been and where we are going. We become free to see beyond ourselves and the vacant brain noise that clutters our existence and tires us of our psychic energies. Often, we need this brain chatter to get things done, but as humans we also have the great ability to turn it off and enter a true state of just being and just let life flow through us.

I hope this helps. It is very possible to live without all out vacant thoughts and be fully aware and perceptive (if not more so) of everything going around us and within us. Talk to a learned Buddhist monk sometimes, they are fully aware (more so then the majority), always in a joyous mood and are as sharp as a tack.

Edit: Sorry about the migraines. My sister has been getting severe ones for a while, so bad she starts mumbling her words, loses feeling, can't think straight and becomes agitated and upset by her symptoms. She thought she was having mini strokes, but it seems to be just the migraines. I feel for you and hope you get better. If you haven't, you may want to go in to get an MRI or CT scan just to be on the safe side. You may also want to cut some the stress out of your life, one way or another. It seems to be a major catalyst for the majority of migraines.

[edit on 5-5-2009 by frailty]

reply to post by bringthelight


So let me get this straight: Brain damage = enlightenment = salvation

So in order to get to "heaven" or the after life, whatever you want to call it, you need to have enlightenment, that is fairly understood. So one way of getting to heaven is basically stabbing yourself in the brain, and you call that enlightenment? Why don't we all just stab ourselves in the brain if we'll get "enlightenment" and go to heaven?

Another thing about this experience of enlightenment and perhaps the superficial nature of "enlightenment", people can have intense experiences on certain chemicals that most would deem enlightening and spiritual. But since when is enlightenment either a physical or chemical choice that anyone can have, and why do both of those involve damaging your brain? Drugs and a stroke that is.

It doesn't make a lot of sense...how does an intense experience equate to salvation when it can be artificially induced via physical of chemical manipulation on the brain?


That's cool that you've had some intense experiences in your life, but I think people can have similarly intense experiences in every religion or spiritual system. Some might call it enlightenment, others might say they experienced a connection to Jesus, or just a closeness with God ect. If you travel deep enough in any system and self scrutinize, one should be able to find truth.

[edit on 5-5-2009 by ghaleon12]

*yawns*
was that supposed to thrill me or something? someone's brain gets messed up and they see things.

i reckon this is the same woman from Arizona that has been known
for quite some time now.

seems she has used her subjective experience to jump start another
exotic career.

in 1997 i had the same type of brain hemorrhage,
telepathically spoke with that dis-embodied 'voice' of authority,
had the same rushes of ecstacy that surged through the 'self'
(with a promise that my eternity would be a continuious moment-of-ecstacy...If i elected to remain in heaven/spirit-world)

this woman focused on that exotic aspect of the event,
myself more engineered minded...was focused more on the mechanics
of the situation at hand and later during the extended therapies and living circumstances.

at the moment of 'death' during the 10 or-so minutes of my Stroke event,
i recall voiding my bladder and bowels & rationalizing the embarrasment away as being non-important.
my consciousness recalls that i told the person driving me to hospital that
i was going to deliberately 'shut-down' my body & to tell the ER people i wasn't dead but in deep trance...much like i recall Yoga & Fakiers in the East being able to do.


in the weeks of being in the Death-Watch room, on a respirator, i was aware of the Earths rotation as if i were on a roller-coaster ride,
with the roar of the wind in my ears, and the feeling of velocity very much
present even as i was in a bed all strapped down.
i also recalled going through the whole prenatal development again...

basically though...i don't see 'enlightenment' in this woman's subjective
experience, or what she has brought from the episode...
other than her journey may be helpful to a handful of people in the global community...
but , she should not be emphasizing making a profit from the gift/experience


thanks,

great! i watched it a year ago, from youtube, it really touched me.

S&F.

[edit on 5-5-2009 by spystalker]

A polite warning. Please do not take the rarely unique experience from this woman to minimize the devastating, permanent side effects suffered by many stroke victims. She is lucky and her experience rare. Please don't get me wrong, I am happy for her and inspired by her story and also read her book "A Stroke of Insight." (great book.)

Her relatively young age and career makes this story even more compelling.

As a stroke survivor I can tell you the aftermath, for many like myself, are less than ideal. I must use a cane to walk and am typing this with my only functional hand.
(I have NEVER shared this on ATS before.)

My near death experience was painful (like getting stung by a thousand bees in the head) and I was in the hospital for 17 days followed by 3 months physical therapy / rehab. No "enlightenment" but rather pure panic, fright and terror and permanent loss of balance. In the blink of an eye, my life of 50 years was inexplicably altered forever.

I simply provide my story so others don't misconstrue the real-life consequence to those of us "lucky" enough to survive. Trust me, it not as "enlightening" as you may think. Don't confuse with spiritualism or meditation. You don't want to go there.

Avoid one at any cost if you can. Above all, monitor blood pressure, minimize the stress in your life, quit smoking and watch your diet and drinking.

Sorry to be a downer, I prefer "realist." It ain't no picnic folks.

Nonetheless, I'm happy to be alive.

Great thread.

Without Wax...KK


[edit on 5-5-2009 by kinda kurious]

reply to post by kinda kurious


Yes of course!

Sorry to hear about your experience, thousand bees sounds painfull.

I bet you can type real fast with one hand now right?

[edit on 5-5-2009 by _Phoenix_]

Originally posted by _Phoenix_
I bet you can type real fast with one hand now right?

Faster than a one-armed wallpaper hanger.

Keeps me busier than a one legged man riding a skateboard.

Hey chicks seem to dig that guy on House with the cane.
(Or as I prefer to call it, my portable pole dance audition device.)

Unfortunately, my warped sarcastic humor remains intact.

Kind Regards...KK

reply to post by Viral


lol sounds like you got off lightly, or I've had a lot of strokes!

Don't think that's the case though; I'm not suggesting the two are the same or that I think I may have had a stroke, I was just surprised at how similar the two are in regard to the symptoms and I was wondering if anyone else noticed that.

By the way, haven’t had them for years now but thanks for the concern!


reply to post by frailty


I just don’t think I’d call that enlightenment. To me enlightenment is the realisation of a greater truth, which isn’t what she described.

Through this, she realized that we all have this side of ourselves that is more at one with the universe.

But what does this mean in real terms? How do you define “at one”?

And that, when we take away our worries and stress of who we are and what are place in this society, we are able to understand that underneath all that is a being that is pure energy filled with love and joy.

But that’s not true though is it. That’s anthropomorphising a collection of energies and states of matter and ascribing emotions to them that don’t really exist.

We become free to see beyond ourselves and the vacant brain noise that clutters our existence and tires us of our psychic energies.

Well I think this is where the two of us will find an irreconcilable difference. I take the scientific view that is no such thing as psychic energies in any mystical sense. My position is that if you accept this as true then what is being described is just an altered brain function.

A coma could be said to do the same things, as can dreams and drugs and a number of other things. But they don’t correspond to anything profound; I’m not denying that being in this state may be peaceful or whatnot but it’s not going to give you access to strange truths or allow you to interact with the real world in a manner that can only happen in this state.

Originally posted by ghaleon12
So in order to get to "heaven" or the after life, whatever you want to call it, you need to have enlightenment, that is fairly understood. So one way of getting to heaven is basically stabbing yourself in the brain, and you call that enlightenment? Why don't we all just stab ourselves in the brain if we'll get "enlightenment" and go to heaven?

Haha, no. What you are talking about has nothing at all to do with enlightenment nor the nature of reality nor spirituality in general.

The truth cannot be grasped by the mind. Truth is limitless and infinite, mind is limited and finite. The truth can only be experienced, it cannot be properly conveyed or spoken about.

But of course, one can try to explain what it's like through language, but the explanation will always come up short and never do it any justice. So it's funny to see people sit here and try and justify this as some sort of drug induced fantasy, or to try and rationalize it in terms that a human mind can understand.

It simply can't be done with the mind. The mind must be transcended.

How does one do that?

One gives up all desire and worldly attachments to mind and body. You experience the death before death. And it is at that point one sees the truth.

The truth is you are not the body. You are not the mind. "You" don't even exist. The only truth is infinitely loving conscious awareness.

Now, if people are actually experiencing this shift in consciousness, what does that tell you? It is not a trivial thing. One actually becomes fully detached from the body and mind. One clearly sees that awareness continues on after the death of the body, because nothing can touch that awareness.

That's all to it really.

As long as the ego is still in place, one remains in suffering.

Think on this a while. If it is possible for you to give up all desire -- desire for money, sex, even helping other people and life itself, what do you think would happen? It is that never ending and insatiable desire for "stuff" that is at the root of all suffering. The ego never truly gets what it wants, and if it does, it only wants more (or some other thing).

Releasing all desire is how one reaches heaven, or enlightenment, and sees the true nature of reality.

Jesus spoke of this just as the Buddha did. It's all the same universal truth.

The Kingdom of Heaven is within.

Wow its really sad that so many of you posters didn't even understand the message.

She's stating that in the right hemosphere there is this sense of equal, undetermined, non judgemental energy. And by sharing her experience with this energy she hopes to open people up to the idea of being one. Oneness is not a new idea but here we have a Harvard researcher, a BRAIN researcher sharing her exerience with such a realization of energy.

Shes not trying to prove anything. Just share. Clearly you dont see that.

Originally posted by RedDragon
Ummmmmmmmm. no. The same thing happens on hallucinogenic drugs: your brain malfunctions. Nothing else.

/ thread

malefunctions? Ehm, why don't you try some magic mushrooms, and then come back and give us your opinion. Because what you've just said is dumb.
You're the type of guy who gives your opinion about stuff, without really knowing for yourself. Stop beliving what everybody ells is saying, and make an opinion for your own. I've tried cannabis, mushrooms and salvia. Belive me thats the last thing your brain does.

PS: Going to peru to try some Ayahuasca with a shaman soon.(google it)

I saw this a while back and also found it really amazing.

I just wanted to share a suggestion with some of you, if you are looking for a unique & different way to "experience" some of what she describes. A lot of what she mentions made me think immediately of my own art practice.

So, if you want a shift in perspective and you don't want to meditate - even if you are not even remotely an artist - you could try exploring positive & negative space with a brush and some ink or do some blind contour drawings.

en.wikipedia.org...

drawsketch.about.com...

You may not consider yourself any type of artist - but drawing/painting is really about seeing as much it is about putting something on paper. Anybody can do it. (And You don't have to show anybody your results!) Exploring the contours and spaces around you while slowing moving a pencil in conjunction with your eyes is a terrific "perspective shifter."

Originally posted by Amaterasu

Originally posted by RedDragon
Ummmmmmmmm. no. The same thing happens on hallucinogenic drugs: your brain malfunctions. Nothing else.

Ah. And you can cite studies or point to some expertise?

I mean, you seem to have the answer...but with nothing to back it up.

You can't be serious. This person has a stroke and hallucinates, and you think their hallucinations are real?

A stroke involves bleeding into the brain. That means that there was heavy brain damage going on. Also, it means that the person was near-death and there was probably '___', the most potent hallucinogen known to man, being secreted in massive quantities as a result.

So, you have massive brain injury + most potent hallucinogenic drug known to mankind going on in the same brain at the same time and, in the face of all logic, you choose to believe the person was experiencing something like 'nirvana'?

Hell, it's even possible none of this happened; with such a stroke, she's lucky to even be alive. When your brain hemorrhages, if you live, which 90 something % of people don't, there's another 90 something % chance that you will suffer extreme brain damage. That includes not knowing who you are, etc. ; your memories get trashed. In addition to just hallucinating like crazy, it's also very likely that her memories of whatever are just fake memories caused by neurons regulating her memory being destroyed.
Basically, with all this going on, it's not a remotely intelligent thought process to believe this #..

Originally posted by frailty
reply to post by Mike_A

 

The enlightening part is that she was able to break through her brain chatter and experience a true state of just being while having the stroke. Through this, she realized that we all have this side of ourselves that is more at one with the universe.

Something similar happened to me when I did salvia divinorum when it was legal. I must have experienced enlightenment. Oh wait, I was just hallucinating, like this lady probably was.

We become free to see beyond ourselves and the vacant brain noise that clutters our existence and tires us of our psychic energies.
[edit on 5-5-2009 by frailty]

Psychic energies? Ok buddy... Can you prove that these 'psychic energies' exist?

[edit on 5/5/09 by RedDragon]

[edit on 5/5/09 by RedDragon]

[edit on 5/5/09 by RedDragon]

reply to post by Mike_A


The enlightening part for her and for others who find similar conclusions, one way or another, is that we are more than our brain chatter. That is the truth that she found and many others have found as well. That is what is enlightening. It is not like she is saying she understands all the secrets and mysteries of the universe. I am guessing that understanding this different state of being opened her eyes to the fact that there is more to herself than she thought there was before this experience.

As far as, being one with your surroundings, that is an experience, so it sort of hard to describe. It sort of like losing yourself to a point that instead of fighting the world around you for control, you learn to except them, change what is a necessity and possible and be content with the rest. It is a very peaceful feeling to understand what is yours to control in this world and what is out of your hands. I think it is essential for lessening the burden of stress that is put upon you in this world and many older people who have become wise to the ways this world works have found this out for themselves.

Your statement "anthropomorphizing a collection of energies and states of matter and ascribing emotions to them that don’t really exist." I think it fairly overstepping to state straight out that these states and energies "don't really exist," as if you had the great knowledge of all that is and all that ever was. But to put it frankly, these states and energies really do exist and they are easily observed. The easy way to observe them is to just observe a small child before they are too focused on learning how to just get what they want by any means possible. You will quickly be able to see their contentment in their just being conscious and their zest that they have for living in and learning about the world around them. It is something the majority of us lose as the cynicism of age and experience get the better of us.

I think for the most part you misunderstood what I meant when I was speaking of psychic energy. Psychic energy is not anything mystical. It is brain power pure and simple. Living with constant the noise of our internal voices, we become depleted of our brain power much quicker. And when we really need to use our brains for something important we are less efficient and competent in our thoughts because of its tiredness. So, in the end it is nothing mystical, just common sense. Turning off of this chatter is very difficult for some people, and lead some to be excessively tired and stressed.

As far as being in a clear, not inhabited by vacant thought, mind is that it will not give you all the truths of the universe in some mystical burst of information and energy. But it will give you the mental focus to better understand yourself, the world around you and what you want out of your existence. Living with an always busy mind is like being trying to do work in a cluttered house. It is difficult to work in, but if you clean the clutter before you work, it becomes much easier.

The profoundness of anything in our personal experience is just that personal. Making a judgment on what someone else sees as profound, eye-opening or thought-provoking is in a way very self-centered and judgmental. As far this type of experience, that anyone can have, being an altered state. It is more akin listening to another part of our brain than just the part that seeks to have control of all your experience. The profound part is that you can do it yourself by many different avenues: art, meditation, music (my favorite personally), writing, playing, manual labor or motorcycle repair. There is many paths to this realization.

I personally feel sorry for you not being able to actually "get" what she is talking about for I feel that learning to understand this side of your existence would be beneficial to your previously stated problem.

I'll say this for everyone who doesn't understand this, the stroke is the unimportant part in this video. Her realizations that came from that are what is really important. It is somewhat sad that she had to have a stroke to understand this side of existence. Strokes are no path to enlightenment or realization for most, but a debilitating part life. She just had a very unique experience during one and learned a great deal from it.

BTW, KK, you are too much. I am glad you were able to keep yourself and your humor through your experiences.

[edit on 5-5-2009 by frailty]

reply to post by frailty

The enlightening part for her and for others who find similar conclusions, one way or another, is that we are more than our brain chatter. That is the truth that she found and many others have found as well.

But what does that mean? Taken at face value it sounds like a given.

As far as, being one with your surroundings, that is an experience, so it sort of hard to describe. It sort of like losing yourself to a point that instead of fighting the world around you for control, you learn to except them, change what is a necessity and possible and be content with the rest. It is a very peaceful feeling to understand what is yours to control in this world and what is out of your hands.

Again that’s very vague and the last sentence again seems obvious. You don’t need to have a stroke or do anything with your brain function to realise or understand this; unless there is something more you’re getting at that I’m not seeing.

But to put it frankly, these states and energies really do exist and they are easily observed. The easy way to observe them is to just observe a small child before they are too focused on learning how to just get what they want by any means possible. You will quickly be able to see their contentment in their just being conscious and their zest that they have for living in and learning about the world around them.

That’s explained by an underdeveloped brain and chemistry; it has nothing to do with any energy field.

I think for the most part you misunderstood what I meant when I was speaking of psychic energy. Psychic energy is not anything mystical. It is brain power pure and simple.

…

It sounds like you’re mixing science, pseudo-science and mysticism all together.

The thrust of what you’re saying seems to be that a less stressed brain functions better and that reducing the activity in the left side of your brain contributes to reducing that stress. If that’s the case I don’t disagree but it has nothing to do with psychic energy as commonly defined or emotional energy fields or anything of that which is the pseudo-science and mysticism.

But still, what is so profound about this? Isn’t it obvious?

It might be profound to some people, fair enough but by broadcasting this via a lecture and internet video the message is that it should be profound to most people. It’s like me putting up a video saying that we all die someday so isn’t it great that we’re alive now; which is all well and good and true but not really that profound.