Obama's Request to Cover Christian Symbol

It's funny that this is being used as another socialism scare tactic. Jesus was a socialist if ever there was one.

Originally posted by Max_TO
The thing about faith is that we all have a bit of it placed in something , its our right . What will you do when your article of faith it targeted ?

[edit on 1-5-2009 by Max_TO]

Edited your post for clarity

Well, my religion has been targeted for a very long time. Being Wiccan, I am always a target, but you don't see me making threads to complain that Obama did not put a Wiccan symbol behind him do you? Nor do I see other religions complaining per the same issue.

Why is it always Christians? And Christians wonder why non Christians are beginning to complain about them more and more. Get over yourselves, Christianity is NOT the only religion in this world, no matter how much you guys might wish that were so.

To the Christians, Enjoy your beliefs, keep them, love them, live by them, but stop trying to force others to be just like you with your complaining and fear mongering.

Politics and religion do not and should not ever mix. I can understand why the president would not want pictures of him with ANY religious symbol above him that people all over the world will see and equate him with. I see him trying to do what is right, which is keeping church and state separate.

Peace

reply to post by amazed


??? What ???

Perhaps you didn't have the chance to read all that I have said ?

I am not upset that he didn't place a religious symbol behind him . I am bothered by the fact that the government can go to a " respected establishment " and make a request to cover there displayed symbols , as guaranteed by the constitution , in order for the government official to use the event for political means .

I do not care one way or the other what the ideological meaning of the symbol is , not important . All that matters is , was it there constitutional right to have it displayed ? And if the answer is yes , then no form of government should make an attempt to subvert there right .

As a Pagan you should recognize the importance of this train of thought .

If we can just get over the name Jesus & Obama long enough to see past our own self righteousness , then perhaps we can see what has happened here .

What I'd like to know is WHY ARE WE STILL TALKING ABOUT RELIGION IN POLITICS?

I mean seriously. It has become a joke. Seperation of church and state? Sure, except where we deem appropriate.

Not a christian? Sorry, we wont elect you.

Pathetic.

Originally posted by amazed

I can understand why the president would not want pictures of him with ANY religious symbol above him that people all over the world will see and equate him with. I see him trying to do what is right, which is keeping church and state separate.

Peace

To be frank , I do not care what he wants behind him during an official visit to various places when making a political address . He went there , he is our representative , he works for us and is sworn to up hold the constitution and protect it's rights .

The government should not have the right to tell a place what to do in order for the government to make an appearance , as long as the place is expressing there right as so promised by the constitution .

reply to post by cautiouslypessimistic


Once again we cant seem to get past names . This should not be about religion or politics , nor have I tried to make that link .

Its about the constitutional right granted to " us "

If the government wants a set stage to make an address then they are free to design whatever stage they so chose and host there own presentation , they do this all the time . They should not go to a place and then ask them to alter there respected place to suit the governments needs .



[edit on 1-5-2009 by Max_TO]

[edit on 1-5-2009 by Max_TO]

reply to post by amazed

I can't remember the name or artist right now but one of my favorite Christmas songs has the line "Now when Christians get with Pagans, only pumpkin pies are burning"
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CNS The "Right" news right now.
Yes, The point of the article is to go on another socialism rant. And looking a little deeper sheds a little more light.

“The White House wanted a simple backdrop of flags and pipe and drape for the speech, consistent with what they’ve done for other policy speeches,” she added. “Frankly, the pipe and drape wasn’t high enough by itself to fully cover the IHS and cross above the GU seal and it seemed most respectful to have them covered so as not to be seen out of context.”

Get bent as much as you want.


[edit on 1-5-2009 by Grimstad]

Originally posted by Max_TO
reply to post by cautiouslypessimistic

 

Once again we cant seem to get past names . This should not be about religion or politics , nor have I tried to make that link .

Its about the constitutional right granted to " us "

If the government wants a set stage to make an address then they are free to design whatever stage they so chose and host there own presentation , they do this all the time . They should not go to a place and then ask them to alter there respected place to suit the governments , needs .



[edit on 1-5-2009 by Max_TO]

I'm sorry if you took it that way, but I wasn't calling anyone names. I was saying the overall mindset that this is even an issue in this country is pathetic. It was not directed toward anyone in particular.

Second, just as the government has a right to build their own set, the university (or wherever it was) had every right TO NOT LET IT BE COVERED.

Bottom line this reeks of an attempt to start a religious debate, when there is really no issue here.

He did non denounce christ. He did not make them remove it permanently. They asked that it be covered for an address, and when you consider the heat that this administration has taken for their so-called "deifying" of Obama, do you blame them?

Originally posted by Grimstad
reply to post by amazed

 

I can't remember the name or artist right now but one of my favorite Christmas songs has the line "Now when Christians get with Pagans, only pumpkin pies are burning"


Dar Williams. Love that song. And so spot on.

reply to post by Grimstad


Ah how sweet & thoughtful of the government .

Perhaps I can use that line on my girlfriend with regards to her mothers picture on the wall .



[edit on 1-5-2009 by Max_TO]

reply to post by cautiouslypessimistic


You are correct with a lot that you say and I tend to agree .

However , the government went there and simply should not put its self over the places it goes to as long as the respected place was operating within its constitutional rights .

IMHO we see far to often the erosion of individual rights and we in general have become to complacent when ones rights are infringed upon .

Originally posted by Max_TO
reply to post by cautiouslypessimistic

 

You are correct with a lot that you say and I tend to agree .

However , the government went there and simply should not put its self over the places it goes to as long as the respected place was operating within its constitutional rights .

IMHO we see far to often the erosion of individual rights and we in general have become to complacent when ones rights are infringed upon .

I can't agree with you last sentence more.

As for the second statement though, can you show me where they FORCED this to happen? If not, it is as much a choice of the university as it is the Obama Administration. They could have quite easily said "no, that will not be covered", and there would have been nothing that Obama's staff could have done but change locations.

Also, in what I can find on it, the reason it was covered was because it became halfway covered by the presidential backdrop. Had any christian symbol been shown half covered, or like it appeared as though it had a slash through it, can you imagine the backlash?
\
I'm just not seeing where anyone's rights were violated.

reply to post by cautiouslypessimistic


Excellent points yet again .

You may very well be right and I will say it again , you bring up very good point .

The thing I see coming from this is a president being set and only time will truly tell who is on the right side of this topic .

Sad that just about everything we see on T.V is so over prepared before its presented to us and its sad that tradition has to be hid for the sake of this prepared presentation , or any other reason .

reply to post by Max_TO


All right, let's see if I understand your complaint. You are not complaining that he had a "Christian" religious symbol covered. Correct?

Even though your thread is titled "Obama's Request to Cover Christian Symbol". Is that right?

You are complaining that he requested a symbol of ANY kind covered? Correct?

I am under the impression, that Georgetown asked Obama to speak at the University, not the other way around. Yes?

A point I am trying to make, is that Obama had the right to make the request he made, and the establishment had the right to say yes, or to say no. They chose to say yes. Just as Obama would have had the right to say no either way, so did the university.

No ones "toes" were stepped on.

It is not as if he just chose some establishment out of the blue, told them he was speaking there no matter how they felt, and oh by the way they also had to cover up their religious symbols. Now, in that case I would agree that he would be wrong.

Even though, I agree he has the right to ask, and they would have the right to say no. As long as he does NOT use threats etc, then he has the right to make the request he made.

As far as I can tell, no one anywhere had their constitutional rights taken away in any manner.

If I asked Obama to speak at my house, and he said "sure, as long as you mow your lawn", would you be upset? It is my right to have tall grass in my area if I want. I could even claim it my constitutional right. Or if he said "sure, as long as you cover up your religious symbols", (knowing that my religious symbols are not Christian) would you still be upset? I suggest that perhaps you(Christians) would not and perhaps you(Christians) would even support him, and or maybe even start a thread titled "Proof Obama is Evil" or some such crap.

So what are you really complaining about? I don't get it, it seems as if this is another bashing Obama with religion thread.

And let's not forget, Georgetown asked Obama to speak at their establishment, not the other way around.

Peace

reply to post by amazed


Very good point you make as well .

Just for the record I do not make Obama threads all that often nor do I often post in the different threads out there about Obama .

Could I be over reacting , very possible .

Did the title of this thread create the very debate that I was trying to avoid , the religion card , possible , however in all honestly it was not my intention to do so . Nor did I which to create an Obama bashing thread and I hope my past posts here prove that .

Would I cut my lawn for Obama , sure .

Did the direction set out in this post by myself as well as others , on both sides of the debate , turn this issue into something that its not , again very possible .

Once again time will tell .






[edit on 1-5-2009 by Max_TO]

Why did he have to go to these extremes when he could have given the speech someplace else at the University???

This man is so strange.....
maybe he is the antichrist.............

Originally posted by amazed

Originally posted by Max_TO
The thing about faith is that we all have a bit of it placed in something , its our right . What will you do when your article of faith it targeted ?

[edit on 1-5-2009 by Max_TO]

Edited your post for clarity

Well, my religion has been targeted for a very long time. Being Wiccan, I am always a target, but you don't see me making threads to complain that Obama did not put a Wiccan symbol behind him do you? Nor do I see other religions complaining per the same issue.

Why is it always Christians? And Christians wonder why non Christians are beginning to complain about them more and more. Get over yourselves, Christianity is NOT the only religion in this world, no matter how much you guys might wish that were so.

To the Christians, Enjoy your beliefs, keep them, love them, live by them, but stop trying to force others to be just like you with your complaining and fear mongering.

Politics and religion do not and should not ever mix. I can understand why the president would not want pictures of him with ANY religious symbol above him that people all over the world will see and equate him with. I see him trying to do what is right, which is keeping church and state separate.

Peace

Christians are used to being the main religion of the U.S that they seem to think the country was founded as a Christian country. This is why Christians are freaking out over things like this. They think that all these changes, such as religion out of schools, governement, etc is something that is going to lead to the countrys doom, but really it's something they see as a threat that'll be the end of their religion. They don't want to share, they want to be the ONE religion. It's nothing new, all religions feel this way. Some may view this move by Obama as something bad, but it really isn't. It's showing that government is being neutral with religion, which is how it should be. There has been so much religious bias in government that it has went against what our nation has stood for. Religious freedom. As long as books aren't being burned, statues being destroyed, Christians being burned alive, etc etc then there is nothing to worry about.

Simple explanation. Obama is the anti-christ and obviously if he didn't cover up the Christian symbol it would hurt him. So he doesn't want everyone to find out the truth and just covered it up from feeling the pain.

You have to cover up Jesus if you are a servant of Satan. The implication here is that Obama is some sort of satanic demon or possibly the anti-christ. Who knows?

All you people are so funny.. the simplest thing happens and you
go telling around the anti christ has come, or evil incarnate has
shown up to play your president.. come on!

The ONLY reason Obama would want to cover a Christian symbol
or word or whatever, is to respect the many other religions that
exist in America. The government is supposed to be impartial to
religions, they can't favor one religion above the others. How'd
you feel as a Christian, if he would have an Islam symbol behind
him on the wall? Muslims, Hindus and others feel just the same
when they see the symbol of just one religion behind their elected
president. Christians aren't the only voters, you know..

You Christians, have to start realizing that you are NOT an inch
better than a Muslim, or a Hindu, Sikh, Buddhist or Gnostic.
I'm a Christian, but I've never felt my religion to be superior to
another religion.. maybe because this stupid religious patriotism
isn't that strong in my counter.

All religions are man made, the one isn't better than the other.
The monotheistic religions all say the same things anyway.

[edit on (1/5/09) by Wehali]