Terence Mckenna (not timewave zero)

reply to post by trueforger

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I dont think there is "right" way to do these things. And often I dont even think its intention, but more so personality type which will grant you a spiritual experience.

I can speak personaly. I abused a dissociative substance for about a year on and off. I used pure and simply, to get wasted and prance around town not giving a crap. But, unintentionally it turned into the most spiritual experience I have ever had so far in my entire life. I no longer use it because it litterally showed me that "something." Perhaps "it" didnt at all, but it allowed me to.

reply to post by Wisen Heimer

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"It" opened the doors of perception.Most of the cutting edge folks I know,whether bike builders,Hatha Yoga devotees,chefs,all sorts of people will admit that their explorations were kick started by a dose of something which jolted them out of the "narrow high walled canyon of cultural conditioning"The real catch is that the more you're given to understand,the more responsibility to act accordingly.So ya wanted enlightenment,eh sport?Now deal with it!My biggest catalyst was an electric shock that went up my spine and durn near killed me.Kundallini activation is a real phenomenon,no BS.Glad it happened,of course,but it's not a method whose safety recommends itself.Your description sounds like DXM,the cough juice stuff I have read of.Life is not a toy,eh?

You must be talking to a different genre of shaman from the ones I met.

Most don't know their arse from their elbow, are full of conceit and jealousy, and lust after the gringo dollar

Yes, they can take you to hell and back in the Aluna, and they seem to know a few tricks, but I lost my reverence for them during a wee stint in Colombia.

There's talk in the Aya circles of the 'Return of the Eagle' or something like that (I didn't pay much attention to the fairy tales which seem to surround everything), which smacks of 2012 spiritual awakening and a reuniting of east and west, hi-tech and no-tech.

Nice that the thread has moved gently into hallies, careful it doesn't get canned.

reply to post by RogerT

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It's about delving into the subconscious.One's very body reacts reliably,the trick is learning to listen.And that is where telling the fraud hucksters from the seers can be performed,in the gut.The keys don't have to be ingested,and that method doesn't usually bring about the desired result directly.And synchronicity reinforces the understanding of your clarity.It's a sort of feedback from the beyond.The I CHING is a reliable sooth sayer,but again,the hard part is interpretation.I don't rely on another for that.

Agreed. You have to be your own oracle in the end. At least that way, it's only your own egoic mind doing the filtering and not someone elses as well.

Not sure from your posts if you've 'journeyed', but I find a similar thing in the 'other worlds'. Much of it seems to be a reflection of mental and subconscious garbage, and then there's the other stuff .....

I found the garbage is kind of shallow/fleeting, without the intense solidity or 'gravity' of the other stuff. Still scary pants, but not so impacting once you get past the initial fear.

Sorry for cryptic post, but if you've been there it should resonate.

reply to post by RogerT

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"Or have you ever been experienced?Well I HAVE!"In fact I am the only person you know who has stood in front of a judge and as a matter of public record (and nothing else),pled to have the full psycho-pharmacopia be placed under my jourisdiction as an Ordained Minister,to attempt to have some actual control on the substances then starting to sweep Canada.I lost on the more radical substances which you may well imagine and save my mentioning them by name,etc,yet won on the Tree of Life.Which outcome did play a slight role in our Church's pleadings in the Canadian Supreme Court.And too bad as it turned out that without a sane voice of moderatin and careful titration the E use turned into abuse faster than it takes to describe,especially once the money/mob thing reared it's ugly head.Govt attempts at control predictably failing and now there are burned out people,kinda seems like a conspiracy to me.Terrence is a Saint in our Church,by the way.

He just makes things up as he goes along.

Pure fiction.

reply to post by clint flint

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What's wrong with making it up as ya go?Why is that an untruth?Show ONE thing he got clearly wrong?

I think Terence is misunderstood by a lot of people. Terence is an Ethnobotanist. Mushrooms, ayahuasca and other entheogens are his study.

He does not do acid all the time and he does not smoke cannabis all the time. Acid isnt even an entheogen. He is professional and intelligent about what he does. He talks about how one should only use cannabis once a week and how negative substance abuse is. When he does use mushrooms or other entheogens, he does so in a safe and respectful manner, alone and idle. He does not do these things for fun, it is his research.

He is not high ALL the time and he was not high during this video. Thats completely ignorent to assume.

[edit on 25-5-2009 by Wisen Heimer]

My impression from many listenings of recordings of his is that Terrence actually was stoned most of the time.He commented about how much his prodigious feats of memory contradicted the stereotype of the forgetful pot-head.He went for 'breaks' of not too uncertain aspect during long talks and spoke of it after.Lysergic acid dyethlimide is a semi synthetic,derived from a fungus,so it must be a semi-entheogen if plant origin is the criterion.The closest he came to rating substances was the concept of 'cultural sanctioning' which,to us,means those approved by long history of benefit and low risk.To those doing the first samplings,it might have been a death sentence.Especially with mushrooms.
Several times I recall his commenting on how cannabis should be used in a certain large dose seldom done way to be a true hallucinogen,but that he couldent do that because of his daily use tolerance buildup.He often alluded to his imperfections and celebrated the democratic aspect of this realm of trance-formative agents in that you didn't need to sweep around the Ashram for twenty years to get the ticket to the journey toward enlightenment.Just a bit of courage and....Compass toward the strange.The strongest are those most like the naturally occuring brain chem's.,with just one slight chemical tweak here...
He did warn against doing cocktails of various substances,not that some were good and others bad,just that the results were unpredictable and non repeatable for further study.He was very careful,knowing the Latin names for plants ought to be a clue to that.And all the dates.And people's names.And got it right.

reply to post by Solomons

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I've heard of academiics and scientists say it's true though??? But I suppose there must be others who disagree with it. It's one of those things that most take as fact.

If what you're saying IS right then what if did evolve to a level where we could use all our brain at the once? Rhetorical question of course :-) Perhaps we could reach a point of collective conscience giving a much smarter "brain" for lack of a better word? Mutual understanding, support, equality etc etc. Woman would understand us...Or there would be even more hatred...women don't half hold a grudge lol jk girls :-)

Interesting thread I've just gotten into mckenna in last 6th months or so, I've got a few of his books. A lot of his theories I at least partially agree with and some of them to me at least are very plausible. And yes sometimes he does come off as a tripped out "hippy", well not really to me, but I can see how some people can see him as that. To me a lot of times when he is talking he just sounds like someone who is just letting his thoughts come out like stream of conscience, it has nothing to do with drugs (although I'm sure he came up with and first thought about a lot of his theories on hallucinogens, but thats what they do, they make you think). And not to be rude or anything but some of you seem to be so open minded about a lot of stuff like I'll see you on other parts of this board discussing aliens and all kinda stuff and you appear to totally believe, but then when someone like mckenna has interesting theories you write them off just because they used hallucinogenic drugs (and thats all he used I'm pretty sure, although admitedly I don't know for sure, but I'm pretty sure he doesn't advocate drug use of any "hard" drugs). Maybe you don't think like that but it seems like you do from some of your posts.

By the way some of you are so uneducated about drugs and hallucinogens (if you havent experienced hallucinogens, you have no say on if people should do them or not, and not all drug users are poor homeless people on the street).There is a HUGE difference between someone who does hallucinogens every now and then and someone who abuses drugs. And also a lot of times hallucinogens aren't even a fun/nice experience, so there really isnt much people who use them just for recreation (and I'm talking about like mushrooms and stuff not extacy I know a lot of people abuse extacy and people consider it a hallucinogen, but in my mind it isnt its completely different, that stuff is basically just speed with a different name). A lot of times real hallucinogens cause you to go deep inside yourself and it can be scary, so not much people take them just to get "high". matter of fact these substances have opened a lot of people i know minds up and these are what made them start looking into more "fringe" subjects and thinkin different. Of course there are people who abuse these drugs but the people who use them for ritual or to learn far outweigh the people who abuse them (for instance you NEVER EVER hear about people getting busted for hallucinogens on the news or anything, its always heroina and crack and other harder drugs) Some of you need to forget about all the stuff you see on tv and in public service announcements and crap, because a good portion of it isnt true. Also the main reason a lot of these drugs are illegal is because of how they make people think these drugs cause a lot of people to have revelations about themselves/the world and to think more freely, the governments don't want that, and another reason is because the governments of the world are in cahoots with the pharmacuetical (spelling?) companies and if things like pot were legal people would just use that for pain rather then opiates and crap (I know those are just conspiracy theories but to me they are obvious, and seem very true).

Edit:by the way no where in this post I talk about myself using drugs, so mods I don't think you should have to edit this (but if something in the post is against the rules, sorry.

sorry for ranting guys

peace,
jouse





[edit on 21-6-2009 by jouseroni]

[edit on 22-6-2009 by jouseroni]

sorry i didnt mean to post in this thread again... please delete this post if possible.


[edit on 22-6-2009 by jouseroni]

sorry i thought this was another thread... this the second time i did this... sorry im a idiot

[edit on 22-6-2009 by jouseroni]

this is the most hillarious and random comment i've seen on ats so far. great illustration! keep it up!

Hey, I'm new here but I just headed for the Terence Mckenna room-:>

Check this out...

cognitionfactor.net...

It's a brand new movie (June 2009) on the evolution of consciousness and the war between science and spirit, and the best part is that it stars Terence Mckenna and his brother Dennis.

best

Schwann (South Africa)