Bush lies on Iraq? 58% say yes

Personally, I think that number is too low.

CREDIBILITY GAP!
58% BELIEVE BUSH
WOULD KNOWINGLY
LIE ABOUT IRAQ

CNN/USA TODAY/GALLUP POLL (2/4)
Reported on CNN's Inside Politics

In UN presentation, the Bush administration is very or somewhat likely to:

knowingly present inaccurate information:

49%

conceal evidence against Bush position:

58%

Who do you trust more on Iraq?

Powell:

63%

Bush:

24%

We'll see today if Powell deserves that 63% after his Speech to the UN.
Interesting Note: The UN decided to cover up Picasso's antiwar masterpiece "Guernica" , in the hall where Powell will be speaking. It depicts an actual event where every man/woman/child/animal in a village was killed simply to test the Nazi war machine's arial arsenal. The irony is palpable.

CNN's poll explains it all. They poll idiots in the ghettos of LA, Detroit, NYC, Boston, Miami and call it a cross-section of American society.

...somehow I doubt you'd be complaining if the poll was in favour of Bush...

Originally posted by Bout Time

The UN decided to cover up Picasso's antiwar masterpiece "Guernica" , in the hall where Powell will be speaking. It depicts an actual event where every man/woman/child/animal in a village was killed simply to test the Nazi war machine's arial arsenal. The irony is palpable.

For you, Bush is a new Hitler and Powell is a new Himmler ?

And Rumsfeld, he's who ? The new Dr Goebels ?

" HEIL MEIN PRAZIDENT ! "

Our ABRAMS M-1 Panzer Divizions are fighting in Irak and our Luftwaffe and her F-22 raptor are unbeatable.

Our Kriegsmarine and her aircrafts carriers NimitZ and EnterpriZe are conducting many operations.

Baghdad is surrounded by our S.S MarineZ Corps Storm TrooperZ, THE VICTORY IS TOTAL MEIN PRAZIDENT !

DAS IST EINE BLITZ KRIEG, ZIEG HEIL FUR MEINE PRAZIDENT GEORGES W.BUSH ! "

BT, the real nazis are in the UN, not outside.

Originally posted by alien
...somehow I doubt you'd be complaining if the poll was in favour of Bush...

You're not an American, thus don't understand how left-wing CNN is with their view of the world.

Polls are a joke anyways. This President makes decisions based on FACTS, not the polls like the previous President.

Polls BT? C'mon - They are always loaded.

His approval rating is about that high - I guess Americans like liars?

"idiots in the ghetto" ??? i'm truly amazed at the depts to which you will sink MT69. in the land of the free, which you swear your alligence to, everyone has the right to voice their opinion freely even the poor/working poor. you say you believe in democracy but you have no clue of what democracy is. if you did then you wouldn't dismiss the opinions of your fellow americans because of their financial status. sure there are idiots in the ghetto, but there are idiots in the suburbs and on capital hill and all of their opinions matter in a democracy. you are truly disgusting and foolish. and you don't represent the american point of view. i'm starting to think you aren't even american because no american i know would say something so un-american.



ah well. i'm with Bee-O-Bee88, polls are useless. our last president lived by them. the current president doesn't seem to care too much about opinions. he's got a set agenda and it has all of his focus . i don't think a poll will change that. it has been reported that he believes like once the bullets and bombs start flying and things go well he'll get all the support he needs from americans and the international community. we'll have to wait and see.

...and where is the poll about Saddam lying about WMD's?

Sad that people think Saddam is more credible than Bush.

[Edited on 5-2-2003 by Bob88]

UP

Right winger to the core, huh? You truly suffer from a debiltating USA envy!
Please get some art education under your belt regarding Guernica.
Bob - he's at 53% approval; did I miss a spike?
Kind of funny who you lambast polls and yet LOVE to quote that approval rating poll!!

-STILL 20 point lower than Clintons on Impeacment day
-STILL not looking at the critical "Would you vote for Bush in the 2004 election" It's less than 50%!!!!!!!!!

Buh-bye Dubya!

yeah, I think you missed the post state of the union spike - thought it went up to 66%. But as your data is usually more up to date than mine (i've gotta work for a livin' you know ) it's probably already dropped again. lol. I am not a fan of the approval rating actually but since your team loves that sort of data I thought you would think it to be credible.

So, Bout Time, from what I can gather, Gen. Powell laid out a convincing outlay of the situation, with ample evidence to convince everyone. Whether one feels the need to defend the U.S. is beside the point, there was plenty of evidence to validate the need for war if Hussein doesn't comply.
You say we'll see if Gen Powell deserves the 63% credibility rating after the speech, as if somehow you'd all of a sudden know his heart. I didn't have to wait, as a matter of fact, I knew before he was in the Bush cabinet, and I knew before the Gulf War I. I knew his credibility when I was a soldier in Europe in the '80's. Gen. Powell's credibility is betond reproach. I may not, and do not agree with every position he holds, but his credibility and integrity I do not doubt.

As far as polls, polls don't lie, but liars poll. Who you call and how you phrase the question makes all the difference in the world. You've taken Sociology, you should know that.

Originally posted by MT69

You're not an American, thus don't understand how left-wing CNN is with their view of the world.

...riiiiight...and there is no such thing as the internet or CNN on SkyTV on our televisions here??? I may not be from America, but I do in fact understand how left-wing CNN is...


...but you are right...polls can easily be doctored to achieve whatever the poller has in mind...

Saphronia - People in the ghetto believe anything the Democrats shovel to them, because the Democrats promise to keep the welfare gravy train open for them. So....CNN goes wandering into the ghetto asking them who they believe Bush or the Democrats.....hmmmm.

Originally posted by Bob88
...and where is the poll about Saddam lying about WMD's?

Sad that people think Saddam is more credible than Bush.

[Edited on 5-2-2003 by Bob88]

I don't think Saddam is credible at all...

MT69, why don't you send CNN an e-mail and ask them who they poll instead of assuming who they poll...

Or you assume they'll lie to you???

Originally posted by Java
So, Bout Time, from what I can gather, Gen. Powell laid out a convincing outlay of the situation, with ample evidence to convince everyone. Whether one feels the need to defend the U.S. is beside the point, there was plenty of evidence to validate the need for war if Hussein doesn't comply.
You say we'll see if Gen Powell deserves the 63% credibility rating after the speech, as if somehow you'd all of a sudden know his heart. I didn't have to wait, as a matter of fact, I knew before he was in the Bush cabinet, and I knew before the Gulf War I. I knew his credibility when I was a soldier in Europe in the '80's. Gen. Powell's credibility is betond reproach. I may not, and do not agree with every position he holds, but his credibility and integrity I do not doubt.

As far as polls, polls don't lie, but liars poll. Who you call and how you phrase the question makes all the difference in the world. You've taken Sociology, you should know that.

But, once he became a politician, well, you know.
THe poll manipulation does not come into play here....the question asked is listed in my post. But you are very correct in the fact there is often a gap between the question asked and the data presented.
As to Powell laying out a convincing case? No, but it was an articulation of ideas and facts, though stretched beyond plausible limits, that has been painfully lacking from this administration. There are other threads where I'll post my reservations on what he said.
Attacking Iraq does not take away a threat to the US and is not defending the US, it's a genesis point for Jihad and Intefadha that all terror cells active & dormant will reference.
To make a case for war is to also make a case for the loss of American life, you can't seperate the two. With better options available to implement, the case for the loss of US lives has not been made to date

Originally posted by TheBandit795
MT69, why don't you send CNN an e-mail and ask them who they poll instead of assuming who they poll...

Or you assume they'll lie to you???

Yeah, CNN will tell me the truth....just like Saddam.

And Bush...Who is a politician...
Even though Saddam is 1000x worse.
.

Poll: Majority See Justification for War

Washington Post Staff Writers
Thursday, February 6, 2003; 10:35 AM


In the aftermath of Secretary of State Colin L. Powell's address to the United Nations, a growing majority of Americans now say the United States has presented enough evidence to justify going to war with Iraq, according to a new washingtonpost.com-ABC News poll.

Overall, more than six in 10 Americans-61 percent-believe that the Bush administration has made the case for war, up from 54 percent in a survey conducted last week after the president's State of the Union address.

But the survey also found that Powell's speech did not immediately increase public sentiment for launching a war with Iraq or deepen support among those who favor using military force. Two in three continue to favor attacking Iraq, with slightly fewer than half of the country "strongly" supporting a military option, unchanged from last week. One in four-27 percent-now oppose going to war, down slightly from a week ago.

The poll found that seven in 10 also believed that Iraq has chemical and biological weapons, and a slightly larger proportion believe that Saddam Hussein is not cooperating with U.N. weapons inspectors. Six in 10 believe Iraq is trying to develop nuclear weapons.

But most Americans are not yet convinced that Iraq has provided assistance to the al Qaeda terrorist group, including those familiar with Powell's speech. In his address, the secretary of state went to great lengths to tie Iraq and Saddam Hussein to international terrorism and the group responsible for the Sept. 11 attacks.

According to the poll, a clear majority now support taking action against Iraq within the next few weeks, rather than waiting a few months or longer to make a final decision about going to war, as France and other U.S. allies have urged.

A total of 504 randomly selected adults were interviewed Wednesday night for this washingtonpost.com-ABC News survey. The margin of sampling error for the overall results is plus or minus 5 percentage points. The practical difficulties of doing a survey in a single night represent additional potential sources of error in this poll

The survey suggests that Powell succeeded in presenting a persuasive case for war to the American public. Six in 10 Americans said they had seen or heard the speech or news accounts about it. Among this group, seven in ten said there was now enough evidence to justify going to war.

Those familiar with his presentation also were nearly twenty percentage points more likely to say that the administration has shown "strong evidence" that Iraq possessed chemical or biological weapons (78 percent compared to 60 percent.) Speech watchers were also somewhat more likely to say the United States has proven that Iraq is trying to develop nuclear weapons and that Iraq is not cooperating with U.N. weapons inspectors.

Less than half of those surveyed (49 percent) said the administration presented a link between Saddam Hussein and al Qaeda, and those familiar with the speech were no more likely (50 percent) to be convinced than those who had not heard about yesterday's Security Council appearance (47 percent).

News of Powell's address was not limited to war hawks and fellow Republicans. Democrats and Republicans were equally likely to report having watched or heard about the U.N. appearance (60 percent of Democrats and 65 percent of GOP members). War proponents were only somewhat more likely than opponents to have heard about the speech last night (64 percent compared to 54 percent).

Overall, the administration has been much more successful convincing Republicans of the merits of their case for war: 91 percent of Republicans said they've seen enough evidence, compared to 54 percent of political independents and 43 percent of Democrats.

A CNN/USA Today/Gallup poll also conducted last night also found that the majority of those who had heard about the U.N. speech found Powell's presentation to be convincing, but relatively few minds were instantly changed.

About four in ten speech watchers said the Secretary of State made a "very strong case" for military action, and a similar percentage thought he made a "fairly strong" case. But the immediate increase in support for a ground invasion of Iraq was only 7 percentage points (from 50 percent to 57 percent among those familiar with the speech.)

As in the washingtonpost.com-ABC poll, Americans were least persuaded by Powell's assertion of ties between Saddam Hussein and the al Qaeda terrorist network.

� 2003 The Washington Post Company

Originally posted by Bout Time
UP

Right winger to the core, huh? You truly suffer from a debiltating USA envy!
Please get some art education under your belt regarding Guernica.

Right-winger to the core ? OF COURSE !

And for Guernica, I didn't wait for your " advice ". The first time that I saw this paint, I was 9 ( NINE ) years old and the first time when I went to a museum, I was 6 ( SIX ) years old. You'll have to be more smart if you want to depict me like what I'm not, a redneck !

And for Guernica, I wasn't speaking about what his meaning. I was speaking about the parallelism that you was doing between Bush/Powell and the nazis !