Our Aryan Heritage: Learn about your real spiritual heritage

Is there an an link between Aryan and Ari-An ??
Dumb question but I just felt like tossing it into the debate .. )

My self is from the Aryan part of the world, my fathers mother was from Germany as far as I have been able to figure out..

reply to post by TheComte


I don't think Aryans originate in India, and I think spiritual tradition is very old, and perhaps shared with Neanderthals, or even inherited from them. But we have lost memories of that, buried them under our narcissism. Especially if we believe that our reason and emotions are the key elements of "intelligence", instead of spiritual and creative experience... When I look for "origins" I'd rather look there than in "reflective" history of pride and violence...

Originally posted by Roark
I have one question:

Why should one's spiritual heritage be a derivative of one's biological ancestry?

Definitely has nothing to do with eugenics
Linear advancement and evolution understood as such, is quite an idiotic concept.

Interesting topic!

My only question is: if we are living in a virtual reality, an hologram or whatever, then how can all that you said be true or false? How can be the artifacts and consciousness in any form be true if it's created by our brain and made of images (eyes) and words (ears)?

Originally posted by digitalwarrior
Interesting topic!

My only question is: if we are living in a virtual reality, an hologram or whatever, then how can all that you said be true or false? How can be the artifacts and consciousness in any form be true if it's created by our brain and made of images (eyes) and words (ears)?

It is all such a miracle, isn't it!
Understanding will resolve the mystery, but do not use the means of mystery to "understand" it. Try NOT-doing that and then you will "see".

In other words: peel off the perception and see what is left. If you feel as if there's no end to peeling (like fractal) - stop!

If we think about string theory and the multi-dimensions that are needed to make it work, then spirituality can be the path to evolve from what we are now into a multidimensional entity and reach finally the absolute consciousness becoming able to feel the world in all its dimesions.

I think each of these dimensions can be basically a new perceptive dimension of space or consciousness. It can be telepathy, Clairvoyance or maybe just about the ability to see the dark matter....who knows?

Interesting topic anyway. thx for your effort of posting such a long thing!

First of all, thanks to Indigo for one of the best threads I've seen on ATS.

The debate can follow two lines. The first is the factual/ material existence and origin of the Aryan civilization. It's my belief (through my research) that the Aryans originated from the northern regions of the Caspian. The group then propagated the world, and the most important subsets were the Indian/ Iranian ones. Certain Indians and Iranians are about as closely related as two nations can get. The Avesta and Sanskrit languages are so similar that scholars who know one can read the other.

Aryan heritage originated from the area north of the Caspian, and was taken and carried by the many scions of that civilization. The vedas are the repositories of Aryan knowledge... supposedly timeless truths that the sages heard when meditating upon the banks of the Saraswati river. It's said that when you are advanced enough, you can hear the eternal refrains of the vedas when you meditate.

The other thing to be considered is the nature of Aryan spirituality. I'll have to use Hinduism, because that's the modern day representation of that spirituality.

Many people deride Hinduism as a stupid quack religion, where people worship cows and a multitude of icon-gods. In a way, they are correct.
Some people exalt Hinduism as pure philosophy on earth, the most incorruptible and wisest form of spirituality around. In a way, they are correct.

So how can there be this duality within a religion? Well, Hinduism (ie the Vedas) are a framework for spiritual advancement and understanding. It's a bit like the Freemasons- they have no agenda or teachings of their own, but they allow you to explore and understand knowledge to find your own answers. The Vedas are the supreme collection of knowledge on earth, presented in a form that allows the user to draw his inferences based on his level of intellectualism and understanding.

Someone of low intelligence will come to the conclusion that he ought to worship a certain god because it may rain if he does so. That's fine... that's his level of understanding and spiritual advancement. Perhaps when he reincarnates, he will be more evolved.

Another person will understand the metaphysics and philosophy of the Vedas and conclude the answers to life- why he is on earth, what he should do to advance himself etc.

The most important fact that I must share with you is that no two people need come to the same conclusions. They select their answers and their path based on their level of evolution. In time, they will all reach the goal of the absolute: enlightenment. In time, they will all understand the supreme truth. For the time being however, we must give each other space to determine our own beliefs. Unlike organised religion, there is no dogma, nor tenets, nor teachings within Aryan spirituality... there is only space for individual advancement and spiritual evolution. Proponents of big religion will look down on you, call you names and deride your beliefs and question your intellectual ability. Dismiss their words, for they know not what they say... in time, in another life, they too will understand.

May this thread serve as a lightening bolt to invigorate your mind in the quest for the absolute. Namaste.

Hey great post!
You gave us a brief explanation of a true history!
Vedas are truly the easiest way to understand the reality.

What I am interested in is how do you perceive the whole WW2 situation..
Is it possible the one of the most scientifically and technologically advanced "organizations" - the Nazis misunderstood the whole purpose of Vedas? It is obvious that they were highly influenced by Aryan teachings and practiced occultism (spirituality)...

Or is it that they got the whole idea correctly and therefore the ruling groups of the world didn't want them around?
The WW2 still has a lot of puzzles to solve..

Yeah, I was first introduced to this idea in my teens when I was researching my own genealogy and heritage in great depth and read some of the books of Peter Berresford Ellis, who writes about the Celts of Britain and who discussed the connections between Sanskrit and the Celtic languages, as well many other connections, such as the obvious similarities in the legal systems, and so on. It's a fascinating subject.

[edit on 26-4-2009 by Malcram]

Yes, those similarities are not coincidental. The druidic culture practiced in ancient Briton was the same Aryan culture practiced in the Indian subcontinent.

reply to post by Roark


It shouldn't and isn't. While it is true the Aryans have common biological ancestory, Aryanhood has nothing to do with biological ancestory. You can be born into an Aryan bloodline, and still not be Aryan. Aryanhood completely has to do with ones spiritual character. This is why the word means "noble"
It so happened that in the past this culture was being practiced all over the world. If one watches these videos I am linking, one will see all races of all colors embracing Aryan culture, the whole notion of Aryan being connected to ones race, caste, creed or sect will disappear.







Whether you are white, black, brown, yellow or any other colour makes no difference. Aryan is a cosmic title, that any of us can wear so as long we resolve to be noble and virtuous in thoughts and deeds.

Where are Aryans from? I have heard so many theories on where they originated. The best hypothesis so far is they originated in the Indian subcontinent, because all the records of Aryans point to the Indian subcontinent and the Vedas describe the Indian subcontinent as well as an ancient but now dried up river along which Vedic cities were built. The archaelogical evidence strongly supports this hypothesis. However, I have also heard of other hypothesis which give Aryans a more extraordinary origin. They are

1. Aryans were from Atlantis
2. Aryans were from the Arctic
3. Aryans were from the stars

Wherever they were from, the Aryans are the ancestors of our civilisation and have left for us a great spiritual heritage that we the worldover should reclaim and end the Abrahmic rule of our planet.

[edit on 27-4-2009 by Indigo_Child]

reply to post by zhuzha


The Nazis were just a blip/ black mark in the history of Germany. I'm not German myself, but I have to say that overall Germany is the country which most understands Aryan spirituality. They have taken to heart the teachings of the Vedas more than India itself, and their ventures in day to day life are guided by the same baseline as the Vedas.

The Nazis just attempted to make the exterior match the interior. Racially, Germans aren't Aryans... but spiritually and mentally they definitely are.

The more dangerous side of Hinduism is that it condones the concept of Dharma- that is "righteous duty". Dharma/ Dharma Yuddha (righteous warfare) is normally a concept reserved to justify the use of force against evil forces. The Dalai Lama recently released a statement saying that terrorism must be defeated by force- ie by Dharma Yuddha.

Within Hinduism, killing can be moral. If you are a soldier and you kill your enemy, there is no element of immorality in it.

The Nazis twisted this to a sociopathic level in order to justify the "final solution" and the genocide of Jews. They were wrong to do so, and they were put in their place by destiny (ie The Allies, practising their own form of righteous warfare).

Still, Nazi Germany was a period that should be looked upon as merely the surfacing of a dormant Aryan nature, combined with a wrong path taken.

Hmmm, I'm all in favour oflearning about other religeons but this one struck a cord with me ; mainly because I'm a Pagan ( good) and my surname is Bramham ( sounds almost like Brahman - very good) .
Double whammy, get in.....

reply to post by digitalwarrior


Virtual reality is also a reality. However, it is only a temporal reality. Just as the mirage appears as the lake. You can still see a lake, it looks just as real as any lake, until you look closer and the lake disappears. Likewise is our empirical reality which appears to us in a certain way because of our senses and mind that apprehends it and organizes it in a certin way. It is only temporal, when you look closer, it will disappear.

In actual fact what we call reality is virtual reality, it is series of qualia constructed in our mind. What we call reality is nothing more than colour, shape, form, vibration. On a physical level there is no such thing, there is mostly empty space and a flux of particles coming in and out of existence. However, we experience not flux, but substance. To us a table looks solid and static, in actual fact it is not solid and nor is it static. It is instead observer-dependent-reflective behaviour. There would be no table, without the observer to see it, but there would be something which when observed by different observer will appear in many ways. At the sensory level a table, at the atomic level a whirl of electrons around a central nucleus, at the quantum level information states. The Vedas assert that once you observe reality at its most fundamental level you will happen upon an amazing discovery - Tat Tvam Asi - you are that. That you are consciousness apprehending your self. This entire universe is pure consciousness and it on this screen of consciousness that the world appears.

What is the difference between dream and waking? The difference is that time in dream is faster and time in waking is slower. Your thoughts manifest instantly in the dream world, and in the waking world they manifest slowly. Both are illusory and unreal and disappear completely in deep sleep. Then there is neither waking reality or dream reality.

The Vedas describe the physical universe as being jagat(waking) that is that the universe itself is conscious and what we call the physical plane is just its waking state. Its dream state is what we call the mental or astral plane. It's deep-sleep state is what we call the causal plane and in each plane the laws of space and time are different.

So there is a vast reality for us to discover beyond our own virtual reality. As the Vedas say: "the string beyond the string"



[edit on 27-4-2009 by Indigo_Child]

You seem to be describing Adi Shakara's Advaita Vedanta, which is the basis of the Smartist hindu belief system. I have personally always believe that there can be no personal god, but that we are all connected by consciousness. I see Nirguna Brahman (Advaita's Vedanta's version of Ultimate Reality) as the proverbial fountain of consciousness. Consciousness flows in and out, as individual life experiences begin and end.

The concept of Ishvara is that people need to believe that there is a personal god. A god with human like features, that looks out for them and empathises with them. In a universe of mystery, this is understandable, but to the logical thinker, it is impossible for there to be such a god. Brahman can exist as a parallel to quantum theory, and I personally believe that can help to explain a number of things that are still not understood by mainstream science.

There is Brahman, the source and Atman, which is the source within us. Brahman is us and we are all Brahman. It isn't all that religious when you break it down. I consider myself to be an atheist, but I believe in these concepts and I am sure quantum physics will one day prove it.

Originally posted by Filter
Good evening Indigo_child
Very interesting thread here, I would like to ask about musical notes and instruments that may have been used to help with meditation. I am curious because some of the sounds I have heard that may originate from instruments in that part of the world strike me in a unusual way on a very personal level.
I am trying to put my finger on a type of long horn that is very deep and and I have "seen" being used. Any ideas?
I have read of sound notes having extraordinary effects on both animate and inanimate objects. Do you have any insight on this being discussed in the Vedas?
I would like to try meditation myself, it seems like a very natural thing to do.
Thanks.
C

Yes, according to the Aryans, sound indeed does have extraordinary effects. Aryan music is known as raaga music, raaga meaning melody and each raaga is designed to suit a certain mood, season and energy. You can directly interface with the universe itself and cause powerful effects to happen through the use of music and sound.

Aryan music is meditative, it is usually characterized by the drone of an instrument(called a Veena I think) and the subtle use of Sitar which I suppose is done to induce meditative states. The monotony and the subtle use of musical notes takes one to higher states of consciousness. Another interesting fact about Aryan music is it is microtonal, it has the amazing ability to glide from one note to the other seamlessly and harminously.

If you are interested you should check out Ravi Shankar, a world renowned Maestro of Indian music:



[edit on 27-4-2009 by Indigo_Child]

reply to post by mrmanuva


Yes, I consider myself an Advaita Vedantist. That is what the Aryans are themselves - they are not dualistic. Dualism is a philosophy which took root in India in the middle ages due to influx of Abrahmic religion and since has become the dominant force in India. Most Hindus believe in the same personal, creator and ontic god that the Abrahmic religions believe in.

The Abrahmic religion has very successful in infiltrating all the cultures of the world and subverting and perverting their heritage. India is no exception.

The Vedas do not speak of a personal god, rather they speak of an impersonal and absolute reality and supreme being which underlies all of creation. It is called Brahman, which means the infinite and absolute one. It declares this is the true existence. In fact creation and Brahman are synonymous.

What is Brahman? What is Brahman depends on what language you use. To a subject who directly experiences Brahman, Brahman is pure bliss, pure knowledge, pure truth. To the logician and mathematician, Brahman is the ultimate abstract entity and to the scientist, Brahman is the substratum of existence. To me Brahman is all of those things and more.

The Aryans were a highly advanced spiritual and scientific culture. Their science was so advanced that it was able to reconcile the physical with the non physical; matter with consciousness, the subject with the object; science with art.

If you read the Vedas scientifically you will discover pure science; if you read them spiritually; you will discover pure spirit; if you read them poetically; you will discover pure poetry. The Vedas being a cosmic religion, what the Indians call Santana Dharma(the religion of the eternal) do not favour any language. They speak to the scientist, they speak to the poet, they speak to the mystic, they speak to the ordinary person. They are eclectic and which is why the many paths they prescribe to self-realization are eclectic.

I want to say something about the Vedas from the scientific perspective. Are you familiar with the Samkhya karika? It is an Aryan treatise on quantum-observational physics. Of course if you look at antiquated translations of early Indologists who barely understood Sanskrit, you will not discover this. The translations tend to be grossly inaccurate and nonsensical. Recently, an expert Sanskrit translator and engineer has translated the Samkhya Karika properly bringing out their scientific content. After reading his translation everything about physics will start to make sense. He is able to describe and unify the physical universe and consciousness using the Samkhyan metaphysics. Some the material in his book are speculative, but his translations and acute descriptions of the Sutras are the most accurate I have come across:

Aryan Quantum Physics

Just a brief primer on Samkhyan metaphysics. Samkhyan metaphysics starts where Nyaya-Vaiseshika(empirical science) ends. It is based on pure rationalism. It is able to using very advanced logic produce a complete theorem of the observable universe. It does this simply by observing cyclic phenomena and enumerating them and thus the observer is integral within its physics.

According to Samkhyan metaphysics that are two types of phenomenon - subjective and objective; consciousness and matter. However this distinction is only an apparent one because consciousness and matter are really the bifurcation of an absolute, dynamic super-coherent state, known as Purusha, which literally means singularity or nuclear core. In this case this is the absolute singularity and the very core of being.

The first step in the evolution of the cosmos is the bifurcation of the absolutem.
This split’s the absolutem into cosmic mind(Mahat or Ishvara) and cosmic matter(Moolaprakriti). Cosmic matter is in a state of super symmetry.

The second is step is the evolution of cosmos is the further division of cosmic mind into infinite units minds and cosmic matter into infinite unit-matter. Each unit mind is a subject/soul and each unit-matter is a universe.

The third step is the evolution of the unit-mind structure and the evolution of the unit-matter or universes. The order is as follows:

Mind: Ego, Intelligence, processor, senses, sense organs
Matter: Space, force, energy, plasma, solids. (Each state of matter has its own particle, except for space forces are vibrating quantum strings, energy is photons, plasma is ions, and solids are atoms and molecules.

The fourth step is the evolution of unit-mind and unit-matter back to cosmic-mind and cosmic-matter back to the absolutem. Thus completing the cosmic cycle.

This happens as follows:

Unit-mind develops in consciousness from unconscious(microrganims) to subconscious(animals) to conscious(human), to super conscious(superhuman)

Unit-matter develops by acclerating and expanding an decelerating and collapsing back on itself and reverting back to the state of super symmetry.(This happens because the three fundamental forces resolve)

The Samkhyan account is not the end however. It only gives an account of the observers universe to the point of the absolute singularity. Thereafter Vedanta takes over and declares that this long evolution process Samkhya describes never actually happened. The absolutem was always absolute and only appeared to have become transformed to the observer.

Quantum physics will not be able to discover anything about consciousness, because quantum physics can only deal with the empirical and not with non-empirical. However, quantum physics has brought an end to empirical physics and will soon be replaced by theoretical physics and string theory. Modern Science will discover just as the Aryans did that the observer is integeral in physics and one can only discover the truths of physical reality through pure rationalism.

[edit on 27-4-2009 by Indigo_Child]

Oh commrade, i thank you a thousand times for taking the time to post such an informitive thread. Although i feel such a strong need to inform to masses, i cant begin to peice together my words as beautifully as you have done here. When i try to tell people about this subject, they usually just look at me weird and tell me to F off, and its a sigh of relief to me to see this takin seriously for once and that we actually contemplate our aryan heritage, and the possible existance of a still standing alien race of aryans that may be out there... mabey even closer than we'd like to think. I think plenty others would also like to thank you, but the burden of informing peolpe has only just begun. With the cosmos sand running thin, we have to be swift and carefull in teaching the old ways to those who are willing to listen to us and not turn thy ear the other way. Shun not that which you dont understand, afterall.

You and I do share some common ground in this matter of these 'old teachings.' I am convinced, as you obviously are, that this 'ancient wisdom,' codified in the Vedas and the resultant deriviate literature of 'Mother India' is a treasure trove of valid knowledge, the correct application of which would greatly benefit the lost and confused masses of people, 'blind from birth,' as it were, who wander without direction in today's darkening world.

It is just for this very reason, that this subject is of very great importance, that I take issue mostly with the 'unskillfulness' of your presentation. Besides that primary fault, there are other instances of misunderstanding, or perhaps, in deference to you, faulty presentation for whatever reason which I should address as well.

Your refusal to acknowledge my posts is unfortunate, since, although you appear to have accumulated a great deal of accurate information, many of your conlcusions and inferences are faulty, inaccurate and misleading.

My main concern is that the 'net effect' of what you post on this important material will serve only to increase the 'polarization' and 'level of conflict' in the 'great ocean of negativity' upon which we are already, all of us, almost 'hopelessly adrift.'

Once again, I begin at the beginning -

Aryan

Aryan is an English language loanword. As the American Heritage Dictionary of the English Language states at the beginning of its definition, "[it] is one of the ironies of history that Aryan, a word nowadays referring to the blond-haired, blue-eyed physical ideal of Nazi Germany, originally referred to a people who looked vastly different.

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/0f8e2e9f22f7.jpg[/atsimg]
Source : Wikipedia

Again, regardless of the 'fairness' of the situation, this term, 'Aryan,' is useless for any purposes of 'decreasing conflict' in today's world. It has been rendered entirely 'impotent' for this purpose by the 'accidents' of history.

The Aryans are history - please 'get over it' ...

That being said ( yet again ), I will now address several 'issues' concerning 'details' of your presentation.

You said :
Sanskrit is the language of Mantras and it is the only language that Mantras can be constructed in. This language is the closest to our universal language of thoughts, which is a language every living entity can speak.

This is completely misinformed, although it is based on a 'kernel of truth,' it amounts to destructive misinformation. For the benfit of those following here, this error should be addressed.

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/b44f16134da5.jpg[/atsimg]
Source : Amazon.com

This same text then goes on to say that parashabda, the 'first sound,' for those who may be following ( and this in itself is quite 'interesting' for at the 'moment' of this 'first sound' there wasn't anything yet ! Just another example of the inconcievability of this subject matter ) this 'OM-syllable' then 'somehow divided' or 'became' 51 'intelligent syllables.'

It is these 'intelligent syllables' which then went on to actually 'form the material universe' by creating various 'organs of expression,' that is to say, 'throats and such' so that they, these 'intelligent syllables,' could 'find expression.'

Indeed these 51 syllables are said to be the basis of the Sanskrit alphabet, and this is the 'kernel of truth' in what you have said. But Sanskrit is not the the 'only' language of mantras. I can assure you of this.

If anything, I would say that Sanskrit is the language which is 'best suited' for a description of the 'technology' of mind.

It's pretty good for mantras too - I am not disputing that ...

I will limit this to two other 'issues', since it's getting pretty lengthy ...

You said :
What is the difference between dream and waking? The difference is that time in dream is faster and time in waking is slower. Your thoughts manifest instantly in the dream world, and in the waking world they manifest slowly. Both are illusory and unreal and disappear completely in deep sleep. Then there is neither waking reality or dream reality.

Again, misleading and unskillfull. Our experience of 'time' is always 'subjective' whether in our 'dreams' or when we are in a 'waking' state.


When one 'looks into' it 'deeply,' one finds there is actually 'very little' difference between our waking state and our dream state. This is why, in the Tibetan tradition, the 'dreamlike quality' of our 'waking state' is quite often referred to.

Lastly, but certainly not least, we have -

You said :
What is Brahman? What is Brahman depends on what language you use. To a subject who directly experiences Brahman, Brahman is pure bliss, pure knowledge, pure truth. To the logician and mathematician, Brahman is the ultimate abstract entity and to the scientist, Brahman is the substratum of existence.

This is an unneccessarily confusing description. IMHO, the following is much better -

Brahman projects the phenominal universe. Brahman is the 'light' of the projector which produces an image, unlike the projection on the 2-D screen we are all familiar with as 'movies,' the projection Brahma produces is in 'more than' 2-D.

'Prakriti' is the 'film' in this projector which 'modifies' the 'stainless light' of Brahman to produce these 'images' we all percieve as the 'phenominal universe.'

So, in closing, it's pretty evident to me what you're preseting here is 'your own synthesis.' I would be suprised to learn you are connected in any way with an 'authentic teaching lineage.' Please correct me if I'm wrong.

As you know, there is no need to 're-invent the wheel.' The misguided 'drive' to do so will only increase the negativity which is now so great it threatens everything ...

If you choose to ignore this post as well, I understand. Your 'ego' just won't let you do so.

It's ok - we're all in the same boat ...

reply to post by visible_villain


The only person here making a big issue over the use of the word Aryan, is you. Therefore there is no real problem with using the word. People seem open to learning about the positive and accurate meanings of the word and to letting their prejudices go. You've made your point, more than once, and you are the only one running with it. So, I suggest you "get over it" and let the issue drop now.




[edit on 27-4-2009 by Malcram]

Originally posted by DangerDeath
reply to post by visible_villain

 

Something else.
It is interesting, Serbian (Slavic) language is one of the most closely related to Sanskrit.

In Serbian, "vedeti" (not in use anymore) means "knowing", and the verb "videti" (to see) is directly derived from it. In Sanskrit "vidya" is knowledge.

webapps.uni-koeln.de...

There is a phrase in Serbian folklore "Indian books", referring to certain very old, pre
historic knowledge (but maybe also to the Codex of Mani, which is from historic times). Still, the usage of "Indian" rather than Persian, indicates much older tradition.

"Budan" in Serbian means "awake" = Buddho in Sanskrit. Practically the same word.

This is an interesting find upon which I would like to expand a bit if I may, pointing you to the Vinca script presumably from around 6000 BCE. It is as yet, not proven as a writing system, but is interesting to note that whatever it is it contains several depictions of the symbol "swastika" and strangely enough an encircled "christian cross".

The Vinca script mystery

Kind regards, M.