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Swine Flu news and updates thread

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posted on May, 14 2009 @ 01:31 PM
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Originally posted by fleabit

Well then it looks like the MSM and TPTB have got you exactly where they have been trying to get you, way to go.


There is never a happy-medium around here, is there. It's either complete despair and chaos along with the "we are all going to die!" syndrome, or it's utter dismissal of something.

As far as being cautious, I am cautious, I do know this is an actual risk, and I am careful with what I do. I just think people go overboard. We get continual updates from "contacts," par for the course around here. Anonymous people that supposedly are in the know about everything, and somehow, people from this board are buddy-buddy with them. From these 'contacts' we keep getting gloom and doom messages.

People give our rather disorganized government bodies far too much credit imo. Media blackout? Nonsense. If there was a large outbreak or deaths associated with illness in any town, the local news agencies would be covering it, guaranteed. I am hearing nothing, I haven't seen a single person with flu symptoms, nor heard about one through the grapevine.

I have a reasonable amount of trepidation and have a plan of action, if things 'get worse,' which they could, if this were to mutate in a bad way, which while there is a very low chance of this, it's possible. But I feel an inordinate amount of fear-mongering goes on.

Just because people don't personally believe that a super flu is 'spreading like wildfire,' nor that it is 'very very bad,' (key terms people use to blow it out of proportion a bit), doesn't mean they are ignorant idiots, unable to deduce what is really going on.

I highly doubt this will be any worse than the last couple 'pandemics' that were at that time, also blow way, way out of proportion. I'm ready if it turns out different, I just don't think there is nearly as much to this as people are making out.


sorry but i really have to disagree with you over the media blackout, its obvious.
This blackout started as soon as pandemic level 5 was initiated, about week and a half ago or something, since then nothing.

Think about it, the media loves a huge story and you dont get much bigger than the WHO declaring that a pandemic is "imminent" (they said that). So the next day or two all media reporting stops apart tiny little bits - it does not add up at all - it was a big story and still is now.

I would bet money that one of the conditions of the pandemic level 5 is to encourage countries to control the media - i.e stop panic by stop reporting.

I could be wrong but i think its obvious and they think we are fools.




posted on May, 14 2009 @ 01:35 PM
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Originally posted by fleabit

I just think people go overboard. We get continual updates from "contacts," par for the course around here. Anonymous people that supposedly are in the know about everything, and somehow, people from this board are buddy-buddy with them.


Fleabit, I completely get your skepticism. Take a few moments to read my posts here and I think you'll find no bigger skeptic than me. In fact, I have been called a "disinfo agent," more than once


I have, however, followed this thread carefully and can tell you that the "sources," of some of our posters here have proven to be legitimate. Why do I say that? Because there have been frequent occasions in which information was posted here that was not being reported anywhere else (and believe me, I looked) only to have it be confirmed a week or so later.

As with all ATS threads, each post must be viewed with healthy skepticism but keep an open mind about this particular thread especially. There has been a lot of good intel being posted here.



posted on May, 14 2009 @ 01:43 PM
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I don't see any panic here at all, I see so many intelligent posters sharing information, and I am soooo grateful to all of you that are putting in so much time to help keep us all informed. Thank you.

This is not an ordinary flu, and that attitude, in my opinion, is dangerous and will only assist in the spread of this flu, which will inevitably kill more people.

As for not seeing anyone who has it.....where I live there are many that are infected and they've had to close some schools, I think Chicago and other cities have similar numbers. Why would anyone want to downplay an illness that has the chance of infecting and killing our young people?



posted on May, 14 2009 @ 01:44 PM
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Australia has 1 confirmed infection and 14 suspected cases in the state of NSW (national numbers wre impossible to get in the internet). Despite this and the fact that they're almost in winter, beggining of the flu season, there's absolutely nothing in australian media about this new virus. Not even in alternative media. Do they think that it's possible to avoid the spreading of the virus just pretending it doesn't exist?
What's very weird and quite worrying is the fact that in many other countries in the Southern hemisphere the same thing is happening. Argentina has 154 suspected cases and the media is not giving a # about that.
Is that happening because we're almost in the beggining of the flu season and they know something about this that we shouldn't know?



posted on May, 14 2009 @ 01:48 PM
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reply to post by Hx3_1963
 


I remember something like 2000+ people infected and 200+ deaths in Mexico alone. I am sure I saw that somewhere. Around the last week of April.



posted on May, 14 2009 @ 01:49 PM
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reply to post by jonny2410
 





I would bet money that one of the conditions of the pandemic level 5 is to encourage countries to control the media - i.e stop panic by stop reporting.


Pssttt...its in the NIPP guidelines.(HLS) All reports are to come from the top and trickle down to us.

Lebowski achiever
You did see it and it wasn't a misprint either. The numbers where a lot higher than that even in a lot of places. At that time almost half of the states in Mexico had it.
They have now come out and said it has mutated. Another tickler that is either going to get them canned or praised is the CDC told them it is VERY possible that it has been man made! I will jump over to the other thread and grab the Link for you guys. It is in Spanish but can be translated with the software just give it a minute to load and read slow kind of hard to get it...from Spanish to English.

To Add:
Here ya go:
Mexico detected a mutation of the H1N1 virus and warns has aggressiveness
May 13 09 - Mexico City
www.larazon.es

For the CDC part go to the bottom of the article.
[edit on 14-5-2009 by xoxo Stacie]

[edit on 14-5-2009 by xoxo stacie]



posted on May, 14 2009 @ 01:53 PM
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reply to post by nanbei
 


Nanbei...I'm from Australia...they've not hidden anything from anyone....they took extreme measures there and quickly enacted legislation allowing them to quarantine the infected and possibly infected, they've been checking people coming in through the airports thoroughly with questionaires and health checks, they've chased down pretty much every person on every flight with every possible infected person and isolated and tested them all.

When the alert went to Leval 5, they told people not to panic, but to stock their pantries with 2 weeks worth of supplies, including water.

The only reason it's fallen out of the news presently is it hasn't taken off there yet, and we are sooooo far away that North America almost seems like a remote place to many. We hardly have anyone that goes to Mexico, and only limited flights each day from San Fran, LA & Vancouver to Australia.

I am currently in canada on holiday, and was shocked how drastically different the government's reactions were. I was proud that Australia told people to get 2 weeks worth of supplies and got the legislation in place to quarantine people. I think/hope they will contain it there far better than has been done here in Canada.

Also, remember it's an island, and doesn't even have rabies...we have some of the strictest quarantine and customs legislation in the world to protect us.

ETA...it was front page there for quite some time, and if people start getting infected, I think it will hit front page again.

[edit on 14-5-2009 by phoenixs1]



posted on May, 14 2009 @ 02:00 PM
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I just quickly checked one of the 2 leading sydney newspapers, and you'll see they are covering it daily often 2 articles a day,.....these are the search results for the articles on swine flu from the Sydney Morning Herald

search.smh.com.au...

Our other leading paper, the Daily Telegraph, has almost 800 articles come up under "swine flu".

search.news.com.au...

[edit on 14-5-2009 by phoenixs1]



posted on May, 14 2009 @ 02:01 PM
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Here is one article I found.



In Mexico, 2,000 people have been diagnosed as suffering swine flu. Some 150 of them have died, though there is said to be no pathological indication of all these deaths being linked to the new flu strain. People die all the time after catching flu, especially if not medicated.


www.guardian.co.uk...

Edited to add from the BBC "Have your say"site (emphasis is mine):


Yesterday in my office it was a bit surreal walking in to see all in blue masks with deep cleansing of computer equipment and surfaces going on. Let's hope it is contained and does not escalate. The local news is reporting 200 fatalities and reports of flu spreading from areas outside of Mexico City. Given the volume of daily commuter traffic on cramped busses and trains, this may not have to be too virulent to be disastrous in human terms. I wonder what controls there will be on flights in and out. Will Shea, Mexico City




[edit on 14/5/09 by Lebowski achiever]



posted on May, 14 2009 @ 02:03 PM
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I was searching for some images of bio lab balloon suits and found these weird Japanese "masks". I like the idea, I just have no clue if they can filter out a virus or not.

No mouthbreathers, obviously.

bio pit mask make nice season you



posted on May, 14 2009 @ 02:13 PM
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reply to post by yzzyUK
 


I totally agree with you on how pregnancy is viewed as a medical condition instead a pregnancy. About the immune system, I don't think the word weaker was used. I think it's more to do with it being different. The immune system has to work for you yet at the same time keep from rejecting the baby. Also, we know that stress affects the immune system too. Pregnant women stress. Well, a majority of them do, especially if it is the first.



While some immune system cells increased during pregnancy, others, such as lymphocytes, decreased, the study found. Also a form of white blood cells, lymphocytes produce antibodies. Luppi and her colleagues are now expanding their study of these alterations during pregnancy by measuring cytokines released by the activated immune cells. Cytokines are inflammation-promoting proteins produced by immune cells. “This is all considered to be part of a generalized inflammatory response,” said Luppi. “A heightened immune response during pregnancy could conceivably protect the mother and baby during gestation, especially from an attack by foreign pathogens. This would explain why pregnant women usually don’t die from infections.”


www.umc.pitt.edu...
Still new at all this. Hope that worked out all right. That article is some years old, but very informative.



posted on May, 14 2009 @ 02:33 PM
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posted on May, 14 2009 @ 02:54 PM
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I think its time for vacation NOT.www.timesonline.co.uk...



posted on May, 14 2009 @ 03:00 PM
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Disposable respiratorswww.ussafety.com... =CIC0ytvLvJoCFSAgDQodVV0tdA



posted on May, 14 2009 @ 03:05 PM
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reply to post by jonny2410
 


I think there needs to be a clarification regarding cause of death. Yes the patient may be getting secondary infections or it could be the Cytokine storm,
but the actual cause of death has been the same in everyone! Everyone is dying from PULMONARY EDEMA a condition which causes the lungs to fill with fluid including blood which leads to CONGESTIVE HEART FAILURE! THESE PEOPLE ARE LITERALLY DROWNING IN THEIR OWN FLUID!! This is the exact way the 1918 flu claimed it's victims.

With that said pneumonia either viral or bacterial CAN cause Pulmonary Edema but NOT ALWAYS.



how the 1918 virus - modern history's most savage influenza strain - unleashes an immune response that destroys the lungs in a matter of days, leading to death.

Importantly, the new work shows that infection with the virus prompted an immune response that seems to derail the body's typical reaction to viral infection and instead unleashes an attack by the immune system on the lungs. As immune cells attack the respiratory system, the lungs fill with fluid and victims, in essence, drown.


link:[news.bio-medicine.org...]




This flu kills not by causing secondary infection, but by causing pulmonary edema. So far, the illness hasn't been as severe outside of Mexico, but we don't know why that is--and until we do, the medical profession is scared to death to take it anything but seriously. Better to be thought fools now than sit idly by and later ridiculed for doing too little too late.


link[gaymwalker.blogspot.com...]



posted on May, 14 2009 @ 03:07 PM
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reply to post by blc4r4
 


relevance?
i always wonder that about your posts.....................................



posted on May, 14 2009 @ 03:32 PM
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Maybe if you had actually been following the thread rather than jumping in to troll it you would know that.


Are you joking? I've been in this thread since the day it was created, and have read a large majority of them. Just because someone had a different viewpoint than you doesn't make them a troll. Just because someone doesn't buy into the whole 'government is trying to kill us' theory, or the media blackout theory, or the 'this is much worse than we can imagine' theory doesn't make them a troll or a disinfo agent. Negative threads? This entire thread is full of doom and gloom. I'm the one trying to be positive.

Would you disagree that many threads are full of people with 'sources' that almost unconditionally are proven to be NOT true? Why would you be surprised that someone would doubt yet another 'my sources say' post. You may indeed have well-placed contacts, and are feeding accurate information. If so, great.

But there is an inordinate amount of fear-mongering as well. I've lost count of the "this is really really bad" comments. Or the "spreading like wildfire" comments. It's spreading no faster than a regular run of the mill flu. Or how near the top of one page, one guy quoted a source that said something along the lines of "It has the possibilty of spreading again in the fall," and on the same page, he made another post, changing it say "a fall pandemic is near guaranteed!" The sheer amount of sensationalist, dramatic, over-the-top posts gets tiresome. And it's not fair to those who do panic easily. I've seen many posts in this thread where people are freaking out, not sure what to do. And it's the other posts that feed this.

How many people have warned "Don't take flu shots no matter what!" This could be not only very bad advice, but possibly deadly advice. You don't think it's right for others to try and put some perspective into things?

I personally think this is a typical flu outbreak (as far as how fast and far it has spread), with the worry being that we have no antivirus for it as yet, so a deadly mutation could be devasting. But experts have claimed this is quite unlikely. Anything is possible, and it's great to be prepared.

But don't call folks trolls because they want to point out overreactions and call out bad advice. Just trying to keep it in perspective here.

With all that said, yes, I've seen some great advice about supplements, health, and safety, stuff that should probably be observed all the time. It's good to see it. But I just made a simple post about how it's not a big a deal as some are making it out to be, and I'm accused of being a troll and 'negative.' oy.



posted on May, 14 2009 @ 03:37 PM
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Originally posted by fleabit

Maybe if you had actually been following the thread rather than jumping in to troll it you would know that.


Are you joking? I've been in this thread since the day it was created, and have read a large majority of them. Just because someone had a different viewpoint than you doesn't make them a troll. Just because someone doesn't buy into the whole 'government is trying to kill us' theory, or the media blackout theory, or the 'this is much worse than we can imagine' theory doesn't make them a troll or a disinfo agent. Negative threads? This entire thread is full of doom and gloom. I'm the one trying to be positive.

Would you disagree that many threads are full of people with 'sources' that almost unconditionally are proven to be NOT true? Why would you be surprised that someone would doubt yet another 'my sources say' post. You may indeed have well-placed contacts, and are feeding accurate information. If so, great.

But there is an inordinate amount of fear-mongering as well. I've lost count of the "this is really really bad" comments. Or the "spreading like wildfire" comments. It's spreading no faster than a regular run of the mill flu. Or how near the top of one page, one guy quoted a source that said something along the lines of "It has the possibilty of spreading again in the fall," and on the same page, he made another post, changing it say "a fall pandemic is near guaranteed!" The sheer amount of sensationalist, dramatic, over-the-top posts gets tiresome. And it's not fair to those who do panic easily. I've seen many posts in this thread where people are freaking out, not sure what to do. And it's the other posts that feed this.

How many people have warned "Don't take flu shots no matter what!" This could be not only very bad advice, but possibly deadly advice. You don't think it's right for others to try and put some perspective into things?

I personally think this is a typical flu outbreak (as far as how fast and far it has spread), with the worry being that we have no antivirus for it as yet, so a deadly mutation could be devasting. But experts have claimed this is quite unlikely. Anything is possible, and it's great to be prepared.

But don't call folks trolls because they want to point out overreactions and call out bad advice. Just trying to keep it in perspective here.

With all that said, yes, I've seen some great advice about supplements, health, and safety, stuff that should probably be observed all the time. It's good to see it. But I just made a simple post about how it's not a big a deal as some are making it out to be, and I'm accused of being a troll and 'negative.' oy.


the WHO has said multiple times H1N1 is spreading significantly faster than seasonal flu and the a CDC have also claimed this. Apart from that fair enough

edit - i linked to an article earlier than calculated that H1N1 cases have increased 25,888% (yes 25 thousand) since 20 days ago.

[edit on 14-5-2009 by jonny2410]



posted on May, 14 2009 @ 03:57 PM
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Aon White Paper Report--Snip of their report regarding business pandemic plans:

Not enough plans have been tested for weak points. Any plan that does not
assess its weak spots is of little worth. Philadelphia is a prime example of this. In
many ways, Philadelphia was one of the better-prepared US cities for the second
wave of the 1918 pandemic. The city knew the wave was about to hit and its
importance as a military centre meant that it had more nurses and doctors at
its disposal than many other cities. Its organisation was also magnificent; having
the ability during the pandemic to set up a special telephone line that people
could ring if they needed medical assistance and cars to transport medical experts
around. However, all of this came to nothing, as the city did not encourage social
distancing, as was demonstrated by allowing a march of some 250,000 people to
promote the purchase of bonds to finance the war – something not uncommon
in other US cities. Another planning gap concerned mortuary capacity. During the first week of October 1918, the city had to deal with 706 deaths (almost 20 times the city
mortuary’s capacity), then 2,635 the next week, and 4,597, 3,021 and 1,203 in
the following weeks. The city did not reach a weekly death total under 100 until
December 1918. practically impossible to avoid transmission of the virus.

Today, it is this lack of appreciation of weak points in so many preparation plans
– mainly spurred by overconfidence or the myths described in this paper - that
is so disconcerting. Some organisations seem to have not only avoided any
test run of their plan but have also dispensed with a thorough analysis of the
interdependency of every part, operation, site and person in the process.

Aon white paper || 2009 || Pandemic influenza H1N1



posted on May, 14 2009 @ 04:03 PM
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reply to post by fleabit
 


So where were you when each of these posts you disagreed with were made? Claiming to be a participant but saving up to attack everyone in general in one big post is not debate or conversation, it's thread-jacking. (Not to mention being a nifty way for you to force everyone to either go back and reprise the entire thread in order to defend themselves or say WTF ever and allow you to misrepresent quite a bit of the thread's content).

You're exaggerating the hell out of posts and taking things out of context. That's why it's kind of important to participate while the discussion is occurring and not just pop in to unload a couple of weeks worth of angst.

We get it. You don't think things are bad at all, the media reporting has been spot on, etc, etc.

It's not your choice what others concern themselves with. No one is fear mongering or trying to scare anyone. If people can't handle knowing the truth the thread is completely optional. That goes for all the people who think there's nothing to discuss.

If you feel so strongly about it then why bother?

I think I speak for the majority here when I say I really, really hope you're right. Unfortunately it doesn't seem to be the case. I've seen the information my associates are passing hit the bulls eye over and over again. In fact, they haven't missed one item so far.

I'm trying to give people the information that may just help save them. The spirit of this discussion group is to watch out for each other and pass on the suggestions our "chosen" officials have decided not to share with us because they care more for preserving the economy, protecting their investments / huge pandemic profits and maintaining their power structure. Let's not even mention that most of them are eugenicists who want something like this to kill as many of us as possible.

We've gone through the ATS "prove your credibility" round a long time ago and come out shining. Anyone who wants to come in and try to start that up again had better be ready to do so at the same high standard we were held to. Playing skeptic and making broad, general statements about what you think is not enough. Back up your assertions and prove to us your position is the correct one. If you can't do that, I for one have no interest in what you have to say. It's a position popular with people all around me who can't be bothered to dig for the truth or ask questions when they see the media playing lazy games with us.

Perhaps you could start by explaining how the number of deaths in Mexico went from hundreds to a dozen overnight? If everything is fine and there's nothing to this you should be able to easily explain that one. So? Do tell, I'm anxious to hear a reasonable explanation. . .

[edit on 14-5-2009 by ecoparity]



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