While watching the president's address to the nation after the Columbia disaster the other day, I was overcome with a deep sense of impending doom. For the first time, I realized that George W. Bush is dangerous in an insane zealot kind of way. Here is a president who quotes Bible scripture, prays, and invokes God each time a camera is pointed at him.

In a nation where separation of church and state was considered to be essential for the formation of a free state, I find the current trend of "political spiritualism" disturbing.

I personally feel that unscrupulous men can use religion as a tool to manipulate the ignorant masses. This has been so for centuries. What better way to justify war than to proclaim God is on our side? To "demonize" the enemy is to lessen their humanity. (Can anyone remember the "Godless Communists" of the cold war?)

For politicians, regular church attendance is mandatory to foster a certain image. Clinton was obviously not a boy scout but he still attended church regularly. As hypocritical as that seems, it is really harmless. Other presidents have been deeply religious but still managed not to turn every public appearance into a national prayer meeting.

This brings me to Mr. Bush. This president is one of two things. A calculating manipulator who is using religion to gain public support for the atrocities he is about to commit, or he actually believes that God is on his side and guiding his actions.

There is nothing more dangerous than a religious zealot in power. Remember that all the bloodiest wars have been fought in the name of religion. Religion has been and is still used to justified atrocities against man that no God would condone. Here is a man who stands draped in the flag of our nation with a Bible in one hand, and a gun in the other.

Such men have been known to cast the world into darkness. Such men have killed millions in the name of God. I fear there is a madman on the loose. And he has weapons of mass destruction. If God is on his side, heaven help us all.

Amen to that brother !!!! Let's these people know the truth

Particle, your concerns shows the EXACT problems with america these days. We have freedom OF religion, not FROM religion.

None of the founding fathers would ever have dreamed people would not go to church at least once, let alone be athiests!

Bush can pray and god this and that all he wants, you may be afraid, but really it's good to maintain an air of dignity for all people, to at least understand that there is a higher power than themselves, which there is, just look at the night sky!

Sincerely,
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[Edited on 5-2-2003 by FreeMason]

"Godless Communists" of the cold war?"

Uhhh I hate to break this to you, but they were "godless" and as soon as the soviet union fell, the first thing they did was tear down statues, then build churches.

Sincerely,
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Oh hes a real big threat?

very sad post.

What your scared because he believes (evil) shuld be erased?

Would you rather have an evil communist with no respect for humans or god himself run the country so
we can have an even more rising abortion rate?

Or how about an evil dictator like hitler who killed at will by listening to
the theology of satan?

The minute someone with a belief in god is president we want to hate him because he promotes
morality and loving care for our nieghbors?

Just because athiest have a lifestyle of lust and hate towards the creator whom they ignorantly disbelieve?


let me guess, you wouldnt mind if a murderer was president as long as he was an athiest?


You lack the basic understanding of christ teachings which is (love) the enemies and neighbors.

so how living by these can the world be bad??

It cannot.

sadly enough the whole world does not live by these commands which come from the creator.


answer me this?

is an evil athiest better than a loving christian?


peace.

FM, my friend, you are a strange freemason.Except you, I never saw a freemason who was pro-Church.

But I understand what you mean in your post. That's right, we need to know that we have someone who's really far above our heads and who's seeing everything. ( The All Seeing Eye ? )

I'm not going to comment on the general subject (yet), but I do have a question for the Christians in this thread.

GWB honestly believes his actions in Iraq are hastening the eventual end-timers Armageddon in which he and his fundamentalist buddies (Falwell) believe. During a 60 Minutes interview, Falwell was proud of the fact that he advises the president weekly on this very subject (later confirmed in a Washington Post question of Bush). Do you believe it is a good thing that our president is working to duplicate the end-time events of one religion?

I think the very fact that Falwell advises Bush is a problem. If a president has a religon advisor, he should have one for every Religion, not just ultra right-wing baptist evangelists.

Bush is a threat to this nation's already fractured freedom. A separation of church and state is necessary for a true democracy. A true democracy gives a representation of all peoples and in this country a government with christian-right connections cannot represent the people who follow allah, or yaweh or buddha or brahmah, or any of another thousand gods and/or powers, including lucifer. This is a democracy and every person, satan worshiper or not should have the right to vote. I do not condone devil-worshipping, and do not agree with it, but I also do not agree with the christian-right's views either. No matter, they should have equal opportunity to vote and participate in the government.

They however, if in a govenmental position of power should do what is best for the people, not for him or his beliefs. Is a war on Iraq best for America? It is good for Big Oil companies, like those related to Bush, Cheney, or a multitude of other government officials. But why do we, as citizens need oil? We have other, viable ways to power our cars, but they aren't being used because of Big Oil's hold on the government. Does anyone really believe that the government has any care for the citizen anymore, and really wants to help us?

We are degenerating into Ancient Rome, with corrupt emperors benefiting themselves, as the empire went to heck in a handbasket. "The peasants are hungry? Let's go conquer Gaul! they always like triumphs." Are we really going to stand for this? America is fat, complacent and ignorant as a whole, and easily decieved on top of that. We need to be rallied, stirred, and not in a way that involves going out and conquering some little, insignificant dictatorship somewhere.

We need to educate ourselves, open our eyes to the injustices being done to ourselves. Most Americans, have little schooling and awareness of the world and are happy to believe the government and go to wal-mart, and be happy, not wondering why or how they have these amenities. I don't think they realise that the rest of the world sees americans as fat ignorant people, and I dont think they care either. They don't think about what is going to happen tomorrow and if they will be able to wake up to starbucks and dunkin' donuts tomorrow.

They think that Germany is still Nazi, Britan is run by a king and other brits are pesants like those in Monty Python's The Holy Grail. They think that Taco bell is Mexico and south america, Spain is in south america, Italy is pizza, Africa is mostly cavemen in huts, Russia is communist, They didn't know that the middle east existed outsde of aladdin until 9/11. Japan still has the same government that bombed pearl harbor, China is one big factory, and canadians are all mooses and mounties. Is this the country we want as the worlds only super power? A country run by corrupt old men that lie to the populace? We need to rise up, educate our neighbors and stretch, and act like a role model for the rest of the world.

To make a point, are we just going to let a cabal of corrupt old men run our lives and ruin the world, go to war with anyone that suits them, when we have more pressing events at home to deal with.

XAOS

p.s. Sorry about the off tangent rant. this is about the fourth time this week i am apologizing for ranting but I am just so frustrated by the state of modern affairs I am nauseous.

[Edited on 5-2-2003 by xaos]

HEY! Canuck land isn't all mooses and mounties. You forgot the beaver and hockey!

George should be shot, get it over with and end America's suffering. Todays government is like the one in 1875-1900 where railroads were allowed to do what they wanted for most of the government had their hands in the pot. Today it is a oil pot, but same difference. Back then train company wanted this, they got it, they didn't want it, it didn't happen. Today oil companies want it, they get it, they don't, it doesn't happen. Next time we get a president, make sure his brother won't throw out or "lose" votes for the competitior or go "oops, they voted for Gore, they must not be able to understand these ballots, recount!" and that his buddies are rich big business men who will corrupt him.(of course, he already was, but now he is even more)

And other ways to power cars? Like the ones I heard about from Toronto running on hemp fuel? The cars were made from hemp, the officers clothes were made from hemp, even the handcuffs were made from hemp!!!!!(no, not pot, hemp, which should be legal, not pot! you stupid druggies!)

Originally posted by James the Lesser
George should be shot, get it over with and end America's suffering.

...Not just George...The entire Federal Government needs *serious* downsizing...

...Acceptable methods of accomplishing this task should be carried out in the "democratic way by majority vote"...

I'm sure the Secret Service would like to know a couple goons on this board want to kill off the President, especially a former military person.

i got this email from a friend in november



M ax Lucado on President Bush

Max Lucado is a Christian author who is very popular for his many wonderful books about the Lord. This week, Max was invited (along with several other famous preachers) to have lunch at the White House with President Bush. Their meeting took place on Thursday and Max shared with us this morning how it had gone. As the ministers sat down to lunch and waited for President Bush to appear, Max said that he was expecting G.W. to walk in the room looking tired, serious, and depressed. When the President came in, Max said he looked totally opposite of tired: he was energetic, joyful, and very focused on his talk with the ministers. Max asked President Bush how he could seem so calm and peaceful in the midst of all the tragedy. The President's reply was,


"I'm feeling stronger now than I've ever been in my life. And the reason is because every person in America is praying for me. When I stay on my knees, that's when I have power." The ministers then asked the President how he would like them to pray for him, and how their congregations back home should be praying. Mr. Bush asked, first, for clarity of mind so that he could make wise decisions, and then he asked that we pray specifically for his wife and two daughters, as he is very concerned about their safety.

I knew that you would be as encouraged as I was to hear about this meeting.

We must thank God that we have a President who loves and fears the Lord. No human leader is perfect, but God is perfect, so let's keep President Bush lifted up in prayer before the Father.

Originally posted by William
Do you believe it is a good thing that our president is working to duplicate the end-time events of one religion?

So you want him to duplicate the end time events of the Muslim, and Hindu relgions as well?

Look at it this way, if it comes to pass because its MEANT to come to pass, then it will come at the correct time - predestination(?) - so nothing Bush does can ADVANCE it.

If it is not meant to come to pass then there are other forces God can use in the world to prevent it from happening if he wishes.... mind you he may not.

I think the coming war is a sociological conflict just as much as a religious one, it carries the religious clothes but like wars in all history its fueled by politics.

NC, I think he meant that he shouldn't be creating end times period.

Besides, we shouldn't have a president so into religon, just one religon. If he had a minister, a rabbi, a High Priestess, a whatever for other religons and prayed, that would be good. But if he just has all ministers and rapists for a prayer, it can't be good. Might be why none of the rapists are in jail. May be why most of them still work as preists. He is afraid of being condemed to hell if he does anything.

Of course, where is hell? It isn't in the earth like bible and the church wants you to beleive. And where is heaven? it isn't in the sky like bible and church tries to make you believe it is.(Babylonian Tower knocked down for trying to build to heaven, but heaven isn't in sky, so doesn't make sense to knock it down)

Originally posted by MT69
I'm sure the Secret Service would like to know a couple goons on this board want to kill off the President, especially a former military person.

Where did I say that he should be *shot*? I said that the entire government should be *downsized* (Perhaps even "shot down from that position", if you really want to get *interpretive* of what I actually wrote)...The *method* of downsizing should be left up to the Democratic method.
It's obviously apparent that you only read part of what someone writes & assume the rest...And there's quite a few people who know what it means when you "assume" too much...

Here's a point about Bush in Office that disturbs me; Since he seems intent on bringing on the Apocolypse & has gotten Congress to fund a war for at least 10 years (when the Constitution & the Amendments only allow for a total of *8 years in Office*), what do you think he may have planned to try making the changes neccesary to become the first "President for Life"? Bush has already been seen to disregard the very Constitution that he's *sworn to uphold*!

One notable example in history of someone actually *accomplishing* that task was Hitler...And history also notes him as being the one person who came the *closest* to actually bringing on an Apocalypse. But with modern military technology, Bush could come much closer...


[Edited on 7-2-2003 by MidnightDStroyer]

Let's see...you quote James the Lesser who said "George should be shot....," then you said "Not only George..."

Yeah, nice try at covering your tracks. ANY PUBLIC THREAT AGAINST THE PRESIDENT IS A CRIME, no matter if you "claim" to be joking.

I'm sure the Secret Service after reviewing your brief military stint would drag you to jail. Timothy McVeigh pops into my mind...

oil god

They both deserve a Pulitzer for what they said.

So much for freedom of speech....

thank you illmatic. but mine was just a rant, particle needs a pulitzer though.

XAOS

[Edited on 7-2-2003 by xaos]