We know nothing - Expanding the mind with philosophy

I’m sorry if the spelling and grammar in this post is in a “txt chat” format. I was writing this when talking to a friend using online instant chat (I wont name the software as I don’t know if I’m allowed, probably am but you know the one anyway) and thought it would make a good thread. This friend is fairly closed-minded and I was trying to explain to him why I like philosophy and why he shouldn’t call me a crackpot for saying some of the things I do…I was just trying to expand his mind a little

The more I think and ponder things, and the more I come to know, the more I realize how much I don't know...and how complex reality really is...a rock isn't just a rock...what we see isn't all there is...what our conscious mind tells us lacks most of what the subconscious mind knows.

Scientists do say it's very possible that we are just an Alien computer simulation...a hologram in a way...really...just think...really think...how much do u know about reality...how long have u been here...how long has anything existed anywhere and what existed before that...what the hell do we really know about anything at all...we are a bunch a organisms JUST starting to develop yet we think what we see is what we get...reality is reality...if u aren’t with it u need a slap back into reality coz your a crackpot...

We think everything is so simple and easy and we just know it all...a rock is just a rock after all....or is it....the same principle goes for being an alien ant farm...we really have no idea at all about anything...reality isn't all dandy and easy to understand...straight forward...what is at the edge of the universe...what is beyond that...what was before the big bang...did time just start...but what was before that…is the universe eternal or infinite…what is time…what is anything? When you ponder these philosophical questions...you begin to see we really know nothing and we have no idea how things really work...we are only looking at the surface of reality with what sensory intake equipment mother nature gave us....an illusion essentially...we get only what we need to keep things simple and easy to understand, letting us survive most effectively, but hiding the true nature of reality...and we accept it as all we get because it's so simple for our primitive brains to understand...a rock is just a rock...and it makes sense...it's just made of some matter...it just sits there...lifeless...on this planet...in the galaxy...in this one and only universe...and everything started at the big bang...because it's a neat and easy to understand format isn't it?

I claim we are but an Alien ant farm...or but an advanced Alien computer simulation..computerized reality...or I claim we are but the dream of a much more complex being…or that I am part of, and have more intelligent beings living inside of me...and you call me a crackpot? What do you really know? What does the human race know about reality...what do we really know about anything? We just figured out we are actually 99.99999% empty space and the matter that makes us up is popping in and out of existence and can also be directly modified in extreme ways simply by observing it and that there is no such things as particles..but merely vibrating energy...it's called modern physics...and it's the beginning of us understanding that we really know nothing...and a lot of what we know is very wrong in some aspects...we can't handle that at this stage...but we will...eventually…

"A human being is a part of the whole called by us universe, a part limited in time and space. He experiences himself, his thoughts and feeling as something separated from the rest, a kind of optical delusion of his consciousness. This delusion is a kind of prison for us, restricting us to our personal desires and to affection for a few persons nearest to us. Our task must be to free ourselves from this prison by widening our circle of compassion to embrace all living creatures and the whole of nature in its beauty.”

- Albert Einstein

Cognito ergo sum - I think therefore I am. Rene Descartes

EDIT: I will be back in after a sleep, looking forward to replies

[edit on 16/4/09 by CHA0S]

If we are generated by an alien computer program, we probably would be programmed to not question our existence.
So are we, the ones asking questions, made by alien hackers to corrupt the system?



EDIT: I will post a more usefull reply when my brain is rested



[edit on 16/4/09 by locster]

Here's a nice line for you

"And the end and the begining of my knowing, and all of my knowing that there was, was this -- that man knoweth not." -Lord Dunsany

From the Gods of Pegana, great read. A work of pure genius.

I have thought this before.

The saying goes..."Robots will take over the world one day" - if we program them to be "smarter" than us - even if they do not have a squishy brain.

But...if we ARE just a developed program...then where did the developers come from?

I do not throw away all of these philosophical ideas in the trash, as I think any of them are "possible" to some extent...but my favorite is this.

Think of life as a circle. If you were told to run around that circle until you reach the end - will you ever?

Logic is the process of applying reason to everything...something that has become fundamental of the human species. But what if every answer can be found by logic - except the "ultimate" question (what is life, etc)? Maybe the answer to life does not make sense...and that is why we have not found out what it truly is yet.

Then again..."it is the journey that counts". Maybe our will as a species will crumble when we find out what life is? Maybe that is why we are never supposed to find out what it is?

When you have nothing to live for, you no longer live. The answer to life is perfection - something all humans want but will never get. For once we achieve perfection, we are complete, done.

I am just trying to toss some ideas out there to think about...

Yea I think if were were told everything, life, emotions, etc might not be as exciting to us?

Ever played a new game and was excited about it until you either beat it, or cheated at it then it wasn't fun any longer and you became bored?

[edit on 16-4-2009 by SeeingBlue]

reply to post by SeeingBlue


Good point.
And i don't think this game has a lot of replay value.
I always get a new game when i've beaten the previous one, so maybe this IS a new game for me, or i failed to find healthpacks in time.
I do like finding glitches, synchronicity anyone?

[edit on 16/4/09 by locster]

Yeah - another way of saying it too, just from a gamers perspective

We want to know everything...because it is the curiosity. But once we find out, it really isn't all that special.

Like symmetricAvenger likes to say. It's all about "WHY" You can't think about the answer. You just have to understand the question.

Originally posted by locster
If we are generated by an alien computer program, we probably would be programmed to not question our existence.
So are we, the ones asking questions, made by alien hackers to corrupt the system?

What if we were artificial intelligence? Like the "bots" in our games...but much smarter...so smart infact...we think for ourselves and are aware of our own existence...and what if there were "players" (ie Aliens) running about this simulation playing the game...or what if we are the players...we link our brains up to the "system"...and the game begins...we are born and start fresh with no memory...it's all part of the game...it's the ultimate virtual reality...we might not even be human outside of this game...wow...this would make one hell of a movie (I claim this story as my intellectual property)...lol...

[edit on 17/4/09 by CHA0S]

reply to post by locster


Or we were programmed to question, which is a distinct possibility. Perhaps questioning is intregal to the program. But I find it rather funny to dismiss something saying that something should only do this otherwise it isn't true.

There still remains the possibility of hackers though...maybe they work from the inside...or the outside...it's all very similar to the matrix but we aren't born into a prison reality, rather it's a game we can enter whenever we please...so what could be the goal of these hackers? What would be the goal of us players? And if we are living in a VR right now...what happens when we create VR...virtual reality within a virtual reality...haha...that could be like the big twist at the end of the movie...when we die we exit this VR...but it turns out that what we thought was the "real" world is actually just another VR...Ooooo...

EDIT: When you hurt your self in some way...your nerves send an electrical signal to your brain...your brain makes you "feel" pain...they could send fake signals to the brain to make u feel anything without actually harming you...like a dream...I've felt, smelt, heard, seen, and tasted things with extreme detail and life-likeness...I have dreams so vivid there is no difference between this reality and the dream...Dreams are VR really...our brain is our own little virtual reality generator...

[edit on 17/4/09 by CHA0S]

reply to post by Mr Headshot

Loved the quote...I will have to get hold of that book it sounds very interesting. Dang word limit...

I find all of this interesting. My own ideas on reality are:

1. That we all could be one "eternal" being that lives as each creature in the universe one after another living in it's own time space. Since forever is such a long time this would be one way of passing the "time".

2. Another variant is the whole Battlestar Galactica type reality where everything has happened already and will happen again either the same or slightly different.

3. Add inanimate objects, atoms, particals ext. for even more variety.

reply to post by CHA0S


Now that would really be next-gen gaming! I think this is very much like a virtual reality, our brains make up this reality by external stimuli.
I think it's safe to say your green could be my red, it's all about interpetation.
But when we realize all this is virtual reality, do we have enough code in our program to change it? Since awnsers are very much like missing scripts.

reply to post by Watcher-In-The-Shadows


Interesting possibility. We could be little programs running around one super computer to figure out the great questions for the programmer.
Great analogy in my humble opinion.



EDIT: i think we should write movies

[edit on 17/4/09 by locster]

reply to post by CHA0S


We must have some very similar thoughts going on or we're on to something

A previous post of mine

Originally posted by whoswatchinwho
I'm sorry to burst your bubble, but we a re not part of a galactiv TV show..

We are in fact a fully interactve MMORPG, we are played by a highly advanced race who became so enlightend that they no longer needed to work, they had reached the pinnacle of evolutionary learning, so the only thing left was to take gaming to the ultimate level..

De'javu is someone making a blunder and trying again..

U.F.O.s are remote cameras coming in for a closer look..

Ghosts are glitches in the system, your seeing past players..

The game itself is not so popular anymore, for those of you whose life seems to be a repitition of work, home, pup on a friday, annual holiday ect, , well I'm afraid to tell you that your controller got bored and left a long time ago... you're now in a loop....Sorry...

How do I know all this? well I dont really...or do I...dont ask me...hell I'm just a glitch what do I really know



[edit on 9/4/2009 by whoswatchinwho]

I think some how we are shielded from the truth. I read somewhere, that bill clinton said once that not one soul in this world knows what is going on. I wonder what he meant by that?

I too believe we are just in a computer game, but that does not mean we cannot question that fact.

We are shielded from the truth, maybe by others, probably by ourselves. Fear.
I we were totally oblivious to it we wouldn't ask these questions. I think deep down everybody knows but are protected by their sub-conscious.

I really feel the need to get in touch with the one that is holding my controller.
The real me, pushing the buttons.

Originally posted by locster
We are shielded from the truth, maybe by others, probably by ourselves. Fear.
I we were totally oblivious to it we wouldn't ask these questions. I think deep down everybody knows but are protected by their sub-conscious.

I really feel the need to get in touch with the one that is holding my controller.
The real me, pushing the buttons.

I feel the EXACT same way...deep down...right in the back of my mind...I know the truth...I know the answer to every concieveable question...I think this is essentially what Avenger meant by trying to understand the question...but who knows...yes...I have always felt "out of touch" with the real me...who "I" really am...

EDIT: It's ashame that you just posted as I'm going to sleep...well...to get me some virtual reality generated by the subconscious...lol...read this thread I've recently been participating in...

Dreams: Who am I when I dream?

Another edit: I see you first posted a while back! Dang! Oh well...you just went off line...

[edit on 17/4/09 by CHA0S]

reply to post by whoswatchinwho

Originally posted by whoswatchinwho
I'm sorry to burst your bubble, but we a re not part of a galactiv TV show..

We are in fact a fully interactve MMORPG, we are played by a highly advanced race who became so enlightend that they no longer needed to work, they had reached the pinnacle of evolutionary learning, so the only thing left was to take gaming to the ultimate level..

Hahaha...that post was classic

reply to post by locster


I think you mean we are protected by our concious mind. Though there are so many levels who knows.

Its a good question, shame we are blocked from knowing alot of the turths, as maybe we just cannot function, with knowing what possibly would be the truth.

We just know that the nsa or cia, know alot more than us, and they use it to control society.