CNN cover - "Texas governor says secession possible"

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posted on Sep, 23 2009 @ 01:16 PM
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reply to post by Lemon.Fresh
 


Uaoc actually said most of what I've been going on.

All you and Titor are going on about is that if you had to, you could run Texas as itself.

Though, that's impossible.

Do you honestly believe you'll set up a stock market, power grid, school system, health care system, trading system, formalized government, formalized army, (BELIEVE ME, YOU'll BE INVADED), plus a national budget.

Also, you and Titor still refuse to answer how much Texas is given in a day for aid from the federal government to help with the state.

Where will you get the money now?

So, let's see: if 75% of Texas wants the state to stay, and there's approximately about 24.3 million people within the state, that means that about 18.2 million people are opting for them to stay, and if they won't, I would make a good guess that they'll leave.

So, Titor and Lemon, you two seem to be friends of democracy. In a democracy, the majority is chosen.

The majority of Texas doesn't want secession.

Remember the people, you guys...




posted on Sep, 23 2009 @ 01:24 PM
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reply to post by Mak Manto
 


Yes, Texas has the resources to run all the things you mention internally.

Do you believe that Jamiaca, and Haiti can do it with their limited resources, but Texas could not?

Of course there would be growing pains, and a transition period, and not all states in the US have all the resources they need, but TX certainly does.

When the USSR fell apart, my friends in Armenia did not have power, or water. One day a week they would get some water to their communities, and one day every several weeks they would get power! They survived, and built the infrastructure they needed, and things improved slowly!

TX would be able to do the same thing in a vastly accelerated amount of time, especially if they took OK, and AR, and LA with them!!



posted on Sep, 23 2009 @ 01:27 PM
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Originally posted by getreadyalready
reply to post by Mak Manto
 


Yes, Texas has the resources to run all the things you mention internally.

Do you believe that Jamiaca, and Haiti can do it with their limited resources, but Texas could not?

Of course there would be growing pains, and a transition period, and not all states in the US have all the resources they need, but TX certainly does.

When the USSR fell apart, my friends in Armenia did not have power, or water. One day a week they would get some water to their communities, and one day every several weeks they would get power! They survived, and built the infrastructure they needed, and things improved slowly!

TX would be able to do the same thing in a vastly accelerated amount of time, especially if they took OK, and AR, and LA with them!!


They wouldn't go.

You still didn't answer my question...

Do you think that if they seceded, they could have all of that set up at the end of the year?

Hell, at the end of 2011?

Texas would burn, and I sincerely hope to God that Perry is just doing this for votes.

Pretty much, the [snip] probably is.



Mod Edit - Mod Edit: Profanity/Circumvention Of Censors – Please Review This Link.


[edit on 23-9-2009 by elevatedone]



posted on Sep, 23 2009 @ 01:35 PM
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reply to post by Mak Manto
 


Ahhhh your just spreading doom and gloom for the sake of it....

I am not sure you have even been paying attention to the words we are writing.

Again

Texas has its own power grid. We supply ourselves electricity and sell the excess.

And here is your FED answer. We give more to the Fed than what we receive.

And I am a proponent of democracy... I break from the crowd in that sense I suppose... But I also support fair elections and real polls..

When the statement is made that 31% want to leave and 75% want to stay ... Forgive me for assuming we all had basic math skills here and the the total 106% is not only a lousy margin of error but it kinda makes me doubt the poll as I doubt all polls because a Poll is not a hard thing to manipulate.

Anyways you make a VERY BOLD claim when you claim to know what Texans want... At least Hunka can say he has lived in the state.

You Mak have even less of a clue what Texas is like .... So I guess you do not like wiki links either.

[edit on 23-9-2009 by titorite]



posted on Sep, 23 2009 @ 01:36 PM
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I was more of an expert on my american history and american goverment oh say ten years ago now. Since then I have drifted more into an interest for world history and goverment. So if I am wrong please excuse me, I have been out of the game for awhile.

I was under the empression that Texas was the only state in the US that still had the power to succeed from the nation? The reason being the deal they signed with the US when becoming a state clearly state that they could go back to being a soveriegn nation if they choose to.

Even after the civil war when all other states where put under mandate that they couldn't succeed. Texas's former contract was still honored by the US. Making them the essentially the only state in the union with the power to succeed. With maybe the exception of Hawii due to how they became part of the united states (the country of Hawii was basically given to the US by one of there kings so the people didn't have a choice in the matter).

Then again Texas signed onto America for protection from Mexico if I remember correctly. If Texas succeeded I don't think there would be a fight america would let them go putting massive trade embargo's on them (much like we have on cuba now). We would pull out are troops leaving them to fend for themselves other then humanitarian aid if they needed it.

Now I'm not saying texas can't or wouldn't be able to make it on it's own but it would have ruff start right out the gate. No trade with the US, No allience with the US. It would have to form it's own Malitia pretty quick. On top of that form new trade routes that don't infringe on american territories. Though texas wouldn't have to worry about war because Mexico would more then likely be to afraid to invade do to the fact that Texas could just as easily make a new friendship with the US as the one it left behind (although this time the contract would surely intail that they could not succeed again.).

Basically I see it as a novel Idea but that's all it is, an Idea that will never see the light of day. Simply even if Texas is able to stand alone it will have a social and economical struggle right out the gate. I say econimical simply because of the possible embargo's from the US and the fact that Texas will have nothing to back the money (witch was one of the hardships of the confederacy). No one wants to deal with a country that has nothing to back up the cash flow. They could use there oil to back it up. That will only last so long because before you know it much like the mid eastern countries eventually those oil wells will dry up at best Texas might have a good ten or twenty years before they got nothing left.

[edit on 23-9-2009 by OWoutcast]


[edit on 23-9-2009 by OWoutcast]



posted on Sep, 23 2009 @ 01:37 PM
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reply to post by getreadyalready
 


LMAO


Do you believe that Jamiaca, and Haiti can do it with their limited resources, but Texas could not?


Too Funny bro- Haiti is the poorest nation in the western hemisphere, and Ive been there, so if thet's what you WANT for Texas, I would say that you have a death wish. It's a hard place my friend.

Also, Jamaica was a British protectorate until, I don't know, the 1970's maybe..... Sure, there's your target empire of Texas... LMAO

Assuming that you issue currency based on these "Resources" that you refuse to identify specifically, as I said earlier, can you even comprehend the ramifications of a US Embargo..? Nobody will be able to do business with your imaginary Nation.

Not to mention that many of the industries currently operating in Texas, aren't Texan. They shut down, just like 98% of the rest of your economy.

Then there's the standard of living that everyone's use to, Kiss it goodbye my friend, and get yourself prepared for a tribal village standard of living.

Pharma companies won't ship to Texas, so I suppose you will refine the compounds and make the pills yerself huh...?

Just in infrastructure alone, I agree with you on one thing..... It will be just like Haiti.

Now THERE'S something to strive for.

Get real man.



posted on Sep, 23 2009 @ 01:38 PM
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reply to post by Mak Manto
 


No, they wouldn't have it set up by the end of the year, or even 2011. Look at Iraq, it still isn't set up!

But, they already have all the state departments. Education, Energy, Law Enforcement, Health, Emergency Ops, etc.

I know here in Florida, that we like the Fed Money, but without it, we would still function. We have continuity of government/operation plans, we have emergency operation plans.

The Federal Government only provides oversight and money, all the infrastructure is within the state. So, if the Fed went away tomorrow, the teachers would show up and teach, the nurses would show up and nurse, the electric companies would show up and restructure grids, and provide electricity!

So, yes to growing pains, and yes to some burning, looting, rioting, etc. But, rather quickly, things would take shape and people would support one another, and life would go on! Laws and governments are only technicalities. Life is lived on the street, person to person!



posted on Sep, 23 2009 @ 01:45 PM
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reply to post by uaocteaou
 


I think you are helping my point. Yes Haiti and Jamaica are poor and rough places. I have visited them plenty as well. But, they are surviving! And, they are doing it with a small fraction of the resources Texas has!

TX has water, power, oil, arable land, cattle, industry, coastline, natural borders, a hardy populace, and a pretty good state government!

Many of the pharmaceuticals are already made in TX, but if they need to buy some, I am pretty sure they won't have a problem selling Oil, Beef, Electronics, and Gasoline in order to buy some Pharms!

People would certainly trade with them, and I doubt if the borders would be sealed off. People would still travel, and with our current state of affairs, TX would not stand alone for long! OK, AR, KS, MO, AZ, NM, LA, MS, GA, FL, TN, and Kentucky would probably follow along, New Hampshire, Utah, Nebraska, and the Dakotas are liable to join if it looks successful! Then, what does Michigan have to lose, the Fed already sold them out to China! So they join! Virginia and the Carolinas follow! The entire Great Lake region may see a rising Republic against a failing Pseudo-Democracy, and they would likely join!

What we are talking about is a coup! I don't think TX would have to fight to secede. All they have to do is declare it, and let the dominoes fall where they may!



posted on Sep, 23 2009 @ 01:57 PM
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Originally posted by titorite
reply to post by whaaa
 


Well Then maybe we should go with Hunka polls because his poll showed the number of Texans for secession at over 30%...





PLEASE LEARN TO READ.... it said 31% of Texans claim right to secede, yet 75% opt to stay part of the Union

It's exactly in line with whaa's numbers.

[edit on 23-9-2009 by HunkaHunka]



posted on Sep, 23 2009 @ 02:01 PM
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Originally posted by titorite
reply to post by Mak Manto
 


Ahhhh your just spreading doom and gloom for the sake of it....

I am not sure you have even been paying attention to the words we are writing.

Again

Texas has its own power grid. We supply ourselves electricity and sell the excess.

And here is your FED answer. We give more to the Fed than what we receive.

And I am a proponent of democracy... I break from the crowd in that sense I suppose... But I also support fair elections and real polls..

When the statement is made that 31% want to leave and 75% want to stay ... Forgive me for assuming we all had basic math skills here and the the total 106% is not only a lousy margin of error but it kinda makes me doubt the poll as I doubt all polls because a Poll is not a hard thing to manipulate.

Anyways you make a VERY BOLD claim when you claim to know what Texans want... At least Hunka can say he has lived in the state.

You Mak have even less of a clue what Texas is like .... So I guess you do not like wiki links either.

[edit on 23-9-2009 by titorite]

Actually, your math does suck..

The 31% was to a previous poll if people wanted to secede from Texas.

The 75% was a new poll.

75% want to stay.
18% want to secede.
7% are not sure.



posted on Sep, 23 2009 @ 02:03 PM
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reply to post by HunkaHunka
 


PLEASE TAKE YOUR OWN ADVICE!

in the quote box you have me quoted saying above 30%...

31%>30%

DUH?

It was entirely accurate to state that your poll offered a margin of over 30%.

Take your own advice. learn to read...basic math skills wouldn't hurt ya none either.

reply to post by Mak Manto
 


31% of Texans claim right to secede, yet 75% opt to stay part of the Union

Same thing goes for you too Mak Manto.

Look you two are just out for blood now.... Your whipped up over some nothing story over an idea of something that has not come to pass...

Your determined to be right over something that is theoretical...

My advice to you both...

Turn of your computers and go see whats going on outside.

You two are getting way to emotionally attached to this idea of Texas DYING if they leave the union...Your trying to save a swimmer that isn't drowning.

News Flash... Just like Alex Jones the secession of Texas has not happened ....YET.




[edit on 23-9-2009 by titorite]



posted on Sep, 23 2009 @ 02:10 PM
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Yeah... I'm definitely out for blood.

The cartels want into Texas, and I want Texas to stay apart of the Union so that the people of Texas will not be harmed by Perry's ignorant thinking.

Yeah, jeez! Wooh! How horrible of me! Thinking of the people! Shame on Mak!



posted on Sep, 23 2009 @ 02:20 PM
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Originally posted by titorite
reply to post by HunkaHunka
 


PLEASE TAKE YOUR OWN ADVICE!

in the quote box you have me quoted saying above 30%...

31%>30%

DUH?

It was entirely accurate to state that your poll offered a margin of over 30%.

Take your own advice. learn to read...basic math skills wouldn't hurt ya none either.



You are still missing the point! The poll stated that only 30% CLAIM THE RIGHT... not that 30% want to Secede...

Geesh..



posted on Sep, 23 2009 @ 04:45 PM
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This is so amazing to me to read, all of the misinformed YANKEES on here first of all, Second of all do you not realize that TEXANS make up 1/4 of the U.S. armed forces. That is Army, navy, and Marine Corps Mainly the Marine Corps and Army. Texans went down over to new Mexico a while back and the U.S. eventually said they didn't haev the right to shoot anyone coming across the border. Well Well wouldnt all of that change whenever we suceed. The thing is not whether or not we can suceed it is when are we going to do it. Californians are moving away from Cali to Texas and some weak Texans are moving towards the north. Texas will not be conquered and if we are conquered there will be a battle cry remembered in History such as "REMEMBER THE ALAMO" except this time, there will not be a National Monument built behind it because as soon as texas falls the U.S. will be soon there after with ther Socialistic Views and lets make peace with the world Dictatorship that it has currently. Our president going around the world Apolgizing to the very people that we helped out in WW II and every conflict since them. SICKENING.

He can bow down for all of you or anyone who wants him to LEAD THEM. But as for me and my fellow texans we don't bow down before ANYONE.



posted on Sep, 23 2009 @ 04:48 PM
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Originally posted by ho chi minh

Oh man,you people,already talking of civil war and mindless killing
Was'nt one civil war enough...
To you gun toting texans chill out and relax in less than 4 years there is every chance
that there will be a white man back in the oval office
hey who knows maybe jeb bush could save you...


It's not about a color but you up north would never understand that Every since Abraham Lincoln ... Heck, COLIN POWELL would have been a great president. He is not white is he !?!? Sorry if I don't recognize color to well.



posted on Sep, 23 2009 @ 05:40 PM
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. . .

Do you honestly believe you'll set up a stock market,


Yes


power grid,


Already set up


school system,


Already set up


health care system,


Already set up


trading system,


Already set up as Texas has the 10th biggest economy in the world


formalized government,


Already set up, and it does better than the federal government, and most states, for that matter


formalized army, (BELIEVE ME, YOU'll BE INVADED),


Already set up


plus a national budget.


Once again . . . 10th largest economy . . . it is already set up.


Also, you and Titor still refuse to answer how much Texas is given in a day for aid from the federal government to help with the state.

Where will you get the money now?


Texas pays more to the federal government than they receive.


So, let's see: if 75% of Texas wants the state to stay, and there's approximately about 24.3 million people within the state, that means that about 18.2 million people are opting for them to stay, and if they won't, I would make a good guess that they'll leave.

So, Titor and Lemon, you two seem to be friends of democracy. In a democracy, the majority is chosen.

The majority of Texas doesn't want secession.

Remember the people, you guys...


The majority of Americans did not want a revolution. They did not go anywhere.



What else you got?



posted on Sep, 23 2009 @ 05:53 PM
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reply to post by getreadyalready
 


Yes. Memarf is a learned man, and well spoken. I appreciate his initiative to see what the Historian would say, and I would expect him to say exactly that.

Doesn't make this Historian right.

This is supposed to be a nation of law. How many times have we heard that? The Constitution set forth certain procedures and rules that Congress was to abide by.

They didn't. They circumvented the rules and the law.

Now if you violate the Constitution in order to ram in NEW laws, does this not make them UNCONSTITUTIONAL?

For an amendment to be ratified, each state has to ratify said amendment WORD FOR WORD. This has not been done since 1861 on many amendments. You check, and the states reworded what they ratified.

That makes the ratifications null and void.

Legally. Constitutionally.

Just like Ohio NOT a state until 1931, and that nullifies their votes on everything between 1861 and 1931 - which would invalidate a number of amendments all by itself.

This stuff drives me nuts. One of my college professors exposed me to this many years ago, and I though he was FOS.

Come to find out, I was the ignorant one.

Surprise there, huh?



posted on Sep, 23 2009 @ 07:45 PM
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reply to post by Lemon.Fresh
 


Sorry Lemon, but every thing I stated was provided by the Departments of Energy, Education, State, Treasury, Commerce, Labor, Agriculture, Health and Human Services, plus the National Guard and the Coast Guard.

You can't steal what the government gives you.

Also, be reminded, do you think doctors, teachers, scientists, firemen, policemen, and many others are going to stay if you don't have a national budget?

And don't bring up the tenth largest economy. That's only because you're part of the US.

And as I said up above, which is provided by facts, 75% of Texas has stated they don't want secession.

Call it a quits, you two. The people have spoken.

Texas is not seceding.

Or, you can overpower the people's voice and secede anyway.

So, here is the question, gentlemen:

Do you listen to the majority of Texas and remain apart of the US, or do you secede despite their wishes?



posted on Sep, 23 2009 @ 08:40 PM
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Originally posted by Mak Manto
reply to post by Lemon.Fresh
 


Sorry Lemon, but every thing I stated was provided by the Departments of Energy, Education, State, Treasury, Commerce, Labor, Agriculture, Health and Human Services, plus the National Guard and the Coast Guard.


Wrong.

Fact: Texas has its own power grid. Everything extra is sold to the other states.

Fact: Texas pays it's own teachers without Federal assistance (save for this last year where they gave a one time $800 dollar raise, which in following years is going to be picked up by the state).

Fact: Texas has its own department of health, and have some of the best hospitals in the country.

Fact: Texas has its own Department of labor.

Fact: Texas has it's own standing Army, Guard, and Air Force.

Fact: Texas has its own department of Agriculture.

The slogan is correct: Texas . . . it's like a whole other country




You can't steal what the government gives you.




What exactly has the government given Texans, that Texans' dollars have not payed for?


Also, be reminded, do you think doctors, teachers, scientists, firemen, policemen, and many others are going to stay if you don't have a national budget?


Apparently you are not grasping the concept. All these people are paid by the state already, with almost no federal money involved. Having the 10 biggest economy in the world lets Texas do that kind of thing.



And don't bring up the tenth largest economy. That's only because you're part of the US.


Really? How has the US helped? Texas is the largest exporter of goods. This is from private companies in Texas. What does the government do there to help, besides tax the crap out of the businesses.

I would also like to note here, that the USA would be in a world of hurt with out Texas' financial input.

So whom is helping whom?




[edit on 9/23/2009 by Lemon.Fresh]

[edit on 9/23/2009 by Lemon.Fresh]



posted on Sep, 23 2009 @ 08:51 PM
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Just assume for a moment that Texas announced they were tired of the Federal BS, the overregulation, the burden of Federal taxation, and the loss of freedom from circumventing the Constitution.

They announce a succession date, and it's ratified by the State government.

There may be some people leave Texas. They sure as hell wouldn't be real Texans, so no great loss.

But there would also be a significant influx of people likewise tired of the crap we call the Federal Government.

No one is going to border up Texas! Hell, they can't even border off Mexico.

No one is going to "attack" Texas, or else Texas just may cut off a wealth of pipelines and the stuff flowing through those pipelines.

No.

What would happen is that any number of other states would follow suit, and when the dust had settled, and enough states had also pulled out - they'd likely call a Constitutional Convention - and form a government like was intended by our Founding Fathers.

Not only could Texas survive, but they would THRIVE.

As would the others who pulled the plug.





 
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