Now Pro-Life Advocates are potential terrorists

Originally posted by Blaine91555
Obama is forming the NWO right in front of our faces and we are arguing whether killing babies is OK or not. How sad is that.

But that's what this thread is about. Abortion activists having the potential to kill based on their belief. None of the others on the list that you mentioned have engaged in terrorist activities. There has never been a bombing carried out by hunters in the name of gun rights, or a veteran who shot somebody in the name of veterans rights, etc. Not the case in the group being discussed on this thread. There are many threads about Obama and the NWO, I don't think it's sad to discuss the topic this thread was opened about.

A certain poster in this thread (not going to mention who) only supports the Department of Homeland Security's conclusion.

It seems the far right is more concerned about being soldiers for Jesus instead of disciples.

reply to post by 27jd


The article is about the report which I read and it is about much more than Abortion. I'm discussing the whole article including the cited and linked document. I think that is on topic.

Basically what this is about is the Left VS. the Right. For the first time since Carter the Radical Far Left has control of everything. What better way to eliminate the Right than to convince people the Right is evil through exaggeration and innuendo?

If anyone is implying that all Pro-Life people are violent or potential terrorists the whole concept is insane on its face. The number of related violent incidents is tiny in fact. So whats it doing in a report on possible Terrorist threats? Nobody is being fooled here. It is an attack on the Right, the Left must be terrified of loosing its power at the mid-terms.

At no point does it even mention the Far Left Activists who are in the news worldwide. If it metioned nut cases from both sides it would be acceptable but it does not. It is an obvious hit piece on the the Right in general. It completely ignores the violent protests by the Left and concentrates on a group who is yet to do anything.

I can't wait to see how they spin today's Tea Party's consisting of average peaceful working folks. I have a feeling the next round of Tea Party's might jump to millions of people.

reply to post by Blaine91555


For the last eight years, all domestic terrorism threat analysis have dealt exclusively with left-leaning groups.

This newest analysis was likely intended as an addendum to previous studies due to the fact that left-wing groups have already been exhaustively covered in detail by the last administration.

Originally posted by Blaine91555
The article is about the report which I read and it is about much more than Abortion. I'm discussing the whole article including the cited and linked document. I think that is on topic.

You're right, but there are a few threads on this article, and the other threads are discussing the broader picture of the extreme right. Not saying you were off topic, but this thread is pretty specific about one group.

Basically what this is about is the Left VS. the Right.

It always is. You personally have a pretty hard right lean yourself, and many of the threads I've participated in with you, you almost always slam the left. I'm not on either side personally, but you're right, they do a great job keeping you at each others throats.

If anyone is implying that all Pro-Life people are violent or potential terrorists the whole concept is insane on its face.

Nobody was.

The number of related violent incidents is tiny in fact.

Tiny?

For the sake of space, I'll only list the US here, although Canada and Australia also have a long list...

Incidence

[edit] Incidents in the United States

[edit] Murders
In the U.S., violence directed toward abortion providers has killed at least 7 people, including 3 doctors, 2 clinic employees, a security guard, and a clinic escort.[4]

March 10, 1993: Dr. David Gunn of Pensacola, Florida was fatally shot during a protest. He had been the subject of wanted-style posters distributed by Operation Rescue in the summer of the year before. Michael F. Griffin was found guilty of Dr. Gunn's murder and was sentenced to life in prison.
June 29, 1994: Dr. John Britton and James Barrett, a clinic escort, were both shot to death outside of another facility in Pensacola. Rev. Paul Jennings Hill was charged with the killings, received a death sentence, and was executed September 3, 2003.
December 30, 1994: Two receptionists, Shannon Lowney and Lee Ann Nichols, were killed in two clinic attacks in Brookline, Massachusetts. John Salvi, who prior to his arrest was distributing pamphlets from Human Life International,[5] was arrested and confessed to the killings. He committed suicide in prison and guards found his body under his bed with a plastic garbage bag tied around his head. Salvi had also confessed to a non-lethal attack in Norfolk, Virginia days before the Brookline killings.
January 29, 1998: Robert Sanderson, an off-duty police officer who worked as a security guard at an abortion clinic in Birmingham, Alabama, was killed when his workplace was bombed. Eric Robert Rudolph, who was also responsible for the 1996 Centennial Olympic Park bombing, was charged with the crime and received two life sentences as a result.
October 23, 1998: Dr. Barnett Slepian was shot to death at his home in Amherst, New York. His was the last in a series of similar shootings against providers in Canada and northern New York state which were all likely committed by James Kopp. Kopp was convicted of Dr. Slepian's murder after finally being apprehended in France in 2001.
A fourth doctor, George Patterson, was shot and killed in Mobile, Alabama on August 21, 1993, but it is uncertain whether his death was the direct result of his profession or rather a robbery.[6]


[edit] Attempted murder, assault, and threats
According to statistics gathered by the National Abortion Federation (NAF), an organization of abortion providers, since 1977 in the United States and Canada, there have been 17 attempted murders, 383 death threats, 153 incidents of assault or battery, and 3 kidnappings committed against abortion providers.[7] The attempted murders were:[8][9][4]

August 19, 1993: Dr. George Tiller was shot outside of an abortion facility in Wichita, Kansas. Shelley Shannon was charged with the crime and received an 11-year prison sentence.
June 29, 1994: June Barret was shot in the same attack which claimed the lives of James Barrett, her husband, and Dr. John Britton.
December 30, 1994: Five individuals were wounded in the same-day shootings which killed Shannon Lowney and Lee Ann Nichols.
December 18, 1996: Dr. Calvin Jackson of New Orleans, Louisiana was stabbed 15 times, losing 4 pints of blood. Donald Cooper was charged with second-degree attempted murder and sentenced to 20 years.[10]
October 28, 1997: A physician whose name has not been revealed was shot in his home in Rochester, New York.
January 29, 1998: Emily Lyons, a nurse, was severely injured in the bombing which also killed Robert Sanderson.

[edit] Anthrax threats
The first letters claiming to contain anthrax were mailed to U.S. clinics in October 1998, a few days after the Slepian shooting, and since then, there have been a total of 655 such bioterror threats made against abortion providers. None of the "anthrax" in these cases was real.[11][8]

November 2001: After the genuine 2001 anthrax attacks, Clayton Waagner mailed hoax letters containing a white powder to 554 clinics. Waagner was convicted of 51 charges relating to the anthrax scare on December 3, 2003.

[edit] Arson, bombing, and property crime
According to NAF, since 1977 in the United States and Canada, property crimes committed against abortion providers have included 41 bombings, 173 arsons, 91 attempted bombings or arsons, 619 bomb threats, 1630 incidents of trespassing, 1264 incidents of vandalism, and 100 attacks with butyric acid ("stink bombs").[7] The first clinic arson occurred in Oregon in March 1976 and the first bombing occurred in February 1978 in Ohio.[12] More recent incidents have included:[4]

December 25, 1984: An abortion clinic and two physicians' offices in Pensacola, Florida were bombed in the early morning of Christmas Day by a quartet of young people (Matt Goldsby, Jimmy Simmons, Kathy Simmons, Kaye Wiggins) who later called the bombings "a gift to Jesus on his birthday."[13]
October 1999: Martin Uphoff set fire to a Planned Parenthood clinic in Sioux Falls, South Dakota, causing US$100 worth of damage. He was later sentenced to 60 months in prison.[14]
May 28, 2000: An arson at a clinic in Concord, New Hampshire on resulted in damage estimated at US$20,000. The case remains unsolved.[15]
September 30, 2000: A Catholic priest drove his car into the Northern Illinois Health Clinic after learning that the FDA had approved the drug RU-486. He pulled out an ax before being shot at by a security guard.[16]
June 11, 2001: An unsolved bombing at a clinic in Tacoma, Washington destroyed a wall, resulting in US$6000 in damages. [14]
July 4, 2005: A clinic Palm Beach, Florida was the target of an arson. The case remains open.[14]
December 12, 2005: Patricia Hughes and Jeremy Dunahoe threw a Molotov cocktail at a clinic in Shreveport, Louisiana. The device missed the building and no damage was caused. In August 2006, Hughes was sentenced to six years in prison, and Dunahoe to one year. Hughes claimed the bomb was a “memorial lamp” for an abortion she had had there. [17]
September 13, 2006 David McMenemy of Rochester Hills, Michigan crashed his car into the Edgerton Women's Care Center in Davenport, Iowa. He then doused the lobby in gasoline and then started a fire. McMenemy committed these acts in the belief that the center was performing abortions, however Edgerton is not an abortion clinc.[18]
April 25, 2007: A package left at a women's health clinic in Austin, Texas contained an explosive device capable of inflicting serious injury or death. A bomb squad detonated the device after evacuating the building. Paul Ross Evans (who had a criminal record for armed robbery and theft) was found guilty of the crime. [19]
May 9, 2007: An unidentified person deliberately set fire to a Planned Parenthood clinic in Virginia Beach, Virginia.[20]
December 6, 2007: Chad Altman and Sergio Baca were arrested for the arson of Dr. Curtis Boyd's clinic in Albuquerque. Altman’s girlfriend had scheduled an appointment for an abortion at the clinic. [21]
January 22, 2009 Matthew L. Derosia, 32, who was reported to have had a history of mental illness [22]rammed a SUV into the front entrance of a Planned Parenthood clinic in St. Paul, Minnesota.[23]
en.wikipedia.org...

reply to post by mkultraangel


Well said... Im pro life but I do not see how a pro lifer can kill a Doctor or nurse and call it justified. There are many sick people in this world. They seem to get easily dissuaded into a certain train of thought.

BTW I'm all for gun rights too.. I wonder if I'm on the list?

I'm very disturbed to see replies in this thread that support and advocate violence against abortion clinics. In my opinion that crosses the line and actually makes the argument against the OP.

Originally posted by Jadette
I'm very disturbed to see replies in this thread that support and advocate violence against abortion clinics. In my opinion that crosses the line and actually makes the argument against the OP.

Isn't that advocating illegal activity? Advocating illegal activity is a violation of this site's Terms and Conditions. How very strange how this site picks and chooses what T&C violations it enforces. .

reply to post by Blaine91555


No its not, the OP brought the bible into the issue and I was simply pointing out contradictions in his professed belief system that allow him oppose Abortion yet clearly idolize a man who murdered with some of the flimsiest rationalzations I have seen in some time.

Hatred for Christians? SOme of my best Friends are..... (Sorry i could not resist Lack of tolerance for the manner with which the OP can decry murder yet support in in the same sentance? Yep!

reply to post by HooHaa


Thanks glad to see you made it this far in the thread....I simply stopped posting, because this argument is never going to end....a good debate, I like---but as previous posts have indicated this should be about gov't and not a left vs. right "Me Me ME!!!!", pick me, I'm right!!! (or left)

Do posters realize that there is no "magic moderator" to come along and say, good job! You've proven you're point....this is now fact, officially.

Gee... pro-lifers are known for bombing abortion centers and driving trucks around with mangled babies on them while I'm eating out...

I'd say they are "potential" terrorists.

I mean they call Pro-choice people baby killers... why not call them terrorists?


I really think this whole change of things is great... There has to be some sort of accountability for the conservative rhetoric...



[edit on 15-4-2009 by HunkaHunka]

You guys would all make great Brownshirts for the new regime. Now that there aren't anymore jobs, you can go get one working as a spy or a guard or part of the new Youth Corps.

Maybe you can get a job at Abu Ghraib.

Expand your campaign of death from the babies and take out a bit further to your fellow citizens who don't share your love of death and skull and bones and your high regard and deep respect for people who make their living by killing babies.

While I disagree with the pro-lifers cause, I also have no joy in watching my opponents be told they're "terrorists" for holding a certain point of view.

I fight quite regularly with the right wing pro-lifers.
But I believe their views are just as valid as my own... if they're silenced, in all fairness, what right would I have to my opinion?


I may want you guys to shut up and go away, but I'm not about to agree on forcibly shutting you up or locking you away.

I do find it odd though, that a fascist tactic is being used on the right wing... normally the left wing is targeted by fascism.

Originally posted by johnsky
While I disagree with the pro-lifers cause, I also have no joy in watching my opponents be told they're "terrorists" for holding a certain point of view.

I fight quite regularly with the right wing pro-lifers.
But I believe their views are just as valid as my own... if they're silenced, in all fairness, what right would I have to my opinion?


I may want you guys to shut up and go away, but I'm not about to agree on forcibly shutting you up or locking you away.

I do find it odd though, that a fascist tactic is being used on the right wing... normally the left wing is targeted by fascism.

Tyranny comes from the left and right. The Nazis are more calculating and controlled in their cruelty. The communists just let it fly, just get the blood spilling.

The two-headed eagle of Freemasony is attached to one body, whether the heads turn to the right or to the left. We see pictures of the Freemasons standing with their hands in their shirts -- some have their right hands in their shirts and some have their left hands. The left handed path is said to be the crueler, the dark path, but it's all evil.

Both political parties, the Repugs and the Demonrats, are owned by the same people (the British Zionists), as is the entire media. The left/right paradigm is a manufactured creation to keep our eyes on each other rather than on them, "them" being the NWO Zionist monsters who are plotting tyranny and death for all of us. Also, they put one group in power and after they have worn out the patience of the populace with their destructive policies, they put a new administration in, but the march to tyranny keeps going in the exact same direction, each corrupt administration building on the foundations laid before by the gang that came before it.

People who post here on ATS ought to know these things, but there's a lot of people who are totally gone with the government propaganda from 12 years of government schooling and a lifetime of television propagandizing that death and evil are cool. This is why they are self-destructive, think death and torture is cool, that being a ghoul and a degenerate is cool, and that spying out your neighbor and turning them in to the NWO is also cool. Some really, really creepy people posting here on ATS. And they enjoy picking on little babies too, which is as low as you go, and they make heroes out of people who make a living by twisting the arms and legs and heads off human babies.

BTW, it's 2:30 in the morning and I hear helicopters flying around right now, and I live in the country. Great country we live in, yes? Land of the barbarians and cowards and the military industrial complex and FEMA camps and turn your neighbor in before he turns you in. Great place.

[edit on 16-4-2009 by Salt of the Earth]

For those women in need of care from clinics that provide abortion, these people have been terrorists for years! The decision to terminate a pregnancy is not an easy one for most women (I am aware that some women use abortion as birth control and I am OPPOSED to that) and to have to face the signs, the jeers, and the crowds is just plain abuse, or terrorist behavior.

While I agree that protest is an appropriate thing, to block the way to clinics and to scream to the women going in that they are going to hell is past what anyone should think is appropriate.

With bombings, deaths of doctors and nurses the pro lifers dare call the pro choice people murders????? Spare me the rhetoric.

Really, I cannot disagree with that new stance the US government is taking, as these groups are really indeed... terrorists!

Why?

- They pose direct threats to womens who had an abortion or intend to get aborted;

- They pose direct threats to clinics who rightfully practice abortion, or individually to the doctors who do it;

- They pose direct threats to immigrants (with or without a status) in this country, through organizations like the Minutemen and other extreme right-wing nationalist groups (such as the ones many ATS users are part of);

Really, if there is a menace against civil liberties in the US, aside from the Police State itself, it's the White and male-dominated reactionary groups who fight in UNCIVILIZED manners (negating debate and negociation with other interests groups) to defend their White supremacy and their stolen land as well.

Originally posted by Rockstrongo37

"In Germany, they came first for the Communists,
And I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a Communist;
And then they came for the trade unionists,
And I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a trade unionist;
And then they came for the Jews,
And I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a Jew;
And then . . . they came for me . . .
And by that time there was no one left to speak up."
Pastor Martin Niemöller (1892–1984)

www.washingtontimes.com
(visit the link for the full news article)

Please stop using this great quote to your specific political credits.

You know to what extent you do not relate to either communists, unionists, Jews, and probably even yourself.

Fascists will always be the same... parasiting and usurping the struggles that the people with real social issues have brought forward. This is how the skinheads from the poor working class neighborhoods in Europe became so predominantly neonazis for such a long time, even hough they were originally about communism and anarchism.

Originally posted by redhead57
For those women in need of care from clinics that provide abortion, these people have been terrorists for years! The decision to terminate a pregnancy is not an easy one for most women (I am aware that some women use abortion as birth control and I am OPPOSED to that) and to have to face the signs, the jeers, and the crowds is just plain abuse, or terrorist behavior.

While I agree that protest is an appropriate thing, to block the way to clinics and to scream to the women going in that they are going to hell is past what anyone should think is appropriate.

With bombings, deaths of doctors and nurses the pro lifers dare call the pro choice people murders????? Spare me the rhetoric.

Yes, let's all weep for the poor mommies, and the baby executioners and their assistants for having to consider the baby, even briefly.

There are plenty of women who changed their minds about getting that abortion because of the prolifers holding signs and calling out on behalf of their babies. These people are forever grateful. The others? If their conscience bothers them, it should. The baby executioners HAVE no conscience. Many of them are Satanists in fact, and incorporate their abortion practices into their worship of Satan.

And for the guy from Canada in the post just ahead of mine who's on here advocating that Americans start turning in their fellow citizens who are prolifers as being "terrorists," why don't you stick to promoting the NWO tyranny and mind control for your own country, not ours.


[edit on 16-4-2009 by Salt of the Earth]

reply to post by Salt of the Earth

Many of them are Satanists in fact, and incorporate their abortion practices into their worship of Satan.

Got any proof of this or is this more of the same old rhetoric you are spouting in this thread?

Divide and Conquer. The more divisions the easier it will
be to force the agenda.

Great arguments on both sides...the egos versus the heart!

It is easy to see that this country is lost as there people
cannot get it together to stand up to the TPTB.

Look for the real! Good Luck.

Originally posted by AlternateEnding
Divide and Conquer. The more divisions the easier it will
be to force the agenda.

Great arguments on both sides...the egos versus the heart!

It is easy to see that this country is lost as there people
cannot get it together to stand up to the TPTB.

Look for the real! Good Luck.

I think a lot of people who post here are looking forward to getting chipped, to being able to have their masters materialize, and to enjoying the bloodbath of the rest of us. It's John Lennon's utopia, no religion, no countries, no positions, everybody living for today (ie Do as Thou Wilt).