Christianity is an Imaginary "Sin Insurance" Racket

Originally posted by Gawdzilla
reply to post by Simplynoone

 

"I dont recall every hearing about God in any science class either .... "

And you won't hear about the Great Sky Fairy in science class if we keep fighting the creationists. Remember them? The guys who believe in the literal interpretation of the BuyBull? That believe the only book anyone needs to own is the BuyBull? That the only book that any school needs is the BuyBull? The people who want to lead us boldly into the 11th Century?

If you're not working to prevent that from happening, I have to ask you why? Don't give a hoot out personal liberties? Don't worry that we'll be a backwater, if not outright conquered by a country that studies science? This doesn't worry you?

I am personally of the opinion that everyone has the right to CHOOSE what they want to believe or not ...but you need to HEAR IT ALL in order to have a FAIR CHOICE dont you think ?
I taught my kids what Scientists believe ..what athiests believe .what wiccans believe ...what alien followers believe etc etc .....what satan believes and what I BELIEVE >>..
Because why ? We cannot be there 24 seven when someone else is teaching our kids other things ...so I first gave them my version of THINGS ...now they will hear others versions of things ..then they can come to their own CONCLUSION based on everything they heard and saw and were taught ..at least they wont be SHELTERED and just be easily BRAINWASHED to believe whatever they are told to believe I dont want ROBOT zombie kids either ...why would you want that ? .......you sound just like the creationists your so mad at ...They want to just shut up and do away with any other VIEWS and beliefs except their own ..
Sounds like a dictator mentality to me ..

Originally posted by Gawdzilla
reply to post by Simplynoone

 

"I dont recall every hearing about God in any science class either .... "

And you won't hear about the Great Sky Fairy in science class if we keep fighting the creationists. Remember them? The guys who believe in the literal interpretation of the BuyBull? That believe the only book anyone needs to own is the BuyBull? That the only book that any school needs is the BuyBull? The people who want to lead us boldly into the 11th Century?

If you're not working to prevent that from happening, I have to ask you why? Don't give a hoot out personal liberties? Don't worry that we'll be a backwater, if not outright conquered by a country that studies science? This doesn't worry you?

You don't have to exclude god to move forward. What did religion teach before it was turned into hellfire and brimstone?

Peace, Love and Understanding. Don't we all need those things? What you believe is what you believe but the fundamental teaching is correct. Love thy neighbor, treat others as you would like to be treated, and my favorite turn the other cheek. (Most people are too big of wusses to do that one) You do not have to exclude god from science to move forward in science. In fact it's a good place to look for him. Besides if god is real than god would be scientific correct? All I'm saying is they never mentioned god once in science class. When i graduated from this "religious" school to move on to a public high school, I was already 2 years ahead of any of my public school peers in every aspect of my education. So you cannot argue that god holds back education because I got a far better education going to a catholic school.

[edit on 14-4-2009 by DaMod]

I believe there's a balance that will eventually be reached between the extremes of absolute religion/creationism and absolute atheism (everything being only random accidents, no design). I believe it will be in tandem with the end, at least eventually, of secrecy-based government in general. There are huge truths that will scramble a lot of minds in the currently severely polarized paradigm. Who knows how long it will take, or what it will take to get to that more enlightened state of being? To me the key is in not claiming to know THE Truth, but in the honesty to seek it more vigorously. I personally have a lot of trouble outright believing there's a Single Creator of the ENTIRE universe, but I admit that I don't know, and would very much like to know.

reply to post by DaMod


"You don't have to exclude god to move forward. What did religion teach before it was turned into hellfire and brimstone? "

Human sacrifice and the total domination of the public by Heaven's Anointed Representative on Earth, the King. And before that? That the Great Sky Fairy is on the side with the biggest battalions. Before that? That the GSF would look favorably on one tribe killing everyone who wasn't slave material in another tribe with slightly different ideas about their own GSF.

Not necessarily a response to the thread, and I'm not sure if this is OT or not. Anyhow... just a random thought that crossed my mind just now.

There's a saying that tends to get passed around. "If you don't stand for something, you'll fall for anything." Could it be, that by not fully forming their own personal morality and instead have it dictated to them by an ancient desert tribal religion, truncated only by the rules of modern society (you know, because slavery and stonings aren't acceptable behavior anymore).

It could be said, in a rather vague sense, that they don't stand for anything - and thus, fall for anything - such as the crazy and impossible stories about Noah's flood, special creation, talking snakes, etc. Well, they do stand for their religion which is supposed to impart those morals - which leads into a negative feedback loop.

Probably way off the mark, but as said... it's not a strong point I wish to make... just a random thought.

Originally posted by Lasheic
Not necessarily a response to the thread, and I'm not sure if this is OT or not. Anyhow... just a random thought that crossed my mind just now.

I'm sittin here watching America Idol with the girls and somehow got my computer from the lil' one...and saw this thread on the 'recent posts' and saw you name Lasheic...

And then to read you were thinking of the ole' guy does my heart proud! I hope all is well....I'll read the rest of the thread later...

OT

ps: never changed my avatar, never would re-post under another name...OT is OT bud! Thank you....

reply to post by Gawdzilla


It saddens me that everyone looks for the bad instead of seeing the good. Sure a lot of horrible things where done in the name of religion, but just as many very wonderful things where done for the same cause.

Take Mother Theresa what did she do to promote evil in the world? The answer is of course nothing. She dedicated her entire life to others (which by the way is the true underlying teaching of religion). People can take and construe anything they want. They can say god wants them to kill and if they truly believe it then they will do it, but is that really the teaching? If you read the bible there is a lot of sound wisdom and advice in there. Its more a story of love and not hate. The problem with society today is we get too wriled up over petty differences. Why cant we realize that we are stuck here with each other and make the best of it? We cannot obviously, because someone must always place the blame on someone else. For example if someone hears about god and doesn't like it why not turn your ear and move on to other things instead of starting a fight over it. The fight really shows some sort of underlying resentment. Perhaps a family member abused you? Perhaps you have gone through some sort of horrific experience that causes you to lash out against god? There is more to this than you let on Gawdzilla. Who is your real enemy? You can fight about religion for all eternity but what would you really have accomplished? Sure I have religion, but at the same time I can also be a productive member of society. Moral values are not based solely on religion. Morals are embedded into us no matter what you believe in.

Imagine all the people, living life in peace. You may say I'm a dreamer, but I'm not the only one. Perhaps someday you will join us, and the world as one. (yes I know part of the song says imagine there's no heaven yata yata but either way the message is good)

I'm done with this thread. cya...

reply to post by DaMod


"It saddens me that everyone looks for the bad instead of seeing the good. Sure a lot of horrible things where done in the name of religion, but just as many very wonderful things where done for the same cause."

You could just as easily say Hitler brought Germany out of the Depression or Mussolini made the trains run on time. The problem is that it's not 50/50. First, religion has been an impediment to the human race of much greater scale than it has been a benefit. Second, the things done by religion could have been done by secular groups if religion hadn't been pushing its way into them all the time, to keep a "high profile" and continue to profit from other people's labors.

So your saying Hitler killing 6 million Jews, and countless blacks, Christians and everyone else was driven by religion? I'm pretty sure they did it in the name of power....... I'm done talking to you.

Originally posted by DaMod
So your saying Hitler killing 6 million Jews, and countless blacks, Christians and everyone else was driven by religion? I'm pretty sure they did it in the name of power....... I'm done talking to you.

"So you're saying . . ." is the primary way to spin someone else's statement. I said what I said, not "So you're saying . . ."

Sin has been used for millenia as a bludgeoning tool to put fear into men's hearts in order to control the masses. The truth of the matter has been distorted and manipulated.

Sins should be avoided only because it keeps a person firmly attached to the body and mired in drama, which in turn prevents one from discovering the truth of reality and self. Sins are not inherently good or bad, they just make it more difficult to achieve enlightenment.

And that is why all the great spiritual leaders have instructed us to avoid sinning.

reply to post by Dean Goldberry


I confess my sin as a serial killer. I've killed ants and mosquitoes because they're such a nuisance.

reply to post by DaMod


No question that most mass murdering, particularly since the 20th century (and probably most of it going back to antiquity), has been outside of religious motivation, but I don't see religion as a solution to the horrors, only an avoidance or ignorance. I believe there needs to be a new (to us, as a whole) spirituality that doesn't divide people (intentionally or not), but that would surely have to come with a whole new concept of government-politics altogether... somehow.

We humans have the ability to forgive eachother unconditional. We also punish other humans for their sin's like theft or murder by putting them in jail for a reasonable amount of time.
Most of us can also respect other people if they do not beleive in our own ideas.

But we forget that God is no human. He demands blood, death and offering for sin. We humanize God to much and judge him by that. But he is no human and has an entire galaxy to run. It would be a mess if he was to soft for us sinning creatures.

Anyway, I guess this has strayed a bit from the topic. Thank you all for your input, and keep it coming if possible. I've learned a few interesting things. Peace.

Originally posted by Gawdzilla
reply to post by Simplynoone

 

"I dont recall every hearing about God in any science class either .... "

And you won't hear about the Great Sky Fairy in science class if we keep fighting the creationists. Remember them? The guys who believe in the literal interpretation of the BuyBull? That believe the only book anyone needs to own is the BuyBull? That the only book that any school needs is the BuyBull? The people who want to lead us boldly into the 11th Century?

If you're not working to prevent that from happening, I have to ask you why? Don't give a hoot out personal liberties? Don't worry that we'll be a backwater, if not outright conquered by a country that studies science? This doesn't worry you?

not wanting to be a smart a--
but i think you might want to get out of the science class and go to the histroy class.

if you think back to WWII, science was one of the nazi's most important tools. they used it to come up with all kinds of wonder weapons, and to commit crimes againest many different races of people, mianly "GODS chosen people" and they still lost.

and why do you think that happened, because the US came into the fight.
back then US for the most part was a Christain nation, still had prayer in school, people went to church, had a strong family values. and our armed forces at that time were behind in technology. all we had going for us back then was industry and raw meterials, and the drive of our citizens, which i think came from our faith.

we cranked out countles numbers of tanks, planes and ships, all of which were inferior to the nazi war machine. as time went along our weapons did improve but it was our numbers and drive that broke their backs. that and hitler ran out of gas and ball bearings.

now for the right wing wacko in me to come out!
have you ever read the what our founders thought, ever read any thing about their faith. i know some people claim that they were one worlders and that they were trin to start thier own deal, but the fact remains that most people back then came here for freedom to worship how they wanted to.

i could go on and on but i think you can see what my point is.

science is a tool, a gift given to us by GOD. and like any tool, it can be used for good or evil. its up to the people who are using it ,what will be done


I think maybe i might need to back to spellin and grammer class

reply to post by Dean Goldberry


Real easy logic here...

"Behold, The Kingdom of heaven is at hand!" i.e. near

When his disciples asked him "where" it was, he said no one will ever say It's there, or over there, because it is in you.

The Kingdom of heaven is not some afterlife experience, it's a right now experience that is at hand... however, most of us are way to busy with the hustle and bustle of earning worldly wealth and the stresses that come with that to be able to experience the Kingdom of Heaven.

I'm so glad I have entrance to it myself... as it is truly a well spring.

reply to post by Dean Goldberry


Sin is the bread and butter of the original church and something that was more easily adopted by all the denominations of churches after that.

Without sin is not need for repentance and without repentance is not need for eternal salvation and with it the sell of the heavenly kingdom.

One of the worst traits of man kind as per church believe is free will the ability of man to make its own decisions and to question authority, the church had a hard time controlling this part of human nature, now that humanity has more access to knowledge and is able to think by itself without the need of the Church this has taken away much of the power of the concept of sin.

But as with everything the truth will only set you free and while I feel very much free right now is many that can never be able to think by themselves without the help of God's middle man.

Originally posted by Dean Goldberry
...Jesus (if he existed) was primarily all about the "do unto others..." Golden Rule (that was FIRST taught by the Buddha, btw). ...

Buddha's "golden rule" is different from Jesus' golden rule. Additionally, there is a very subtle but incredibly important distinction between all the other "golden rules" and the one espoused by Jesus.

Buddhism: "Hurt not others in ways that you yourself would find hurtful."

Confucianism: "Do not do to others what you would not like yourself."

Hinduism: "This is the sum of duty; do naught onto others what you would not have them do unto you."

Judaism: "What is hateful to you, do not do to your fellowman. "

Zoroastrianism: "Whatever is disagreeable to yourself do not do unto others."

Now, let's compare those with Christianity: "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you."

See the difference? No? If I walk by a man trapped in a pit, and do not help him out of the pit, have I broken any of the other "golden" rules? Nope.
Have I broken Christianity's golden rule? Absolutely! (Unless, of course, I happen to like being trapped in a pit.)

Put another way: All the other "golden rules" tell you what you CANNOT do. Jesus' golden rule tells you what you MUST do. See the difference now?

Originally posted by sir_chancealot


See the difference? No? If I walk by a man trapped in a pit, and do not help him out of the pit, have I broken any of the other "golden" rules? Nope.

I'm sorry but I would say that you had broken these other rules. Because the mere act of walking by me trapped in the pit is hurtful.

I don't see any distinction between these golden rules, but thank you for posting them :-)