Schools hire bouncers to control kids

Schools hire bouncers to control kids

www.news.com.au

NIGHTCLUB bouncers and former soldiers are being hired by schools in Britain to help control unruly students.

A teachers conference has heard that "stern and loud" bouncers were being hired as teaching assistants to help when permanent staff were off sick.

(visit the link for the full news article)

Compulsory education is not working. It's not as bad as that - yet - here in Australia... but it will be.

Many of these 'students' should not be in school. There needs to be alternate programs for them to take other pathways in life. I don't have the solution, but I know that forcing children to school isn't a viable option for a positive future.

It's a negative feedback loop... a lot of these students probably have parents who are losers. When these students are old enough to breed, their offspring will also be damned as losers too. Generational misery and sadness.

www.news.com.au
(visit the link for the full news article)

This isn't a reflection of the entire UK education system. It's a sensible solution to the serious problems faced by some schools in usually tough areas. A few years ago, the Blair Govt empowered a policy of 'inclusion' and introduced League Tables to score schools, departments and naturally, teachers.

The 'inclusion' policy skewed the behavioral policies by making some behavior acceptable when earlier it was not. Severely disruptive or aggressive pupils would be sanctioned and ultimately suspended/ excluded. This was to provide for their needs and the general needs of the school. So year on year, pupils that would have come to the end of the line much earlier still remain in school. It only takes a couple of bad apples to ruin a lesson. We've all been there and I was one of the 'bad apples.'

The levels of violence towards staff and pupils has risen each year with some schools being trained in methods like "Team Teach". This is a behavior management system that enables teachers to intervene when the risk to self/others/damage to property is possible. Unfortunately, a teacher's career is subject to false allegations and this is where the 'bouncers' come in. They will allow for physical intervention by capable men and women without jeopardizing careers...

The league tables means that schools have to get results to be successful. This has resulted in 'teaching to the test'. This means that pupils are taught how to pass tests rather than gain subject knowledge. Teachers aren't to blame for this state of affairs. The best schools are the church of England ones. They have a policy of picking pupils from 'good families' with a proven track record of intelligence and academic ability.

Good schools attract and choose bright prospects. The remaining schools in the area get what's left. Some schools already have resident police officers and staff trained to get physically involved. I think it's inevitable that 'bouncers' will become a popular feature in schools. If the violent pupils have to stay then someone needs to be able to protect their peers from danger. It's a crazy world

Originally posted by Kandinsky
This isn't a reflection of the entire UK education system. It's a sensible solution to the serious problems faced by some schools in usually tough areas.

Yes, I agree. That's why I stated that compulsory education doesn't work.

I know that in Australia, like the UK, there are lots of prestigious schools that do well for their students. Many students do want to attend school to learn, etc. Some people and families value education.

However, having bouncers in the remaining schools, to me, is an admission of failure. A sign of a broken system. There has to be a more sensible solution to the problem, than hiring bouncers, surely???

[edit on 13-4-2009 by tezzajw]

I worked the clubs of Brisbane and *shudder* Ipswich on and off for five years.

I have had a bottle broken across my face and been in numerous fights and brawls.

I wouldn't work a school.

You have a disagreement with a drunk person, it ends in a fight and next week they would come in and apologise (yes this actually happened more than once in Ipswich!).

Kids now cannot be reasoned with and you can't touch them.

It won't take them long to figure this out.

[edit on 13-4-2009 by OZtracized]

Even if they do employ bouncers at schools, those bouncers will also have restrictions, if they, even toucha ny of those children, they could find themselves being arrested or charged.

Remember kids nowadays have more law to protect them than the teachers or anyone else. (And yes there are a few pupils who will extort this as far as they can.

reply to post by tezzajw

However, having bouncers in the remaining schools, to me, is an admission of failure. A sign of a broken system. There has to be a more sensible solution to the problem, than hiring bouncers, surely???

From what I understand these bouncers have only been used in incidences of staff absences. Supply teachers can be over a hundred quid a day whereas 'door staff' I know would cost 70-80quid. Management being creative with their budgets:?D It's too early to call it a sign of things to come just yet...Only one school has tried it out and only one 'bouncer' remains.

IMHO it will happen more and more and it IS a sign of core failures in the English education system. Example:

Say a a school has a catchment area that includes poorer families and a lot of the kids have single parents? This sector tends to have an unsettled home life that reflects on their school life and education. The school is unlikely to get more than 30-40% A-C grades. If all the kids enjoy that school and get the best grades they can achieve then the school and community have succeeded in some way. Agree? It makes sense?

In the eyes of the Govt, this school will be deemed a failure on the grades rather than the quality of life enjoyed by staff and pupils. When a successful school is portrayed as a 'poor school' it affects the morale of staff and the pupils. Self esteem is at stake. When self esteem slips away people present as not caring and that spiral of failure can kick in.

I know enough people in education. They all say that kids are 'getting worse' in their behavior and attitudes to learning. Maybe they are? It's hard to call because people have been complaining about the new generation for centuries. It's hard to know what perspective is accurate.

Originally posted by OZtracized
I wouldn't work a school.

You have a disagreement with a drunk person, it ends in a fight and next week they would come in and apologise (yes this actually happened more than once in Ipswich!).

Kids now cannot be reasoned with and you can't touch them.

It won't take them long to figure this out.

[edit on 13-4-2009 by OZtracized]

You're mostly right about the rights of kids. Reasonable force and the paperwork requirements are naturally detailed and witness accounts need to be provided also.

In some independent schools in the UK they deal with aggressive pupils that are excluded from mainstream schools. Some are residential, some referral units and some day schools. Assault, attempted assault and damage to property are day to day in these schools. These 'kids' come in all shapes and sizes. Some spend their free time mugging adults or running with gangs. Big lads with big tempers. The systems the staff use in these places is Team Teach

TeamTeach is similar to the type of holds and restraints you'll be shown when you get your badge for door work in the bars. It has less room for aggression and is focused on causing as little harm to the kid as possible. If a kid kicks off he's getting held. If he throws a chair or swings at someone, he gets held. It can take up to four staff to hold a hyped up kid safely. Afterwards it gets written up and any injuries are drawn on a body map. The paperwork is then stored for life in case allegations arise in the future. It sounds crazy and probably is, but it's all some of these kids know and staff get used to the life.

That was an awesome rebuttal.

I like that appoach and am impressed with the tactical and documented system in place.

I think it will work. Let's hope it does and this plan becomes popular.

My sister-in-law was considering home schooling for her child. Also, I was talking with a colleague at work and she tried this for her son. I don't know what I'd do if it were my child. I know that I was advanced for the schooling that I got as a child, and this just increased as I went into high school. I found high school a very boring place to be, even though I was in pre-college classes. So, in turn, I skipped out without being caught, many times and still graduated in the top 20% of the class. I think that I would look into an alternative in this time to keep my kid out of harm's way.

This issue has absolutely nothing to do with compulsory education. This recent problem of extremely unruly kids in schools is about 10-15 years old and is solely based on a drastic change in our culture and a major lack of parental influence.

I graduated from high school in 1990. In my high school years this was never a problem in a high school of 1500 plus students. The occassional idiots were swiftly dealt with and would spend their days in suspension or detention. Case closed. We knew and respected our limits.

Back then there was an actual fear of reprisal and an actual respect for authority. We didn't always like the 4 unit principals and Head principal but, we accepted it. Any trouble in the school was usually chalked up to general mischief. No big deal. The occassional stink or smoke bomb didn't lead to violence.

Currently, there is a disturbing level of disrespect among teens and pre teens for authority, parents and elders that is utterly mind numbing. We have a huge problem in our culture that has lead to a massive indoctrination of our youth.

In the eyes of this population, anything goes. A culture of immediate gratification, recklessness, disrespect for each other, entitlement, and chaos has been fostered by the entertainment industry and the MSM. Youth are bombarded 24/7 with violence, suggestion and sex. Kids must have cell phones and 24 hour access to anything that they desire.

Our culture has slipped down the slope of no return and the generation of parents that has allowed this to happen are regretting their decisions or indecisions now. I never thought I would see my local suburban schools under camera surveillance and daytime lock down. You now have to ring a buzzer to be let into the schools.

I am a parent to two 2 1/2 year olds and I worry tremendously about what they will face in their future if things in this world don't change for the better soon.

Enough is enough. Parents need to take back their kids from this BS and say no to the crap that is incessantly thrown their way.

[edit on 13-4-2009 by jibeho]

hahahaha, this just makes me laugh so much. I found out that they used mind control on people at school in 1992. Could not beleive it as they targeted me, and i did nothing to bring it to me.

But when i see how far things have come is amaxzing, bouncers in class to stop kids, wtf, is that about. When i was at school like above i doubt there was any real serious trouble, except for one incident when this mob in the playground beat up one boy, but that was an isloated case. But todays kids, are just beyond belief, and no one seems to want to control over them, i.e parents.

When i first saw this thread i thought i was seeing something, but it did give me a chuckle to see how far people have come down this road, of total bull, and having no morals or respect for anything. Kids must be fed with the ego today, on mass scale, and if you watch tsarion he talks about people being over stimulated today in the west.

Life is supposed to be boring, and that makes the good moments, worth more than they would if we where over stimulated and we see everyone like that today. Give me everything i want society has totally foked up the human race in the west, and thankfully some of us where right in saying this would happen.

I wonder how people can justify this, with there stupid ego first society we live in today. I wonder does the leaders know they have gone too far now, or will they just keep going down this road.

But all of us who where born with some morals should just laugh at the society these people have made, and the busy bodies who think that they have a right to run others lifes, have made the society absolutely sh1t for everyone.

If you made the choice to never bring someone into this society, just be glad because i know i am.

But to society they are making today.

hahahahhahahahahaha, you people have no clue what so ever.

1 ofthe security guards at my old high school was a bouncer by night. im not realy a fan of bouncers in general as there usualy assholes bt this guy was ok. just hought id share lol

Originally posted by OZtracized
I worked the clubs of Brisbane and *shudder* Ipswich on and off for five years.

I have had a bottle broken across my face and been in numerous fights and brawls.

I wouldn't work a school.

You have a disagreement with a drunk person, it ends in a fight and next week they would come in and apologise (yes this actually happened more than once in Ipswich!).

Kids now cannot be reasoned with and you can't touch them.

It won't take them long to figure this out.

[edit on 13-4-2009 by OZtracized]

Well ill keep to my trusty rusky friends, they tend to keep things in order, oh yes and they do clean up after wards. Well it seems like with every generation they seem to become more hostile with little or no respect, that is until they mee(t) the wrong person to say f@ck ofF too.

[edit on 13-4-2009 by tristar]