Ark of the Covenant- What is it really?

reply to post by Amagnon


That was a nice post from the skeptics' side Amagnon. Just a guess on my part but I'm thinking that ghaleon12 has met very few atheists and so his or her "lazy" characterization is without basis. Please correct me if I'm wrong on that ghaleon. That an atheist might look at the same evidence as you and conclude that there's nothing worth pursuing is not equivalent to "lazy and not really looking for truth". That would be equivalent to me stating all believers are delusional. Speaking of delusions, I suspect if I ever divulged my theory that the Ark was a lunchbox and that the matching thermos could be found on eBay we might now have a very different thread. Shhhhhh! Let's not go there!

Anyways Amagnon...

Delivered by ETs is intriguing. That also leads me once again to wonder whether the violent, jealous god of the OT was actually an ET. That would tidy up many a scripture in my mind. But like you, I'm wary of a universal fix for this cryptic mess. I'm coming from the slant that the scriptures have many authors and that they built on and incorporated plots and aspects of the earlier writings so as to give credence to their own. Can anyone be certain that scriptures were not, let's just say "refined", at later dates to better fit the current agenda or simply tighten the plot? I think we've all witnessed refinements in the recording of modern events. Why wouldn't that have happened 2,500 years ago? But I digress...

Back to the ET thought. I think someone mentioned earlier in the thread that the Egyptians had the ET technology and that the Hebrews took a few parting gifts on the way out of town. It would seem from some of the stories related here that the Hebrews were not in total control or understanding of the Ark. Perhaps they didn't get the users’ manual from the Egyptians.

Originally posted by serbsta
"I am from above...", he probably was talking about the spiritual level of man rather than just Heaven and Earth.

Lets see what we have so far...

The Ark is:

-A weapon of war either radioactive or electrical.
-It is symbolic of the Old Covenant, while Christ is the New Covenant with man.
-Metaphoric representation of the heart/truth of man.
-A communication device to God.

Am i missing anything?

You're not missing anything, but I would like to stress to you that this is the highest level of communion with Spirit and God is Spirit.

1. The ark held the law. Our bodies are the new temple and God promised to write the law on our hearts. Also Jesus told Satan in the desert, that man did not live by bread and water alone but by "every word" of God. For those who have the indwelling of Spirit - this takes on a whole new meaning of the necessity of the "word" remaining in the believer.

2. The ark held manna. Jesus said few find the truth and one day he will say to many people who thought they really knew him all along "I never knew you." Jesus is the manna that came down from heaven - he is the holder and revealer of all God's mysteries. Secret manna sustains the spirit.

3. Aaron's rod. This powerful rod has the capability of shepherding his flock, blooming fruit ( bloomed almonds overnight when the Levites were chosen for the priesthood) and movement. Most people forget the rod can turn into a...... good serpent which has the ability to gobble up bad serpents in a display of power. Sort of takes on a whole new meaning of John the Baptist and Jesus calling people a "brood of vipers."

I tend to look at it that the Holy Spirit is self correcting. It will either shape you up or it can destroy a person - same capabilities as the Ark. We have to remember when Aaron's rod bloomed - one side had good almonds and the other bitter ones......

One legend holds that the rod was created on the sixth day, at twilight.

Now that I think about it - I think you should add "God's divine spark" to your list.



[edit on 14-4-2009 by Myrtales Instinct]

Originally posted by prevenge
it's not a magic chest.

it's your skull.
the wings are the sphenoid bones.
mt. sinai is the "sinuses" plural.
the "tent" of the tabernacle = tentorium cerebelli.
The tentorium of the cerebellum is the tent-like portion of the dura mater, the outermost of the three membranous connective tissue coverings of the brain

holy = hole-ey the holes in our head.. the ventricles that fill with kundalini when we break the waters from the stone of our "sacrum" when we resist orgasm during sex.

it's activated using byssus.. the same threadlike hyphae that falls from modern day clouds as "fiery serpents." (mogellons)

the "washbasin" is the third ventricle.

the grail isn't an actual cup either.
it's the uterus.



you can look at all these legends with the mind of a child and imagine the superficial descriptions of a gold box..and wonder about their magical powers...

or

you can read between the lines and see the intellectual diagramatical instructions as to how to re-arrange your genome (the word)

Or you can ask your self... "did these words I'm using like "tentorium" even exist back then?"

I like your imagery, but the words you used to say "it really means this"... well most of them didn't exist back then.

Like the sinai sinuses connection...

[edit on 14-4-2009 by HunkaHunka]

Great post, I think if the quotes from the bible are to be taken at face value then I would agree with the OP that there would have to be an element of radioactivity from within the Ark. Burns, blindness and death are all classic symptoms and it would make sense that it would be used as a beacon during war as everyone on the opposite side would fear the wrath of God.
I think it is one of these things that we will unfortunatley never fully get an explanation of what it was, strangley enough I was in Rosyln Chapel at the weekend as live a few miles down the road and there was over 50 people meditating above the main recess where the Ark/ Holly Grail is rumored to be buried. I can tell you with first hand experience that there is something of real importance buried there, be it any of the above. The chapel has a calming, otherworldly presence about it. I would love to get under the stone floors and investigate

Originally posted by Myrtales Instinct

Originally posted by undo
reply to post by Myrtales Instinct

 

some people always ignore the rest of the verses relating the info on the 144,000...they are MALE, VIRGIN JEWS. now i dunno about you, but if the only folks that get to go to heaven are males, why does it say salvation is for everyone ? do they forget 50 percent of the population is female? (i mean, the people who promote the idea that the only ones going are 144,000...

please, try not to just pick out one idea from an entire set of ideas on the subject. use the whole thing and if you can't make heads or tails of it, keep looking!

It's kind of interesting that you mentioned that. I'm very fond of the Gospel of Thomas and when you wrote that about male virgins I instantlty thought of Peter whining to the Lord to 'make Mary go away because females don't deserve life.'

Jesus said, "Look, I will guide her to make her male, so that she too may become a living spirit resembling you males. For every female who makes herself male will enter the kingdom of Heaven."

I read tons of stuff and attempt to keep an open mind in all my studies, so when I'm done I can step back and look at the bigger picture. I said it's "possible" the 144,000 are picked a certain way - not that it's a fact. I'm pretty sure Jesus is looking for 144,000 beloved disciples - that I can say is probably a fact. How they are changed and chosen is entirely up to him.

With God all things are possible.

Well atleast they seem to have pretty good taste there in the Kingdom of Heaven.
Sorry, couldn't resist.


I have my guesses what it meant, though.

...and not one mention on Indiana Jones anywhere!!!

Well done to all you ATSers (unless I missed a glaringly obvious inclusion).

I'm gonna enjoy reading up on this - excellent thread!!!

Originally posted by Ahatmose
reply to post by undo

 

reply to post by undo

 

understand the holy of holies is your head
the cherubim on the ark are the 2 halves of your brain.
the mercy seat is your third eye -- the seal of God in the forehead.
solomon's temple (a human body template)

Actually this is incorrect.

The temple wherein the ark is placed is of course the most sacred temple of all ... The Temple of Man

The holy of holies is not at all the brain for the wisest of the races, The Ancient Egyptians drew it out through the nose and discarded it as so much garbage and the brain actually stops the feelings from the heart. Yes it is the heart that is the seat of all the wisdom and knowledge, it is the heart that is the Ark of The Covenant and within this most sacred of places, this most holy of holies was placed the most awesome thing ever devised, the thing that could destroy armies and allow you to talk to "god". And this all powerful force that could do anything ... this amazing power was simply and beautifully ... The Truth. And you want the truth Jack Nicloson says, you want the truth ... but most of you wouldn't be able to stand the truth.

Emhotep
Don Barone

I think undo has it right, in fact I'm sure she does. The heart has to be circumsized before anyone can enter into the Holy of Holies. The crowning reward is in the Holy of Holies and crowns go on our heads - not our chests.

The Holy of Holies is where the consummation act of marriage to God, through Christ takes place - the veil is rent and we get an actual foretaste of things to come. This is the meaning behind Christ saying "Father glorify yourself" and the Father said "I have and I will do it again."

Left and right, male and female, good and bad - they must be blended. The consummation act produces - the Son of Man.. It proves God is real and every claim Jesus made is true. He's the bridegroom, he's the King and it's his chamber.

These are not strange and foreign teachings. Every last one of you has within you what the ancients called the divine spark. It's like a mustard seed that starts out small and grows into something big. It's like hidden leaven, which has the ability to rise. It is the Son of Man lifting up within a person and how everyone will ultimately be taught by God himself.

The goal is to know God to produce witnesses for testimony.

reply to post by Hemisphere


Well, I think there is a good case for the god of the Old Testament being an ET - and not a particularly patient one.

I find Genesis to be fairly interesting. Very telling was the reference to the Sons of God, being distinct from mankind (the sons of Adam).


Genesis 5

1This is the book of the generations of Adam. In the day that God created man, in the likeness of God made he him;

2Male and female created he them; and blessed them, and called their name Adam, in the day when they were created.


Genesis 6

1And it came to pass, when men began to multiply on the face of the earth, and daughters were born unto them,

2That the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair; and they took them wives of all which they chose.

3And the LORD said, My spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he also is flesh: yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years.

4There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.

This indicates Sons of God were around at the time, as well as daughters of Adam - and they interbred - creating 'mighty men', 'men of renown'.

Also, you might want to have a closer look at verse 3 -

3And the LORD said, My spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he also is flesh

This seems to suggest that God himself is 'also flesh'. This is fairly surprising and candid response from a being that just 4 chapters ago was attributed with creating heaven and earth.

This interpretation is fairly straight forward, and hard to confuse - although the original Hebrew or whatever might have meant something else entirely - its just non sequitur. I think then, the myth of creation was attributed to God, not because he claimed he had done it - but rather he had described it.

Of additional interest is God cutting short the length of men's lives - as they previously lived around 800 or so years - now he was reducing it 120. Making this change would have many effects - racial history would tend to get lost over time, and learning and social adaptation could occur more quickly - profound effects.

Anyhow - I guess I am digressing from the topic of the Ark. If you follow through with the Yaweh (God) was an ET proposal - then the Arks purpose was a communication device to speak with him. I'm not sold on the idea that it was a kind of weapon, rather it was like a battle standard carried before them into battle - there were times that battles were lost and the Ark was captured - to the Philistines at one point. They complained that it gave them hemorrhoids though - so they sent it back - true story.

The Bible claims the Temple was destroyed (possibly with the Ark inside);

2 Kings 25

8In the fifth month, on the seventh day of the month-which was the nineteenth year of King Nebuchadnezzar, king of Babylon-Nebuzaradan, the captain of the bodyguard, a servant of the king of Babylon, came to Jerusalem.
9And he burned the house of the LORD, and the king's house and all the houses of Jerusalem; every great house he burned down.

And was to be forgotten;

Jeremiah 3

16And when you have multiplied and increased in the land, in those days, says the LORD, they shall no more say, "The ark of the covenant of the LORD." It shall not come to mind, or be remembered, or missed; it shall not be made again.

So - maybe it was destroyed back there by Nebuzaradan and the Chaldean army (timing was around 590 BC apparently).

Anyhow - it was a fairly interesting box - I'd love to know if it still exists, and perhaps contains the tablets - which I find more interesting.

[edit on 14-4-2009 by Amagnon]

Originally posted by TailoredVagabond
...and not one mention on Indiana Jones anywhere!!!

Well done to all you ATSers (unless I missed a glaringly obvious inclusion).

I'm gonna enjoy reading up on this - excellent thread!!!

Raiders of the Lost Ark was mentioned in an earlier post in this thread.

Originally posted by Magnivea
I personally think it's some kind of communication device for talking to "aliens" but that's just me. And alot of other people probably.

I thought something along this too. Suppose it is true, what a fantastic twist regarding Judaism and also Christianity this would be! Two alien religions

reply to post by PGTWEED


Well, there is a Texan called Dr. Vendyl Jones who has been searching for the Ark most of his life. At some points he says he is the inspiration for the character Indiana Jones - and at other times disputes it.

Regardless - he says he knows where the Ark is - and just needs to raise $80k to go dig it up - so send him your money - lets not be tight asses with such knowledge at stake!! Of course he's probably wrong, and Israel won't let him drill where he wants anyhow.

[edit on 14-4-2009 by Amagnon]

The Ark of the Covenant is mentioned in the Apocrypha in the Book of 2 Maccabees 2:1-8. 'It was also in the writing that the prophet, in obedience to a revelation, gave orders that the Tent (Tabernacle and the Ark should accompany him, and that he went away to the mountain where Moses went up and beheld G-D's inheritance. And Jeremiah came and found a cave-dwelling and he took the Tent and the Ark and the Incense Altar into it, and he blocked up the entrance.'

[edit on 14-4-2009 by PGTWEED]

Originally posted by Amagnon
reply to post by PGTWEED

 

Well, there is a Texan called Dr. Vendyl Jones who has been searching for the Ark most of his life. At some points he says he is the inspiration for the character Indiana Jones - and at other times disputes it.

Regardless - he says he knows where the Ark is - and just needs to raise $80k to go dig it up - so send him your money - lets not be tight asses with such knowledge at stake!! Of course he's probably wrong, and Israel won't let him drill where he wants anyhow.

[edit on 14-4-2009 by Amagnon]

Vendyl only needs to raise $25,000. I've been working with him since 1992.

The ark of the covenant - what is it really?

It was a box that held some stone tablets and nothing else. They just made up all that other stuff to keep people from tagging it

I really doubt it was some super cool alien telephone. One of the Jews built it, so dont you think he would build more if it was some great way to communicate.

reply to post by justsomeboreddude


The construction of the Ark is commanded by God to Moses while the Jews were still camped at Sinai (Ex. 25:10-22; 37:1-9).

The Ark was used in the desert and in Israel proper for a number of spiritual and pragmatic purposes. Practically, God used the Ark as an indicator of when he wanted the nation to travel, and when to stop. In the traveling formation in the desert, the Ark was carried 2000 cubits ahead of the nation (Num. R. 2:9). According to one midrash, it would clear the path for the nation by burning snakes, scorpions, and thorns with two jets of flame that shot from its underside (T. VaYakhel, 7); another midrash says that rather than being carried by its bearers, the Ark in fact carried its bearers inches above the ground (Sotah 35a). When the Israelites went to war in the desert and during the conquering of Canaan, the Ark accompanied them; whether its presence was symbolic, to provide motivation for the Jews, or whether it actually aided them in fighting, is debated.

Wow, what an amazingly intersting topic, just what was this ark, was it tangible at all?Perhaps only symbolic?Perhaps it didint exist at all.

Wouldint evidence that the exodus never even happened throw its very existence into doubt, evidence that Im pretty sure I saw on a documentary lately.

Anyways, as with all issues like these, its khugely open to interpretation and notoriously hard to find teh truth, but hey, aint that what makes life interesting.

Originally posted by Amagnon
reply to post by PGTWEED

 

Well, there is a Texan called Dr. Vendyl Jones who has been searching for the Ark most of his life. At some points he says he is the inspiration for the character Indiana Jones - and at other times disputes it.

Regardless - he says he knows where the Ark is - and just needs to raise $80k to go dig it up - so send him your money - lets not be tight asses with such knowledge at stake!! Of course he's probably wrong, and Israel won't let him drill where he wants anyhow.

[edit on 14-4-2009 by Amagnon]

The Israeli government hasn't said Vendyl can't conduct any excavations, as long as Vendyl meets the legal requirements to excavate by the Israel National Parks Authority. He is conducting a geological survey which permits him to drill a borehole into a chamber detected by Ground Penatrating Radar. Then send down a camera to see if any artifacts are inside the chamber. This isn't any different when Egyptologists found a Pharonic barge in a sealed chamber near the Great Pyramid in 1988. As I said earlier, Vendyl only needs to raise $25,000

Websites about Vendyl Jones search for the Ark of The Covenant. www.bnainoah.net , www.vjri.purleguy.net Vendyl's discoveries 1988: Shemen Afarsimon (Holy Annointing Oil), 1992: Qetorit (Holy Temple Incense), 1994: The actual site of Gilgal-excavations are ongoing.

Originally posted by Myrtales Instinct

Originally posted by serbsta
"I am from above...", he probably was talking about the spiritual level of man rather than just Heaven and Earth.

Lets see what we have so far...

The Ark is:

-A weapon of war either radioactive or electrical.
-It is symbolic of the Old Covenant, while Christ is the New Covenant with man.
-Metaphoric representation of the heart/truth of man.
-A communication device to God.

Am i missing anything?

You're not missing anything, but I would like to stress to you that this is the highest level of communion with Spirit and God is Spirit.

1. The ark held the law. Our bodies are the new temple and God promised to write the law on our hearts. Also Jesus told Satan in the desert, that man did not live by bread and water alone but by "every word" of God. For those who have the indwelling of Spirit - this takes on a whole new meaning of the necessity of the "word" remaining in the believer.

2. The ark held manna. Jesus said few find the truth and one day he will say to many people who thought they really knew him all along "I never knew you." Jesus is the manna that came down from heaven - he is the holder and revealer of all God's mysteries. Secret manna sustains the spirit.

3. Aaron's rod. This powerful rod has the capability of shepherding his flock, blooming fruit ( bloomed almonds overnight when the Levites were chosen for the priesthood) and movement. Most people forget the rod can turn into a...... good serpent which has the ability to gobble up bad serpents in a display of power. Sort of takes on a whole new meaning of John the Baptist and Jesus calling people a "brood of vipers."

I tend to look at it that the Holy Spirit is self correcting. It will either shape you up or it can destroy a person - same capabilities as the Ark. We have to remember when Aaron's rod bloomed - one side had good almonds and the other bitter ones......

One legend holds that the rod was created on the sixth day, at twilight.

Now that I think about it - I think you should add "God's divine spark" to your list.


[edit on 14-4-2009 by Myrtales Instinct]

"God's divine spark", can you elaborate on what you mean by that? I read through your post but still couldnt clearly understand what you meant by this. Spark as in some form of uknown knowledge?

Noah's Ark was the First Ark also Noah's Commandments of 7 was the first Commandments before the 10 Commandments of Moses. Then came the 10 Commandments & then the 613 Commandments
The Zohar is a mystical commentary on the Torah (the five books of Moses) has a interesting Volume on the 10 Commandments being of Sapphire Tablets of Cosmic/supernal Dew.

Zohar Vol 10. Yitro Section 21. "The Tablets were the work of Elohim"
We hear how the tablets of the Ten Commandments were of sapphire, and the letters were visible on both sides and composed of both black fire and white fire, from the left and the right. The rabbis are in some confusion about whether Elohim made the tablets specially or whether they were really 'just' sapphire as any other sapphire. Rabbi Shimon says the tablets were formed of the supernal dew which flows from Atika Kadisha, and that they pre-existed the creation of the world but were perfected on the sixth day of creation especially for this purpose. The miracle was that one could read one side from the other. We are told that the Torah actually literally restored the souls of Yisrael after they had flown away at the time that the people heard the words of God. The text now turns to the rule of Solomon, during which time the moon was full. When Zedekiah came, the moon waned and remained thus, so Malchut was removed far from Zeir Anpin, and became dark. The moon shone when Yisrael stood by Mount Sinai, and it shone when Judah was found worthy to receive the kingdom.

Notice how it's of Black & White Fire from left & the right & Hebrew is from left to right.
Now the part that puts this Gem! heh to real use here is the other story of the Kabbalah The Story of the Hebrew Letters of Creation

Individual energy forces, which express themselves as Hebrew letters, came before the Creator requesting that they be the instruments by which the world is created. The Creator eventually agrees to utilize the letter Beit ?, as this particular letter begins the Hebrew word Brachah [Blessing]. The Zohar then depicts the unique attributes of each of the twenty-two letters and the spiritual energy they emit. All these forces and their power of blessing are transferred to us when we visually scan the Aramaic text and learn the lessons it holds.

To Confer on this story of creation the Meru Foundation has some interesting research on the hebrew language being the letters of the flame using some interesting science as well as a Video of it here called Dance of the Hebrew Letters with Stan Tenen

This adds to the Enjoyment of the Tablets in the Ark, Cosmic tablets wrote in the same language as creation itself it provides a story of interest to those on the same track

& that track is Da'at btw

Ah yes in the later times when the Ark was in Solomons temple only the Kohen class could go into the temple upon the Ark of the Covenant & this is what they Appear like in the temple when upon the Ark of the Covenant Example of the Kohen Preist here

This Kohen would go into the temple with the secret Kabbalah knowledge of the 72 names of god formula. According to the Jewish tradition there is a formula or a name that defines g-d in a total way. The name is made of 216 letters. The origin of the name is in Exodus 14: Dividing the 216 letters of the sentence (in Hebrew) to thirds will give us 72 combinations of 3 letters