Why do Atheists care about religion?

Originally posted by Gawdzilla


"All atheists agree that matter is self-existant, not created, capable of producing life within itself. "

Evolutionary scientists say the same thing. So what?

So they are atheists. An atheist is somebody who believes strongly and is prepared to defend his belief that matter is self-existant, able to create life in and of itself, and that an eternal, self-existant almighty Creator God is not part of the equation when it comes to origins. Any "god" who does exist would be a cultural icon or some evolved creature, some little G god.

These are the same people who think that aliens are coming to visit and save us from ourselves, who think the universe is teeming with life, probably with creatures more advanced and more intelligent than we.

reply to post by Salt of the Earth


You're making up your own definitions again. Atheists, by the normal definition, DON'T believe. Try to keep up with that point.

Originally posted by Gawdzilla
reply to post by Salt of the Earth

 

You're making up your own definitions again. Atheists, by the normal definition, DON'T believe. Try to keep up with that point.

Agnostics don't believe.

Atheists do believe. They believe God does not exist.

They believe matter is self-existant, not created, and that it has powers within itself to produce life.

This is not their opinion. This is their firm and committed belief.

If they had doubts about this they would not claim to be an atheist, but would call themselves an agnostic instead.

Atheists are materialists. They believe only in matter, nothing else. Period.

Matter is where it's at. It exists by itself and it creates life by itself. Period. No questions, no doubts, no disputes. This they say is the "scientific" way, and you cannot be a real scientist unless you are an atheist.

So atheists really worship the atom, as some mysterious almighty, self-existant, eternal thing able to create life in and of itself, to form itself into infinite life forms, to orgnaize itself spontaneously, with an inherent intelligence.



[edit on 12-4-2009 by Salt of the Earth]

reply to post by Salt of the Earth


"Atheists do believe. They believe God does not exist. "

Sorry, but atheists don't see any evidence that God exists. You should try to understand the distinction. Or fail. You're choice, really.

reply to post by Salt of the Earth


You need to define what you mean by "Worship" because;

wor⋅ship
   /ˈwɜrʃɪp/ Show Spelled Pronunciation [wur-ship] Show IPA noun, verb, -shiped, -ship⋅ing or (especially British) -shipped, -ship⋅ping.
–noun
1. reverent honour and homage paid to God or a sacred personage, or to any object regarded as sacred.
2. formal or ceremonious rendering of such honour and homage: They attended worship this morning.
3. adoring reverence or regard: excessive worship of business success.
4. the object of adoring reverence or regard.
5. (initial capital letter) British. a title of honor used in addressing or mentioning certain magistrates and others of high rank or station (usually prec. by Your, His, or Her).
–verb (used with object)
6. to render religious reverence and homage to.
7. to feel an adoring reverence or regard for (any person or thing).
–verb (used without object)
8. to render religious reverence and homage, as to a deity.
9. to attend services of divine worship.
10. to feel an adoring reverence or regard.

Dictionary

[edit on 12-4-2009 by Welfhard]

Originally posted by Gawdzilla
reply to post by Salt of the Earth

 

"Atheists do believe. They believe God does not exist. "

Sorry, but atheists don't see any evidence that God exists. You should try to understand the distinction. Or fail. You're choice, really.

No, that's an agnostic. If you say, I don't know it means you are on the fence.

If you have committed yourself to a belief that God does not exist, then you are an atheist.

So what are you? If you haven't decided what you believe one way or the other, then don't call yourself an atheist. Say you are leaning to atheist, but if anybody can convince you that matter is not self-existant and eternal and able to produce life from itself then you will reject that belief in atheism.

Aheists don't say "we don't know." They say, we DO KNOW. We KNOW FOR A FACT THAT GOD DOES NOT EXIST. This is an atheist.

Agnostics say, I don't know. I haven't seen anything to convince me one way or the other.

reply to post by Salt of the Earth


"If you have committed yourself to a belief that God does not exist, then you are an atheist. "

Again, your own definitions.

An agnostic doesn't know if god exists or not.

An atheist doesn't care if people think god exists or not. (As long as you stay out of our faces with that garbage.)

Myself? I used to say that I would be an atheist if I was more interested in religion. However, I was utter dismissive of the whole topic until Ben Stein's little propaganda horror made me understand that it was time to go to the mattresses.

Originally posted by Welfhard
reply to post by Salt of the Earth

 

You need to define what you mean by "Worship" because;


[edit on 12-4-2009 by Welfhard]

Based on the definition of "worship" you posted I'd say that true committed atheists worship dirt, because they have a deep and religious belief in the abilities of matter (ie dirt) to exist without beginning and without end, to be able to form itself into infinite life forms and to create life from within itself.

This is the highest kind of reverence one can possess toward a deity, and indeed atheists ascribe godlike powers to matter, and regard it as a real deity for all intents and purposes. Further, it is a deliberate choice to believe in matter this way, to ascribe such powers to matter. It is in fact a religion, one of great commitment and deep belief and emotion, even rivaling that held by many Christians and pagans.

Committed atheists also always, I mean ALWAYS believe in evolution as the means of both creation and formation of all life forms, and as such they tend to believe lately more and more in punctuated equilibrium, meaning a belief that mankind is due to take a giant leap in its evolution into a superman status. That is, those atheists who are really into evolution enough to follow it through to its conclusions.

Some atheists are just lazy thinkers who have adopted atheism as a sop, and don't care enough to sort out their dogma to any extent, who are just looking for an excuse, quick and easy, to explain God away because they want to do things they know are wrong and it's a lot easier when they can imagine God doesn't exist or care what they do or say. So to invent a "force" a God of forces, like electricity, with magical lifegiving and creative powers but no interest in how men behave, this is convenient for people who want to delve into depraved behavior without the annoyance of a nagging conscience.

[edit on 12-4-2009 by Salt of the Earth]

reply to post by Salt of the Earth


You haven't been listening to anyone but yourself. Atheists say "There is no proof for the existence of God." Distinction is important, and probably beyond most people. Does that include you?

Originally posted by Gawdzilla
reply to post by Salt of the Earth

 

You haven't been listening to anyone but yourself. Atheists say "There is no proof for the existence of God." Distinction is important, and probably beyond most people. Does that include you?

Atheists go past this. They are not open minded. Their minds are closed to the possibility that God exists. They claim to have proofs that God does not exist. They claim evolution is scientific and full of proofs (which it is not). They claim matter is self-existant and not created. It is a religious choice they make, not based on proof, but on faith. Atheism is a religion, and has been declared to be so by the SC, and Secular Humanism and the Humanist Manifesto expresses the creed of the atheist.

So what are you? A committed religious atheist? Or a searching, open-minded agnostic who may be leaning one way or the other in your beliefs?

Originally posted by Salt of the Earth

Originally posted by Gawdzilla
reply to post by Salt of the Earth

 

You haven't been listening to anyone but yourself. Atheists say "There is no proof for the existence of God." Distinction is important, and probably beyond most people. Does that include you?

Atheists go past this. They are not open minded. Their minds are closed to the possibility that God exists. They claim to have proofs that God does not exist. They claim evolution is scientific and full of proofs (which it is not). They claim matter is self-existant and not created. It is a religious choice they make, not based on proof, but on faith. Atheism is a religion, and has been declared to be so by the SC, and Secular Humanism and the Humanist Manifesto expresses the creed of the atheist.

So what are you? A committed religious atheist? Or a searching, open-minded agnostic who may be leaning one way or the other in your beliefs?

You're the closed minded one. You deny the full evidence for evolution, and fear that that evidence has killed your God. Sorry, but it has effectively done that. Good thing, too. Religion has screwed up more people than it has saved.

reply to post by Salt of the Earth


A hard core atheist behaves much like Gawdzilla does. Why dont you just use that as an example.

But he will reject it by saying that you make up your own definitions lol.


Or he will attack you in some other way. He is a teenager.


[edit on 27.06.08 by spy66]

I think what he's trying to say is that atheism is in itself putting faith into not believing in creation. For example scientists must have faith in M-Theory or parallel dimensions, because they cannot physically test these hypothesis and they exist mathematically. Religion puts faith into the fact that there is something that created what the scientists are studying to make sense of. I believe in science AND religion personally, but the choice is up to you. Science cannot disprove religion, and religion cannot disprove science, so I go by both.

reply to post by lastxdance


Again, "faith" is not a word used by rational people. It's woo of, ahem, fundamental proportions. Believers need everyone to have faith or they would look silly for clinging to such a childish system.

Hey, I just jumped on here, and I haven't read all the posts so maybe I am saying something that's already been said--

My husband is an atheist, and he doesn't care at all about religion. He simply doesn't believe in God, afterlife, etc. He doesn't offer any proof because he says it's not up to him to prove a negative. Whenever I discuss spiritual issues with others he tunes out because he says the subject bores him. His philosophy is live and let live. It doesn't bother him at all that his family and extended family consist of Baptists, Presbyterians, Mormons, and Scientologists. When he visits his dad (a Presbyterian minister) he even attends church service, and sits there respectfully in a pew, and doesn't argue or proselytize. I really don't know how he does it. He is a master of tolerance. As an agnostic, religion drives me up the wall, and I can't sit in a church without grinding my teeth.

I also have a couple friends who are atheists. They rarely bring up the subject of religion because it isn't something that interests them. I've never gotten into a discussion with them in which they tried to talk me out of my beliefs.

So what I'm saying here is: don't generalize. Not all atheists carry around a chip on their shoulders. In fact, based on my experience, most atheists are decent people who don't proselytize their "beliefs" and only ask that we return the favor.

reply to post by Charis


I know hundreds of atheists, and they all pretty much have the same position as your husband. The problem lies with people who just can't conceive of someone who doesn't believe as they do. Bigoted attitude.

No no chip in their shoulder, but in the hand or head.(RFID COMING!!!)

www.share-international.org(space brothers? aliens? christ's second coming? The UN)

This star is indeed very real, and it is no star. Its a UFO.

Why did the news cover this guy healing people, and WHY DID THAT ACTUALLY HAPPEN?

Think about it...

reply to post by lastxdance


Thought you goddies would be interested in this.

Talking to God is like talking to a friend

Originally posted by lastxdance
Keep in mind the Earth was not proven to be flat until long after the days of Jesus and the Old Testament at that. Good old Albert Einstein even found E=MC2 in the text of Genesis himself. You were considered a heretic if you believed science over religion 500 years ago, now we can see they can be put together. Why refute the existence of a Creator who oversees the creation rather than embrace the fact that He created it. There is so much design all around the universe; it is based on math and physics. He can also take it all away you know.

Albert Einstein
Science without religion is lame. Religion without science is blind.

There are two ways to live your life - one is as though nothing is a miracle, the other is as though everything is a miracle.

your arguement is solid...but...religion in this country takes off on a entirely ominous path when 7 state constitutions refuse to have an atheist hold office. this is in direct violation of the U.S. constitution, and i'm suprised that those laws are still on the books. sounds like a christian taliban has taken over in these states.

Originally posted by Salt of the Earth


So atheists really worship the atom, as some mysterious almighty, self-existant, eternal thing able to create life in and of itself, to form itself into infinite life forms, to orgnaize itself spontaneously, with an inherent intelligence.



[edit on 12-4-2009 by Salt of the Earth]

Seeing as the atom is the building block of matter and of the mysterious forces contained within the atom create everything we know.

Yeah, I can dig that, I can believe in the atom, I don't even need faith to do it.

Atheists and agnostics, we need a god, we shall call it 'Lord Durt'

As we look at Dirt, we look at ourselves.
We have Dirty minds, DURT is all around us.

Did not John Paul II kiss the dirt when he got off the plane, perhaps he worshipped LORD DURT?

LORD DURT requires no faith, now that I can believe in!