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Israel: Iran Talks Only Within Time Limit

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posted on Apr, 11 2009 @ 09:27 AM
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reply to post by Foppezao
 


Yeah good job digging up old and irrelevant references to make a point which holds no bearing.



Now building 6000 centrifuges will get the Iranians on their way of enriching u-235 but they already have plutonium!


To a MAXIMUM of 4.0%.

All the centrifuges in the world aren't going to do it. Iran needs Zippe-type gas centrifuges which they cannot import.


common u-238 can be bombarded with neutrons to produce plutonium.


Remind me, when did Iran get a hold of a Fast neutron reactor?

Yeah, I rest my case.

Run-of-the-mil fearmongering once more.




posted on Apr, 11 2009 @ 09:53 AM
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reply to post by The Godfather of Conspira
 



Plutonium can also be seperated from the reactors rods, then it may be contaminated but thats the kind of bomb NK probably tested, ugly but deadly..
Now for some reason they have found plutonium in Iran.Many more sources explained that, the reason i posted the 2003 one is because that is a long time ago so you can guess how far they are now?!
.. and the IAEA find it "unexplained" then what the fudge are they doing up there and you believing all these peaceloving crap information they get from Iran.. and fearmongering..
If you see all these parades of long range missiles, Shahabs and what not, you still believe these reactors are only to produce peacefull energy and medical isotopes..for the love of god...



posted on Apr, 11 2009 @ 10:01 AM
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Originally posted by The Godfather of Conspira

There's nothing wrong with enriching Uranium.
It's the degree you do it to and with what methods.


Yes, that is the whole problem. What exactly are Iran's intentions. They are going to tell the world "Why yes we are eventually going to get to weapons grade material". The latest UN report STILL has Iran:

www.iaea.org...



18. The Agency has been able to continue to verify the non-diversion of declared nuclear material in
Iran. However, Iran has not implemented the modified text of its Subsidiary Arrangements General
Part, Code 3.1, on the early provision of design information and has continued to refuse to permit the
Agency to carry out design information verification at IR-40.

19. Contrary to the request of the Board of Governors and the Security Council, Iran has not
implemented the Additional Protocol, which is a prerequisite for the Agency to provide credible
assurance about the absence of undeclared nuclear material and activities. Nor has it agreed to the
Agency’s request that Iran provide, as a transparency measure, access to additional locations related,
inter alia, to the manufacturing of centrifuges, R&D on uranium enrichment, and uranium mining and
milling, as also required by the Security Council.

20. Regrettably, as a result of the continued lack of cooperation by Iran in connection with the
remaining issues which give rise to concerns about possible military dimensions of Iran’s nuclear
programme, the Agency has not made any substantive progress on these issues. As indicated in
previous reports of the Director General, for the Agency to make such progress, Iran needs to provide
substantive information, and access to relevant documentation, locations and individuals, in
connection with all of the outstanding issues. With respect to the alleged studies in particular, an
important first step is for Iran to clarify the extent to which information contained in the
documentation which Iran was shown, and given the opportunity to study, is factually correct and
where, in its view, such information may have been modified or relates to non-nuclear purposes.

21. Unless Iran implements the above transparency measures and the Additional Protocol, as
required by the Security Council, the Agency will not be in a position to provide credible assurance
about the absence of undeclared nuclear material and activities in Iran. The Director General continues
to urge Iran to implement all measures required to build confidence in the exclusively peaceful nature
of its nuclear programme at the earliest possible date. The Director General, at the same time, urges
Member States which have provided such documentation to the Agency to agree to the Agency’s
providing copies thereof to Iran.

22. Contrary to the decisions of the Security Council, Iran has not suspended its enrichment related
activities or its work on heavy water-related projects, including the construction of the heavy water
moderated research reactor, IR-40, and the production of fuel for that reactor.


23. The Director General will continue to report as appropriate.



You make it sound as is Iran isn't even trying remotely to enrich fuel further. They are, and have blocked any attempts to verify what they have done at IR-40. And remember the IAEA can only make accurate statements on what has been declared by IRAN at certain sites. Given their past history of deception, I see no reason to trust Iran on their word.

Sorry.



posted on Apr, 11 2009 @ 10:04 AM
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reply to post by Foppezao
 



Plutonium can also be seperated from the reactors rods,


You're kidding aren't you?

Separating run off from the control rods and attempting to weaponize it despite the fact it's mostly decayed?




the reason i posted the 2003 one is because that is a long time ago so you can guess how far they are now?!


They're so far ahead they haven't even completed construction of the Bushehr enrichment plant.

And Russia is stalling development talks. Bushehr is where the majority of their light-water reactors will be based.


If you see all these parades of long range missiles, Shahabs and what not,


I see ballistic missiles with a maximum range of 2,000km (confirmed).

I see no satellite guidance system capable of relaying targeting data back to Iran to guide the missiles in the first place.

I see no MIRV-capable missiles.

I see easily traceable, mobile TEL launcher sites which any spy satellite in the world can pick out like a sore thumb.


you still believe these reactors are only to produce peacefull energy and medical isotopes..


You see what you want to see.

When you think the only solution to nuclear proliferation is a hammer, suddenly every problem looks like a nail.

Keep up the lies and distortion, I'm sure many people are willing to buy the same crap fed them in 2003.



posted on Apr, 11 2009 @ 10:06 AM
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reply to post by pavil
 



You make it sound as is Iran isn't even trying remotely to enrich fuel further.


Re-read my last posts until your English comprehension skills finally kick in.

IRAN DOES NOT HAVE THE CAPABILITY to enrich the Uranium hexafluoride any further.

Doesn't matter how hard they try. They lack the right reactors, gas centrifuges and fuel.



posted on Apr, 11 2009 @ 10:10 AM
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reply to post by The Godfather of Conspira
 


If I remember correctly, the terms of the agreement with Russia dictate that all spent fuel rods (which Russia are supplying) are returned to them.

I'm not entirely sure what difference this makes, but I thought I'd throw it out for discussion, just in case it had any bearing on the debate.



posted on Apr, 11 2009 @ 10:31 AM
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reply to post by The Godfather of Conspira
 


mostly decayed? and if the reactor is specifically designed and/or operated for weapons grade plutonium production?

Like Pavil said you get your information from sites stating IAEA findings, they find plutonium in waste sites "unexplained"? i bet you haven't red that report already..
And for your information 2000 km[that's metric system] is lfar enough to hit Israel, and in case you forgot Iran already launched a satellite in space, and you know what's next then right?[targeting satellites or ICBM reentry-vehicles]

news.bbc.co.uk...

If only Russia modifies those reactors to the type of their thorium IR-8 research reactors we wont have this discussion, but no Russia gets the fuel spent rods[which i doubt really happens]





[edit on 11-4-2009 by Foppezao]



posted on Apr, 11 2009 @ 12:43 PM
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Originally posted by The Godfather of Conspira
reply to post by pavil
 



You make it sound as is Iran isn't even trying remotely to enrich fuel further.


Re-read my last posts until your English comprehension skills finally kick in.

IRAN DOES NOT HAVE THE CAPABILITY to enrich the Uranium hexafluoride any further.

Doesn't matter how hard they try. They lack the right reactors, gas centrifuges and fuel.


So what can you tell me with certainty what Iran is going to be doing at it's IR-40 site? The IAEA can't and they have major concerns about the design of it since it doesn't seem to designed for the purposes Iran has stated.

Personally I think the Natanz enrichment Facilty is an expensive decoy keeping prying eyes from other sites.

No need to go to the personal tirades ok?



posted on Apr, 11 2009 @ 01:02 PM
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reply to post by pavil
 


What's going on?

Well construction for one. Since Arak isn't finished and won't be until 2011 and criticality won't happen until 2013:
www.webcitation.org...

Until then you're just speculating out of your ass my friend.



posted on Apr, 11 2009 @ 02:00 PM
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Well, no use waiting for it to be completed.

Contrary to the self-proclaimed nuclear physics expert and Iranian intelligence specialist, there's really no telling what is going on. Things can be purchased. Knowledge can be purchased.

The poor Persians have such an inferiority complex after getting kicked around and/or ignored for the past millennia, that they want to have a manly weapon, a nuclear weapon.



posted on Apr, 11 2009 @ 02:35 PM
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reply to post by dooper
 



there's really no telling what is going on.


Which is why I said everyone is still speculating out of their asses with all this "clear & present danger" nonsense.


The poor Persians have such an inferiority complex after getting kicked around and/or ignored for the past millennia,


Yeah, they used to be world's largest empire for a continuous 1,000 years.
They've got some serious chips on their shoulders...


How much longer are you gonna keep bringing that crap into every Iran thread?

[edit on 11/4/09 by The Godfather of Conspira]



posted on Apr, 11 2009 @ 03:43 PM
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reply to post by The Godfather of Conspira
 

Iran has an agenda. One that does not bode well for Israel. The fact is, they want to be the major player in the Middle East, but up to now, they've been an outside joke.

The Arabs don't like them, and they don't like the Arabs.

Just as I said. They're not getting the respect they think they need, and the only way to get that respect is through fear, which is accomplished through having nuclear weapons.

Now that they've threatened Israel's existence, I'd say that is certainly actionable, and long drawn-out talks only delay the inevitable, to the Iranians benefit.

You don't have to like it, but if Iran gets fried, it was their own doing.



posted on Apr, 11 2009 @ 04:22 PM
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reply to post by The Godfather of Conspira
 


Then why does the IAEA have so many questions about the complex? Why is Iran not forthcoming with answers to those questions. They (IAEA) are within their rights to ask these questions and expect answers. You seem to think that that is no big deal, but what kind of reactor are we talking about here? What will it be able to produce?. Yes, the reactor isn't complete but Iran will (2-4 years) soon have a 40MW heavy water reactor, that wasn't really designed for isotope research based on the plans submitted to the IAEA. You connect the dots.



posted on Apr, 11 2009 @ 04:53 PM
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reply to post by pavil
 



Then why does the IAEA have so many questions about the complex?


Most likely because they're puppets who report directly to the UN Security Council which is dominated by the United States and serves to try and give an "air of legitimacy" to it's aggressive foreign policy by mandating resolutions and pre-approval to war, which are basically just Licences to Kill.


Why is Iran not forthcoming with answers to those questions. They (IAEA) are within their rights to ask these questions and expect answers.


The Iranians don't have to say a word. They allow them to conduct inspections, track Uranium hexafluoride movements and that's pretty much all they're mandated to do.

They don't have to grovel to them, you do realise?

You wouldn't be too thrilled to have me going through your house with a magnifying glass either. So can the suspiciousness.


Yes, the reactor isn't complete but Iran will (2-4 years) soon have a 40MW heavy water reactor,that wasn't really designed for isotope research based on the plans submitted to the IAEA.


It's designed for power generation and isotope production, the reason being:

IR-40 sits in the city of Arak, one of Iran's largest industrial centres which is booming and needing exponential amounts of juice yearly.

IR-40 will produce 10-14 kilograms of plutonium as spent nuclear fuel once operational.

Now before you hit the "big red button", realise this plutonium is DECAYED. Hence useless for weaponization unless reprocessed.

Iran doesn't have PUREX hot cells for reprocessing plutonium, which you're beloved IAEA numbskulls have verified:


Iran Nuclear Research Reactor (IR-40) through inspections and design information
verification (DIV). There have been no indications of ongoing reprocessing related activities at those facilities.

www.iaea.org...


You connect the dots.


Hmm I get a picture that looks awfully similar to Iraq.

What do you get?


[edit on 11/4/09 by The Godfather of Conspira]



posted on Apr, 11 2009 @ 05:07 PM
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The NIE that Bush ignored, because he didn't like wht it said, can be found here in PDF format.

Like the man said - a lot of similarities to Iraq...



posted on Apr, 11 2009 @ 05:56 PM
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It seems to me that most of you think Russia is trying to help Iran develop Nukes LOL!!



posted on Apr, 11 2009 @ 06:02 PM
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reply to post by xbranscombex
 


Don't flip the paranoia button please.

Russia is helping Iran build nuclear reactors; as mentioned above, for various purposes such as electrical generation, isotope production and testing purposes.

They're not supplying them fuel, they're not giving them anything more than light-water VVER reactors and they haven't even completed construction of the only enrichment facility they agreed to build.

Russia's involvement on paper looks significant, but it's more ideological than anything.

The Russians just appreciated a man who stood up to that troglodyte-jagoff Bush, who was breathing down their necks about "Cold War tensions" and Georgia.

Hence they gave him a taste of his own medicine. Same old deal.







[edit on 11/4/09 by The Godfather of Conspira]



posted on Apr, 11 2009 @ 06:40 PM
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People seem to be forgetting that since Iran is a signator of the Nuclear Non Proliferation treaty, the US is Obligated to assist them in building nuclear power plants. Given that the US has instead called for embargoes against Iran, it is no wonder that they have been limiting any inspections to the minimum required by law. They have effectively been back stabbed by the US and others.

That being said, All 16 US intelligence agencies have indicated that Iran is not producing weapons grade materials and is not capable of doing so. All this talk about imminent danger of Iran having nukes is simply propaganda drummed up by Israel in their lame attempts to promote War.

Iran has not violated the Nuclear Non proliferation treaty, but Israel who refused to sign, has violated US and international law by trading in US nuclear weapons technology to other nations.

Anyone who has studied Irans electrical generation needs knows full well that they need to increase capacity for todays needs as well as for the future. This is why along with Nuclear power plants, they are actively installing Wind, Solar, and Geothermal power generation capabilities. Would anyone like to make the claim that Iran will use solar mirrors to attack Israel?


Israel is just trying to create a bogey man out of Iran to distract from the war crimes committed in Gaza.



posted on Apr, 12 2009 @ 01:57 AM
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Originally posted by The Godfather of Conspira
reply to post by Dark Ghost
 


Sorry mate, but I think you're being overly-thin skinned here.

This board sees on average 5-10 Islamophobic articles every week. I don't see anyone in good conscience scrutinising them (which are almost always from very biased sources) or questioning the relevance of them. Some of them aren't even proper articles, just links to videos of some nutjob saying something or other.

What I do see though is the anti-Muslim brigade on ATS pile up on the thread faster flies to dog turd and then cry bloody murder when anyone actually tries to defend Muslims, as if you're defending a convicted rapist.

The main stream media may not like Israel, but they hate Muslims even more. I'm sure I don't have to tell you that FOX News, CNN and the BBC are all conservatively-backed and owned propaganda outlets that just thrive on sensationalism.

Yes it does suck seeing people ragging on something for no good reason.

My solution? Suck it up. Everything takes a beating on here once in a while, and Israel and Islam do in equal number especially.


I'm not being thin-skinned. I am simply pointing out what happens here on ATS in so many threads. (BTW, there are far more anti-Christian threads on here than any anti-Muslim or anti-Israel topics.) Even if there are x number of anti-Muslim threads, that does not mean that every article that discusses events in the ME should blame and demonise the nation of Israel and its people.

I agree the media is very sensationalised and most of it is utter garbage. Fortunately, people who have the ability to think can see this and not take what they say too seriously.



posted on Apr, 12 2009 @ 07:52 AM
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Originally posted by The Godfather of Conspira
The Iranians don't have to say a word. They allow them to conduct inspections, track Uranium hexafluoride movements and that's pretty much all they're mandated to do.

They don't have to grovel to them, you do realise?




The IAEA has certain things that member states have to do, which the Iranians have not in regards to IR-40. They didn't submit complete plans for the IAEA to view (like they were supposed to) and have not been allowed access to verify what is exactly being built. Why do the Iranians build a Heavy water reactor supposedly for isotope production without having hot cells as part of the design?

To you, it's ok if Iran masters all phases of the nuclear energy process. So they won't go about reprocessing the spent plutonium eh? Wouldn't that be a "natural progression" of learning the full nuclear cycle?


Iran is proceeding down a very dangerous path, not only for itself but for the entire region. That's why much of the world is concerned.

I don't trust them, and their past and current history of concealment of their Nuclear program still gives me and IAEA reason for concern. What about Iran makes you think they are being 100% forthcoming with the IAEA?



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