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theocracy making the decisions.
Is that supposed to be an poser? If so, go back and read what I said. "ID is not ready to be taught in schools." That's because it's not science. Clear now. Do keep trying, I don't mind pointing out where you fail.
Somewhere we lost track of the difference between Creator and Creation. Some of us are returning to sanity.
Wrong. Of course. I'm saying we forgot who created whom. The Creator was some hairy dude sitting around a fire in a cave, scaring the kids with tales of supernatural beings. Pretty sad when you think about it. IF you think about it. IF you can think about it.
I'm not trying to be your Great Sky Fairy. He exists only in your mind. You sought him out in your imagination. Not hard to find things in there, is it?
Originally posted by Revolution-2012
reply to post by Gawdzilla
Less than sinister, but it's completely wrong to provide philosophy as science. Many philosophies have had scientific grounding, ID does not.
Depending on who's preaching what, spirituality and religion are two different things, I'd say that Creationism and ID are based on metaphysical and spiritual mechanics as to religious indoctrination, none the less -- not science.
Metaphysics investigates principles of reality transcending those of any particular science. Cosmology and ontology are traditional branches of metaphysics. It is concerned with explaining the fundamental nature of being and the world. Someone who studies metaphysics can be called either a "metaphysician" or a "metaphysicist".
The word derives from the Greek words μετά (metá) (meaning "beyond" or "after") and φυσικά (physiká) (meaning "physical"), "physical" referring to those works on matter by Aristotle in antiquity. The prefix meta- ("beyond") was attached to the chapters in Aristotle's work that physically followed after the chapters on "physics", in posthumously edited collections. Aristotle himself did not call these works Metaphysics. Aristotle called some of the subjects treated there "first philosophy".
A central branch of metaphysics is ontology, the investigation into what types of things there are in the world and what relations these things bear to one another. The metaphysician also attempts to clarify the notions by which people understand the world, including existence, objecthood, property, space, time, causality, and possibility.
Before the development of modern science, scientific questions were addressed as a part of metaphysics known as "natural philosophy"; the term "science" itself meant "knowledge" of epistemological origin. The scientific method, however, made natural philosophy an empirical and experimental activity unlike the rest of philosophy, and by the end of the eighteenth century it had begun to be called "science" in order to distinguish it from philosophy. Thereafter, metaphysics became the philosophical enquiry of a non-empirical character into the nature of existence. Thus the original situation of metaphysics being integral with (Aristotelian) physics and science, has, in the West, become reversed so that scientists often consider metaphysics antithetical to the empirical sciences.
Origins of the concept
Whether the complexity of nature indicates purposeful design is a subject of recorded philosophical discourse dating back to ancient Greek philosophy. In the 4th century BC, Plato posited a good and wise "demiurge" as the creator and first cause of the cosmos in his Timaeus. In his Metaphysics, Aristotle developed the idea of an "Unmoved Mover" . In De Natura Deorum (On the Nature of the Gods, 45 BC) Cicero stated that "the divine power is to be found in a principle of reason which pervades the whole of nature." This line of reasoning has come to be known as the teleological argument for the existence of God. The most notable forms of this argument were expressed in the 13th century by Thomas Aquinas and in the 19th century by William Paley. Aquinas, in his Summa Theologiae, used the concept of design in his "fifth proof" for God's existence. Paley, in Natural Theology (1802), used the watchmaker analogy.
In the early 19th century, such arguments led to the development of what was called natural theology, the study of nature as a means to understand "the mind of God". This movement fueled the passion for collecting fossils and other biological specimens, which ultimately led to Darwin's theory of the origin of species. Similar reasoning postulating a divine designer is embraced today by many believers in theistic evolution, who consider modern science and the theory of evolution to be fully compatible with the concept of a supernatural designer.
Intelligent design in the late 20th and early 21st century is seen as a development of natural theology that seeks to change the basis of science and undermine evolutionary theory. As evolutionary theory has expanded to explain more phenomena, the examples that are held up as evidence of design have changed, though the essential argument remains the same: complex systems imply a designer. Past examples have included the eye and the feathered wing; current examples are typically biochemical: protein functions, blood clotting, and bacterial flagella. (See irreducible complexity.)
Barbara Forrest describes the intelligent design movement as beginning in 1984 when Jon A. Buell's religious organization the Foundation for Thought and Ethics (FTE) published The Mystery of Life's Origin by creationist and chemist Charles B. Thaxton, arguing for "Special Creation by a Creator beyond the Cosmos" which holds "that the source that produced life was intelligent". In March 1986 Stephen C. Meyer's review described it as using information theory to suggest that messages transmitted by DNA in the cell show "specified complexity" specified by intelligence, and must have originated with an intelligent agent. In November of that year Thaxton described his reasoning as a more sophisticated form of Paley's argument from design. At the Sources of Information Content in DNA conference in 1988 he said that his intelligent cause view was compatible with both metaphysical naturalism and supernaturalism, and the term intelligent design came up.
Intelligent design deliberately avoids identifying or naming the agent of creation—it merely states that one (or more) must exist. Although intelligent design itself does not name the designer, the leaders of the intelligent design movement have said that the designer is the Christian God. Whether this lack of specificity about the designer's identity in public discussions is a genuine feature of the concept, or just a posture taken to avoid alienating those who would separate religion from the teaching of science, has been a matter of great debate between supporters and critics of intelligent design. The Kitzmiller v. Dover Area School District court ruling held the latter to be the case.
I wouldn't even equate fundamentalism with philosophy. In philosophy you're supposed to THINK. Fundamentalist doctrine mandates against thinking.