Pittsburgh shooter was fan of online conspiracy theories, page 2

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ATS Members have flagged this thread 19 times

reply posted on 5-4-2009 @ 02:06 PM by imitator

reply to post by xmotex

I've said it before, some elements of the right are going off the rails, and there will be violence - and now there has been. There will certainly be more.

as mention by Raist.... "Every crowd gathers its nut cases."

Ah I remember when Dungeons & Dragons was considered as dangerous, but now it's feed to millions of children in video game formats, I'm sure there will be a few that will go off the rails in that as well...BUT.. It's more about the person mental power to handle the capacity of what there doing...It's not what there doing that makes them deadly.

[edit on 5-4-2009 by imitator]

reply posted on 5-4-2009 @ 02:09 PM by MrVertigo

But didn't he attack a center for immigrants?

How does that make sense if he believed that Obama would usher in the New World order & take away his guns?

Wouldn't someone like that attack somewhere else, like maybe a bank, an Acorn center or the FDA?

reply posted on 5-4-2009 @ 02:11 PM by SphinxMontreal

Yeah, the guy murdered three police officers in cold blood JUST BECAUSE he was a conspiracy theorist. The fact that his father abandoned him at a very young age, had relationship problems with his girlfriend, lost his job, was disrespectful to military authority and obviously had problems adjusting to society had ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do with his actions.

It is much easier to lump together a select few and point the finger at them than have society take the collective blame for the many injustices which occur in this world. Just like it is much easier for the media to oversimplify complex human actions than for them to do some real work and research what is the real cause of senseless violence in a society.

reply posted on 5-4-2009 @ 02:15 PM by truth_seeker3

Thanks for the constructive comments. I agree that this man had some problems right, and that the media was trying to lump conspiracy theorists together, and that is just wrong.

It could have been anyone who committed a crime and posted online. The media would say, oh, he was a 'extremist conspiracy theorist'.

I forgot who it was, but I also want to impress the fact that I DO NOT AGREE WITH THE ACTIONS HE COMMITTED. I was not defending him but trying to clarify the actions of the media.

Thanks
truth_seeker3

reply posted on 5-4-2009 @ 02:18 PM by organism315

Has anyone mentioned "Manchurian Candidate" or that this is a "seed" event, that was staged for the purpose of limiting our RIGHT to free speech??

O-315

reply posted on 5-4-2009 @ 02:18 PM by huckfinn

reply to post by SphinxMontreal

yeah, the people who promote his beliefs on these forums probably have the same exact background. some of you really need to think hard about what you're selling; after that, if you still decide to sell it, its fair for a person like me to assume that what happened in Pittsburgh is exactly what you want to happen. Only you want it to happen on a much larger scale.

Someone is sitting behind their monitor quite happy about yesterday's outcome and you all know it.

reply posted on 5-4-2009 @ 02:26 PM by xmotex

Yeah, the guy murdered three police officers in cold blood JUST BECAUSE he was a conspiracy theorist.

Has anyone actually said this, or are you just setting up a strawman?

Obviously the guy had major problems.

Plenty of people here on ATS with extreme views, most of them manage not to shoot anybody

However when you have a big horde of people claiming the US has been taken over by a stealth communist who is going to outlaw private firearms ownership, yeah I'd say that definitely contributes to a climate that encourages violence and mayhem.

Hell if I believed that, I'd be ready to sign up for a violent revolution.

Problem is it isn't a POV even remotely related to reality.

This incident only strengthens my determination to speak out against those who spread disinformation here and elsewhere - the answer to "bad" speech is not censorship, but to speak out yourself.

Deny ignorance, am I right?

reply posted on 5-4-2009 @ 02:37 PM by Seany

Originally posted by huckfinn
reply to post by SphinxMontreal

yeah, the people who promote his beliefs on these forums probably have the same exact background. some of you really need to think hard about what you're selling; after that, if you still decide to sell it, its fair for a person like me to assume that what happened in Pittsburgh is exactly what you want to happen. Only you want it to happen on a much larger scale.

Someone is sitting behind their monitor quite happy about yesterday's outcome and you all know it.

Wow, whos sounding a little scary now

reply posted on 5-4-2009 @ 05:34 PM by HunkaHunka

Heh... the Republican Overlords don't even realize what they have done. They thought they were stirring up the old school NRA as a voting constituency with their "Obama's gonna take yer gunz" rhetoric.

What they did, however, is add fuel to the explosive lunatic fringe of the right.

Get this straight... ANYONE who is an extremist, is one step away from being a terrorist. Whether that be the authoritarian father who regularly beats his children, or the power starved teacher who enjoys breaking the spirit of their students.

This also includes anyone who would take up arms against the public at large.

I hear a lot of Glenn Beck fanatical rhetoric these days, and it is all fuel for lunatics like this guy.

Someone else pointed out that this guy had a lot of other problems that were contributing factors to his atrocities. However, what triggered his sense of validation?

You see, all you have to do to inspire someone to action is trigger their sense of validation. That's how you unleash it in anyone, including yourself.

The trigger in this case is the fear. It's a sense of being cornered.

And what really gets me, is that this, fear, is the grandest conspiracy of them all.

In every age we have extremists, driven by fear. We always are told about how the pilgrims left to find a new world where they could free express their religion. Where in truth they were the extremists of their day who believed they were right for sticking a hot poker through the tongue sinners.

Today the fear of the extremists find "the-powers-that-be" to be the Satan which must be purged at all costs.

I'm sorry, but yes this guy had his own issues, but so do a lot of people today who are also doing similar things. The entire point here, is that Pundit Inspired Radicalism is a real phenomenon, and needs to be addressed.

Is this a call for limitations on free speech? Not at all, it's a call for more free speech centered around calling out lunacy for what it is.

reply posted on 5-4-2009 @ 05:42 PM by ROBL240

I cant help but think that this is a set up by the Government to divert attention from the NY state shooting to this one. From one "conspiracy" to one involving one of our own possibly, just to throw us off the scent.

Wouldnt surprise me in the slightest if this was the case, the guy was most likely completely sane but driven nuts due to inaudiable sound-waves that sent him over the edge.

reply posted on 5-4-2009 @ 05:46 PM by truth_seeker3

What really intrigues me about this article, to add, is that it makes it seem that the shooter was probably among us at one point. If he found prison planet, he certainly found ATS. ATS is basically the largest discussion board for alternative topics, and its quite certain he has read some threads here and its given him so ideas....

By no way I am accusing ATS of motive, but I'm saying at sometimes, we tend to overreact, and sometimes, people believe us sincerely.

reply posted on 5-4-2009 @ 05:52 PM by DrMattMaddix

Originally posted by Raist
reply to post by Walkswithfish

It has nothing to do with CTers as a whole. Every crowd gathers its nut cases.

You have to admit though that places such as ATS quite possibly collect a few more nut cases than many others. Not knocking my fellow members but you can quite clearly see this in some of the posts/threads here on ATS.

I really think this guy was a member here if not a lurker at the very least. If he were a member I would love to see the content of his posts/threads. I think we would clearly see this guy had a screw loose if we did.

Raist

What's a nut case ?? One who controls society via controlling money? ... causing some to commit mindless acts of violence because they no longer have hope? (could happen to any and all of us).
The person that actually commits the crime?

I wouldn't be so quick to say that CT are mentally unbalanced... It's my opinion that those at the top including many Congressional leaders are the nut cases; ego maniacal. I could go on but I wanted to point out subtle conviction of CT and "nut cases".

Rethinking what constitutes a "nut case."

reply posted on 5-4-2009 @ 05:53 PM by sweatmonicaIdo

This strictly contradicts views that are natural on ATS.

Do you even read the stuff on ATS? I can name so many members who share those exact same views.

I think this unfortunate incident should be a wake-up call to all in ATS, especially those of you who subscribe to the conspiracy angle and believe that the current administration will bring about the New World Order.

You call it protecting your constitutional rights and look at what happens: three police officers get killed. These officers violated nobody's rights.

Is this what "protecting the Constitution" is all about to you guys? Is it safe to assume that the next such act of "protecting the Constitution" is the murder of innocent civilians?

Anybody who believes all this talk of socialism and whatnot will not have any effect is kidding themselves. There needs to be more outrage over this.

[edit on 5-4-2009 by sweatmonicaIdo]

reply posted on 5-4-2009 @ 05:57 PM by concerned190

I think the media wants people to know he was a CT so that we all seem crazy, and people will be scared of us because we believe CT and therefor discredit anything we say or stay away from us so they don't get shot(not like we would shoot anyone but you get the point right?). just my 2 cents.

reply posted on 5-4-2009 @ 05:58 PM by HunkaHunka

Originally posted by DrMattMaddix

Originally posted by Raist
reply to post by Walkswithfish

It has nothing to do with CTers as a whole. Every crowd gathers its nut cases.

You have to admit though that places such as ATS quite possibly collect a few more nut cases than many others. Not knocking my fellow members but you can quite clearly see this in some of the posts/threads here on ATS.

I really think this guy was a member here if not a lurker at the very least. If he were a member I would love to see the content of his posts/threads. I think we would clearly see this guy had a screw loose if we did.

Raist

What's a nut case ??

Someone who shoots up innocent people because they are afraid.

reply posted on 5-4-2009 @ 06:16 PM by chise61

reply to post by sweatmonicaIdo

This incident had nothing to do with protecting any rights, nor did it have anything to do with CT's . What this had to do with was an unstable person with multiple problems that went over the edge.

reply posted on 5-4-2009 @ 06:28 PM by Leto

Originally posted by HunkaHunka
This guy is nothing more than someone who has succumbed to paranoia. He is a fear based pariah who, thankfully has been killed.

He's not dead, the guy was wearing a bullet-proof vest. He's currently in the hospital for his wounds to the leg and is fully expected to survive.

[edit on 5-4-2009 by Leto]

reply posted on 5-4-2009 @ 06:49 PM by Raist

reply to post by DrMattMaddix

I’ll tell you what I told another poster in this thread.

Read my post again, in fact read all of them in this thread to understand what I am saying.

It has nothing to do with CTers or ATS. It does have to do with the nut cases that happen to be a member of our group. The nut cases are those who attack an innocent person. In this case the police were responding to a domestic disturbance. Yet he has already stated he feared they would take his guns. This man was unstable thus a nut case. Anyone who walks around in that much fear that they attack others in an unprovoked manner is a nut case. Fear is your enemy control of emotion and reasonable actions are your friend. This guy showed fear and reacted strictly with that emotion making him a nut case.

I am not saying ATSers or CTers are nut cases or I would not have been here as long as I have. I have my own beliefs about the government as a whole and do not see them on the side of the average guy. But I am not going to go out shooting down people for doing their jobs either. I am not sure what else I can say to get you to understand why this guy is considered a nut case but others on here are not. It should be pretty obvious in my opinion why this guy was a nut case and others are not, but hey that is my opinion and I fully believe it is right.

Tell me why he is not a nut case exactly?

Raist

reply posted on 5-4-2009 @ 06:50 PM by sweatmonicaIdo

reply to post by chise61

This guy believed Obama was going to take his guns away. He believes in the New World Order. This guy acted on those delusions.

Say what you will about his instability, but to argue that conspiracy theories and false allegations played not role in this tragedy is just plain ignorant.

reply posted on 5-4-2009 @ 07:02 PM by Raist

reply to post by Walkswithfish

I see. My point though is that people like this man that are currently unstable and already on the verge of snapping are more likely to snap because of things on this forum.

If you feed a hungry pit bull raw meat daily they tend to get a taste for it and will go for raw meat first. Give a super paranoid person this site and they will start to freak out even more. But you know what; there is nothing to do about it. You cannot go through and single out every person doing a background check on them just so they can read things. We have to understand that nut cases will be drawn to places like this and be drawn to the idea of violence against others.

I have seen it myself with people asking about who wants to see rioting, who wants things to completely fit the fan, who wants everything to crumble around them. There were numerous threads about this not so very long ago. The majority of people in that thread wanted everything bad to happen. Maybe to make their own hell better by seeing others suffer, maybe they think that is the only way out, maybe they have just given up. There is no real reason to want wanton destruction of things around you, it show little regard for your fellow man. I have seen a great deal of posters on this board that I am sure are just like this guy, they are just waiting for that certain thread that will cause them to snap, it will happen and it will be brought back to this forum you can bet on it.

Again though there is nothing we can do aside from showing the world the majority of us are not some freaked out nut case waiting to snap and kill others. By doing so we are keeping ourselves from being the next target. Look into the Missouri state militia report that recently got yanked back. Somehow it got into the public, things they did not want us to know. In that report a good deal 70%+ of ATS would be considered as dangerous as any other terrorist because of some of the things they listed as those who might be drawn to a militia. I most certainly would have been considered to have been in the militia because of some of those things. I believe it is what kept me from getting a job with the state very recently as well.

So while the normal person is not affected by the threads here the nut cases that are drawn to us are affected by those threads. We just have to live with that and fight the nut cases while fighting those who are involved in the topics here at ATS.

Raist

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