Its time to defeat the powers that be - by adopting communisim!

An attempt to install communism is like playing with fire. It is akin to playing Russian roulette (no pun). You hold a gun to your head and pull the trigger. If you're lucky nothing happens. If your unlucky you receive the bullet.

The government decides to be communist. If you are lucky you languish in mediocre business efficiency. If you are unlucky a “dictatorship of the proletariat” seizes all power and starts up the camps.

It is fine and dandy to discuss the hypothetical merits and flaws in communism. It is not okay to start such a system with the intent to manage the lives of others.

Another example.

You are driving in your car with some friends. You're trying to get to a concert. You as the driver have been given great authority over the lives of everyone else in the car. Time passes and it is getting late. You, being the benevolent music fan that you are, begin to speed up. Your friends ask you to slow down, but what do they know since they're not driving. You begin to speed up even more, only thinking of the concert at the end of this trip. At this point you are needlessly endangering the lives of your passengers by engaging in such a system of speed. To make a long story short, a sharp curve rolls up and you cannot turn the wheel in time. Into the tree you and your passenger go.

Now the other speeders out there will say, “There is nothing wrong with speeding, it is just that that guy messed up. If I were doing the driving then things would have been much different.” It is not about who can do what. It is about the dangerous and negligent nature of such a practice (or system) from the beginning (especially when you have control over innocent passengers).

Originally posted by count66...........

I'm not saying everything they did was right but you have to understand the context in which they operated.

Its not different then say the many loyalists who were killed post the American revolution.

I understand it perfectly... Communism has tried to spread accross the world by the sword, as Communist/Revolutionaries like yourself tried to claim you know better than the rest of the people what they need through your imaginary utopian/dictatorial state.

The destruction of individualism/spiritualism brought by Communism, does not allow for the people to protest against the injustices of the Communist regime.

The system itself is completely contradictory, meanwhile it claims to represent the people, it does not allow for individualism/spiritualism for the good of the Communist state/Permanent Revolution, hence it does not represent the people.

[edit on 3-4-2009 by ElectricUniverse]

reply to post by count66


Watch that documentary I linked.
It proves a lot more of their 'intentions'!

reply to post by Clearskies


I don't want to diminish the points you raise about atrocities committed during the red terror, but there is a more subtle systematic destruction of human lives taking place right now by governments, and espacially the USA and Canada. How do they do it? We all know stress kills people. The government causes stress in people's lives. Sometimes indirectly, and sometimes deliberately. I rest my case.

IMHO the US constitution was a pretty good document . One that was designed to protect personal freedoms , protect people from national banks , gave the soul right to create money to the government , limit the power of the federal government , as well as many other provisions that were set forth to guarantee individual rights.
But something happened , things have changed . Its not the document , no matter how good it sounds on paper , things can and do change either by the public being coned into giving up rights , greedy politicians selling out there constituents , or back room deals designed to sell national rights to help balance budgets .

No matter what document is followed as a blue print for society there will be those that seek to pervert it for there own needs or goals . We do not get what we pay for , we get what we deserve , by not paying attention , by being lazy , by placing importance on things that are nothing more then diversions . We have allowed this to happen by our inactions and by not paying attention .

IMHO it is to late for things to really change and we only have ourselves to thank and no new document will change things as long as the public allows themselves to be coned by there ignorance or by simply not caring .

What is wrong with capitalism is its exagerated focus on money money money as the reason people take more interesting jobs.. It might be true today.. because capitalism created it!
The choose of a job has much (or used to) to do with personal realization.. and that does not come from money money money.. It comes from a sense of belonging and do things that are recognized by society in general.. And are fun too, in the sense of each individual..
So stop thinking that with more wage equality (not same, but with not as much radical differencies) people would only do basic work..
Dont you think people who make research like what they do? Musicians like also what they do.. In fact its more people with less well payed jobs that hate their jobs.. Not because of money.. Who likes to be janitor?
Stop the excessive money centered argument!

reply to post by John Matrix


And THIS is is the problem!
Why are you asking me what solution I have?

I do not have a solution for you or everyone. I have a solution for myself. That's it.
And I do not want to be governed.
So I don't vote and I don't respect any authority except for when it gives me an advantage. I am my one and only authority!

By asking what to do you give away your freedom!

Originally posted by count66
reply to post by romanmel

 

....As for the religious aspect of your quote, Jesus was probably one of the greatest advocates of True communism who ever lived.

I agree that His teachings on money were certainly closer to communism than any other system, as he encouraged, "...holding all things in common." Isn't it interesting that Capitalist Christians today embrace "prosperity gospel", contray to Christ's own teachings?

Originally posted by Clearskies
reply to post by zolom

 

Whoa there with the 'Fools' label!
In America, we cherish FREEDOM! The ability to live and procure what we need WITHOUT government interference.

When was the last time you tried to start a business and make a buck? You are free to follow the rules, regulations and pay taxes if you can afford it, and if you have any money left to continue your business under the oppressive taxes, rules, and regulations someone is going to file a law suit against you and take everything you own.

So much for your Freedom.

[edit on 3/4/09 by John Matrix]

its great on paper.....but when huamns get ahold of it.....it turns to garbage!

OH dear god, I never thought I would live to see this day.
two lines



[edit on 103030p://bFriday2009 by Stormdancer777]

Originally posted by zolom
reply to post by John Matrix

 

And THIS is is the problem!
Why are you asking me what solution I have?

I do not have a solution for you or everyone. I have a solution for myself. That's it.
And I do not want to be governed.
So I don't vote and I don't respect any authority except for when it gives me an advantage. I am my one and only authority!

By asking what to do you give away your freedom!

Good answer. I could sit down and have a beer or two with a guy like you. Couldn't do it with Bush though.

reply to post by ElectricUniverse


And what rights do we have to our individual freedoms today - zero.

I'm a debt slave to the powers that be, to the 10% who own most of the worlds wealth.

I'm lucky enough even to be a debt slave - a huge minority of humanity don't even have that chance.

As for autocratic socialism being spread by the sword - its no different the the corporate capitalist policies that brought the allies to Iraq for oil.

Originally posted by count66

And what rights do we have to our individual freedoms today - zero.

More rights than in any Communist nation, and we are losing our rights because Socialist/Communist Ideals are being imlemented in the Republic, such as nationalization of all the banks, and before that the Federal Reserve which gave total power over the currency in the U.S. to the bankers, and which enslaved us to money system, envisioned through Socialist ideals, to oppress, and subjugate the people.

Originally posted by count66
I'm a debt slave to the powers that be, to the 10% who own most of the worlds wealth.

And most of it you owe it to Communist China, or Socialist Islamic nations, which have implemented part of the Communist system into their lives.

Originally posted by count66
I'm lucky enough even to be a debt slave - a huge minority of humanity don't even have that chance.

As for autocratic socialism being spread by the sword - its no different the the corporate capitalist policies that brought the allies to Iraq for oil.

You are a slave because you let yourself be a slave... you are right now implementing the right to speech which no one in any Communist nation has, just to save the face of your idealist Communist dictatorship...



[edit on 3-4-2009 by ElectricUniverse]

Sometimes pictures are worth a thousand words

Chinese Communist police beating Tibetans



Chinese Communist police beating Tibetans engaged in a non-violent protest and passive resistance. FACT SHEET: Tibetan Deaths Under China's Crackdown since March 2008 Friday, 20 March 2009

reply to post by Stormdancer777


Correction - Chinese Autocratic Socialists beating Tibetan protestors

OK you're all confused.

There is NO STATE in Communism understand?

Forget about the USSR, Maoist China, Cuba etc and all the other nonsense.
These nations were all capitalist and the means of production were put into something inefficient and oppressive like the government.

When we talk about Communism we talk about what happens after capitalism.
Before capitalism we had feudalism so the capitalists were the most revolutionary as their technologies and ideas lead to some of the most spectacular changes in history.

However what Marx was implying that in this system we have a chaotic and unstable society and economy that leads from one crisis to the next eventually it becomes greater and greater.

Communism is the idea that after Industrial Capitalism collapses the means of production will simply be in the hands of the public and things like money, banks, government, police etc etc will not exist thus it is classless and stateless. Communism in its true form cannot collapse as no monetary system or form of banking exists therefore everyone works to the benefit of themselves and society. Primitive forms of Communism existed throughout history (Think tribal societies that bartered and lived off the land)

Socialism on the other hand is when governments try to achieve egalitarianism under capitalism. If you live in Europe, Australia, Canada or even the United States you will have experienced some form of Socialism via Welfare, Medicare etc etc. Note that even in Cuba people use currency and money so despite this misconception that Cuba is "communist" it is in fact not.

Has anyone seen Zeitgeist addendum? The Venus project? It is a very similar concept to the Venus project. I suggest you all watch it if you get the chance.

Originally posted by count66
reply to post by Stormdancer777

 

Correction - Chinese Autocratic Socialists beating Tibetan protestors

Give me a break.

reply to post by kkklownknight6699


Very well put so thanks for that

reply to post by Stormdancer777


I am by telling you the truth