Millions of US Jobs lost to H1b & H2b Visas

It saddens me to think just how narrow minded Obama was, the other night when he had his town meeting on the internet. The first question posed was a woman who was concerned about the out-sourcing of this country's jobs. Well it goes deeper than that. We have foreigners living in this country, taking good paying, high tech, and administrative positions, while US citizens are being asked to bail out corrupt corporate banks and greedy companies. effectively throwing us under the bus. This is an absolute disgrace! All H1B and H2B visas should be repealed and these jobs given back to the people who deserve them the most. LEGAL US CITIZENS........

What about all of the Americans that are doing the same thing thing in other countries around the world? Sorry to point out the fact that some of the smartest minds working in your country aren't American, yet contribute to it's development on a daily basis. Kicking out all foreign workers would hurt you, more than it would help.

As a former holder of such a visa, I was grateful and excited to be able to work in another country for a few months to a do a hi-tech job that Americans could not or would not do.

During my stay there it struck me that many Americans wanted the high-paying jobs that required the least amount of effort.
This creates a vacuum at the bottom which sucks in workers who are more than happy to do work.

In any event, most countries in the world have foreign workers do jobs that are scarce in their own country: doctors in South Africa, English teachers in China etc.

Don't keep on blaming foreigners for your country's ills. Your country is cheap to live in, yet you say foreigners will do the work for less pay - yes of course they do! They are less spoiled, and don't require large expensive cars and houses.
Expensive electronics like big screen LCD tv's and the latest and greatest gadgets are also luxury items - if you are suffering the pinch and still have such items then you really need to evaluate your apportioning of blame.

reply to post by deltaalphanovember


You really got a hold of that kool-aid, didn't ya!? Here we go again with the old "Jobs Americans won't do" crap. I was a technical recruiter for over a decade. One of my closest friends continues to be a technical recruiter. Whenever a job is posted, as is required by law prior to hiring a foreign national, we would receive several dozen to hundreds of resumes. Today he tells me he is receiving thousands for similar openings. We were almost always instructed to find grounds for disqualification and then proceed to the H1B process. Why? Because foreign nationals will work for less money! So instead of exporting the job and risking the PR nightmare, simply import the slave labor and do it under the radar, all with the blessing of the government!

reply to post by drummerroy39


Ah labour protectionism... the rallying call of the incompetent.

First of all: H1B visas have drastically gone down in number since the economic depression kicked in. The struggle to get an H1B is now fierce.

Second: The number of H1B visas was never a significant part of the labour pool (with the exception of software engineering).

Third: US citizens with value adding skills could always find a job, irrespective of H1B allocations. Only the weakest, most unemployable workers whinge about "foreigners coming and taking our jobs".

Are you a software engineer? Are you a doctor? Are you a rocket scientist? If not, a foreigner probably hasn't taken your job. Foreigners do not take jobs away from US citizens. They supplement the US labour force by plugging gaps and shortages.

Immigration based on the selection of educated, skilled migrants is the best pay to increase prosperity in a nation. Frankly the optimal solution would be to bring in highly educated migrants while simultaneously deporting US citizens who can work but refuse to out of laziness.

Outsourcing is another issue. In that case, a foreigner probably has taken your job. But if he can do the same job for a lower price, why do you deserve it over him? Because you had the good fortune to be born on US soil while he didnt?

reply to post by airteck


Totally wrong in your assessment, because these job's are only supposed to be temporary, which is not the case. At the very least restrict or limit the access to them. FYI any gaps in tech jobs can be easily filled by a US citizen knowing that they are available. Example back in the late 90's there was a serious need for IT personnel. We quickly got the training we needed to fill these positions. So your argument does not hold water.

Originally posted by kozmo
reply to post by deltaalphanovember

 

Why? Because foreign nationals will work for less money!

Yes they do it for less money ... and they survive, and survive well! The foreign worker has realised he doesn't need the "excesses" of an American lifestyle to live decently and support his or her family.

I am glad you got my point.

reply to post by deltaalphanovember


Puh-lease, GIVE ME A BREAK.
Up until a year ago, I was working as a BARTENDER in a resort area for $2.65 AN HOUR (thank GOD for tips), had to drive 36 miles 1 way through a treacherous canyon in an area that gets 500 inches of snow per year.
I wasnt able to afford living closer to work because housing in the area was outrageously expensive ie; $200,000 for a mobile home.
Meanwhile, nearly every employer in the area was bringing in people from Hungary, Checkoslavakia, etc... and providing them with free housing.
I wasnt eligible for the housing because I was a US Citizen (imagine that).
So, here I am, born in the USA, competeing for the same job as a foreigner (who doesn't pay TAXES), earning 1/3 minimum wage, paying $900 mo rent, spending $20 a day just to get to and from work, and you call ME spoiled.
This whole thing MAKES ME SICK.

[edit on 30-3-2009 by Elostone]

Mmm, I wonder where we "true Americans" came from?

Are there any native americans on this thread who might have a legit issue as to how their country was taken from them?

Otherwise, for those who believe qualified immigrants should no longer be welcomed in this country, may I respectfully suggest looking up the word "hypocrisy."

Or does the door slam right behind you?




[edit on 30 Mar 2009 by schrodingers dog]

reply to post by deltaalphanovember


Ah yes, thank you for solidifying MY point. The OATH and PROMISE of the United States Government is to protect the United States and its Citizens. It is NOT to provide for cheaper labor for the corporations. By giving away American jobs to foreigners who are willing to it for less money they are violating their oath! It would be one thing is no American could or would do the job - the difference here is that there are often hundreds, if not thousands, of Americans wanting to do that job at market rate, but the government allows the corporation to insource it to a foreigner at a cheaper rate. These politicians are lucky that the public lynchings haven't begun yet!

Originally posted by schrodingers dog
Mmm, I wonder where we "true Americans" came from?

Are there any native americans on this thread who might have a legit issue as to how their country was taken from them

Actually, yes. I AM Native American...A Proud, Mescalero Apache, Thank You very much.
As far as the "issue" of our land being taken from us, I believe that is an entirely different topic that really doesn't belong here on this thread.

Originally posted by schrodingers dog
Mmm, I wonder where we "true Americans" came from?

Are there any native americans on this thread who might have a legit issue as to how their country was taken from them?

Otherwise, for those who believe qualified immigrants should no longer be welcomed in this country, may I respectfully suggest looking up the word "hypocrisy."

Or does the door slam right behind you?
[edit on 30 Mar 2009 by schrodingers dog]

Oh boy! Are we really going down that road again? This has nothing to do with immigration. This has to do with insourcing jobs to foreigners. Qualified immigrants are, and have always been, welcomed here. Separate issue!

reply to post by Elostone


You're missing the point I'm making.

No American has a legitimate leg to stand on in opposing the very process which got them or their forefathers here.

This country was built on immigration from day one. It is one of its founding principles. We who are citizens are ALL here because of this process and it is not one to be turned on and off at our convenience, lest someone have done the same when our parents were immigrating here.

Originally posted by kozmo
Oh boy! Are we really going down that road again?

This has nothing to do with immigration. This has to do with insourcing jobs to foreigners. Qualified immigrants are, and have always been, welcomed here. Separate issue!

Then you misunderstand the H1b/H2b visa process as that is precisely the issue of the OP.




[edit on 30 Mar 2009 by schrodingers dog]

Originally posted by schrodingers dog
reply to post by Elostone

 

You're missing the point I'm making.

No American has a legitimate leg to stand on in opposing the very process which got them or their forefathers here.

Your missing My point...I am a natural born citizen of this land, as were my forefathers.

This country was built on immigration from day one. It is one of its founding principles. We who are citizens are ALL here because of this process and it is not one to be turned on and off at our convenience, lest someone have done the same when our parents were immigrating here.
No. Not ALL citizens are here because of that process.
Furthermore, these people coming here on work visas are NOT intending to immigrate, they are here to take jobs that we Natural Born CITIZENS NEED.

reply to post by schrodingers dog


Friend, no disrespect to you, but I fear it is YOU who does not understand the purpose nor the the process for H1 Visa as I have worked in the field for over 10 years! As Elostone has so eloquently pointed out you are confusing two entirely different issues. The present H1 Visa discussion does NOT deserve to be tainted with misinformation. Thanks.

The H1/2B problem is not about importing talent. It's about facilitating the dumbing down of the country and infusing the country with people that have no allegiance except to the paycheck. If we can't take care of our own people first we have no chance of a future. A country must have a solid foundation and a solid core or it won't continue to function. That is exactly the goal of the NWO. The imports in high tech from India bring with them the caste system AKA superiority entitlement scam. As they move into management they higher on a discriminatory basis with preference to their own people and often bogus educational degrees. Companies like JC Penney and Verison and Microsoft high them in bulk and get discount rates. These people often work long hours without overtime or compensation because to say no means they may not be kept on by their agency. For that reason they seldom switch agencies. Companies know and exploit this. Many H1s get green cards then sue their former contracting house for the lost wages. The companies like JC Penney just reap the rewards. I have nothing against the people. They often have good character. I have worked with them in many situations. However, they don't have any high degree of intelligence or skill they bring to the table. What they bring is an opportunity for Illuminati franchises to look good by obeying the dictate to hire foreigners. When strife comes to this country they will become informers for the NWO and management personnel perpetuating they hiring prejudices asked of them. They have no other allegiance. That doesn't mean they have a monopoly on corruption but it means they just bend over very well.

Many countries are standing up to foreign workers taking local jobs. The US should throw out the H1s and even the Green Cards in preference for hireing and training born Americans.

reply to post by ReelView


You amuse me with your total inability to maintain your logic system.

The imports in high tech from India bring with them the caste system AKA superiority entitlement scam.

The US should throw out the H1s and even the Green Cards in preference for hireing and training born Americans.

Ladies and Gentlemen, hypocrisy at its finest.

It's little wonder the corporations would rather hire workers who actually work hard, rather than whingers. It's little wonder that your government prefers to import workers who build on their skills to get better jobs and pay higher taxes.

Originally posted by kozmo
reply to post by schrodingers dog

 

Friend, no disrespect to you, but I fear it is YOU who does not understand the purpose nor the the process for H1 Visa as I have worked in the field for over 10 years! As Elostone has so eloquently pointed out you are confusing two entirely different issues. The present H1 Visa discussion does NOT deserve to be tainted with misinformation. Thanks.

*sigh*

The H-1B is a non-immigrant visa in the United States under the Immigration & Nationality Act, section 101(a)(15)(H). It allows U.S. employers to temporarily employ foreign workers in specialty occupations.

The regulations define a “specialty occupation” as requiring theoretical and practical application of a body of highly specialized knowledge in a field of human endeavor[1] including, but not limited to, architecture, engineering, mathematics, physical sciences, social sciences, biotechnology, medicine and health, education, law, accounting, business specialties, theology, and the arts, and requiring the attainment of a bachelor’s degree or its equivalent as a minimum[2] (with the exception of fashion models, who must be "of distinguished merit and ability".)[3] Likewise, the foreign worker must possess at least a bachelor’s degree or its equivalent and state licensure, if required to practice in that field. H-1B work-authorization is strictly limited to employment by the sponsoring employer. H1B

The term "non-immigrant" is used to designate the status of the visa as temporary. However, and you should know this if you are part of the "field" as you claim, that the H1B visa process is widely used as a stepping stone to permanent residence and eventually citizenship.

In fact it is a very efficient and legal way to ascertain immigration eligibility. After all an HB1 visa holder has to show that he/she is highly qualified and able to be a productive member of society for (I believe) 5 or 7 years before being eligible to apply for permanent residence.

So to say that the two issues are separate as you state is disingenuous at best.

So please redirect your "misinfo" accusations elsewhere, may I suggest starting with a mirror.

Oh and by the way, as you also probably know, an HB1 visa has to be renewed every year by the employer with just cause.

There are numerous immigration statutes addressing legal and illegal immigration to the United States, some certainly are faulty, it just so happens that imho the HB1/HB2 categories are by far the least problematic or intrusive to the US labor market.





[edit on 30 Mar 2009 by schrodingers dog]

Originally posted by drummerroy39
reply to post by airteck

 

Totally wrong in your assessment, because these job's are only supposed to be temporary, which is not the case. At the very least restrict or limit the access to them. FYI any gaps in tech jobs can be easily filled by a US citizen knowing that they are available. Example back in the late 90's there was a serious need for IT personnel. We quickly got the training we needed to fill these positions. So your argument does not hold water.

Yep then they outsourced you!! to the tune of 3 Million plus jobs since 00' what you think a bunch of illegal aliens took those jobs...... LOL keep blaming the wrong people (look at the people you voted for, they are the ones...).