Re: Humanoid Aliens

Originally posted by LogicalResponse
Why do UFO proponents, "contactees," "abductees" and other supporters always seem to depict their aliens as humanoid? Why are they insistent that these alleged life-forms follow the human body-plan?

This goes against our understanding of science and all current biological models of how life evolved on earth, let alone other worlds. Even if the entire process of evolution on earth were re-simulated with all of the original parameters of biological genesis in place, we still wouldn't come out looking the same. So why would a visitor from an alien world look like us?

It's a near guarantee that they wouldn't.

Let me give you one example ( out of possible billions: )

Let's start with a world that could serve as a location for our hypothetical biosphere. It's a low-gravity, Titan-like moon with an upper atmosphere saturated in energy rich polymers powered by the radiation and magnetic fields of the central planet. These gradually filter down various strata where assorted types of hunter-gather clades develop alongside other more stationary biota. The entire pace of life is incredibly slow and almost frozen in comparison to our earth-like perception of time. Things live for extraordinarily long periods, and evolution itself takes a virtual eternity to run its course.

Eventually, a sentient race emerges. Their biochemistry is based on liquid hydrocarbons, fullerenes, ammonia and nitrogen causing them to appear as a very large and bizarre crab-like or spider-like configuration that only vaguely resembles anything that we could recognize. They move and function so slowly that they can barely be perceived to be living things at all. Their senses are not visual or aural - instead, relying predominantly on sonar-like transmission and detection. (This means no written language or art, but instead similar concepts being employed with geometric configurations and textures conveying the equivalent.)

These beings become the dominant species of the planet and go on to discover space exploration after millions and millions of years of slow advancement.

Incidentally, long distance or sub-relativistic journeys would not be a problem for this species as the passage of time is not really an issue considering their pace of life and perception. Traveling to a distant star system would be no more strenuous to them than sending someone to the moon is for us. Their technology would be based on cryobiology, developed from low-temperature life feeding on Titan-like or Kuiper-belt environments and growing the necessary structures out of polymers, ice and frozen gas. So, basically some VERY exotic stuff. They prefer to compile constructs in orbit or on dead, moon-like worlds without atmospheres.

Their technology, aesthetics, psychology and even architecture would be absolutely mind-bending to behold. If their machinery were put before a population of human beings for examination, almost nothing useful could be extracted from them aside from the fact that they would be quite obviously "alien." Their 'ships' and other components melt, explode or "die" when exposed to earth temperatures and pressures and any 'probes' sent to earth would have to be "custom-made" to adhere to our planets physical constraints. Their behaviors and methods of construction would be a profoundly disturbing sight to anyone first attempting to make sense out of them, and communication or any relative attempts at contact would be extremely difficult requiring a number of years of careful study.

And that is just ONE example of ONE type of world that life could develop on.

This does not take into account how gaseous, Jovian life would develop if it became sentient. (But it's probably safe to say that they'd probably make the guys I just described look pretty normal in comparison.)

My point is this: Considering the possibilities of life in the universe, how intelligent life developed on earth, and how the mechanism of evolution itself works - the idea of humanoid aliens is absurd

[edit on 3/29/2009 by LogicalResponse]

[edit on 3/29/2009 by LogicalResponse]

Even Alien Beings will need similar things to us.

They have to be mobile
They have to be able to make tools

Two legs would be preferred, could be hairy or bare or scaled or plated
Even fingers, nature worked out a long time ago 5 fingers works best.
You would need some type of hand, claws would be useless to make tools.
Likewise with suction cups or claws.

So the basic shape, is pretty much the best shape to be successful and
Intelligent. Only leaves size, skin, color, hair, eyes, head shape etc.


The aliens at the start of The Fifth Element, would not make sense in reality.
Their inability to make tools of any description, they were just big, clumsy.
If you can't make tools, you can never get off the planet.

reply to post by mystiq

you'd have to be pretty closed off in your thinking not to start to connect dots, even if you've never seen a craft in the skies.

You know this is the whole crux of the matter. This is what separates an intelligent person from a non-intelligent person. An intelligent person and a non-intelligent person may have the same information available to them, but the intelligent person will be able to connect the dots properly, while the non-intelligent person will not be able to.

The ability to synthesize is what characteristizes intelligence. Nothing is a hidden from anybody, especially with the advent of the web where virtually any kind of information can be accessed. It is curious, na? With a site like ufoevidence.com available in plain sight, UFO's would be still be a controversial issue? Everything is there in plain sight if you are intelligent enough to see. Aliens, spirits, paranormal abilties, afterlife, time travel or whatever is right there at your fingertips. Nothing is hidden.



[edit on 31-3-2009 by Indigo_Child]

Originally posted by Indigo_Child
Everything is there in plain sight... Nothing is hidden.

Well as the saying goes, there are "none so blind as those who will not see"

[edit on 31-3-2009 by Malcram]

Originally posted by skeptic_al
They have to be mobile
They have to be able to make tools

That is the only thing you got right. The rest is speculative and subjective, born of an arrogance that the human-form is the pinnacle of evolution and cannot be competed with or improved upon.

reply to post by Indigo_Child



In other words, there is no room for genuine disagreement; if someone does not agree with you, they are stupid.

reply to post by SaviorComplex


Nope. Have you noticed that some have told you to read properly? Heres a bit of advice, when you read something take a pause, read every word without any judgement, understand the whole thing, and only then judge it.

I never said that those who don't agree with me are stupid. Read the post again.

Originally posted by Indigo_Child
Nope. Have you noticed that some have told you to read properly? Heres a bit of advice, when you read something take a pause, read every word without any judgement, understand the whole thing, and only then judge it.

I never said that those who don't agree with me are stupid. Read the post again.

Do not play semantic games. And do not try to spin it. We are far more intelligent than you give us credit for, even if we do not agree with you.

Please, tell me what I am misreading...

Originally posted by Indigo_Child
An intelligent person and a non-intelligent person may have the same information available to them, but the intelligent person will be able to connect the dots properly, while the non-intelligent person will not be able to...Everything is there in plain sight if you are intelligent enough to see. Aliens, spirits, paranormal abilties, afterlife, time travel or whatever is right there at your fingertips. Nothing is hidden.

reply to post by SaviorComplex



I do not see any signs of intelligence if you lack basic reading ability.

You have still not shown me where I've said, "those who do not agree with me, are stupid"

Originally posted by Indigo_Child
I do not see any signs of intelligence if you lack basic reading ability.

You have still not shown me where I've said, "those who do not agree with me, are stupid"

Did you not notice the qualifier "in other words?"

It is clear from your words that is your meanings. Intelligent people have put the dots together concerning UFOs, aliens, and so forth; those who have not (ie; disagree) are unintelligent. Again, your words:

Originally posted by Indigo_Child
An intelligent person and a non-intelligent person may have the same information available to them, but the intelligent person will be able to connect the dots properly, while the non-intelligent person will not be able to...Everything is there in plain sight if you are intelligent enough to see. Aliens, spirits, paranormal abilties, afterlife, time travel or whatever is right there at your fingertips. Nothing is hidden.

Instead of dodging the issue and insulting me, you can tell us where I am misreading.

We are all humanoid because we all come from the same source.

We are, after all, one.

Over and out
Twisted-Inside-Out

reply to post by Twisted-Inside-Out


I like the rhyming!
Nice!

Originally posted by Indigo_Child
reply to post by mystiq

 

The ability to synthesize is what characteristizes intelligence. Nothing is a hidden from anybody, especially with the advent of the web where virtually any kind of information can be accessed. It is curious, na? With a site like ufoevidence.com available in plain sight, UFO's would be still be a controversial issue? Everything is there in plain sight if you are intelligent enough to see. Aliens, spirits, paranormal abilties, afterlife, time travel or whatever is right there at your fingertips. Nothing is hidden.

[edit on 31-3-2009 by Indigo_Child]

Indigo_Child,

I've enjoyed and agreed with your posts so far, but I'm very skeptical of anybody who claims to know the truth about the subject of UFOs/Aliens. Maybe I misunderstood?

reply to post by SaviorComplex


Ah, you see that is different. The ability or inability to connect the dots together is not the same as disagreeing with someone. You can disagree with me if I say, "marmite is bad" that does make you stupid. However, if you disagree with valid reasoning, that is what makes you stupid.

Pattern recognition is fundamental to all intelligence.

Look it is the same as conecting the dots together in a detective investigation. Somebody who can do that is called intelligent, this is why we tend to think of the detective figure like Sherlok Holmes as intelligent.

How does this relate to aliens, paranormal, spirits or whatever. There are some who have been able to connect to the dots, and those who have not.
There is no mystery. They are all in plain sight. There is enough evidence to explain everything. I am sorry you are struggling. For me it is obvious. Proof by reason.

[edit on 31-3-2009 by Indigo_Child]

Its also obvious, you're actually expected to ignore your own eyes, with so much of this evidence. An example, when my kids and I saw the first of many crafts, on April 12th, this after quite a few years between sitings, and never questioning many signs of their involvement, I was first alerted to them by a psi contact inside our home a direct answer to my line of thought, and was frozen to the spot so I couldn't move. Then I go outside and this craft moves in to position itself over the evergreens, hovering. Not a bird, not a balloon, not millitary craft by the psi contact, not plane (not only do we see many of those but they do all fall into certain looks, sounds, speed, and clearly observable facts. Not only that, but my oldest childrens grandfather owns his own general charter service and his brothers, their great- uncles own BC Coastal airlines. Not without knowledge of planes), definately not a helicopter. Its oscillating, blinking back and forth quickly to the side, and all my kids great it. One runs to the fence, arm extended, yelling "we come in peace!" The other climbs the shed out back waving excitedly. This thing was observed by all of us, 5 people, and we knew it what it was. I'd even experienced contact from it, for 5 minutes of hovering.

Its all about believing people. We've also had black triangles directly over our roof and out back, and hover monitoring the house according to my 17 year old who was just as alarmed as me. They're soundless but make a vibrational sensation, they also probably belong to the renegades connected to our leaders.

Thats just amongst some eye witness accounts (ours) of some crafts. There were many sitings. But other things involved me when I was young, and my son in September, actually siting a grey. His was prior to sleep, but alarming only until it calmed him down. He was not paralyzed and had turned on all the lights to explore inside and out because the cat was standing at glass sliding doors, looking up into the right corner and growling, in an unusual way for quite some time. Then, after he laid on the couch with all the lights out, he saw what the cat was looking at, and just as he jumped his skin, he calmed down and was admonished for being awake still (he'd been up till 2 in the morning playing video games!) Since he recognized the grey and knew they were very nice people, he told me, he willingly went to sleep.

Those are personal testimonies.

Now, as to connecting dots and our "lying eyes". Look at the photos on marsanomalyresearch.com. My native friend for years asked me, "what do you mean trees on mars?" Well, I showed her the aerial shots and the comparison shot of japan's forest from on high. A huge smile broke over her face. She doesn't need a nasa disinfo campaign to know what she was looking at. Trees and lakes, fresh standing water that there was evidence of photo tampering on, on Mars!! Anyones eyes can see it. In fact, what it takes to not call a spade a spade is amazing, convuloted jumps of illogic. Our eyes and minds work just fine.

[edit on 31-3-2009 by mystiq]

[edit on 31-3-2009 by mystiq]

[edit on 31-3-2009 by mystiq] added because my typing doesnt keep up with my thoughts.

[edit on 31-3-2009 by mystiq]

reply to post by Indigo_Child


That is rather arrogant of you. You presume to know the "truth," anyone who disagrees with your conclusions is not just wrong, but stupid. There is no room for any argument or discussion.

[edit on 31-3-2009 by SaviorComplex]

Originally posted by Nichiren
I've enjoyed and agreed with your posts so far, but I'm very skeptical of anybody who claims to know the truth about the subject of UFOs/Aliens. Maybe I misunderstood?

No, Nichiren. You did not misunderstand. You are just dumb, at least according to Child.

reply to post by SaviorComplex


Then I am arrogant

If somebody started debating with Sherlock Holmes once he solves the case, what would Sherolock Holmes response would be? It sounds like you would think it is arrogance.

There is nothing to solve here. There is no mysterty. We can explain UFO's. Period. The case has been solved, it was solved ages ago. Read my thread, "Debunking Pseudoskepticism" for valid arguments, which so far have not been refuted by anybody on how we can explain UFO's by ETH.

Nothing is a mystery, everything exists in plain sight, if only you are smart enough to see. Sorry if that implies the people who can't see are stupid.

[edit on 31-3-2009 by Indigo_Child]

Originally posted by Indigo_Child
If somebody started debating with Sherlock Holmes once he solves the case, Sherolock Holmes response would be?

You do realize Sherlock Holmes is a fictional character, right?

Originally posted by Indigo_Child
There is nothing to solve here. There is no mysterty. We can explain UFO's. Period.

Is that so? Interesting. I am sure the UFO community will be very interested to know you have solved it.

Originally posted by Indigo_Child
Read my thread, "Debunking Pseudoskepticism...

You mean the thread where full of strawman arguments wherein you tell people they are not allowed to disagree with you, and where you confuse browbeating and silencing your critics with proving your hypothesis? No thank you, made the mistake of walking in to that mess once already.

Originally posted by Indigo_Child
Nothing is a mystery, everything exists in plain sight, if only you are smart enough to see. Sorry if that implies the people who can't see are stupid.

Thank you for telling us all we need to know about you. Fact is, in thread after thread, you have demonstrated you have no desire to discuss or debate anything, resorting to insults when someone disagrees.


[edit on 31-3-2009 by SaviorComplex]

Originally posted by SaviorComplex

Originally posted by Indigo_Child
If somebody started debating with Sherlock Holmes once he solves the case, Sherolock Holmes response would be?

You do realize Sherlock Holmes is a fictional character, right?

Damn, and here was I thinking that he was real and it was actually Arther Conan Doyle that was the fictional character!

You are good at pointless quibbling. I'll give you that.

You mean the thread where full of strawman arguments wherein you tell people they are not allowed to disagree with you, and where you confuse browbeating and silencing your critics with proving your hypothesis? No thank you, made the mistake of walking in to that mess once already.

No, I mean the thread where you walked in crying that it was demonizing you and other skeptics, despite it being clarified several times in the thread by myself and others that it was about debunking fallacious arguments, funny eh, the thread is also tagged with "common fallacious arguments" Also the thread from which you put your tail between your legs and ran away from

Not a single argument was refuted in that thread. It was the most spectacular display of just how illogical the arguments of pseudoskeptics are. You are always welcome to return and try and refute the arguments. But this time go there to do that and not to cry about the persecution of your kind

Thank you for telling us all we need to know about you. Fact is, in thread after thread, you have demonstrated you have no desire to discuss or debate anything, resorting to insults when someone disagrees.

It's simple logic really. Opps sorry, simple for beings who are intelligent enough to reason. UFO's do not belong to us, they belong to another, and if us is human, then another is non-human. Cased solved. Geez, can you believe that there are people who say this is some deep mystery?

[edit on 31-3-2009 by Indigo_Child]

Wow, This is a heated thread.
Personally I dont see any problem with huma
noid aliens whatsoever, as much as you can argure that its not likely, its just as likely , it makes sense that if an advanced alien race got here in physical craft and can manifest physically, that they would thusly be able to operate tools, and I think our own planet is proof of how efficient the humanoid form is at building and using tools.

Ultimatly our science could and in most cases does have the wrong idea when it comes to the origin of life, what it is that governs life and how that effects the morphology of life.

I dont mean to say I know everything, however what I do know is that it is becoming less and less plausible to believe mainstream science, with its history of dogmatism and suppression, only recently I nearly got sick at how the BIG BANG was so matter of factly presented on a new program, same with black holes and neutron stars.