Jason, may I ask the background of your objection? Is it religious, a moral thing, etc?

nope.... fertilizer doesnt live, its just food. The tree can grow without it, maybe not as good, maybe not in the same place but it can.

without sperm on the other hand you can't have an abortion. But let me tell you a little story:

When my mother had her 2nd child the doctors told her she couldnt get pregnant anymore. (guys, never trust *anybody* on that subject!)
And actually for a few years it looked like they were right. But then guess what: she got pregnant again and the doctors told her that she propably wouldnt survive giving birth again. So an abortion was recommended.
In a very, very last minute decision my mother decided "no" (she was in the hospital already, waiting for it)

And thats why i am here typing *waves*

now, when i was 14 or 15 we had a discussion on the subject in school. i told my mom about it and she told me the above story, very matter of factly, being convinced that i already knew it, and that she had told me about it at least 100 times. (guess i was kinda there with her, from her prespective)

At first i was shocked. And then i thought about it: "what would it have meant for me if i got aborted?" and the stunning result: nothing. nothing at all. sure, some fun stuff i wouldnt have done, some challenging stuff i wouldnt have done, i wouldnt have done .... pretty much anything at all really. But i also wouldnt have known that it would have been possible for me to exist. since i would not have existed, you see?

So: you cant ask the foetus how it feels about it, but you can ask me, and i am pretty much the closest to an aborted person you will ever meet. there are propably quite a few who are as close but closer is impossible. And i can therefore tell you: the foetus doesnt care. he doesnt know. nor will he ever.

The womans choice and always should be.I didn't watch the video and dont need to,nothing and no one should dictate to a woman about such a matter.

I support a woman's right to choose what she wants done to her body and with her baby.

I don't think the government has any right to interfere with personal decisions like that.

And if abortion becomes illegal, herbs and techniques like menstrual extraction instead and work around the law to do what is better for themselves.

Many, many women have abortions. Many don't. And they are the only ones who have a right to decide what happens in the end, in combination with their partner or parents or close friends who they trust.

I assure you we all know at least one person who has had an abortion. They are not evil, heartless murderers. It's better to have an abortion if you're not ready, than give a child up to overfilled adoptions agencies to go through a life of foster care, or to not be able to properly care for your child.

The end. In my opinion. As many of you know, this is the issue where... if the US makes abortion illegal... my own personal rights have been infringed on and I leave the country. End of story, end of everything. Doesn't matter what they say about the death penalty or stem cell research, it might for some people, but this is the case where it is MY body, my RIGHT to take Plan B, and if abortion becomes illegal, so will birth control pills eventually, and it will be a disaster. If you don't want to do some gross surgery for it, there are other methods (yes, with higher risk and less guarantee). But honestly, if you're not the one who is pregnant and questioning your ability to have a child, you really shouldn't have a say in the matter. It's personal. And it's going to stay legal for awhile. And I will be happy with that. If it is made illegal, I'm out. And I'd probably end up so sick of ATS if that happened because of things like this that I would leave the site, too.

Making it illegal will be cause for more risky black market abortions. Really, I do support abortions. In fact, I support abortions up until the time when you find out you are pregnant plus one month. If by month 6 you aren't sure and just find out, then I support month 7 abortions. Babies cannot live by themselves in any case, and really... just... do you think miscarriages are awful, too? Natural abortions? What about birth control? What about donating eggs to research? I support all those things, lots of people don't, but to me what is best is what is best for the mother. Not the baby. The important person is the one with an established livelihood- the mother. Not some immature organism that cannot provide it's own food or communicate it's needs enough to just go out into the world.

I don't need to defend myself to you or to anyone else. I've seen videos. My mother has been present for abortions because she is a midwife. She has also seen many, many still births from natural complications of pregnancy. And we both know many women who have had abortions.

This is just one of those things, like me loving Obama, that's not going to change. People hate me for it, whatever, but really I'm a female, I have a uterus, I could get pregnant, and if I did (with using protection and being careful and responsible anyway) I would get an abortion. I am not ready to be a mother. Some women are. But it's my decision. A baby is not a citizen of the country, they are not directly protected by the constitution, and even if they WERE (might be, who knows), the LIBERTY of the mother who is a full citizen overrides the LIFE of the baby, whose LIBERTY may also be better off in the long run if they are not born into a family with perhaps one mother who is not a graduate and who has no job, or to a mother who may not be able to care for the baby for some reason. And also, in many cases, abortions take place to protect the health of the baby, mother, or both.

Some species eat their young. I mean, honestly.

I don't want to see that crap and if you had a decent argument to present you wouldn't have resorted to embedding it here.
It's really a pity too because I am sympathetic for the most part. But, there is no way I'm going to even try to convince this crowd one way or the other. You might as well go piss up a tree, Pal. Go find better arguments if you insist on discussing it here.

didn't watch the video, but will state my position, and why I hold it!!
to put in plain simple terms, giving birth comes with risks to the mother's health and life! it presents less risks to others, and grave risks to some. and well, what can I say, as long as that risk is pooh-poohed even after doctors attest to the fact....like the case of the young girl that recently aborted twins!! well, pooh, pooh to you too!
giving birth comes with risks and NO ONE has the right to tell anyone that they should sacrifice their life or well being for another person!

anyone who disagrees with that last statement will have to have some explaining to do, because by God, we just bombed the hades out of two countries on a percieved risk to our nation's well being and the well being of our lifestyle.

don't expect more from the women than you men can muster up yourselves!

Oh i didnt doubt. I found it unlikely, and after googling: It *is* unlikely... and she was older than me.

So: yep, there are some cases but one must also see that those are cases where something went wrong, and when medicine goes wrong the results usually aren't pretty. Not to mention that the risk of something going wrong is higher if you have to get it through shadier channels than the local hospital.

But i am curious: if you talked to her, did you ever speak about the "what if" szenario? I mean: If i got aborted i wouldnt be here. would i mind? How the hell could i mind? i wouldnt be here.

Originally posted by debunky
But i am curious: if you talked to her, did you ever speak about the "what if" szenario? I mean: If i got aborted i wouldnt be here. would i mind? How the hell could i mind? i wouldnt be here.

NO, the times I met her, I was still at an age where I would never ask a question like that. I was very much in a place where I simply believed what I was told and didn't question it. THat's what happens when you go to a Private Christian School for 9 years and your parents are actively involved in the Pro-Life movement. When you're 13 and made to block an abortion clinic's door, while in the midst of it, you don't have time to think about the other side. Looking back, it's a sad thing.