Mexican's sneeking back into Mexico - Wow, I love it ~!

Originally posted by Armour For Victor
reply to post by jfj123

 

Well for one thing i never said that most do. I said some do.

Yea, im a criminal, i have no problem helping those who are willing to risk everything for something better.

Wont hesitate to do it again either.

Peace!

Maybe you should attract LEGAL workers with a livable wage rather relying on illegals to do your nasty jobs for next to nothing. I KNOW Abercrombie doesn't market towards the minimum wage crowd, yet they expect to run their store on minimum wage labor.

Attitudes and underhanded practices like this are what keeps these people coming, most of whom are chasing that elusive dream only to be taken advantage of by stores like Abercrombie.

Thats just wonderful - hiring illegals to fold shirts made in Bangladesh by a 6 year old. I'll never shop there again.

Originally posted by jfj123
Originally posted by Armour For Victor

I'm all for helping people within the bounds of the law.
I own a construction company and I've gone without pay for months so my employees could still pay their bills. By the way, I'm not rich by any means and over those months, I could barely pay my own bills. My point is that I'm all for helping people out within the system but many illegals abuse the system which costs me money I don't have and force me to make decisions that hurt my employees. How is that fair?

Oh, no im not assuming you are rich, niether am I. And i get it, help within the limits of the law. But how can you support your own coountry when you have poor people living under bridges, in alley ways and corners of streets you never even heard of. What about those people? This country doesnt little for them. Instead all the money goes for the bankers and wall street workers. Instead worrying about helping people who have no papers because they can be criminals or worst you can become one worry about the true criminals stealing money right in front of you. Like I said i wont leave a starving man woman or child in the streets because he has no papers and oh no the police will charge me for helping them. I say to hell with them. Ill give you a job so long as you work your a$$ off and you stay out of trouble. I dont see anything wrong with helping people regardless of their legal status.

Peace!

Originally posted by jfj123

Originally posted by nwosigns
reply to post by jfj123

 

Sadly, he had about 40 resumes from detroit, you know, out of work auto workers. He showed me some of their letters declining the job, and they all pretty much said the same thing....

I need more money.

Truly sad.

I find that hard to believe.
The only possibility is that he wanted massive amounts of experience with little pay.
I know quite a few engineers and they're desperate to work and would have gladly taken 40k if it were a reasonable job.
I think there's more to this then meets the eye.

What, that there were people turning down jobs or that they, being from Michigan turned them down?

Nothing complicated, straight forward Mechanical Design Engineering JOB.

No strings, no hidden fees, no agenda. People simply want more money. They think tha because of experience and this, that or the other, they should be paid 10-20-40% above someone else.

This economy will not allow it. The sooner ALL Americans come to that realization, the sooner people can get back to work. It's the same as the Housing Market. THere is no way, that housing will return to the levels of before, no way no how.

Our economy is in a tailspin, and the "Plunge Protection Team" is doing everything to either manipulate or soften the blow in the stock market.

I read Every Letter.
.. accustomed to a standard of living...
... I need more money to pay my bills
... my experience is commensurate with someone making 65k
... I can't afford to live on that..
... etc.

My friend is the nicest person I know, so it's not a management issue. The work is pretty straight forward engineering, so its not the work. The benefits are excellent with 90% matching on medical.

What else can I tell you. Americans want to be paid more, in an economy that cannot sustain the employment. This is what they mean when people say, 'tighten that belt buckle".

The glory days of high salaries are a thing of the past... er... well except for Banking Execs.

Originally posted by Next_Heap_With
i wonder what you guys think about the rest of the iimmigrants - the ones that came here legally and learn the languague, pay texes, and basically bacame "americanized" (but they are living illegally)

[edit on 24-3-2009 by Next_Heap_With]

[edit on 24-3-2009 by Next_Heap_With]

Well I'm a legal immigrant to the US on a Refugee Pursuant Status under form I-94. I have an indefinite stay in this country. There are things you can do to have your Visa extended BEFORE you have to leave. Part of it is applying for a renewal of your work permit for 4 to 5 years every year and pay the money to do so. Pass a back ground check, and make sure you declare your intentions with the correct form before EVER entering the country or applying for a certain type of Visa. I feel that if they can't stay on top of the paperwork then they should not be surprised when ICE comes knocking on their door.

Illegal immigrants cut in front of the line to those of us trying to follow the rules. And often their intentions have nothing to do with bettering themselves or their respective communities in what one would assume would be their new home, the USA. They have no allegiance to this country, they only want to be here as long as they can while they milk for as long as they can. And rather than demanding the change from their own government, they come here and demand it of ours.

[edit on 24-3-2009 by projectvxn]

reply to post by slicobacon


LMAO!!! well for one thing, i use to work ther and yes that place is horrible dont like it. But it was a job i needed and a job they offered. As far as the people who worked over night. They were the only ones who applied the others who i hired would slack off, legal or illegal, got rid of them. Those who stayed were the hard workers, so happen they were illegal, not my problem, they want to work i had it for them. As far as the wage, it was 8 dollars an hour, if they needed days off i would give them the days no questions ask. We would play music and talk and keep the enviorment entertaining while we worked. I didnt just sit my butt down and supervised i worked with them. i talked to them. Before i left they through a suprise party in the food courts for me, to show that they had appreciated me helping them. I will never forget that.


Peace!

[edit on 24-3-2009 by Armour For Victor]

Originally posted by Armour For Victor

Originally posted by jfj123
Originally posted by Armour For Victor

I'm all for helping people within the bounds of the law.
I own a construction company and I've gone without pay for months so my employees could still pay their bills. By the way, I'm not rich by any means and over those months, I could barely pay my own bills. My point is that I'm all for helping people out within the system but many illegals abuse the system which costs me money I don't have and force me to make decisions that hurt my employees. How is that fair?

Oh, no im not assuming you are rich, niether am I. And i get it, help within the limits of the law. But how can you support your own coountry when you have poor people living under bridges, in alley ways and corners of streets you never even heard of. What about those people? This country doesnt little for them. Instead all the money goes for the bankers and wall street workers. Instead worrying about helping people who have no papers because they can be criminals or worst you can become one worry about the true criminals stealing money right in front of you. Like I said i wont leave a starving man woman or child in the streets because he has no papers and oh no the police will charge me for helping them. I say to hell with them. Ill give you a job so long as you work your a$$ off and you stay out of trouble. I dont see anything wrong with helping people regardless of their legal status.

Peace!

The problem is that those illegal workers typically don't pay into the system via taxes so we get to pay for them.
They use our health care but don't pay for it, so we do.
They don't carry insurances' such as car insurance so we pay for their rates.
and the list goes on and on.
The reality is that we need to help our own countrymen first before we start supporting another countries citizens. I know it sounds cold but the reality is that the US cannot continue supporting illegals as they are a drain on our economy.

On a side note, I'd like to see an amnesty program that would work like this:
If you are currently an illegal living in the US and would like to become a citizen, and as long as you have not committed a crime, you can join the military for a minimum of 5 years.
year 1 will be used to acclimate the illegal to US customs, language, etc..
years 2-5, they will serve their new country and if discharged honorably, will become a US citizen with all it's benefits.
Failing that, they should be removed from the US to their country of origin.

You know what, I'll laugh about this untill the tears dry up. I can honestly say, with out remorse, that I am all for IMMIDIATE deportation of anyone that is here illegally. That goes for Europeans, Koreans, Austrialians, Mexicans, any one that is not from HERE!!

ALSO- this one vexes me more than anything else, NO ONE in this country, and ENGLISH SPEAKING country, should be required, or even asked to learn another language. If you want to, please do. I just think it's wrong for us to force our own people to know another language for certain jobs other than interpreters. They get paid to do it, let them translate to the people that don't want to learn english. I'm NOT, nor will I EVER learn spanish or any other language. Not because I don't want to, but because I am incapable of doing that. I should not feel alienated in MY OWN country, one which I fought and gave SO VERY MUCH for, because I don't know Spanish.

That's my PATRIOTIC two cents.

Originally posted by projectvxn

Originally posted by Next_Heap_With
i wonder what you guys think about the rest of the iimmigrants - the ones that came here legally and learn the languague, pay texes, and basically bacame "americanized" (but they are living illegally)

[edit on 24-3-2009 by Next_Heap_With]

[edit on 24-3-2009 by Next_Heap_With]

Well I'm a legal immigrant to the US on a Refugee Pursuant Status under form I-94. I have an indefinite stay in this country. There are things you can do to have your Visa extended BEFORE you have to leave. Part of it is applying for a renewal of your work permit for 4 to 5 years every year and pay the money to do so. Pass a back ground check, and make sure you declare your intentions with the correct form before EVER entering the country or applying for a certain type of Visa. I feel that if they can't stay on top of the paperwork then they should not be surprised when ICE comes knocking on their door.

Illegal immigrants cut in front of the line to those of us trying to follow the rules. And often their intentions have nothing to do with bettering themselves or their respective communities in what one would assume would be their new home, the USA. They have no allegiance to this country, they only want to be here as long as they can while they milk for as long as they can. And rather than demanding the change from their own government, they come here and demand it of ours.

[edit on 24-3-2009 by projectvxn]

Welcome to the country and thank you for doing it the right way even though it's a bit of a pain.
I'm giving your post a star as it's loaded with common sense which this thread has been lacking to this point. GOOD POST !

reply to post by jfj123


well, i was agreeing with everything you were saying until you through in the military in the mix I didnt have to serve the military. Do you realize how many Illegals are in the army now and probably wont make it to citizeship. and also there are plenty of people legal now who dont pay taxes, plenty who dont have car insurance, but thats not your point and i get it. We need to treat those who are legal and are avoiding taxes first before those who are doing it and are illegal. I comepletly agree with you, my point from the very beging of this thread was the fact that people ddehumanize them and treat them inhumane and laugh at them, and thats what is wrong. Not stating that you are but the SOME are.

Peace!

Originally posted by Seitler
You know what, I'll laugh about this untill the tears dry up. I can honestly say, with out remorse, that I am all for IMMIDIATE deportation of anyone that is here illegally. That goes for Europeans, Koreans, Austrialians, Mexicans, any one that is not from HERE!!

ALSO- this one vexes me more than anything else, NO ONE in this country, and ENGLISH SPEAKING country, should be required, or even asked to learn another language. If you want to, please do. I just think it's wrong for us to force our own people to know another language for certain jobs other than interpreters. They get paid to do it, let them translate to the people that don't want to learn english. I'm NOT, nor will I EVER learn spanish or any other language. Not because I don't want to, but because I am incapable of doing that. I should not feel alienated in MY OWN country, one which I fought and gave SO VERY MUCH for, because I don't know Spanish.

That's my PATRIOTIC two cents.

Very good post.
I have the following ironic phrase for you which I hear all the time.
"TO CONTINUE IN ENGLISH, PLEASE PRESS 1".
I actually have to press something to continue in english???? REALLY?? in the United States???

reply to post by jfj123


Hmm, I actually have nothing to say. I agree with you.

Peace!

[edit] meant to reply to projects post not yours jfj123 sorry.


[edit on 24-3-2009 by Armour For Victor]

[quote
But how can you support your own coountry when you have poor people living under bridges, in alley ways and corners of streets you never even heard of. What about those people? This country doesnt little for them.

I dont see anything wrong with helping people regardless of their legal status.

Peace!

Here's what is wrong with that scenario. The person you hire takes that money back to Mexico. They tell others and 10 more come over in search of that same deal. Now you have 10 illegals competeing for that sub minimum wage job, willing to work for less than the next guy, because hey - its better than they could do in Mexico. Now one or maybe two of those people are given that job. That leaves 8 or 9 Mexican people AND the poor peson living under the bridge without a job. With this comes desperation, and then - you guessed it - crime.

Companies like yours promote this. They are THE reason we have the influx of illegals and they are THE reason many of them are taken advantage of and they are THE reason many of them turn to crime to get by.

An honorable company (like the one I work for) has jobs offering a livable salary for whomever is the best LEGAL candidate. And I know my company does not bring in the revenue of Abercrombie. Its all about hiring for the long term and not the quick cheap fix.

[edit on 24-3-2009 by slicobacon]

Originally posted by Next_Heap_With
this is soo wrong man.....

you so called :patrios: have it all backwards, and act in the most inhuman way possible....

if you love this country so much, and you love the constitution then why dont you support the bill of rights?...human rights for everyone..eh?..creeps

I assume you are Mexican? or at least Spanish from Latin America? America IS about human rights for all, what most illegals do not understand is that they CANNOT break our imigration laws and expect to get free health care SSI and every other benifit under the American sun without going through the proper imigration channels. It is UNEXCEPTABLE to allow what is currently going on here in the states to continue, I bet if the roles were reversed and U.S citizens were invading into Mexican territory taking jobs sapping the welfare system lowering the standard of living for the Mexican citizens, they would kill Americans on site so don't give me that human rights bull$hit.


Sailor

reply to post by jfj123


Been here for 20 years. I'm 24 I don't know any other country. I am wholly shaped by my experiences in the US. Now, all this said, I would rather we abolish borders everywhere and live as one planet and as one species. But there's a lot of prejudice, and systemic bureaucracy damaging any harmonious effort to effectively manage, manufacture and distribute the world's resources. And that's really what this immigration issue is all about. Because of the systems we have in place we cannot afford floods of undocumented workers and others with less noble intentions until the world can meet the base reasons by which these circumstances arise.

I'm afraid that Star Trek system is a few more generations off. But it is what I'm working for. But for the time being one must play by the rules. You cannot subvert things into change this only causes ill-feelings. You have to articulately and thoughtfully create the tools by which such changes can be made. Illegal immigration and the resource squandering this is causing is a detriment for the time being not a benefit.

reply to post by jfj123


Good post! Although i dont know of anyone forcing anyone to learn English.

[edit] i meant spanish or another language......

Peace!

[edit on 24-3-2009 by Armour For Victor]

Originally posted by Armour For Victor
reply to post by jfj123

 

well, i was agreeing with everything you were saying until you through in the military in the mix

I didnt have to serve the military. Do you realize how many Illegals are in the army now and probably wont make it to citizeship. and also there are plenty of people legal now who dont pay taxes, plenty who dont have car insurance, but thats not your point and i get it. We need to treat those who are legal and are avoiding taxes first before those who are doing it and are illegal. I comepletly agree with you, my point from the very beging of this thread was the fact that people ddehumanize them and treat them inhumane and laugh at them, and thats what is wrong. Not stating that you are but the SOME are.

Peace!

They should be treated humanly while being sent back to their countries of origins.
An example of what's going on:
If I show up on your doorstep and walk into your house, make a sandwich from your refrigerator, sit down on your couch and watch your tv. I have no intention of contributing to your household in any way, I'm just here to soak you dry by using your money and property to get what I want.

On a side note, the construction industry has been devastated by illegals. I see this on a daily basis and something needs to be done to end the problem.

reply to post by jfj123


Hahaha, true. I have to call a foreign outsourcing agency for the company I work for to do work order closes, and get to listen to people I can bearly understand. Why do we outsource to other countries, when I know there are people in this country that would gladly get off the streets and sit in an office answering phone calls all day?

That's just another thing that just frustrates me. When I call someone to do business, and it's and AMERICAN business, I would like to speak with someone that speaks ENGLISH fluently. Not a person that can't even understand the phrase, "Got to h---!" as you are hanging up in frustration.

Originally posted by Next_Heap_With
this is soo wrong man.....

you so called :patrios: have it all backwards, and act in the most inhuman way possible....

if you love this country so much, and you love the constitution then why dont you support the bill of rights?...human rights for everyone..eh?..creeps

Many other people have already replied to this, but perhaps I can put it more succintly:

I support the bill of rights, but all RIGHTScome with RESPONSIBILITIES.

Too many illegal immigrants come here to take advantage of those glorious rights, and do nothing to uphold their responsibilities. And since they're here illegally, there's no way to punish them for not upholding their end of the social contract.

Originally posted by projectvxn
reply to post by jfj123

 

Been here for 20 years. I'm 24 I don't know any other country. I am wholly shaped by my experiences in the US. Now, all this said, I would rather we abolish borders everywhere and live as one planet and as one species.

In an ideal world, I think that would be wonderful. Unfortunately, at our current stage of evolution, it's not possible.

But there's a lot of prejudice, and systemic bureaucracy damaging any harmonious effort to effectively manage, manufacture and distribute the world's resources. And that's really what this immigration issue is all about. Because of the systems we have in place we cannot afford floods of undocumented workers and others with less noble intentions until the world can meet the base reasons by which these circumstances arise.

I'm afraid that Star Trek system is a few more generations off. But it is what I'm working for. But for the time being one must play by the rules. You cannot subvert things into change this only causes ill-feelings. You have to articulately and thoughtfully create the tools by which such changes can be made. Illegal immigration and the resource squandering this is causing is a detriment for the time being not a benefit.

Very well said

Originally posted by Seitler
You know what, I'll laugh about this untill the tears dry up. I can honestly say, with out remorse, that I am all for IMMIDIATE deportation of anyone that is here illegally. That goes for Europeans, Koreans, Austrialians, Mexicans, any one that is not from HERE!!

ALSO- this one vexes me more than anything else, NO ONE in this country, and ENGLISH SPEAKING country, should be required, or even asked to learn another language. If you want to, please do. I just think it's wrong for us to force our own people to know another language for certain jobs other than interpreters. They get paid to do it, let them translate to the people that don't want to learn english. I'm NOT, nor will I EVER learn spanish or any other language. Not because I don't want to, but because I am incapable of doing that. I should not feel alienated in MY OWN country, one which I fought and gave SO VERY MUCH for, because I don't know Spanish.

That's my PATRIOTIC two cents.

First, than you for your service! 110%

Second, no one is asking or telling you to learn another language. There are many immigrants here, legal or not, who simply never took the time, or are so engrained in their culture that speaking english is near impossible. The idea for providing some services or capabilities in languages other than english is to be able to help people that don't speak the language utilize services.

Americans are the only people I know who "refuse" to learn another language. Everywhere in Europe, a lot of people know more than 1 language or enough of a second language to get directions . Look at all the soccer players world wide, regardless of origin, they speak English, their Native language whatever that is, and spanish. Spanish because there are a lot of spanish speakers in soccer.

I know a few old people, grand mother types, that don't speak english. Some speak chinese, Korean and spanish and they're just fine, because their grand kids tanslate for them.

Don't misunderstand me... I do not advocate making Spanish OR any language the legal language of the US. I am saying, these languages are here, and they're not going away. Legal or Illegal people speaking them is irrespective of the need.