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The coming evangelical collapse

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posted on Mar, 23 2009 @ 02:57 AM
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Hey, at least there would be an end to Neo-Conservatism.
Hopefully.




posted on Mar, 23 2009 @ 03:02 AM
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All traditional religion as we know it will collapse.
When people will be aware of, that it is all made up by others who wanted to stay in power. So they needed a powerful tool to control the masses = Religion

The Bible which all refer to again and again is nothing but a half made up copy out of the old ancient Egypt and Sumerian stories. Where HORUS 4000 years before the Bible ( the Egyptian Jesus) for example is replaced by a man called Jesus, same story almost to the full.

Also you can NOT rule out the fact that all religions always reports about visitors ( or gods) if you like, coming from the skies. Then draw your own conclusions when you add the Annunaki stories.



posted on Mar, 23 2009 @ 04:42 AM
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There has ever been only a remnant, and thus will it ever be. We’re really not talking about Christians here, we’re talking about Churchians. Those who seek to actually follow the teachings of Christ are generally run out of the churches. Rather like how Christ was persecuted by the religious leaders of his day.

It’s the followers of the religious institutions that will stay home on Sunday’s when the bad times hit. The good news however, is that the coming bad times will actually cause many to seek God in spirit and in truth, rather than play church for cosmetic and social reasons.



posted on Mar, 23 2009 @ 05:45 AM
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reply to post by resistor
 


I agree with you, I am seeing today's economy and gloom and doom actually bringing more people to the church than ever, seeking whatever comfort they can from God and church. It is bringing church 'families' closer than ever. I am not a churchgoer, I used to be, but a lot of my family are, the efforts of their churches to get folks in church needn't be as rigorous as in the past because of those seeking the church for spiritual assitance in these rough times.

Personally I believe WE are the church, in our hearts and souls, and that can never be taken from you. I think there is a single divine enitiy that creates, destroys and gives life to all.



posted on Mar, 23 2009 @ 06:34 AM
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reply to post by MikeboydUS
 


Thats one of the problems with the lack of any set values is your existential example.




Your values become yours and yours alone. In this existential world of people creating their own selfish values not all values are equal. It would be utter anarchy with everyone defining their values in any way possible.


You've overlooked where my values become that of my children, who may then go on to develop their own values, possibly rejecting my values probably incorporating their own.





Only the strongest would survive.


And is there anything wrong with that ? We live on a planet where every other species survives by this principle.

Nevertheless, it could be argued that only the strongest/smartest are surviving now. Some would also argue that religion itself has been but a survival tool, those who would not comply to a particular religious belief eg xtianity were killed off.





Leaving two alternatives: a return to platonic idealism, aka religion, or new values set by what the philosopher Nietzsche calls the Ubermensch. Without set values all there is left is barbarism.



The trouble with philosophers is they don't actually do anything, they think about possibilities but never live all the possibilities.

I could argue that without set values all that could be left is barbarism or cooperation. Seeing how our ancient ancestors and primate cousins tended to cooperate and show few signs of, what we perhaps would call barbarism and many other successful species have a tendency to cooperate.
Surely then we should not be afraid to employ prove successful techniques in order to survive.

If we stretched a history of religion back as far as 8000 years, this is but a blip on on the homo clock. Hominids survive pretty well without religion or supernatural morals from above, what is plain to see in fact that not only did the strongest and smartest survive but they happen to be cooperative which it would appear to be a key to survival.

It's now 2009, we're led to believe that our planet can no longer cope with the destruction we've wrought upon it and our societies are fragmenting stronger nations are slaughtering the weaker.

It would appear that religion simply has not done what we're led to believe it set out to do but has done the opposite. Unless of course it's sole purpose was to control masses, which given the evidence at hand it has done, and reasonably well.

We have to remember at all times, that humans are but another species on this planet and that every other species that has passed on its genes successfully to this day is a "secular" species.

By failing to observe what works pretty well in nature and learning to utilize it, ie cooperation. In our mass delusion that is religion we've not only managed to almost wipe out ourselves but half the planet which we depend on.

Let's help the churches close and the delusion end, it's the eleventh hour it's long past time for reason.

Welcome to the ministry of Moo, lol



posted on Mar, 23 2009 @ 06:53 AM
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This thread is about the demise of evangelicalism.

I wrote a post specifically on topic of why this is happening, namely that the church has gone Zionist, joined with the neocons in promoting war and death and destruction to the Muslim nations.

I pointed out that the Muslim religion used to be considered a Christian heresy and Judaism a false antaichrist religion, but no more since the infiltration of the dispensationlist heresies by one CI Scofield, agent of the British Zionists as reported by one Ed Hendrie on his website.

I also said that Christians throughout history have always been blamed when things go wrong and that the blood has flowed with the blood of Christians throughout history.

Today, with Christian Zionism leading the way to the ruination of the world through first George Bush and now Obama, all puppets of the British Zionists, with Jerry Falwell (now deceased), Pat Robertson, John Hagee, Ken Copeland and all the rest of the Christian Zionists standing for Israel First and promoting war and death, I believe people have had it with the Christian church, just as the thread says.

What I said was right on point, not off topic at all. I think my post was removed because the mod disagreed with what I said, not because I was off topic, because how much more on topic could I be than what I said?

I ended my post by saying that Judgment begins at the House of God, which the demise of evangelicism is indeed a judgment.

I take evangelicism to mean the way it was described in the opening OP's article, which means the big televangelists. Real evangelism will always continue through Christians who will die rather than compromise their testimony or deny Christ.

Yes, Judaism, the Talmud is evil and a false antichrist religion, centered in its hatred of Jesus and of the goyim. For Christians to join up with a religion that hates us and hates our God to help them wage war against others, what else can we expect but a huge judgment from God for doing this. Christians have been told a lie, that they will be blessed for helping the Jews to conquer the world, to help them steal Palestine and rain death down on the Palestinians and other nations in the Mideast, but our nation is anything but blessed. We are on the brink of the abyss, as anybody can see.

Now if this is not on topic and relevant to this thread I will eat my sneakers. I don't care if I lose every point I have going into the negative. This is my position, like it or leave t. There are numerous threads criticizing Christianity, saying awful things about Jesus, saying the Bible is a pack of fairy tales, and nobody minds those threads being put out.

So I am a Christian and htis is my opinion about the demise of the evangelical church. If there is some Jewish moderator here who doesn't like my opinion, go ahead and ban me or take away all my points. That is what I believe and my opinion is as valid as anybody else's. To say it is "off topic" is ludicrous.



posted on Mar, 23 2009 @ 07:09 AM
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Originally posted by Avarus
I agree as well. Religions, in general, are good for nothing what so ever. They promote hate, violence, and even genocide. I'm glad this trend is starting to disappear.


Really? Hmmm....

www.catholiccharitiesinfo.org...



History of Catholic Charities USA Founded in 1910 Catholic Charities USA was founded in 1910 on the campus of Catholic University of America in Washington, DC, as the National Conference of Catholic Charities. The National Conference was created to promote the creation of diocesan Catholic Charities bureaus, to encourage professional social work practice, “to bring a sense of solidarity” among those in charitable ministries, and to be the “attorney for the poor.”

Catholic Charities USA Today Today, Catholic Charities USA serves as the national voice for the Catholic Charities network and the people it helps. Our Catholic values, teaching, and traditions provide the foundation for our work.

Advocacy Catholic Charities USA vigorously advocates federal policymakers on our poverty reduction agenda and promotes the work of local Catholic Charities to the media and the general public.

Networking CCUSA provides networking opportunities to bring our members together to share information, solve problems, and connect with one another. Catholic Charities USA creates and facilitates a wide range of networks and partnerships with other organizations committed to social justice, including the U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops. Catholic Charities USA’s president represents North America before Caritas International—the international conference of Catholic Charities—maintaining contact with the Catholic Charities movement throughout the world.

Training, Financial Support, and Leadership As the National Office for over 1700 member agencies, Catholic Charities USA provides strong leadership and support to enhance the work of the local agencies in their efforts to reduce poverty, support families, and empower communities. We provide training and technical assistance, financial support, and leadership in developing model programs and services for our members. By providing our agencies with these important services, we enable them to better devote their own resources to serving their community.

In addition, Catholic Charities USA has been commissioned by the U.S. Catholic bishops to represent the Catholic community in times of domestic disaster. Our Members Our members—a network of more than 1,700 Catholic Charities agencies and institutions nationwide—provide help and create hope for more than 7.8 million people of all faiths a year.


While I certainly have my differences with Catholicism (and other Christian denominations), it is patently absurd to suggest religion serves no positive purpose for mankind. There are millions of people, worldwide, who benefit from the extraordinary works of Catholic Charities and other Christian charities.

We might want to consider the facts before spewing such one sided, inaccurate rhetoric.


[edit on 23-3-2009 by Night Watchman]



posted on Mar, 23 2009 @ 07:20 AM
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Originally posted by Salt of the Earth
Yes, Judaism, the Talmud is evil and a false antichrist religion, centered in its hatred of Jesus and of the goyim. For Christians to join up with a religion that hates us and hates our God to help them wage war against others, what else can we expect but a huge judgment from God for doing this. Christians have been told a lie, that they will be blessed for helping the Jews to conquer the world, to help them steal Palestine and rain death down on the Palestinians and other nations in the Mideast, but our nation is anything but blessed. We are on the brink of the abyss, as anybody can see.


This thread is about the demise of evangelicalism... it is not about attacking Christianity... it is not about attacking Judaism... it is not about attacking any other religion.

Keep your bigotry to yourself!!!



posted on Mar, 23 2009 @ 07:21 AM
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off-topic post removed to prevent thread-drift


 



posted on Mar, 23 2009 @ 07:26 AM
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Originally posted by grover

Originally posted by Salt of the Earth
Yes, Judaism, the Talmud is evil and a false antichrist religion, centered in its hatred of Jesus and of the goyim. For Christians to join up with a religion that hates us and hates our God to help them wage war against others, what else can we expect but a huge judgment from God for doing this. Christians have been told a lie, that they will be blessed for helping the Jews to conquer the world, to help them steal Palestine and rain death down on the Palestinians and other nations in the Mideast, but our nation is anything but blessed. We are on the brink of the abyss, as anybody can see.


This thread is about the demise of evangelicalism... it is not about attacking Christianity... it is not about attacking Judaism... it is not about attacking any other religion.

Keep your bigotry to yourself!!!


Evangelicism IS Christianity. And Evangelical Christianity is neocon Israel First and Zionist. If you don't know that, you need to take a closer look.

The topic is if Evangelicism is indeed in a demise and if so why.

My opinion is that if Evagelical Christianity, so-called, aligns itself with warmongering neocon Zionists and is working to bring on World War III, then of course this will bring on not only its own demise, but the death of a lot of people, including Christians, Zionist or not Zionist.

This is definitely on topic. Does it bother you the people who are posting on this thread who say that the Bible is a pack of lies? No. You have not responded to them or complained about hteir posts. But my posts, from the Christian persepective, you object to.

Why? Because you obviuosly are a Zionist yourself, an Israel Firster. So why don't you just go see a Rabbi and sign up and get it over with and you can be special like the Talmudics. Why settle for second best when you can have it all?

But in the meantime, let people post their opinions here without crying the blues because you don't like my opinion. I am definitely on topic here. And I am not a hater or a bigot. Rather, the Talmudics who think they need to wipe out most of the people on the planet and leave themselves to rule and reign in Jerusalem from Solomon's Temple are the bigots and haters and racists.

Okay? Go cry to the mods why don't you.



posted on Mar, 23 2009 @ 07:27 AM
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Originally posted by Salt of the Earth

So I am a Christian and htis is my opinion about the demise of the evangelical church. If there is some Jewish moderator here who doesn't like my opinion, go ahead and ban me or take away all my points. That is what I believe and my opinion is as valid as anybody else's. To say it is "off topic" is ludicrous.


You do realize that Jesus and his disciples were JEWISH, right?

There is a legitimate argument to be made that many Evangelical Leaders have gone astray but it's not because they are, as you claim, "Zionists." They have gone astray because they have put their pursuit of personal wealth above genuinely preaching the authentic teachings of Jesus.



posted on Mar, 23 2009 @ 07:32 AM
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reply to post by Night Watchman
 


Hang it up he's obviously a fanatic... just put him in ignore and when the mods have had their morning coffee they will deal with him... I have no patience with such bullhooey.



posted on Mar, 23 2009 @ 07:40 AM
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Originally posted by Night Watchman

Originally posted by Salt of the Earth

So I am a Christian and htis is my opinion about the demise of the evangelical church. If there is some Jewish moderator here who doesn't like my opinion, go ahead and ban me or take away all my points. That is what I believe and my opinion is as valid as anybody else's. To say it is "off topic" is ludicrous.


You do realize that Jesus and his disciples were JEWISH, right?

There is a legitimate argument to be made that many Evangelical Leaders have gone astray but it's not because they are, as you claim, "Zionists." They have gone astray because they have put their pursuit of personal wealth above genuinely preaching the authentic teachings of Jesus.


Of course I know that. I also know that Jesus condemned their Talmud (or what was to become the Talmud later on when it was compiled under cover), that it was the "Traditions of man making null the world of God." Jesus also called them a Den of Vipers. Later when they said "We have no king but Caesar," and "We will not have this Jesus to rule over us," he also told them their "House was made desolate," and he cursed the fig tree and said it would NEVER AGAIN bear fruit.

I also know that the Bible teaches in Galatians and Romans and Hebrews and all over the place that real Jews are those who love Jesus, who believe in Him, that God is not a respecter of persons. God is not a racist and God loves those who love Him, not those who reject Him, who hate Him, who wage war and think they are collectively god on Earth, a special race of beings who can look down on the goyim as cattle (which is what goyim means, cattle).

The Babylonian Talmud is what it is, and so is the Cabala. They are both from the pits of occultism and evil. Neither one of these so-called "Holy books" has one iota to do with the Torah, which Christians believe in and embrace in our own Bible as the Old Testament. Talmudic Judaism is a religion pitted directly against Christianity in particular, and it has blasphemous hateful words written between its covers about Jesus and Mary and all believers and all goyim.

Stop making a god out of the Jews and Israel. The New Testament is full of warnings against the Judaizers, so don't be one yourself.

Jesus also said, Blessed are the peacemakers," and foaming at the mouth to nuke the poor people in Iran and other Mideast countries is not going to win you so-called Christians any points toward Heaven.

And you call me a bigot while you want to kill and destroy, go crying to the Mods to shut my mouth because you know you are murderers in your heart against innocent men, women and children who have done nothing to you.

If you cared about the truth, were lovers of the truth, had received a love of the truth, you would look into this more and have more of an open mind. But the Bible says those who do not receive a love of the truth do so because their deeds are evil and because they love the darkness more than the light.

So be it.

[edit on 23-3-2009 by Salt of the Earth]

As to the claim that evangelicals have gone astray over wealth but not Zionism, don't you know who owns the media? John Hagee is a so-so fat guy who would not have much of a church at all, but his whole ministry is about worshipping and adoring the Jews, and so he has television stations that reach 100 million Christians and he is filthy rich and lives in a huge mansion and obviusly eats very well. Jerry Falwell as we know was given his own personal JET by Israel in thanks for his warmongering Zionism on their behalf. Pat Robertson is a flaming Zionist, also supporting China's one child policy, and a Freemason whose picture on Time shows him giving the Freemason Devil's Claw hand signal. They all are Zionists, all flash the el diablo. Zionism is evil, and the Zionist televangelists are equally evil.

All the while Pat Robertson owned the Family Channel not one time did he ever air a Creationist nature program to contradict the "billions of years" claptrap on the Zionist controlled media. Nor did he ever once educate people about the truth about abortion. He is a plant, a gatekeeper, a Freemason who believes the same stuff that is in the Talmud and Cabala, the sorcery, the Do As Thou Wilt, the kill the goy stuff.

Jesus called them a Den of Vipers, and that's what they are -- all of them, squirming together in one den.

Wake up.

[edit on 23-3-2009 by Salt of the Earth]



posted on Mar, 23 2009 @ 07:51 AM
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It´d be a better place without these idiotic religions.

The only problem is, where Christianity goes down, Islam will grow eventually taking over and causing a new sort of terrorism to arise, anti Islamic terrorism.



posted on Mar, 23 2009 @ 07:51 AM
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reply to post by moocowman
 


The strongest dominating and abusing the weak has all kinds of problems with it. A system of selfish exploitation like that doesn't care about the common good.

Where in the world did you get the idea that our ancient ancestors or primates were not barbaric? Feeding on the bone marrow of other paleolithic humans that were violently killed is not my idea of cooperation.
Humans hunted in groups and cooperatively caused mass extinctions of megafauna. That kind of short sighted cooperation is the kind that will cause our own extinction.

Sure primates have survived without religion but they fling feces at each other and cannibalize their young.

Human belief of universal ideals gave us civilization, law, order, and telos.

Religion, Spirituality, or Faith has tempered our own self destructive natures. Only in its absence have we seen the value of human life become worthless in such places as the USSR and the PRC. In these same places pollution and ecological destruction has occurred on levels seen no where else. In a world without universal ideals even the world itself has no value. There is nothing to restrain us from going head first off into oblivion.









[edit on 23/3/09 by MikeboydUS]



posted on Mar, 23 2009 @ 08:05 AM
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Originally posted by grover
reply to post by Wertdagf
 

I follow a path that strives to find the essential spiritual truths in all religions.


The kingdom wasn't to be found under wood or stone.

Churches rape and deficate on the truth.

-



posted on Mar, 23 2009 @ 08:06 AM
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Originally posted by bicnarok
It´d be a better place without these idiotic religions.

The only problem is, where Christianity goes down, Islam will grow eventually taking over and causing a new sort of terrorism to arise, anti Islamic terrorism.


This is lies and propaganda. Iran is an isolationist country, wants only to be left alone. Same with Lebanon who Israel bombed Beirut into a parking lot in 2007. Same with Gaza. Leave these poor people alone. They only want to raise their families and be left alone.

We cannot go around the world killing everybody who is a religion we don't like because we've been told the religion teaches them to be terrorists.

If that is the case, we had better turn our sights to the Talmudics, who teach that the goy are worth nothing but to die and that they must own and rule the world. They have all the bombs and weapons (ie 400 nukes and the latest high tech weapons that can be bought thanks to the U.S. taxpayers). The Muslims have no weapons.

Russia has weapons. And Russians are Christian. And Russia will defend the Muslims.

Against the fake Christians of the west who care nothing for justice or mercy, only getting fake thrills in church and hearing how they are going to Heaven no matter what they do if they once said a "Sinners prayer," and who care for nobody but themselves, who never tried to stop the holocaust of the babies by way of abortion, or euthanasia, but who just used the church for a social club and to get stroked by having some preacher who graduated from a Jesuit/Zionist infiltrated seminary tell them they were "eternally secure."

The kind of Christians like BTK who went out and serial murdered a bunch of prostitutes and whose Lutheran pastor defended him as a "Good Christian."

Fake, fake, fake, fake. No sense of justice, no mercy, just selfish and hateful and wilfully deceived by every heresy that comes along to create a web of illusion and fuzzy feelings. People who actually think World War III will be a good thing because it will cause them to be raptured, and so are working to help bring on this horror, for their own selfish intents (the rapture).

The imminent rapture is a HUGE LIE. The concentration camps built by the Zionist neocons are no lie, and that's where all of us are going to end up, if we're not killed some other way first.



posted on Mar, 23 2009 @ 08:13 AM
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Originally posted by MikeboydUS
reply to post by moocowman
 


The strongest dominating and abusing the weak has all kinds of problems with it. A system of selfish exploitation like that doesn't care about the common good. Sure primates have survived without religion but they fling feces at each other and cannibalize their young. Human belief of universal ideals gave us civilization, law, order, and telos. Religion, Spirituality, or Faith has tempered our own self destructive natures. Only in its absence have we seen the value of human life become worthless in such places as the USSR and the PRC. In these same places pollution and ecological destruction has occurred on levels seen no where else. In a world without universal ideals even the world itself has no value. There is nothing to restrain us from going head first off into oblivion.


Right. But what if the religion teaches byway of Zionists like LaHeye, Hal Lindsey and CI Scofield and John Hagee and others such as I mentioned above, that the destruction of the world means they will be raptured away to Heaven to enjoy a great feast whle looking down on the rest of the "losers" the inhabitors of the earth being ground into hamburg? What if the religion teaches that those who bless Israel will be blessed, and those who curse will get cursed? What if you have a Satanic religion that believes Do As Thou Wilt, Survival of the Fittest, get what you can any way you can get it and screw everybody -- like the Freemasons and the Satanists and the Zionists?

What if you have a religion that says if you say the Sinners Prayer one time in your life, that no matter what you do after that you are still guaranteed to go to Heaven?

Then you have what is known as antinomianism -- people trained and taught to have no conscience, no mercy and no justice, who think they are special, that because they were "chosen" are invincible?

You then have the recipe for disaster, which is exactly what we have, total disaster, or close to it. Our nation and the world is on the brink of financial ruin, starvation, plagues, death and WWIII.

The parable of the sower in the Bible describes four kinds of people, the first being the type of the hard soil where Satan comes along and by way of lies steals the Word. This is what's happened. Satan has come into the church with many heresies and lies and left a bunch of hard hearted people bound for Hell, devoid of the Word, blind, thinking they are rich and all-seeing but not seeing they are naked and poor and sick and bound for Hell as Jesus said.







[edit on 23-3-2009 by Salt of the Earth]

[edit on 23-3-2009 by Salt of the Earth]

[edit on 23-3-2009 by Salt of the Earth]



posted on Mar, 23 2009 @ 08:30 AM
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reply to post by Salt of the Earth
 




We cannot go around the world killing everybody who is a religion we don't like because we've been told the religion teaches them to be terrorists.


Who's this "we" you're speaking of? The vast majority of religious folk, of whatever persuasion, do nothing of the sort. Haven't you people figured it out yet? These idiots killing in the name of religion would merely have found another reason to do so.

I make no great claims to being a religious man, I'm not. But to blame religion itself for the actions of the people within it is just as stupid as you claim believers are.

Religion has been the excuse for countless acts of barbarity, I can't, I won't deny that. But the flip side of that coin is it's also been the excuse for countless acts of the creation of beauty, acts of compassion. Looking at one side of any story is somewhat shortsighted.



posted on Mar, 23 2009 @ 08:36 AM
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What part of... this thread is not about attacking Christianity... it is not about attacking Judaism... it is not about attacking any other religion...

... Don't you understand?



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