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Chimps, Tools and Honey

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posted on Mar, 22 2009 @ 08:39 AM
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Chimpanzees have been recorded attacking honeybee hives with clubs at Goualougo Triangle Center. They plan and prepare by finding a large club-like branch and stripping it with teeth and hands. To this they add several smaller sticks that they can use to extract the honey from the broken hives.






The team said some chimps would also use a "toolkit" of different wooden implements in a bid to access the honey and satisfy their sweet tooth. The study is published in the International Journal of Primatology. Crickette Sanz, from the Max Planck Institute of Evolutionary Anthropology in Leipzig, Germany, said: "The nutritional returns don't seem to be that great. "But their excitement when they've succeeded is incredible, you can see how much they are enjoying tasting the honey."



Dr Sanz explained: "Nobody knew they would pound over 1,000 times to get to the honey. "Sometimes it could take several hours - they would start in the morning at around 1000, then take some rests, and then finish up at about 1400 or 1500 in the afternoon. "It is quite physically challenging - in the videos you can see how large those pounding clubs are - some weigh over a kilogram."
BBC article

I was reading an article only recently that, despite the evidence, claimed a male captive chimp is the first to be seen actively planning. The chimp collects stones at around 10am to throw at Zoo visitors at 11am. It put a big smile on my face when I read about it.

I was working on the assumption that when a chimp chooses a suitable stick and then strips it to use as a 'termite pick', it was planning? It's physically demonstrating an inner process of cognitive reasoning and and an abstract concept of time.

The Goualougo primates seem to be demonstrating these same concepts. Any ideas or different interpretations of these activities?




posted on Mar, 22 2009 @ 09:23 AM
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reply to post by Kandinsky
 


Very interesting Kandinsky


The study involving the male chimp in the zoo in Sweden , made much of the fact that he collected the stones in a "calm" state for use later in an "agitated" state.


Suggesting that he was anticipating a future mental state.


Interestingly , Santino .... the chimp in question , does not horde or hurl stones in the off-season at the zoo.
BBC News



posted on Mar, 22 2009 @ 09:37 AM
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Chimps are amazing..

www.youtube.com...

www.youtube.com...

theres quite alot out there about their behaviour..fascinating stuff.

[edit on 22-3-2009 by Solomons]



posted on Mar, 22 2009 @ 09:49 AM
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reply to post by Kandinsky
 


Have you seen this ......?

I saw this on a David Attenborough documentary a while back so i hunted around utube and found it .


It about tool use amongst bearded Capuchin monkeys in Brazil .


After an elaborate process of selecting Palm Nuts to see if they are ripe ,tapping them /stripping them and them leaving them to dry out for a few days they then bring them to large stone slabs .......some distance away.


The stone tools (hammers) they use are of a different type of harder stone brought up from the riverbed ......with some of the stones as heavy as the monkeys themselves.


And as for how they deal with jaguars attracted by the hammering ....... i`ll leave you watch that for yourself.




posted on Mar, 22 2009 @ 11:54 AM
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Great Find S+F

You may be interested in this Thread from a while back concerning Pygmy chimpanzees:

Humans Closest Sex mad Relative under threat of Extinction

There is a lot of links and info on that thread.

Also anyone who is doubt to there intelligence and ability to learn languauge even and even create new words from their experiences has to see this amazing Radio 4 Documentary:



CHIMPANA TO CHIMPANZEE
Chimpanzees and Humans are so similar that they vary by only 1% in their genetic makeup. But as scientists are discovering, getting to grips with that 1% difference could lead to a true understanding of the very nature of human beings, and what makes us so unique.

BBc radio 4 Chaimpana to Chimpanzee Homepage

Documentary 1

the second programme:



In this programme, Andrew Luck-Baker looks at Chimpanzee behaviour, from cultural traditions, to tool use, and how they communicate with each other.

Source as link above.

Documentary 2

Quite amazing.

Kind Regards

Elf.



posted on Mar, 22 2009 @ 12:33 PM
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reply to post by UmbraSumus
 

Thanks for linking to Santino. I often race through topics without saving evidence of where I've been. This was an example. I recall the information and not the source. It was an unillustrated article, but in essence the same as the BBC. I'm not a fan of public Zoos so the idea of chimps launching missiles at visitors appealed to my sense of humor. The article made reference to some cases whereby chimps have kept hold of excreta until the public arrive and fling it at them



posted on Mar, 22 2009 @ 12:49 PM
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Originally posted by UmbraSumus
reply to post by Kandinsky
 


Have you seen this ......?

I saw this on a David Attenborough documentary a while back so i hunted around utube and found it .


It about tool use amongst bearded Capuchin monkeys in Brazil .


After an elaborate process of selecting Palm Nuts to see if they are ripe ,tapping them /stripping them and them leaving them to dry out for a few days they then bring them to large stone slabs .......some distance away.


The stone tools (hammers) they use are of a different type of harder stone brought up from the riverbed ......with some of the stones as heavy as the monkeys themselves.


And as for how they deal with jaguars attracted by the hammering ....... i`ll leave you watch that for yourself.



If I could send you applause for posting this video, I would. Attenborough, Capuchin monkeys and Tchaikovsky? It could hardly fail, could it? It's presented in a light-hearted way that may cause some people to overlook at least two crucial points made by Attenborough and the team. It made me smile as well.

One point is that they are a small group with the luxury of leisure time 'to think.' At some point in time our distant ancestors must have paralleled the same environmental conditions and conceived of the same processes. The other parallel is something I read years ago. In a part of Africa were found the remains of many baboons with signs of butchery on their bones. Their skulls showed impact damage. The site was a steep ravine and the supposition was that early hominids had lured or driven the baboons into ambushes where they would be killed by throwing and dropping rocks on them. Seeing the Capuchins deal with the jaguar might be a precursor to more organized behaviors in omnivorous primates. Just an idea.

Great post, thanks
(I'm downloading a copy in case YT do another slash and burn on copyright material)



posted on Mar, 22 2009 @ 12:52 PM
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reply to post by MischeviousElf
 
Thanks for the links. I'm going to listen to the R4 program whilst reading your thread


Edit to add.........or not. The page exists, but the program has long ago expired. The BBC is great at preserving copyright by coding its streams, but some shows would still be 'live and active' rather than stored on a server on a private network.

[edit on 22-3-2009 by Kandinsky]



posted on Mar, 22 2009 @ 01:14 PM
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Originally posted by Kandinsky
post by UmbraSumus
 

Thanks for linking to Santino. I often race through topics without saving evidence of where I've been.



No bother.


The formatting of this site is exceptional , it is good training to seek out the sources etc.


posted by Kandinsky


'm not a fan of public Zoos so the idea of chimps launching missiles at visitors appealed to my sense of humor.


I feel a kinship with that chimp .


posted by Kandinsky


The article made reference to some cases whereby chimps have kept hold of excreta until the public arrive and fling it at them



There is another primate that acts similarly when incarcerated in a zoo of sorts.



Jefferson County District Attorney Tom Maness noted that behavior such as spitting and "chunking," a practice in which inmates hurl feces at correctional officers, makes retaining their poise a complex task for the officers.

source



edit:spelling

[edit on 22-3-2009 by UmbraSumus]



posted on Mar, 22 2009 @ 01:27 PM
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My favoret Ape intelligence story.....In the Boston Zoo Ape house, they sometimes use the facility for evening events. There was a political black tie event held there one evening and the Gorillas did not like having their usual calm evening disturbed by a bunch of self centered politicos. The Dominant Gorilla decided they he did not like the interlopers on his territory so he took action. Just as the Mayor began his speech, the Gorilla began to pelt him with balls of feces mixed with straw that he had prepared a short time ago. The Mayor, quick to react in front of the television reporters stated that he was used to his constituents who were unhappy with his politics throwing sh#t at him.


Tragically, the Gorilla was killed not long after during a routine medical exam when they accidently overdosed him with anaesthetic. Political conspiracy???

[edit on 22/3/09 by Terapin]



posted on Mar, 22 2009 @ 02:08 PM
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Regarding the gorilla, I guess the real tragedy was that he died without knowing he'd achieved a goal that millions of humans have dreamt about for centuries. He also lent weight to the old saying, 'Like attracts like.'


Just in case anyone was interested, I've found a reference to the ambush site represented by the capuchins in the video.


# Olorgesailie (Acheulian site in Kenya 1.0 - 0.5 my) ... a series of sites buried in lake margin and stream sediments at the foot of a volcano, preserve lots of handaxes, and also good evidence of butchery (e.g. smashed hippo bones associated with stone tools)... plus a site with the remains of over 50 giant gelada baboons associated with handaxes and other stone tools.... suggesting either that this was some type of mass kill site, where a troop was surprised and killed off (which would be evidence for cooperative hunting), or a site where baboons were regularly killed. (Remember that chimpanzees not only hunt, but they hunt cooperatively, using ambush techniques...)
Indiana University

The complex behaviors of modern primates might just reflect the capacity for preemptive activities that have led to us sitting at a monitor wondering how we got here.



posted on Mar, 22 2009 @ 02:23 PM
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Originally posted by Terapin

Tragically, the Gorilla was killed not long after during a routine medical exam when they accidently overdosed him with anaesthetic. Political conspiracy???

[edit on 22/3/09 by Terapin]


Yikes! Is this true - accidentally overdosed during a routine exam?



posted on Mar, 22 2009 @ 02:47 PM
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reply to post by spinkyboo
 


Yes, sadly it is a true story. here is a link:
Kubanda dies during annual medical check



posted on Mar, 22 2009 @ 05:51 PM
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Originally posted by Kandinsky
Edit to add.........or not. The page exists, but the program has long ago expired.


Kandinsky the links do work just checked but as it is the old BBC radio format you need REAL player to listen or a Real Networks enabled player if you dont want to install Real player.

Mmm I was told apparently to someone who listened to this file tonight to
it can be done on Media Player Classic to
which a Scroogle search may show you the relevant places.

VLC media Player or Windows Media (Microsoft normal) does not support it, so it is Real or as mentioned above. You cannot though Record this clip.

Having just heard the docu again for the first time in a couple of years, it is a must for anyone interested in this. Quite brilliant I am sure on the second part as mentioned by the Journalist the Chimp is starting to vocalise sounds, attempting to speak but without the correct anatomy is unable.

Kind Regards,

Elf



posted on Mar, 26 2009 @ 01:19 AM
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reply to post by UmbraSumus
 


HOLY C!@P

How did I miss that show?

I had no idea that capucin monkeys were that advanced in thier behavior.

We are looking what our ancestors were doing 6-7? million years ago.

Just in that short little clip, you can see the birth of the most basic behaviors that made us rise above the other primates.
The processing of palm nuts is driving an upright posture, the monkey is forced to walk upright when he tries to carry the nuts to a separate location.
Given enough time, the monkeys might even learn to chip sharpened tools.

they have learned to use a weapon to drive the jaguar away


fascinating stuff indeed.


Chimpanzees have been observed making war.

In an observed incident a male from one group killed a youngster from another group.
a group of males from the youngsters "tribe" got together, grabbed some sticks and waited for the offending male at a spot they knew he would be at. when he came down the trail they ambushed him and killed him.
The same group of chimps was also observed hunting monkeys.



posted on Apr, 3 2009 @ 11:51 AM
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I was describing the capuchin monkey video to a friend and just watched it again. I might have noticed something...Maybe this will seem silly...but I'll write it anyway.

The boulders that the monkeys break the nuts on are concave through the sustained impacts of rocks. Attenborough tells us this at the start. This would imply that the particular group of capuchins have been exhibiting the behavior for some time. A year or much more? Who can say? I'm sneaking up on the 'silly' part...

Towards the end, as the jaguar approaches and the monkeys push rocks and debris down the escarpment, some of the rocks appear to be in small piles. If the monkeys have been pushing debris down on predators for a long time ready material would become limited. If it's over several years much of the loose rock would have already been pushed.

Is it possible (in light of Santino) that the wee beggars are preparing piles for just such occasions? I agree it seems silly. Nevertheless, in the video, there are large rocks and apparently small piles


Edit to add...Mischievous Elf, thanks for the advice about the BBC radio show. I tried Media Classic without success and dislike Real Player too much to put back on my PC. Why BBC ever supported Real is a mystery.

[edit on 3-4-2009 by Kandinsky]



posted on Apr, 3 2009 @ 06:45 PM
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This reminds me of video I saw a while ago.


It makes me wonder, if all of these animals learning to use their environment to their advantage are they really on the brink of evolving? I always wondered if another species evolved, what would it be like? Would humans exploit them? Would we embrace them and teach them? Would we abandon them and simply observe them from afar?

And if so, is this process cyclical?!

[edit on 4.3.2009 by Avarus]

[edit on 4.3.2009 by Avarus]



posted on Apr, 3 2009 @ 11:24 PM
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reply to post by Avarus
 


Once while I sat eating at a fast food resturant, I watched a crow take a large pecan and layed it in the drive through driveway.
It took a couple of cars going through before one ran over the nut and crushed it. All the while the crow sat on a light pole waiting till he got his snack.

I also watched an octopus undo the four wing nuts holding the lid of his aquarium down.


On the octopus note, a few years ago at the monterey bay aquarium, they were losing fish in different tanks, with no sign of predation in the tank.
What they found out was that, after the aquarium closed for the night, one of thier big octopi was climbing out of his tank and dragging himself along the floor till he got to a tank with the flavor of fish he was wanting, climbed in and caught it.
he would then climb out with his prize and drag himself back to his tank and enjoy his snack at his leisure.



posted on Apr, 7 2009 @ 08:50 AM
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Chimps are one of the most dangerous primates. A zoo keeper at one of my local zoo's was telling a few stories about chimps and how they are capable of plotting murder even if its not right away. Most are just trouble makers that try to get a rise out of anyone and anyone hence the reason for throwing 'poo' as long as you don't react then they won't continue, but turn and yell at them and you opened yourself up to more abuse.

Advice from zoo keepers:

-Run if you hear code blue- ( polar bear is loose )
- if a chimp escapes make sure your the fastest one to get away, they can and will tear you apart in a matter of mins. That happaned to a women in Stamford CT.

In the wild they have been known to hunt in groups by chasing prey into an ambush then tear it to pieces and in some rare cases the keeper told me chimps have eaten others of there species.

Not sure how much of this is true or if he wanted to scare me, but a creature that can tear a police car door off without trying has got to be dangerous even if they look cute on national geographic or tv.



posted on Apr, 7 2009 @ 08:56 AM
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On another occasion an orangatuan stole a screw screw driver from some technicians that left it in the exhibit and was chisling away at the way everyday when the zoo was closed.



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