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Why do people commit suicide when God is suppose to only give you as much as you can stand??

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posted on Mar, 22 2009 @ 09:58 PM
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Well, I think if Jesus came back tomorrow, he'd be pretty horrified at the Catholic Church, but only inasmuch as it's just one more horrifying aspect of our horrifying "civilization"... Seriously, Jesus would be scratching his head, "What the hell is a Pope? What is Santa Claus? I didn't authorize any of this! Wait a minute, you say this is all about my glory? Oh, no no no no no, you're not blaming this crap on me!"

Point is, you can't condemn Christianity for the things Jesus actually said and actually did, because Jesus was pretty cool by anyone's standard. You can, however, blame the worst of the Church on the people who created it and have been running it for the last 2000 years, misinterpreting Christ's words — probably editing and censoring his words pretty heavily — and laying this maximum guilt trip on people in the name of Jesus, all the while passing the plate and padding their pockets.

As you can tell, I still have some of my God-hating atheist cynicism left over, even though I now attend the Lutheran Church. But I hob-knob with these people on a regular basis, and I can tell you that the best of them are fairly level-headed and use their common sense, and they wouldn't condemn somebody in agony who was contemplating suicide.

You'd have to be a real hard-ass to stand over some guy who is 95% covered with third-degree burns and tell him Sorry, dude, we're not pulling the plug until you're completely brain dead, and maybe not even then.

— Doc Velocity




posted on Mar, 22 2009 @ 10:06 PM
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Originally posted by jd140
reply to post by saber13
 


Suicide is a personal choice


LOL personal choice. It is NOT a "personal choice". Someone who commits suicide is NOT in a position to make "choices" that they would make under other circumstances.

Broken broken broken, those who commit or try to commit suicide, have been given too much to handle, and have been broken. Sometimes they can be put back together, if they survive an attempt. Sometimes they cannot.

Choice, it is not.



posted on Mar, 22 2009 @ 10:20 PM
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I've asked myself this question as well. I think the answer is not so much
that we can't handle what we are put through, but it is our fear of that
situation never ending, that compels us to commit suicide.

All hardship stops before we cease being able to handle it, but when we
are in such a hardship, and we become so afraid of the possibility that it
will never end, that is when many people commit suicide. That is why it
is extremely important to believe that all hardship will end in time, and to
continue crawling through that last stretch and into the light of relief.

Many people commit suicide for other reasons than hardship though,
some people suicide to take revenge on someone, some people suicide
because their physical pain is so bad that they overdose on painkillers,
others decide to end their life just because they don't see a reason for
being alive.. out of ignorance.

But suicide is never an answer: it doesn't stop your pain, it doesn't take
away any of the reasons why you committed suicide. Because you end up
in an afterlife, where life continues. Suicides end up in a place of gray fog,
of loneliness, despite being near other suicides. The consequences of their
actions are laid open before them, the harm they've caused their friends,
their parents, their families, all the people they have never even met that
depended on you for their own karmic lessons.

Then despair kicks in, and these souls haunt their families, begging for
forgiveness in vain. The pain and anguish a suicide experiences in such
an afterlife, are multitudes of the pain that caused them to suicide.

So yeah, I strongly recommend against suicide, it will only make things far
worse, it makes things worse beyond your imagination. You will cry many
bitter tears.

I have considered suicide too, luckily I decided against it.

In love and light,

Hans



posted on Mar, 22 2009 @ 10:35 PM
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This concept of God is so outdated. It's hard to believe that people/priests still choose to spew out this crap as an explanation for God.

Yes God created the universe and no he does play parts in our lives. We live within the rules of his universe but it doesn't meddle in our business anymore than it would meddle in a dogs business.

We are not the only sentient lifeforms in the universes and that makes us no different to his other creations.

What we do here is all us. We created this life and the way society works. We created the hardships all by choice. Things can be easier it just requires people that are honest and motivated not by money.



posted on Mar, 22 2009 @ 11:02 PM
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I will be truly happy the day religion is no longer a factor of ones being or purpose for being the fact that people believe that some imaginary being has control over us is just silly to me but that is just me so no offense meant.



posted on Mar, 22 2009 @ 11:29 PM
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reply to post by Wehali
 


Are you God? You sound like you know for sure what happens upon death by suicide, so that is why I am asking.



posted on Mar, 22 2009 @ 11:43 PM
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I ask myself that question all the time. The answer is that it's not God who makes it harder in life, it's the devil and he loves his job. I've had a best friend hang himself, a cousin shot herself, and just recently lost my brother-in-law to pills. Some people can take the heat and some can't that's pretty much all it sums up to.



posted on Mar, 23 2009 @ 12:00 AM
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..and some people get more heat than others.



posted on Mar, 23 2009 @ 12:11 AM
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Originally posted by Quiintus
This concept of God is so outdated. It's hard to believe that people/priests still choose to spew out this crap as an explanation for God.

Outdated compared to what? What do we have that is so modern and so chic that it makes the traditional concept of God obsolete?

I mean, we're still basically cave men — we're still wearing clothes made from animal skins and vegetation, we're still burning vegetation for warmth (the most popular theory is that petroleum, the basis for so much of our fashion and energy needs, comes from ancient vegetation), we're still banging on drums and howling and covering ourselves in tattoos, we're still fighting over our respective territories and throwing projectiles at one another. We haven't actually evolved beyond what we were 40,000 years ago.

The technological toys that we have fashioned are not indicative of any intellectual or spiritual advancement within our species. We're currently hysterical because the weather is changing, just as our ancient ancestors were confounded and frightened by the weather. What is our answer to climate change? Why, we become nature worshippers, like our ancient pagan ancestors. Nothing has really changed over tens and thousands of years.

So why is our traditional concept of God so "outdated"...? Over thousands of generations, in a thousand different cultures, isolated by time and distance from one another, our species consistently arrives at the notion that there is a God (or gods) shaping our fate. Isn't that an astounding phenomenon in itself? Look at the enormous popularity of our 20th Century super-heroes with their extraordinary super-powers...They have nothing to do with religion at first glance, but aren't these creations just like the gods of Greek and Roman myth? Do we not worship them through our enthusiastic participation in their respective marketing campaigns? Do we not have our favorite super-heroes? (Mine is Iron Man, I've been a fan since the 1960s)

Doesn't this at least suggest that we're disposed, as a species, to inventing and worshipping deities? Why do we do this? Who knows, maybe we're hardwired for it. In any event, who are we to decide which concepts of God are "outdated," when all we can do is invent more of the same as a replacement?

I know, I took the bait, I went way OT. So let me bring it back...

Many years ago, I endured a physical & emotional ordeal that damn near killed me, but I came through it; and, yes, I do think that some sort of supernatural something intervened and saved me. Quite literally.

After it was all over and done, I experienced a very peculiar depression for several months. I had no idea why I had been saved, or for what purpose; but in hindsight, I felt rather manipulated by whatever had intervened. I mean, I had been an atheist, but I suddenly felt as though I was a pawn in some cosmic chess game, right?

Nothing mattered to me for several months, I took no joy in anything. I looked out on the world as though I was trapped in a glass cage — I felt that I could not change the world, it was out of my hands, so why even bother? At that point, when I had convinced myself that I was completely ineffectual, that was when I thought about suicide.

That's a pretty startling thing, to suddenly realize you're thinking about killing yourself. It was startling to me, anyway. Before I just blindly committed myself to the deed, I tried to reason it out, and I found that I didn't really want to die, but I was afraid of living. It was that fear that I finally turned into my adversary, and it was that fear that I fought until I found a reason to go on.

As has been observed, there are any number of reasons why a human might turn to thoughts of suicide. I was lucky... In my case, I self-analyzed the thing and isolated my fear as the real cause of my turmoil, so I was able to get my hands on it and fight it. But I understand that there are folks out there who can't get their hands around the fear, there are those who "can't handle" the crap Life is throwing at them.

Well, it's like this... God will throw stuff at you relentlessly, like the crashing surf, eating away at the shore, right. I'm telling you, when the surf is too rough for you, or if you can't handle it, get out before it kills you. How that translates into good advice: If you're suicidal, get yourself out of the situation, okay, take a retreat. Go to a safe place up in the mountains, for example, where you alone are in control your situation, pitch a tent, and survive for a few days. Force yourself to work through survival situations. Pretty cool therapy, huh? Combatting suicidal thoughts with survival exercises.

— Doc Velocity



posted on Mar, 23 2009 @ 12:12 AM
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reply to post by saber13
 

Why do people commit suicide when God is suppose to only give you as much as you can stand??

I just happened on this thread. Don't know if it has been mentioned yet, but, the Bible does not say that God will not give us more than we can bear. It says He will not ALLOW more to come on us than we can bear.
A good example would be JOB of OT. God didn't put the misery on Job. Satan did. God lifted his hand to allow tribulations upon Job, but refused permission to take his life. He knew where Job's heart was.

[edit on 23-3-2009 by sizzle]



posted on Mar, 23 2009 @ 12:47 AM
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Originally posted by saber13
I was told by my Catholic priest when I was younger that God will only give you as much as you can take, and I use to take comfort in that. But if God only gives you as much as you can handle then why do people commit suicide? I've asked this question to many of my friends and family and all they can tell me is that some people are weak. But if they are weak then why did God give them so much to handle? If God truly had the power to regulate how much people have to deal with then isn't one of his jobs to help the "weak" along as best as he can? This has been one of my biggest problems with the church.


My mom used to say the phrase 'God won't put on you more than you can bear." Obviously her and your Priest were both quoting Paul 1 Corinthians 10:13:

"No temptation has seized you except what is common to man. And God is faithful; he will not let you be tempted beyond what you can bear. But when you are tempted, he will also provide a way out so that you can stand up under it."

As you can read for yourself it doesn't say or imply what my mother and your priest led us to believe. It's only Paul's opinion that we won't be "tempted" beyond what we can bear but even if we are he says God will provide a way, so that we can rise above the situation.

Jesus knew there are some things we can't bear. It's as simple as that. The message he sent to all of mankind, who read & heed his words is that he has many things he needs to tell each of us, on a very personal level and some of these things will be way more than we can bear. It's like Yin and Yang. There is bad news and good news. The bad news being the things we can't bear and the good news is he promised a way, so that we could at least cope. The coping mechanism is the Holy Spirit. It confirms and testifies to the truth that God and his Son are real, it comforts because he knew we would mourn and grieve his physical presence, and it's counceling aspects range from teaching to explaining past events and our future.

We all go through testing and personal trials and tribulation - it's the way the system works. When Jesus stood up in the synagogue and read from the scroll of Isaiah he did it to announce it is henceforth fulfilled. Isaiah mentions many personal dilemmas we can go through, that God has remedies for. Have a broken heart? My God, for myself there is nothing worse than a broken heart. A husband and father of 20 plus years leaves the family for the much younger woman. It's worse than death because you are running at full throttle every gambut of emotion your mind can bring to bear - not just grief, but jelousy, devestation, your pride..... this list is endless. Jesus says he came to bind up the broken hearted but the suicidal person is very much living in the moment to stop every emotion they are having. Depending on their belief system either things will be better on the other side or they may feel ceasing to exist is better than suffering. When a person is set on suicide they decide they don't have time for God to reveal himself - they are done contemplating any and all matters - they're outa here. But of the person who opts to take the long way home and turns to God, and begs for understanding and compassion you will be redeemed. This person has chosen to acknowledge God's higher power and when a person comes to God with total sincerety, He WILL have compassion, and He WILL reveal himself..... and suddenly when you KNOW the truth - everything that was bad seems so trivial - for your Maker is your real Husband.


"For your Maker is your husband—
the LORD Almighty is his name—
the Holy One of Israel is your Redeemer;
he is called the God of all the earth.

The LORD will call you back
as if you were a wife deserted and distressed in spirit—
a wife who married young,
only to be rejected," says your God.

"For a brief moment I abandoned you,
but with deep compassion I will bring you back.

In a surge of anger
I hid my face from you for a moment,
but with everlasting kindness
I will have compassion on you,"
says the LORD your Redeemer.

"To me this is like the days of Noah,
when I swore that the waters of Noah would never again cover the earth.
So now I have sworn not to be angry with you,
never to rebuke you again.

Though the mountains be shaken
and the hills be removed,
yet my unfailing love for you will not be shaken
nor my covenant of peace be removed,"
says the LORD, who has compassion on you." Isaiah 54:5-10

This is how the power of God works. I chose binding up the broken-hearted as an example because I lived it. If a girl could die of a broken heart I should be dead. I cried so many tears over a year, that I not only washed Jesus' feet with them but they must have flooded heaven because I now know the truth. Don't go feeling sorry for me or think I need a pity party because what goes around comes around.

But this is how the light Jesus spoke of works - had I not made mistakes in my past, and then had mistakes made against me - I wouldn't know God. Now I understand the verdict Jesus spoke of:

"This is the verdict: Light has come into the world, but men loved darkness instead of light because their deeds were evil. Everyone who does evil hates the light, and will not come into the light for fear that his deeds will be exposed. But whoever lives by the truth comes into the light, so that it may be seen plainly that what he has done has been done through God." John 3:19-21

God is so misunderstood. He never meant to be sought in vain. He forms the light and creates the darkness. He brings prosperity and creates disaster. He does these things to test us and see how we factor him into both the good and bad in our lives. He is moved by compassion towards us, when we fall and cry out. He rejoices with us when we acknowledge him in good times. We are His creation and we are a delight and joy to him, but most of his creations hearts and minds are very far from him.



posted on Mar, 23 2009 @ 01:02 AM
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Intelligent Christian women are sooooooooooo sexy. I know, I'm married to one.

— Doc Velocity



posted on Mar, 23 2009 @ 01:08 AM
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Being told that this life is just a game that a higher power is playing with us is not something I think I can except. I dont know if there is a God but if there is I dont think I could stand to worship one who purposely causes chaos and pain to see if we are ready to go into heaven.

If this is true then it could almost be linked back with my question of suicide and if God causes chaos then it could be said that he drove them to suicide and again I dont think I could worship him if that was the case, even if he was real. That may be a bold thing to say and I may regret it later but reading the Bible and hearing some of the things is has to say the loving God that is portrayed now does not exist.



posted on Mar, 23 2009 @ 01:15 AM
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reply to post by Myrtales Instinct
 


Thanks for the refresher course. Very uplifting. I never understand how some read the Bible and only see an evil God. With all the promises given for our health, wealth, joy and safety; it is hard for me to read anything but a loving Father who has bent over backwards to redeem man.
But a relationship with God, is sort of like a savings account that you don't know that you have. If you are unaware, you will never take hold of the resources of either.

[edit on 23-3-2009 by sizzle]



posted on Mar, 23 2009 @ 01:40 AM
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Sounds like people are saying that believing in god is what saves people from suicide. finding god may work for some but not believing does not mean they rejected help and chose their fate. If you are drowning and a raft appears kudos to you for grabbing onto it but not everyone gets the option.



posted on Mar, 23 2009 @ 02:27 AM
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Originally posted by saber13
Being told that this life is just a game that a higher power is playing with us is not something I think I can except. I dont know if there is a God but if there is I dont think I could stand to worship one who purposely causes chaos and pain to see if we are ready to go into heaven.

No, we're not pawns, nobody is pulling our strings, there is no great big bearded white man on a throne, there is no entity hovering over the earth and squirting souls like watermelon seeds into heaven and hell. What's much more likely is that the Universe is One Big Consciousness. There's a very good likelihood that the Universe doesn't care about your existence, and it probably doesn't wanna hear about your puny little problems.

Or maybe it does, because the Universe is fickle and does things like that. Like, a Living Universe. It is a Conscious and Curious Universe. This is probably what we recognize as God.


Originally posted by saber13
If this is true then it could almost be linked back with my question of suicide and if God causes chaos then it could be said that he drove them to suicide and again I dont think I could worship him if that was the case, even if he was real. That may be a bold thing to say and I may regret it later but reading the Bible and hearing some of the things is has to say the loving God that is portrayed now does not exist.

Umm. How about a God that just sits and indifferently twiddles its thumbs as you commit suicide?


— Doc Velocity






[edit on 3/23/2009 by Doc Velocity]



posted on Mar, 23 2009 @ 04:05 AM
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Originally posted by saber13
I was told by my Catholic priest when I was younger that God will only give you as much as you can take, and I use to take comfort in that. But if God only gives you as much as you can handle then why do people commit suicide? I've asked this question to many of my friends and family and all they can tell me is that some people are weak. But if they are weak then why did God give them so much to handle? If God truly had the power to regulate how much people have to deal with then isn't one of his jobs to help the "weak" along as best as he can? This has been one of my biggest problems with the church.


Well, this would imply a few things.

either:

God is wrong

-or-

God doesn't actually exist

coincidently, being that it is supposedly God, then God would know that the burden he puts on a person would cause them to commit suicide, so if God did do this, then in actuality, he must be one evil bastard.



posted on Mar, 23 2009 @ 04:25 AM
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Ok, so I stopped reading after page two.

I need to say, as someone who has very 'unique' views on religion, as well as someone who has attempted suicide, things can get quite fuzzy when looked at from an outside point of view.

YES - I DO believe in a greater power, but not the god from the bible. That is all just made up stories to morally guide future generations. If you quote it thinking it is all true, then you are more brainwashed than i was as a soldier.

YES - I have attempted suicide. I pulled the trigger of a loaded 12 guage turkey gun, that just so happened to be resting inside my mouth. It failed to fire! So, I'm considered a 'survivor of suicide'. Guess what, I still feel like killing myself, but not from pain.

Not all suicides are to escape pain. Back then, yes, it was. Now, I just want to see what is after this life. Life, in this day and age, is very redundant. Who cares what your car is, or where you live. In the end, you'll end up dead anyway.

I see death more as an adventure. The only true place that can't be viewed from human eyes. I seek adventure. I've posted in my person blogs already, but if an alien race came to earth and asked me to go with them, I would leave. Not a second thought about it. the worst they can do is kill me, and that is going to happen wether I go or not. Everything I do is all about adventure.

So, the next time someone says to you, "I wish I was dead, I think it be fun to see whats after life." You should respond with, well, lets go skydiving first. Trust me, you'll get a smile and it breaks the tension.

Just so you all know, I AM diagnosed with PTSD !!!AND!!! Severe Clynical Depression.

Also, WE as humans, are not born with any burden, we are just supose to live. HUMANS give us the overwhelming burdens we face. God has nothing to do with you damned home mortgages or your children not listening to you cause you're afraid to smack the wicked from them. We are our own causes of depression. Stop worrying and start LIVING!



posted on Mar, 23 2009 @ 04:44 AM
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Originally posted by jd140
reply to post by OzWeatherman
 

All those reasons you gave me only one was a mental illness and that was depression.



Well if your wife had depression, then she might have explained to you that all those reasons mentioned, along with depression, can actually be the contributing or trigger factor to depression.

Your wife may agree with you but it seems the masses still dont....have you looked it up yet?



posted on Mar, 23 2009 @ 06:14 AM
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Originally posted by sizzle
reply to post by saber13
 

Why do people commit suicide when God is suppose to only give you as much as you can stand??

I just happened on this thread. Don't know if it has been mentioned yet, but, the Bible does not say that God will not give us more than we can bear. It says He will not ALLOW more to come on us than we can bear.
A good example would be JOB of OT. God didn't put the misery on Job. Satan did. God lifted his hand to allow tribulations upon Job, but refused permission to take his life. He knew where Job's heart was.

[edit on 23-3-2009 by sizzle]


I have to ditto with this comment.

If you believe in God, you must believe in satan. To try to rational God, is to put Him in a box (human rational). If you believe in God, you will know He is an Almighty God and a loving Father, and His ways must be right, even if we cant understand as humans sometimes. Faith!

God knows our heart more than we do, and He knows the extent of what we can bear.

No one can come to the Father, unless the Father calls them. When we feel we are broken, God knows our heart and the extent of our brokenness more than we do. Sometimes He may wait, as our heart is not ready, even if we believe we are at the limit of what we can bear.

God knows our beginning and end, hence He knows if you ever really make the free will choice to accept Christ.

I believe when your heart is screaming, that is God screaming to you: "let go, give it to Me, I will give you rest". Unfortunately we don't want to let go sometimes, even in despair.

When you truly let go of all the human nature oppression you have acquired in this life, then you will be free indeed, no matter what chemical imbalances you may of been told you have.

And with those whom succeed with suicide, Gods grace is what He wills, not man.

For some, when you truly let go, and give Jesus every tear and scream from the depths of your soul, then its like you did die, and have been reborn as some one else.

Freedom indeed! Its supernatural!

This is what I believe and have lived in my life!

He truly wants all of your heart, so you can have His own heart, which is the only true way to be free of all the erroneous emotions of this world

That is the best way I can answer your question, and I pray it may help!




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