Originally posted by Zaphod58
At 25,000 feet Vmo/Mmo is 501mph/Mach 0.72.
Thats not what i asked (by the way, your numbers are incorrect for a typical October night in the NE and STD adiabatic lapse rate).
I asked what is "Vne" for a 767, at 22,000 feet, in terms of mph? The NTSB already posted .86M is "Vne" at altitude. Now you want to change Mach
Zaphod, you only constructed 3 pieces of the puzzle, the fourth (and most important i might add), you conveniently omit. When asked? you choose
obfuscation in terms of completely different numbers.
Now, i dont think you do it intentionally, i just think you came to a battle of aero knowledge, unarmed.
So, anytime you want to address .86M in terms of mph at 22,000
, let us know. We
know you are unable to figure such a number as
indicative in your reply.
UA175 wasn't in a near vertical dive,
Neither was EA990.
and then pull up hard enough to zoom up 6,000 feet. UA175 was in a much shallower dive, with a much easier pull up at the end.
Great. It apears you have the FDR tabulated data and animation reconstruction provided by the NTSB. Please share.
So, let me get this straight... a trained 767 Capt pulls to "zoom up" 6,000 feet to break the airplane, but a "hijacker"with zero time in type has
the finesse to "baby" the aircraft... 150+ knots over Vmo, into the WTC? Uh huh.... and i suppose the pentagon is only covered by a parking gate
Hey, want to buy a bridge? I got one for sale cheap. Its in Brooklyn!
As noted Vmo/Mmo is 501mph/0.72 Mach.
.72M is not limiting on the 767 at altitude. Its .86M.
EA990 exceeded Mach 0.86 (max operating speed) and was at 0.99 Mach at 0150:23.
Very good, now tell us what .86M is in terms of mph at 22,000 feet like you were asked and dodged.
Max operating is .86M or .72M? Which is it Zaph?
The aircraft pulled up at 16,000 feet and at 0151:15 the second dive began and lasted until impact.
According to primary radar which the NTSB admits..
the altitude estimates from these returns are subject to potentially large errors, which introduces significant uncertainty into the performance
calculations during the second dive
... yet you take as gospel...
If you don't care about the "health of all on board" what does it matter if you exceed Vne for a short time?
Let us know when you establish .86M in terms of mph at 22,000 feet. Then we'll talk on this matter.
The excessive speed was a contributing cause. Excessive speed, combined with G loads will cause an airframe to break apart.
Glad you agree, and glad i quoted you. But that is not what you said the NTSB claimed. Short memory perhaps?
Say, any chance you'll want to debate P4T on the matter? How come you never registered there?
During the SECOND DIVE. That means that it was intact at least up until the point that it stalled after pulling out of the dive. Which
means that it successfully passed Vmo/Mmo and Vne and remained intact through pulling out of the dive, at those speeds.
Really, and you have the FDR/CVR data proving as such?
According to the NTSB, the entire aircraft lost power shortly after "peak" .99M, descending through 22,400. But i guess you trust primary radar when
the NTSB themselves admit there can be huge errors.
Edit: Fixed tags
[edit on 28-3-2009 by RockHound757]