Masonry is good

reply to post by Vyrtigo


I am very glad you asked. I will tell youwhat masonry is to me.

Masonry is a way of living your life. It is a place to gather with other people like myself who have taken an oath to be a good person and help out whenever and wherever possible. (not just other masons but everyone) The teachings I have learned so far only reinforce what I have learned all my life. Treat others like you would like to be treated. Of course there is much more theatrical things to teach these lessons, such as the degrees that initiates go through. And when they go through them they have no idea what is going to happen or why. (at least that is supposed to be the idea) then the initiate has to learn (recite) what he went through in that degree. After he recites what happened to him, he will be passed to the next degree. During the lerning to recite what you did, you gaiin a very unique understanding of why you did it that way. It's called learning. Once you are a master mason, you spend your time at the lodge helping others to learn their degrees. And it goes on from there. masonry is not for everyone, and it will not make you rich, powerfull, good looking, or ever popular. But for me is is a constant reminder of why I am the way I am. Thanks for asking.

reply to post by network dude

at what part in the blue lodge dogma (you know where we pray to glorious lord God and the Great Architect of the Universe) are we worshiping satan?

I am glad to see that you admit you do believe in masonry as a religion, that you subscribe to its dogma and that you are worshipers of it.
You may not be worshiping Satan, but the inner circle do. They admit it. They write about how the lower orders are to be deceived.

What do you hope to gain be exposing what ever it is you think is wrong with masonry?

What does a Man gain by shouting warnings to his fellow Man? If I say to you, "watch that man, he is a killer.", what have I gained by warning you?

I only ask these questions because so many anti masons come in here and quote Pike and claim to know something/anything but obviously have absolutely no clue at all about what masonry really is.

Again, Pike is only one of many Masons who have written about the same things. Go into any Masonic lodge and you will find a picture of Pike and Manly P. Hall. Perhaps you don't understand it as fully as you thought. Have all the secrets been revealed to you yet? Are you above 32nd degree?

reply to post by network dude


Your welcome, thanks for sharing.

So from what i gather, it sounds almost like a church. Actually, what is the difference between a masonry lodge, and a church?

And a religion for that matter.




[edit on 9-4-2009 by Vyrtigo]

reply to post by Vyrtigo


again, this is just my opinion. Masonry is not a religion or a church. It does seem a lot like that and for a guy who does not go to church, it is even more like church. But it is something I can aggree with. I stopped going to church because it seemed it was always about money and not so much about God. It also seemed like every religion thought they were better than all the rest. I personlaly think that God is whoever you think he is and he is happy to be that as long as you think of him. I don't think he decriminates against people from Detroit,or babtists, or budists. Freemasonry doesn't ask and will never ask who you pray to.( you are asked in whom you put your trust) It does not matter as long as you pray/have a believe in a higher power. That is is so simple is what makes it beautiful to me. It is kind of like my version of church although it is not a religion per say. I can feel closer to God watching the sun rise than I ever could in a church. I also wish if people are going to quote Pike, that the actually read the whole thing he wrote. there are contexts that get missed, and He is not the guy who made masonry. He has some very good teachings and some wierd ideas. But he cared enough about masonry to devote much of his life to it. For that I respect him. thanks for asking and corresponding in such a productive way. I have enjoyed this.

reply to post by Smack


for real, who is the inner circle and where do they meet? I keep hearing this and I never get an answer. Aparently you guys have some inside information that regualr masons don't. I am a member of a conspiracy site. I like conspiracies. If there was one here and I am in the middle of it, you bet your ass I want to know.

Originally posted by Smack
You see, it is all about deception.

So you say we're all about deception, but then you quote the Taxil Hoax and pretend that Pike said it.

Interesting hypocrisy you've got going on there, pilgrim.

Go into any Masonic lodge and you will find a picture of Pike and Manly P. Hall.

I've been in hundreds of lodges, and never once have seen a picture of either man on display. I do have a small bust of Pike on my desk in my home study though, if that makes you feel any better.


[edit on 9-4-2009 by Masonic Light]

I heard masons get discounts at certain places, and also have to pay an annual membership fee.

reply to post by network dude

for real, who is the inner circle and where do they meet? I keep hearing this and I never get an answer. Aparently you guys have some inside information that regualr masons don't. I am a member of a conspiracy site. I like conspiracies. If there was one here and I am in the middle of it, you bet your ass I want to know.

This is the funny part of the story. The inner circle is hidden in plain sight. They write about it and you can't see it. I've quoted some of the writings from some famous, inner circle members. You can find more if you try.

Originally posted by Vyrtigo
I heard masons get discounts at certain places, and also have to pay an annual membership fee.

Never heard of any discounts anywhere for being a Mason, but yes, all members pay annual membership dues to their lodge.

reply to post by Masonic Light

So you say we're all about deception, but then you quote the Taxil Hoax and pretend that Pike said it.

Interesting hypocrisy you've got going on there, pilgrim.

There are plenty more damning quotes from Pike and others of the various orders. You say it is a hoax. I say who cares. His own words damn him many times over. Interesting that you defend Pike. Hm...

've been in hundreds of lodges, and never once have seen a picture of either man on display. I do have a small bust of Pike on my desk in my home study though, if that makes you feel any better.

Fine then, a bust, not a picture.

omnis fanaticus es amens pariter

reply to post by Vyrtigo


If I get discounts, I want one at the beer store. Yes we do pay dues every year. Not enough to break the bank though.

reply to post by Smack


I think your underware are too tight. You need to lighten up. Please provide the damming quotes from whomever in their entirety, or lets talk about how wonderful masonry is. Seriously, many have come before you and many will come after you, if you have something new to add, please do. As I have said before, if you can make me believe I am in on a conspiracy, I will be all over it.

Originally posted by Smack
You say it is a hoax. I say who cares.

The readers of this forum, since you claim to offer truth, while accusing others of deception.

Interesting that you defend Pike.

Why is it interesting? It was by reading Pike that I decided to become a mason in the first place. Were it not for him and his books, I probably never would have been interested in Masonry, much less joined.



[edit on 9-4-2009 by Masonic Light]

Originally posted by Masonic Light

Originally posted by Smack
You say it is a hoax. I say who cares.

The readers of this forum, since you claim to offer truth, while accusing others of deception.

Interesting that you defend Pike.

Why is it interesting? It was by reading Pike that I decided to become a mason in the first place. Were it not for him and his books, I probably never would have been interested in Masonry, much less joined.

I don't care to debate you on the authenticity of the quote in question. You say it is a hoax, I say it isn't. That is my point. I didn't express it very well. Apologies.

It is refreshing that you admit that it was your interest in the drivel written by Pike that drew you into the Infernal Order.

Be careful, that much honesty is sure to come back to haunt you.

Here is a pretty good link I stumbled across from Pike's Morals and Dogma.

www.sacred-texts.com...

Thus the secret science and mysterious emblems of initiation were connected with the Heavens, the Spheres, and the Constellations: and this connection must be studied by whomsoever would understand the ancient mind, and be enabled to interpret the allegories, and explore the meaning of the symbols, in which the old sages endeavored to delineate the ideas that struggled within them for utterance, and could be but insufficiently and inadequately expressed by language, whose words are images of those things alone that can be grasped by and are within the empire of the senses.

The division of the first Decan of the Virgin, Aben Ezra says, represents a beautiful Virgin with flowing hair, sitting in a chair, with two ears of corn in her hand, and suckling an infant. In an Arabian MS. in the Royal Library at Paris, is a picture of the Twelve Signs. That of Virgo is a young girl with an infant by her side. Virgo was Isis; and her representation, carrying a child (Horus) in her arms, exhibited in her temple, was accompanied by this inscription: "I AM ALL THAT IS, THAT WAS, AND THAT SHALL BE; and the fruit which I brought forth is the Sun."

Originally posted by Smack

I don't care to debate you on the authenticity of the quote in question. You say it is a hoax, I say it isn't.

I don't see how you have a choice. You yourself, in the body of the quote, referenced Abel Clarin de la Rive, who originally published the fake quote in an anti-Masonic magazine, then retracted it after having found it was a fraud, and then publicly apologized to Pike's daughter, Lilian, for slandering her late father. So if you're going to reference De La Rive, we need the whole story to keep it honest.

The Taxil Hoax

It is refreshing that you admit that it was your interest in the drivel written by Pike that drew you into the Infernal Order.

To the Mason, God is our Father in Heaven, to be Whose especial children is the sufficient reward of the peacemakers, to see Whose face the highest hope of the pure in heart; Who is ever at hand to strengthen His true worshippers; to Whom our most fervent love is due, our most humble and patient submission; Whose most acceptable worship is a pure and pitying heart and a beneficent life; in Whose constant presence we live and act, to Whose merciful disposal we are resigned by that death which, we hope and believe, is but the entrance to a better life; and Whose wise decrees forbid a man to lap his soul in an elysium of mere indolent content.

As to our feelings toward Him and our conduct toward man, Masonry teaches little about which men can differ, and little from which they can dissent. He is our Father; and we are all brethren. This much lies open to the most ignorant and busy, as fully as to those who have most leisure and are most learned. This needs no Priest to teach it, and no authority to indorse it; and if every man did that only which is consistent with it, it would exile barbarity, cruelty, intolerance, uncharitableness, perfidy, treachery, revenge, selfishness, and all their kindred vices and bad passions beyond the confines of the world. - Pike, Morals and Dogma, p. 227-228

Perhaps you think it is "drivel". I, on the other hand, think it is exactly what this world needs.

Originally posted by Revolution-2012
Waste of time, my suave commodore.

If it was such a waste of time why even bring up the situation. Sounds more like terminal laziness to me.

Why try and prove something that I may not even be able to prove?

If everyone had that attitude we would still be living in caves and and hiding from the moon.

I think all you masons, signified me pretty well much as a hater and delusional in the conception of masonry,

Do you think your Posting-While-Intoxicated had anything to do with your coming across as a 'hater' and 'delusional'?

however, I believe that masonry has catacombs, as much as Christians believe Jesus will save them if they follow in his light, and he doesn't

Once again these are your opinions which have no support of acutal fact or first hand evidence. You will not make the effort to actually investigate and learn about Masonry yourself so you regurgitate false anecdotes you pirated from others.






[edit on 9-4-2009 by AugustusMasonicus]

Originally posted by Smack
You see, it is all about deception. Masons worship the great deceiver, whether they are aware of it or not.

This sentence is truly absurd.

How do you know that you are not worshiping Osiris without being aware of it?

Originally posted by Smack
I don't care to debate you on the authenticity of the quote in question. You say it is a hoax, I say it isn't.

A few posts back, when I quoted Pike, I posted the chapter, paragraph and line number.

Would you care to do the same, since this will certainly clear up the matter.
Here is a link to the full text, in case you don't have it:
www.sacred-texts.com...

Please feel free to check up on my reference.

[edit on 9/4/2009 by Saurus]

reply to post by Saurus


Thanks for reposting that link.

Seems no one wants to comment on that.