Subject: No one can sell any ammunition after June 30, 2009

reply to post by Hastobemoretolife


How about... use a revolver (or a brass catcher), and scatter around somebody elses brass? The whole thing is asinine.

reply to post by DragQueen4Peace


Re: Alabama Senate Bill 541

(Proposed in 2008) Thats why you didnt see it.

Quote"Talked directly to US house member Cam Ward; he told me this bill comes up every year and never makes it out of the committee. There is little support or OPPOSITION from both sides. End of Quote I dont know this speaker or his credibility.

This bill is not a figment of my imagination and it’s up for review again. Now we have Obama.




[edit on 20-3-2009 by wonderworld]

reply to post by donavias


I’m glad you brought that up!

Any privately held uncoded ammunition must be destroyed by July 1, 2011. (Including hand loaded ammo.)

My hunting friends often re-load themselves. They will probably tax the equiptment! Pee shooters may be our last resort.

Originally posted by andre18

The bill 20 that is being pushed in 18 states requires all ammunition to be encoded by the manufacture a data base of all ammunition sales. So they will know how much you buy and what calibers.

How is that a bad thing?

Any privately held uncoded ammunition must be destroyed by July 1, 2011. (Including hand loaded ammo.) They will also charge a .05 cent tax on every round so every box of ammo you buy will go up at least $2.50 or more!

My gosh the cheek of those devils!

How are they depriving you of anything, you can still have your precious ammo as long as it's coded. How is that bad?

What is there to fight?

[edit on 20-3-2009 by andre18]

This is not a jab at you personally, so please do not take it as such. I understand your society is different, as is to be expected. We have different histories:
-My country declared its independence and broke ties with England in 1776.
-Your country severed its judiciary and legislative ties to England in 1986 (see the Australia Act).

Freedom is first in the heart of Americans. Paranoia comes in at a close second place, mainly due to fear of loss of the first.

Our history and freedoms are tied directly to our gun ownership. The government has no need to know how much ammunition We The People buy. It is our private business, not theirs. The Federal Government was brought about to serve The People, not the other way around. Our Right to Keep and Bear Arms is our collective ability to hold our government accountable should we deem it to be truly tyrannical, and in that we should not waiver in our duty nor allow said Right to be further infringed.

Also, many shooters like to reload their cartridges, saving money and reducing waste. Its actually environmentally smart. Why chunk brass into a landfill or let it sit on the ground for years? Requiring coded ammunition would put an end to this practice.

Why do you people have such a problem with Obama. Get over it the republicans lost, the backwards thinking policies of the neo-conservatives are on their way out and some people just can't deal with it, democrats and liberals were never sore losers, but you guys just can't get over it. CASE IN POINT: THESE ARE STATE LEGISLATION ISSUES. NOT FEDERAL LAWS THEREFORE OBAMA HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH THESE BILLS. Obama and the white house are part of the executive branch of the FEDERAL government. not the STATE governments. so stop blaming Obama. also, I like how you post a link to snopes.com that says in big letters undetermined. AHAHAHAHA you think just because it hasn't been disproved YET that its the truth? Give me a break, I do thank you for one thing, I will never ever ever take anything you post as the truth again....I love when people think they have a good case and post utter nonsense like this, it just gives me another name to add to the retard list....please please don't breed, one thing this world doesn't need is another child version of you going around with their head up their own but oblivious to the world....go read a book.

Well for those of you who care, our friends at Network Solutions give us this info



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Domain ID137427341-LROR
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Expiration Date:15-Jan-2010 17:58:57 UTC
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It looks like they used www.domainsbyproxy.com... so they are afraid somebody will adjust their attitude or hand out a beat down. I say they are cowards and maybe somebody who has the 133t skilz can get inside and give us the name of the person who has too much time on their hands.

reply to post by smokecrops


Nobody cares if Obama did it or if somebody else did it. Nobody cares if it's state or federal bills in question. The only thing that matters is that it's a backhanded attempt to make the Right to Bear Arms unaffordable to practice by many without actually banning it.

Oh, and I'm a moderate independent, and as such I'm in the nice position where I can call BULLCRAP on your "democrats aren't sore losers" statement. You guys are STILL whining about losing an election from 8 years ago.

I'm curious why you felt the need to end your post with a long string of insults. Is thoughtless flaming now the Democratic wave of the future?

This looks more like a "bullet tax" then them wanting to take your ammo off you all together.

As an Australian who guns were taken when I was only a midget, I have no doubt that you MUST defend your rights and not hand over your ammo etc, it's already starting and I still can't believe the majority of Americans didn't wake up and vote for Ron Paul......

Originally posted by Nventual
Well like I said before, you'd be hard-pressed to find any criminal use of a firearm here where they're illegal to possess. The only time you would is in a hold-up at a service station, and even then it's either a hand in a jacket made out to be a gun or a replica, and even even then it's still rare.

Wow, so there aren't any murder, robbery, rape, battery, or suicide victims in Australia? I know where I'm moving next.

Let me tell you what happens here in the real world. Let's just say, and I'm speaking hypothetically of course, that one day congress "justly" decides that a product (we'll say Cannabis) is bad, for whatever reason (we'll say just because). What will happen is all of those that do not want to go to jail will bite the bullet (pardon the pun) take the loss and give in. Those that already have a record, or don't want to accept a loss with no just cause, will either lie about the possession, or hide the evidence. All that we accomplish is the creation of unjust criminals, higher expenses, and increased taxes (and in the case of drugs, a loop).

When you ban a product, whether it be guns, drugs, bread, clothes, etc. you immediately create a black market. And the only thing that will come out of a black market (besides "illegal" contraband) are newly designated criminals.

What would be the purpose of keeping track of ammo purchases? Let's say somebody buys 3 boxes of .223 ammo a week, like many people do (myself included, I hunt for my own food). That doesn't sound like a lot right? But the officer that just took away your rifle for buying so much ammo could say you purchased enough ammo to kill 1200 people last month. Tracking purchases does not prevent crime, it creates criminals, just like it doesn't fix your budget, it creates one.

Another thing, criminals aren't stupid (at least the criminals not in jail already). Like others have said, micro-stamping and serialized bullets are extremely easy to circumvent, and micro-stamping actually becomes completely useless after firing ~20 bullets (at the range, for example).

By creating more restrictive laws, you are just creating more laws to break. By creating less restricting laws, you're creating freedom. You can choose what you want, I don't care, but let it be known MY country will not become yours, and I will practice the natural human rights, restated by the US Bill of Rights, to achieve life, liberty and happiness.

Well, I guess some of you folks have never heard of "Handloading".

I doubt that ANY such Bill would EVER pass muster, especially seeing how many Democrats are actually quite Gun Friendly.

If it ever does pass, in the worst of scenarios, then more Americans would quickly learn the old art of "Handloading" Ammunition. Heck, you can usually find at least one reputable individual in your area who does "Handloading", and could either teach it to you, or sell you their Produced Rounds for a Minimal Fee. NO ONE can stop "Handloading", I do not care what anyone says.

Originally posted by andre18

Well, it seems that his allies in the anti-gun world have no problem with taking your ammo!

It appears you're purposely trying to be misleading, you should change your title to suit the real circumstance of the issue.

[edit on 20-3-2009 by andre18]

Exactly. I give you a star, my friend.

I've seen plenty of threads with sensationalist headlines here on ATS, but seriously, it can go too far sometimes.

I've sent the following email to the organization that wants to shove these laws down our throats (this pisses me off to all ends!)

Your organization is part of what is wrong with America today. Your liberal “feel good” laws have gotten out of hand as this is just another “end-around” the Constitution of the United States of America.

You want to basicly “register” ammunition instead of handguns? Have you ever looked at the real statistics of how much gun crime is actually solved because of handgun registration?

I will do everything I can to inform my fellow hunters and handgun owners of your attempts to sap America’s strength without directly violating the Constitution. Good God! Don’t you think Politicians and our Government have enough power already? You don’t think criminals are going to find a way around these proposed laws while us well-behaved, civilized tax-payers are going to take it in the ass?

Enough already! Gun crimes aren’t going to be affected by what you propose and support! Learn from what has happened in Great Britain and Australia (and don’t tell me that’s the path you don’t have in mind for our great nation!)

XXXXX XXXXXXXX

[email protected]

[edit on 21-3-2009 by CreeWolf]

reply to post by sadisticwoman

An arm isn't an arm unless it's armed. (Huh?)
By your line of reasoning, I could argue that you do have the right to free speech, but not to speak, as speaking isn't mentioned in the 1st Amendment.

Originally posted by smokecrops
Why do you people have such a problem with Obama. Get over it the republicans lost, the backwards thinking policies of the neo-conservatives are on their way out and some people just can't deal with it, democrats and liberals were never sore losers, but you guys just can't get over it. CASE IN POINT: THESE ARE STATE LEGISLATION ISSUES. NOT FEDERAL LAWS THEREFORE OBAMA HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH THESE BILLS. Obama and the white house are part of the executive branch of the FEDERAL government. not the STATE governments. so stop blaming Obama. also, I like how you post a link to snopes.com that says in big letters undetermined. AHAHAHAHA you think just because it hasn't been disproved YET that its the truth? Give me a break, I do thank you for one thing, I will never ever ever take anything you post as the truth again....I love when people think they have a good case and post utter nonsense like this, it just gives me another name to add to the retard list....please please don't breed, one thing this world doesn't need is another child version of you going around with their head up their own but oblivious to the world....go read a book.

Is it even worth the time to engage in a debate with you? You sound like a closed minded, raving maniac.

Originally posted by LiQuiD_FuSioN

Originally posted by andre18

Well, it seems that his allies in the anti-gun world have no problem with taking your ammo!

It appears you're purposely trying to be misleading, you should change your title to suit the real circumstance of the issue.

[edit on 20-3-2009 by andre18]

Exactly. I give you a star, my friend.

I've seen plenty of threads with sensationalist headlines here on ATS, but seriously, it can go too far sometimes.

I do agree that we might be able to debate the relevance of the Headline in question, but I sincerely doubt such "Restricted Ammunition" actions would be under way if a President such as Bush was still in Power.

Even if it is indirect in nature, President Obama, Speaker Pelosi, and Senator Reid have all fostered an Atmosphere which remains friendly to such Restrictions.

reply to post by Mekanic


I noticed in anearlier post you mentioned living in WI, as do I.

Aside from Walmart, I can not remember a single time I have been asked for my D.L while purchasing ammo.

Interestingly enough, I was purchasing some pepper spray for my wife today, was asked for my D.L. and all my info was recorded.

When I asked what that was all about, he said it was in case I used it for a crime, they would be able to track it back to me.

How?

My response to this action is that it will be much easier to track the owner of a killer bullet by doing this. Of course most criminals would not use a bullet that was registered to him/her to commit a crime, they would steal it.

Originally posted by andre18

So basically you're having a cry about having to fill out forms, dude stfu. Guns are obviously dangerous, they need and should be controlled in order to check how much of what is being bought so if guns are being misused, the owners can be delt with properly. That's simple and straight forward.

What criminal legally buys his guns and ammo? I have a few police officer friends and 99% of the guns they confiscate are guns that have been stolen or purchased off the streets. He said only 1 gun they found last year actually belonged to its owner.

Anti-gun and anti-ammo legislation only hurts law abiding citizens. I have the right to how ever many rounds of ammo I want, of whatever type, and I should be able to get them at a fair price without invasion of my privacy. Firearms are a hobby, a sport, and a way of life for many. I love the history of them, the look and feel of them, the smell of some hoppes #9 after cleaning my rifle, I love the mechanics and science involved, the beauty of their craftsmanship. How would you like it if the government decided to tax and oppress something you loved?
I'm amazed to see things such as same sex marriage and drivers licenses to illegal aliens being termed a constitution issues here in California, when there is no direct constitutional protection of these things, but laws against guns...which are directly mentioned in and protected by the 2nd amendment, are freely passed.

I've always had a laugh at people trying to stockpile ammunition for their firearms because it will run out one day and your rifle becomes a Stick.

Better to spend the money on a good recurve bow, arrows, then learn some skills in its use and maintenance. Learn how to make bows and arrows yourself, then you will always be armed when you need to be, plus, they are silent. No Bang and Flash to give away your position or scare away walking food supplies.