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Subject: No one can sell any ammunition after June 30, 2009

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posted on Mar, 21 2009 @ 04:20 PM
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Originally posted by highlander2008
As a UK member must say that I find this whole thread rather hard to swallow. You don't need guns at home..........simple. We still have unarmed police walking the streets too and it works, believe it or not.



Being that you are in the UK, I'd see where you see it that way. Being that the UK is a wonderland with no crime, every policeman is your friend, all your politicians are uncorrupted, and every day is a civilised dance in wonderland.

The naivety of the average UK denizen is astounding. Of course you don't need guns. When the time comes that you will need firearms, the people of the United States of America will come to save you..... yet again.




posted on Mar, 21 2009 @ 04:22 PM
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Originally posted by verylowfrequency

Originally posted by highlander2008
As a UK member must say that I find this whole thread rather hard to swallow. You don't need guns at home..........simple. We still have unarmed police walking the streets too and it works, believe it or not.


Apparently you've never visited the United States of America. Believe it or not it's quite a bit bigger and wilder than the UK. In America many homes are miles and miles away from the nearest town or police - which means many have to lookout for themselves. To an American the UK is more like uh... Disneyland, so yes in Disneyland I agree there's no need for guns.

Ever watch the LA riots on your television? Where hordes of angry people were looting, burning and destroying everything in their path. How are you going to stop those types of situations when it comes to your neighborhood? A dozen or so Armed neighbors would send them in another direction and keep your neighborhood from getting destroyed if such an event occurred. If you've watched any of the documentaries on that indecent you'll also notice that some shop keepers saved their stores from looters by posting armed family members at the doors and on the roof of those stores - when the looters came their way they turned around and looked for easier prey.

As was seen there the police are not going to risk their lives to save your neighborhood when it gets that bad - you have to stand up and have the means to protect yourselves.



A very valid point you are making here. Hat off.

Perhaps we in Europe forget that your nation has had many years to develop into this state of affairs and in "Disneyland" which is a very much older civilisation we have left this type of behaviour.

Even so - it looks like some Eurpean nations will soon find themselves in situations were a firearm at home would be really nice. In the last months we have had a large number of gang shootings in Copenhagen some of them resulting in the deaths of innocent people.
Maybe we'll change our minds real quick like...




Where I live we have these animals called Bears and Cougars. They are both known to attack and eat people on occasion. In fact every year there's stories of people getting attacked and killed by bears. They are bigger stronger and faster than human beings - a gun is an equalizer if one is attacked by one of these creatures. Even then some bullets just bounce off them if you don't have enough firepower.



Another good point. Most countries in Europe doesn't even have wildlife that would (or could) kill you when we go on nature walks.
In northern Scandinavia we have wolves and bears. And there they do carry guns when they are out. So maybe we are not that different?



Of course the real purpose to our second Amendment is so we can't be completely enslaved as we once were- if nothing else it's a deterrent that slows the evil greedy bastards from taking too much too quickly.




What have your mega corporations, investors and bankers done?

They have sodomized your Nation so bad and no guns were there to help you.




What's so bad about the day we say enough is enough? As long as the evil greedy creatures know that at some point I might blow a fuse and put a cap in their skull - they have to be a little more careful on how they behave towards me.



THIS is the scary bit. THIS is where scool shootings come from.



posted on Mar, 21 2009 @ 04:40 PM
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reply to post by Nventual
 


You and Andre need to go and do your research. Aside of the wackos who do the school or work shootings the ammo control means nothing and it really means nothing in thoose because they kill themselves so no need to track them down. Criminals who rob and kill either steal or buy on the black market not in stores. So what does it mean: More GOV spending and more taxpayer money!!!!!


Someone stated earlier that they would not be able to ident the bullet, the coding will be on the shell.



posted on Mar, 21 2009 @ 04:47 PM
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Originally posted by wonderworld
***snip***
The point you make is that the EU doesn’t need or want guns and your police are unarmed. Here in the States we are gun collectors, that perhaps our great grandfathers left or those who collect Spanish/American war stuff, they are a hobby for many.
***snip*


Just to clarify.

A lot of countries in the EU have armed police.
Danish police is armed. And we call ourselves peaceful.

And we are not allowed to own any type of guns without permission. Exept an airgun, but you have to be 18 to buy and use one of them.

Even a pocket knife with a lockable blade is illegal.
A Leatherman tool born in public will give you a 6 month sentence.

A pocket knife with a blade longer than seven centimeters (about three inches) is illegal in public. Even if it is unlockable.

So there you are. Some of us go to the exact opposite extreme as Americans.



posted on Mar, 21 2009 @ 05:06 PM
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reply to post by HolgerTheDane
 


I feel sorry for you (Weapon wise)! By the way Denmark was probably the most wondeful place I ever visted when I was in the Navy! Yes weapons are abused and walking around Denmark back then that would have been the last thing on my mind. But the time we are in all people should be able to protect themselves!

What if people had carry permits in the Mumbai attacks? =A lot of less dead people.

I do agree with background and mental health checks. If someone is schiczo I don't want them buying a AR-15 OR ANYTHING ELSE, I.E. the Virginia Tech massacre!

The need worldwide for proper legistation and control of guns is there, but I stress proper and doing a tax on ammo to discourage buying it is not!



posted on Mar, 21 2009 @ 05:23 PM
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Originally posted by SpacePunk

Originally posted by highlander2008
As a UK member must say that I find this whole thread rather hard to swallow. You don't need guns at home..........simple. We still have unarmed police walking the streets too and it works, believe it or not.



Being that you are in the UK, I'd see where you see it that way. Being that the UK is a wonderland with no crime, every policeman is your friend, all your politicians are uncorrupted, and every day is a civilised dance in wonderland.

The naivety of the average UK denizen is astounding. Of course you don't need guns. When the time comes that you will need firearms, the people of the United States of America will come to save you..... yet again.




Just the response I had expected......I'm not going down that road, you're entitled to your own opinions. I made a point, I'll just go back to wonderland.

[edit on 21-3-2009 by highlander2008]



posted on Mar, 21 2009 @ 06:00 PM
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reply to post by HolgerTheDane
 


Hi there HolgerTheDane;

Well we still have until June 30th for you to make a conclusion. The point is this bill was reviewed in 2008, it’s up for review again the DIFFERENCE is the gun haters have control of the House and Senate. this time


I take it you haven’t read the entire thread or you would know coding is only part of it. Once again on coded ammo……No one including the FEDS have a right to know how much of which caliper I own.

I’m not worried I will get charged with murder with a coded bullet. “What if someone stole my precious coded bullets to kill someone”


I don’t care about the tax part. We need to pay back the stimulus bill somehow.

I DO have a problem being required to destroy all my uncoded ammo by 2011 or be prosecuted. I do not plan to destroy my ammo, nor anything else I own.

Are you from the US? You should read the following link about the FEDS ammo database it may surprise you.

I appreciate your questions. Everyone seeks knowledge. I don’t claim to have it all. This is put out there for the people to see. Things will be much worse by 2010 mark my word on that one, all dates aside.

Here is the link again so you can see how intrusive my State bill is. I’m sure other state are identical. It's one step coser to an all out gun restriction or worse.





posted on Mar, 21 2009 @ 06:16 PM
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reply to post by HolgerTheDane
 


If you are so happy why are you so angry Mr, HolgerTheDane. I simply dont get it. You seem to live in Paradise. What's up with the Defensiveness ? Did someone on this thread bash you for some reason? I was out and hadnt read the last couple pages.

[edit on 21-3-2009 by wonderworld]



posted on Mar, 21 2009 @ 06:49 PM
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reply to post by wonderworld
 

That's why, I go old-school, cap and ball, .44 58 Remington, extra cylinders, 500 balls, 1000 conical. And FFFg. If it is loaded and ready to go, it will run.
The smoke cloud is also a plus, if you miss. Oh, sorry TMI. Feds, on the thread.



posted on Mar, 21 2009 @ 06:51 PM
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Every gun owner should march to Washington D.C. with their guns drawn and see what happens then


Thomas Jefferson said we need a revolution every 20 years(or something similar) to keep our country in check... we are, if my count is correct, 265 years overdue... excluding the Civil War which most people don't consider a revolution...

I don't own a gun myself but I plan to buy one...That is if this $1 million insurance policy malarkey that I read in another thread happens. If that happens I think the gun manufacturers, like the ammo guys, should quit producing for the military until it is pulled... or at least threaten. Civilians play a BIG part in the money they make.



posted on Mar, 21 2009 @ 06:56 PM
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reply to post by thiscountryboycansurvive
 


Hey NVentual here is some info on ammo coding.


Benefits of Ammunition Coding Technology for Law Enforcement
Each code will be common to a single box of cartridges and unique from all other ammunition sold. The unique ammunition codes will be tracked and records maintained to identify individual ammunition purchases. The ammunition coding technology will provide a method for law enforcement personnel to trace ammunition purchases and link bullets and cartridge cases found at crime scenes to the initial retail ammunition purchaser.


This system will not necessarily prove who pulled the trigger, but it will provide law enforcement with a valuable lead and a starting point to quickly begin their investigations.

The design of the ammunition coding technology laser engraving system will allow law enforcement personnel to identify the bullet code in cases where as little as 20% of the bullet base remains intact after recovery.

Since bullets are designed to keep the base solid and in its original configuration, the likelihood of ammunition codes remaining legible after recovery is very high. Law enforcement testing has already shown a 99% success rate in identifying the ammunition code after bullet recovery.

Benefits of Ammunition Coding Technology for Law Enforcement
• Does not require any special training or equipment for lawenforcement officials.

• Micro-laser engraved bullet and cartridge-case code provides timely and efficient identification by simply using a good magnifying glass.

• Eliminates subjectivity in identifying the buyer of the round. In many cases a bullet trace can be initiated at the crime scene.

• Code is identifiable in cases where as little as 20% of the base of the bullet is recovered.

Implementation of the Ammunition Coding Technology

The implementation of the ammunition coding technology will require legislation to establish an ammunition sale database. In those states that have already developed and implemented bar-coding systems that include driver's licenses and other forms of identification, the integration of a database system to record ammunition sales will be relatively simple and inexpensive to implement.

How will ammunition coding technology work?

A unique ammunition code will be assigned to each box of new ammunition. Most major ammunition manufacturers already use bar-coding for inventory control and management. Ammunition manufacturers will simply include the ammunition code in their current bar coding system. Ammunition retailers will scan the bar code on each box of bullets along with the purchaser's driver's license or state issued ID. The resulting electronic record would be transferred to a secure computer database that would confidentially maintain individual ammunition sales information.

CREEPY! I'm adding some mico coded ammo pics next.



posted on Mar, 21 2009 @ 07:01 PM
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Lets look at the cons of this.

1. Higher prices
2. Hurts businesses (potentially)
3. The likeliness of it going deeper and law enforcement doing searches of anyone buying large quantities of ammo.

The pros?

I fail to see any. PLEASE tell me if there are any...because any criminal after seeing a law like this would get their ammo off of the black market (aka uncoded).

A law that only hurts the good.

THAT is why it is a stupid one.



posted on Mar, 21 2009 @ 07:04 PM
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Micro coded ammo.









coded PCA-Spectrum 5.56x45mm rounds, I could not detect any difference from standard brass cased ammunition, except the micro code.






[edit on 21-3-2009 by wonderworld]

[edit on 21-3-2009 by wonderworld]

[edit on 21-3-2009 by wonderworld]



posted on Mar, 21 2009 @ 07:14 PM
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Accidental re-post

[edit on 21-3-2009 by wonderworld]



posted on Mar, 21 2009 @ 10:35 PM
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Just a theoretical question...

Whats to stop a ammo buyer from taking something abrasive and rubbing off the codes on the bullets?



posted on Mar, 21 2009 @ 10:45 PM
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reply to post by peskyhumans
 


Well it's my understanding that they are micro coded, as well. Both on the outer brass and also inside somehow.

The thing I worry about it getting busted for having non coded ammo or be required to destroy my ammo.

I would never do that and I havent heard a proposal that says "We will exchange your ammo, at no cost if you register. Trust me I dont plan to register.

I foresee restrictions on re-loading ammo, as well.

There may be a way to remove the code but I wouldnt hassle with trying.

I'm ahead of this BS and dont plan to part with it.

Good luck on your effort though.




posted on Mar, 22 2009 @ 12:55 AM
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I really dont understand this ???

If I am planning on committing a crime, all I have to do is pick up the spent casing ???
What is the point of encoding the brass ??

It looks to me they just want more tax money and also disarm America.



posted on Mar, 22 2009 @ 02:24 AM
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reply to post by R3KR
 


It's just an attempt to do an end run around the 2nd Amendment. They can't outright ban guns, so they'll use underhanded means to make owning arms prohibitively expensive. It's clear that Obama, Pelosi, and the rest of the limousine liberals think they know what's best for the American people. They will have their way.

I don't see any of this ending well for the country, its people, or the Constitution. America, the country the rest of the world detests, but always turns to when they are in need, will cease to exist as the nation it was. The great experiment is over.



posted on Mar, 22 2009 @ 02:57 AM
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I go to a few desert shooting areas to collect brass for reloading and I am always finding unfired live rounds.

They get lost in the dirt when someone drops them or are lite primer hits that someone ejected.

If i was to use them in a crime who will get a visit from the cops.

I know the cops mentality, When they don't match the ballistics of the persons that bought the ammo's guns, The cops will get a search warrant and tear the persons home apart looking for another guns. plus take all the persons guns till the crime is solved.

They will never believe the ammo buyer had nothing to do with the crime.

Also how will this help if the criminal uses a shotgun.
how will they mark every pellet.

What would stop a criminal from buying shotgun ammo and removing the pellets and replacing them with BBs.

One thing this law will do is cause some criminals to go from using hand guns and rifles to using shotguns.

With most criminals being so bad of shots as many are i would not care for criminals that switched to shotguns.
They might hit someone more often.


[edit on 22-3-2009 by ANNED]



posted on Mar, 22 2009 @ 03:51 AM
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reply to post by RFBurns
 


I agree, I know a few people who reuse their cartridges and with the price of ammunition on the rise, it would cut a hole in the finances of honest, hard working Americans. I hope this bill does not pass, but I won't hold my breath. Another step to absolute control IMO.




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