Subject: No one can sell any ammunition after June 30, 2009, page 1

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Topic started on 20-3-2009 @ 07:22 AM by wonderworld

Nobody can sell any ammunition after June 30, 2009 It has already started.... Ammunition Accountability Legislation Remember how Obama said that he wasn't going to take your guns? Well, it seems that his allies in the anti-gun world have no problem with taking your ammo! The bill 20 that is being pushed in 18 states (including Illinois and Indiana) requires all ammunition to be encoded by the manufacture a data base of all ammunition sales. So they will know how much you buy and what calibers. Nobody can sell any ammunition after June 30, 2009 unless the ammunition is coded. Any privately held uncoded ammunition must be destroyed by July 1, 2011. (Including hand loaded ammo.) They will also charge a .05 cent tax on every round so every box of ammo you buy will go up at least $2.50 or more! If they can deprive you of ammo they do not need to take your gun! This legislation is currently pending in 18 states: Alabama , Arizona , California , Connecticut , Hawaii , Illinois , Indiana , Kentucky , Maryland , Mississippi , Missouri , New Jersey , New York , Pennsylvania , Rhode Island , South Carolina , Tennessee , and Washington .. Send to your friends in these states AND fight to dissolve this BILL!! To find more about the anti-gun group that is sponsoring this legislation and the specific legislation for each state, go to:

ammunitionaccountability.org...

www.snopes.com...

[edit on 20-3-2009 by wonderworld]

reply posted on 20-3-2009 @ 07:32 AM by Blanca Rose

reply to post by wonderworld

This whole mess is silly, really. If guns were taken away, people will find a way to get them. If people cannot buy ammunition, people will figure out a way to make their own.

This won't stop people at all, as all this accomplishes is black market goods.

If they want to charge taxes on rounds, and people don't want to pay them, they will work around them.

How will they enforce people not having any privately owned ammunition?

Anyone with say, jewelry making skill will easily be able to make ammunition, if they have the materials at hand.

reply posted on 20-3-2009 @ 07:35 AM by RFBurns

Pretty dumb considering there are tons of people who re-use spent ammo casing and reload their own ammo.

Not to mention that this only puts just one more step in the manufacture process for new ammo. Has no relevance or impact on anything other than manufacturers and new ammo.

Its a pointless bill that deserves to be put into file 13 so they can focus on more important matters.

Cheers!!!!

reply posted on 20-3-2009 @ 07:53 AM by Hastobemoretolife

I can see this legislation passing in some states, but overall it isn't going to work.

Ammo manufactures are not going to code their ammo for a few states out of 50. The states that do pass this legislation are only hurting themselves. I don't know how exactly they are going to figure out which ammo is coded and which ones aren't though.

reply posted on 20-3-2009 @ 07:53 AM by wonderworld

reply to post by Blanca Rose

No doubt! I know several people that reload their own ammo. If any get caught with un-coded ammo it sounds as if they have the right to take your gun. If reloading, just save your brass, however reloading equipment may also have conditions. My 44 Pistol isn’t on Obama’s list yet and I’m sure the list isn’t complete. I like your comparison to making jewelry! NOW is the time to stock up. If I aim to shoot they’ll be prying out the bullet to see if it is coded and I wont be leaving any brass laying around to be analysed.

reply posted on 20-3-2009 @ 07:58 AM by andre18

Well, it seems that his allies in the anti-gun world have no problem with taking your ammo!

It appears you're purposely trying to be misleading, you should change your title to suit the real circumstance of the issue.

The bill 20 that is being pushed in 18 states requires all ammunition to be encoded by the manufacture a data base of all ammunition sales. So they will know how much you buy and what calibers.

How is that a bad thing?

Nobody can sell any ammunition after June 30, 2009 unless the ammunition is coded.

You still get to keep your ammo. Coded ammunition is a good thing, how can you see that as a negative?

Any privately held uncoded ammunition must be destroyed by July 1, 2011. (Including hand loaded ammo.) They will also charge a .05 cent tax on every round so every box of ammo you buy will go up at least $2.50 or more!

My gosh the cheek of those devils!

If they can deprive you of ammo they do not need to take your gun!

How are they depriving you of anything, you can still have your precious ammo as long as it's coded. How is that bad?

Send to your friends in these states AND fight to dissolve this BILL!!

What is there to fight?

[edit on 20-3-2009 by andre18]

reply posted on 20-3-2009 @ 07:59 AM by wonderworld

reply to post by RFBurns

Yes, they should file this bill under B, for Bull@#^@. You may think it's pointless bill, however one step closer to their main goal. It make me wonder what else they have up their sleeve.

reply posted on 20-3-2009 @ 08:03 AM by thisguyrighthere

This doesnt have anything to do with Obama though his election I'm sure has made proponents of this and other bills such as the microstamping garbage feel emboldened.

The ammunition coding bills and microstamping bills have been floating around for a while now. CA actually passed the microstamping bill last year. CT laughed off the idea of ammunition coding but seriously considered the microstamping bill although it didnt pass it is scheduled for this year to be considered again.

For the slave states that do pass this crap it would only mean ammunition not coded would be banned from sale in the slave states which could actually turn out better for people like me since the market could be halved for ammo at current production levels though overall I would have to oppose the scam even if I would benefit from it.

reply posted on 20-3-2009 @ 08:07 AM by wonderworld

reply to post by Hastobemoretolife

I did some further reading. It seems thatIf ballistic evidence cannot be quickly linked to a crime gun, and the gun recovered and quickly linked to a suspect, the chance of arresting the criminal is less likely. If the bullets and cartridge cases used by criminals were linked directly to a suspect I could see their point. ACS assigns a unique code to every round of ammunition manufactured, and by recording sales records, law enforcement personnel will be able to easily trace the ammunition involved in a crime and have an avenue to pursue and solve even the most difficult cases. The key to ACS is the unique code that is micro-laser engraved on factory-produced ammunition. This laser engraving is etched on both the projectile and the inside of the cartridge casing. Each code will be common to a single box of cartridges and unique from all other ammunition sold. The unique ACS codes will be tracked and records maintained to identify individual ammunition purchases.

So why do we need further coding!

reply posted on 20-3-2009 @ 08:08 AM by thisguyrighthere

reply to post by andre18

On a superficial level the bad things about it are the price increase, the PITA of having to hang out at the desk and fill out paperwork, not being able to reload at home, not being able to buy a box of your buddies ammo while you're both at the range without breaking some law.

If we go deeper the bad thing becomes wasted investigation time as criminals (and people like me who love spite) just scatter empty cases registered to lord knows who all over the place for fun and games. If you dont think this is possible or likely than you've obviously never been to a public range or had much shooting experience.

reply posted on 20-3-2009 @ 08:10 AM by Blanca Rose

reply to post by wonderworld

Brass can be had at flea markets for pennies. If you have any flea markets near you, check it out sometime. People ditch it because it takes polishing, like silver. Once it loses it's luster, people give it away.

Don't believe me? Go to a flea market this weakend and have a look!

I think brass is pretty, and I don't mind polishing it. I get a couple of new pieces a week. I rotate it around in my house, storing some pieces at a time, to decorate with. I have solid brass statuary, flower pots, candle snuffers, candle holders, lamps, just about everything you can think of made of brass.

The only way I could see people having to worry about this would be if brass were to be made extremely hard to get. I don't find that to be true.

reply posted on 20-3-2009 @ 08:11 AM by network dude

reply to post by andre18

go read 1984, take two days to think about what you read, and then come back here and explain you thought on this subject.

reply posted on 20-3-2009 @ 08:13 AM by wonderworld

reply to post by thisguyrighthere

Good point. Washington will more than likely be one of the slave states. Too conservative. I’m sure Montana is exempt but wonder the ramifications if I were to buy ammo there. Will they want my ID? I’m sure they would. I’m proactive on this one and one step ahead of the game. Most of us here feared Obama would try to bush the gun ban. Most are already heavily supplied. I can tell by your avatar you are well prepared, as some of us are.

reply posted on 20-3-2009 @ 08:18 AM by thisguyrighthere

Originally posted by wonderworld
reply to post by thisguyrighthere

I can tell by your avatar you are well prepared, as some of us are.

I wont be home to sign for it so I have a couple thousand rounds being shipped to my work today UPS. I'm going to stack a couple hundred up in my cubicle as decoration.

reply posted on 20-3-2009 @ 08:21 AM by j2000

reply to post by andre18

Like your opionion matters on this subject?

Down Under without guns last I heard..................I am sure you have real good advice for us.

If we let our Govt. keep chipping away at our rights like yours, we will have none.

I still have not heard a good argument for encoding the ammo to begin with other than for us to pay them more tax money.

Americans are all out. We have no more tax money to give. There is nothing you can buy, that does not lead to taxes. There is nothing you can own, that does not lead to taxes.
There is nothing you can earn, that does not lead to taxes.

[edit on 20-3-2009 by j2000]

reply posted on 20-3-2009 @ 08:22 AM by wonderworld

reply to post by andre18

It appears that our 2nd amendment rights is indeed trying to be suppressed. You are entiled to your opinion and respect those with opposing views , however, by banning or diverting ammo, it is only obvious that if there is no ammo, that will leave the public defenseless or the ammo will be so expensive that only the rich or well to do will be able to afford it. These one-size-fits all gun laws might be popular in some parts of the country, but they don't work here in Washington.

reply posted on 20-3-2009 @ 08:23 AM by thisguyrighthere

reply to post by network dude

Isnt it obvious what he would think?

Winston was a sociopath and should have been put down immediately.

reply posted on 20-3-2009 @ 08:28 AM by Hastobemoretolife

reply to post by wonderworld

I understand the concept behind the ammo coding, but they say that all non-coded ammo must be destroyed by a certain date. How are they going to be able to tell if the ammo you have that has not been shot coded? That is what I'm getting at.

Coding ammo is a pointless effort. Just use a revolver or pick up your brass. I know in New York and I think Maryland have gun "fingerprinting" which means every weapon you buy is shot and the markings left by the gun on the bullet and casings are recorded. They have been doing this for a few years and it has helped solve 1 crime in MD and 0 in NY.

The whole point of these types of legislation has nothing to do with solving crime it all has to do with stripping our rights of bearing arms away from us.

The statistics on gun crime overwhelmingly proves that most gun crime is committed with stolen weapons. All this stuff does is waste time and resources.

Not to mention the scientific evidence behind these types of legislation is nil. Same thing with firing pin serial numbers, micro stamping, it doesn't take much skill to file it off or replace the firing pin. Or yet again use a revolver or pick up the brass.

There was a bill like this that the inventors of this process was trying to get passed at the federal level and the ammo manufactures went to testify and pretty much told the federal government that 1) it is not feasible to make ammo with and without coding for law enforcement and military, that was to keep cost down. 2) They said we will simply close up shop and quit making ammo for the military if you pass this legislation.

So after the inventors of this ammo-coding technique got shot down at the federal level they are going to the states to have it passed. The main reason is because they already tried to pitch it to the ammo manufactures and the ammo manufactures told them thanks but no thanks.

This is nothing more than some company trying to own a monopoly on this technique and get rich.

I know Cali and it was mentioned earlier MD shot this legislation down, so if CA and MD shot it down I don't see it as much of a threat.

[edit on 20-3-2009 by Hastobemoretolife]

reply posted on 20-3-2009 @ 08:29 AM by andre18

Originally posted by thisguyrighthere

On a superficial level the bad things about it are the price increase

Well it seems that is the only draw back in all of this, but it's inevitable for prices of all things to go up and up as every thing eventualy does.

the PITA of having to hang out at the desk and fill out paperwork, not being able to reload at home, not being able to buy a box of your buddies ammo while you're both at the range without breaking some law.

So basically you're having a cry about having to fill out forms, dude stfu. Guns are obviously dangerous, they need and should be controlled in order to check how much of what is being bought so if guns are being misused, the owners can be delt with properly. That's simple and straight forward.

reply posted on 20-3-2009 @ 08:31 AM by wonderworld

reply to post by j2000

That is my point my opinion does not matter, nor did it matter when they picked my pockets to take my tax money on the TARP, TALF, bailing out my neighbors mortgage pament, paying CEO bailout bonuses. The fact is I, as many do want their voices heard, they do want their opinions to matter. Taxing ammo is one thing. Messing with my rights is quite another. I too am looking for a good argument on encoding ammo.