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New Mexico governor repeals death penalty

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posted on Mar, 18 2009 @ 09:24 PM
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Originally posted by Black_Fox

Perhaps those who are against the death penalty would feel different if a loved one was murdered for a couple of dollars.




My convictions are not situational. I do not support the death penalty regardless of what may happen to me or to someone I love.

I refuse to give the state the power of life and death over any citizen. They are not that trustworthy.




posted on Mar, 18 2009 @ 09:26 PM
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reply to post by mrwupy
 


Precisely. Not to mention statistically there is a racial bias against death penalty vs. life in prison. Not really an even playing field....
But thats hardly the point...only a part of a big picture.

And yes its true there are many a Holocaust survivor that would not even put Adolf Hitler to death if they could...It also conflicts with Jewish belief.


Judaism offers three primary rationales for the death penalty: deterrence, retribution, and the Maimonidian notion that murder, unlike other terrible crimes, irrevocably rends the divinely ordained social fabric, requiring the most extreme measures to restore balance. However, Judaism also places an extraordinarily high premium on each individual human life, exhibits a profound concern about executing an innocent or undeserving defendant, and stresses the importance of the possibility of teshuva (the Jewish process of repentance). Seen through these complementary and competing Jewish lenses, I believe that one must conclude that the death penalty as it exists in the United States is broken and immoral and should be abolished.

There is no evidence to suggest that capital punishment serves as a deterrent against committing terrible crimes. And retribution can now be affected by means other than capital punishment. Long prison sentences--especially life-without-parole--unavailable in biblical and talmudic times, can now fulfill the retributive requirement of Jewish law, while ensuring that innocents are not unintentionally executed. To the extent that a murderer has attempted to undo the fabric of society, long prison sentences also serve to remove the murderer from society and thus achieve Maimonides' goal of restoring a sense of moral balance. Such a harsh sentence addresses the need to protect community while acknowledging the community's unwillingness to tolerate those who would undo society.

www.myjewishlearning.com...



posted on Mar, 18 2009 @ 09:30 PM
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Originally posted by mrwupy

Originally posted by Black_Fox

Perhaps those who are against the death penalty would feel different if a loved one was murdered for a couple of dollars.




My convictions are not situational. I do not support the death penalty regardless of what may happen to me or to someone I love.

I refuse to give the state the power of life and death over any citizen. They are not that trustworthy.



Arguments for the death penalty tend to be emotional, because there is no logical argument.

They bring up especially bad crimes or the "what if it happened to you" thing, but never any reason why the death penalty makes the world a better place.

Ask yourself that supporters - does the death penalty make the world a better, safer place to live?



posted on Mar, 18 2009 @ 09:33 PM
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reply to post by mrwupy
 


Well let me explain something to you.
I live in Wisconsin,and it does not have the death penalty.
Gang violence runs rampid here.
And the gang members know there is no death penalty.
Children have died many times here in the cross fire.
And many many parents want there murders to get the death penalty.
If you commit a crime that hanous,then you should be put to death.
And if you perfer it not be by the state,ok,then allow the victims family to put a bullet in their head.

This world is not a nice place.
There are evil people in it,who do horrible things.
And to allow them to live,shelved away in some prison for life is just pointless.

To have the freedom of killing someone,without the consequence of knowing you could pay with your own life,is just asking for more bloodshed.

But if your world is a better place where locking these people up,to live out their lives,where their victims can no longer do so,I perfer not to be a part of it.

They kill,so shall they be killed.



posted on Mar, 18 2009 @ 09:37 PM
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Originally posted by Black_Fox
reply to post by mrwupy
 


Well let me explain something to you.
I live in Wisconsin,and it does not have the death penalty.
Gang violence runs rampid here.
And the gang members know there is no death penalty.
Children have died many times here in the cross fire.
And many many parents want there murders to get the death penalty.
If you commit a crime that hanous,then you should be put to death.
And if you perfer it not be by the state,ok,then allow the victims family to put a bullet in their head.

This world is not a nice place.
There are evil people in it,who do horrible things.
And to allow them to live,shelved away in some prison for life is just pointless.

To have the freedom of killing someone,without the consequence of knowing you could pay with your own life,is just asking for more bloodshed.

But if your world is a better place where locking these people up,to live out their lives,where their victims can no longer do so,I perfer not to be a part of it.

They kill,so shall they be killed.



I should tell you that these gang members would still kill people even if there was a death penalty. They have little or no conscience or understanding of consequence. Are there no gangs in Texas?

And again, the idea of putting someone to death to avenge a child disgusts me. Killing a child is sick, but isn't killing in the name of a child sick too?



posted on Mar, 18 2009 @ 09:44 PM
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Originally posted by Black_Fox

This world is not a nice place.
There are evil people in it,who do horrible things.
And to allow them to live,shelved away in some prison for life is just pointless.



No it's not. They took a life and lost theirs in return. Prison is not some sort of picnic. They spend their time in a controlled, heavily structured day to day boring existence.

Imagine for a moment that reincarnation is real. A crazy mass murderer is arrested, taken out back and shot. He's going to come right back as another crazy mass murderer.

Give them half a century in a cage to dwell on it though, to learn, to pray, to dream of possible redemption and maybe, just maybe, they will come back as something better.

I'm not soft on crime by any means. Jack the jail up and toss them under it. still,

I do not trust the state with the power of life and death over it's citizens. They are not that trustworthy.

Again, this is just my humble opinion,

wupy



posted on Mar, 18 2009 @ 09:47 PM
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Well we will just agree to disagree.
I believe people should be held accountable for their actions.
And the punishment should fit the crime.
If you kill someone,then you too should die.

Now,if the happy thing to do is find a more "humane" way of carrying out the sentence,than so be it.

But to allow murders to continue to live life,when it was them who decided to end the life of their victim,makes no sense.

We keep them alive for what?
The deserve to live why?

Kinda fitting I think.
A murder gets to decide whether or not their victim lives,they make the decision,without any say from the victim.

So the fate of the murder can be decided from a jury.
Yes,the decision is made without any say from the soon to be condemed.



posted on Mar, 18 2009 @ 10:33 PM
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"Regardless of my personal opinion about the death penalty, I do not have confidence in the criminal justice system as it currently operates to be the final arbiter when it comes to who lives and who dies for their crime,"

Wow! An American politician who not only values life, but who also has no confidence in the barbaric, Draconian and corrupt American justice system. What is this world coming to?

The death penalty is not a deterrent. Canada and many European countries do not have a death penalty and guess what? Their crime rates are much lower than the American crime rate. In fact, the USA has some of the harshest crime laws on the books and they still have one of the highest crime rates in the Western world.

I would be interested in seeing a study of states which do have the death penalty compared to those that do not. My guess is that those states which do have the death penalty DO NOT have a lower crime rate.

Taking it one step further, the previous President supported torture of detainees because he was a former Governor of a state which put more prisoners to death than any other state in the nation. If the USA wants to take the moral high ground and lead the way, they have no choice but to show compassion for all human life. You cannot have it both ways.

[edit on 18-3-2009 by SphinxMontreal]



posted on Mar, 18 2009 @ 10:40 PM
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Originally posted by Black_Fox

They kill,so shall they be killed.



This is exactly the reason why society has the problems it has. The primative thinking is the core of the problem, and spreads to not just the quiet little suburbs from the big city, but also spreads from old to young.

The problem is NOT the people, the problem is THE SYSTEM.

When the system breaks down, so does society.

Unfortunatley there is no pretty pink house with white picket fence birds chirping flowers growing world, never has been. That was always a false premise of reality. Get used to it.

If you want to change whats going on around you, then the problem must be dealt with at the core, the system, its elected leaders, and YOU...ME...US...EVERYONE!!

Killing never solved anything, and it never will. If it would have solved the world's problems, those problems would be solved already after hundreds of centuries of killing.


Cheers!!!!



posted on Mar, 18 2009 @ 10:57 PM
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reply to post by RFBurns
 


Are we looking at the world through rose covered glasses?
Humans can be vile creatures do you really think the rest of us should pay for there crimes?
Do you know how much it cost to pay for a murderer?not to mention the emotional damage?
With positive proof of guilt they have given up there rite to be among the living it is up to us to liberate there flesh from our world.
Sever the blood line and sleep in peace.

[edit on 18-3-2009 by flyingfish]



posted on Mar, 18 2009 @ 11:01 PM
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Originally posted by flyingfish
reply to post by RFBurns
 


Are we looking at the world through rose covered glasses?
Humans can be vile creatures do you really think the rest of us should pay for there crimes?
Do you know how much it cost to pay for a murderer?not to mention the emotional damage?
With positive proof of guilt they have given up there rite to be among the living it is up to us to liberate there flesh from our world.
Sever the blood line and sleep in peace.


Did you read my post correctly or just zip through it to reveiw certian words.

Note what I said..."there never has been a pretty pink house with white picket fence with chirping birds and flowers growing..that is a false premise of reality".

Summed up, but pretty much what I said. And did you read the part about curing the problem by starting at the core of the problem?

PEOPLE..THE SYSTEM...US.

I think that pretty much states what your saying...dont you think?!!

Everything costs money man. If you want to complain about costs, then go complain about these bailouts that arent doing you or me or anyone else any good, but were paying for it.

Freedom isnt free...learn it, live it, or leave it.



Cheers!!!!

[edit on 18-3-2009 by RFBurns]



posted on Mar, 18 2009 @ 11:05 PM
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reply to post by RFBurns
 


The system hu? We will never get it perfect there will always be a bad guy.
You are talking about Utopia.



posted on Mar, 18 2009 @ 11:37 PM
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Originally posted by flyingfish
reply to post by RFBurns
 


The system hu? We will never get it perfect there will always be a bad guy.
You are talking about Utopia.


No, I am talking about mankind taking responsibility for its actions and grow up out of its infancy and need for blood.

In other words, social development in mankind is centuries behind the times. Well maybe not centuries, but certianly not up to the times as it should be.

This is the 21st century, not the 1st century. As I have said, after all that time of killing and conflict, has anything really changed?

Oh sure there are technology advances, but has mankind himself changed?

Hardly.

And what is so wrong with a utopia? What is so wrong with a world where mankind has put aside their petty differences and petty conflicts? What is so wrong with a world where children can grow up and live long healthy lives? What is so wrong with a world where there is no hunger, no war, no pain or suffering, no murder, no rapes, no crime, no death penalties??

At some point in future history that will become a reality..and such a world is NOT byond reality.

Its a matter of prospective, and a matter of choice.

Choose to continue to live in the mindset of mud and thats exactly where you will always be.

Decide to change direction for the better, and your one step closer to that new direction, and new way of life.


Cheers!!!!



posted on Mar, 18 2009 @ 11:47 PM
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I may be naive, but I would rather see the money spent on death row inmates being spent to prevent more murder rather than for the murder of murderers.

And for anyone who doesn't believe life imprisonment is harsh enough, then perhaps a 23 hour-a-day solitary confinement super-max prison is someplace you'd like to live. Personally, I'd rather be dead.



posted on Mar, 19 2009 @ 12:22 AM
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reply to post by RFBurns
 


Never said anything is wrong with utopia.
You seem to think at some point we are all going to "grow up''and peace love and happiness for all well yes in a perfect world without will-well yes good for you.
Enter- WILL- yours and mine.
Sometimes we will disagree to to agree but other times I will not and if it goes to far then I will make you pay it depends on how you react as to how far I will retaliate.
Like in words you see?
But there are people out there that dont give two #s about what you say and worse would rather see you dead..this is the point where your child man fails and people die.
You choose to house them I choose to liberate them from their flesh.
End of story .

Peace



posted on Mar, 19 2009 @ 12:13 PM
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i don't think this is that big of a deal for New Mexico, they already knew it was going to pass ... plus they've only executed 1 person since 1976 so it's not that much of a change ..

[edit on 19-3-2009 by baseball101]



posted on Mar, 19 2009 @ 05:02 PM
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I just think that there needs to be something to fear... Without that there is no reason a crime would not be committed. I'm afraid to steal because I do not want to go to jail, while jail to them is nothing so their not afraid to kill.... I like the idea of forced labor.

Hey move this rock over here... ok now move it back...



posted on Mar, 19 2009 @ 07:56 PM
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How can anyone support the death penalty when there's a chance that a verdict could be wrong? The justice system is not perfect. The death penalty is just primitive and wrong. Countries without it are doing just fine!



posted on Mar, 19 2009 @ 08:53 PM
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I can't deny that I am often inclined to want those who commit horrible criminal acts to suffer the death penalty.

Do you think that there is any REAL possibility that at least ONE of them is innocent? Or one that doesn't really deserve to die?

Are you comfortable with the notion that as long as they kill those deserving it's OK if the State kills a few innocent people here and there?

I don't know. I can't reconcile the notion that we would be sanctioning the State to take an action that cannot be undone. How do we rate that kind of power?

Yet, I have been sickened by the depths of depravity the media flashes at me, constant reminders of the flaws of humanity. I would not morn them gone.

If only I could believe we were always right.

But we're not, are we?



posted on Mar, 19 2009 @ 08:56 PM
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reply to post by Maxmars
 


Nothing is perfect. And, that was one of the reasons Richardson cited in his decision to repeal the death penalty.

If nothing is perfect, then how can we possibly justify imprisoning someone for life? That's not fair, either, is it?

Nothing is perfect. Nothing ever will be. But, there are crimes that deserve the death penalty. Anything else is too little and never enough.



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